_____________________________________________________________ NORTH CAROLINA STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION _____________________________________________________________ INTERNAL REVIEW TEAM FOR VIRTUAL CHARTER SCHOOLS PRESENTATION OF NC VIRTUAL ACADEMY _____________________________________________________________ WEDNESDAY, DECEMBER 17, 2014 _____________________________________________________________ State Board Room 755 Education Building 301 North Wilmington Street Raleigh, North Carolina 10:30 a.m. Kay McGovern & Associates Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road C Raleigh, NC 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 C FAX 870-1603 C (800) 255-7886 2 A P P E A R A N C E S Martez Hill, Executive Director State Board of Education Meeting Chair Committee Members Eliz Colbert Andrew Cox Paul Davis Helen Nance Kevin Piacenza (via telephone) Becky Taylor Sherry Thomas (via telephone) NC Virtual Academy Christopher Withrow Steven Moody Travis Mitchell Marjorie Benbow Sara Struhs (online) Mary Gifford, Consultant, K12, Inc. Office of Charter Schools Joel Medley, Director Deanna Townsend-Smith KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 3 1 P R O C E E D I N G S 2 (Transcriptionist's Note: Chairman Hill called 3 the meeting to order. 4 the roll, after which the Pledge of Allegiance was 5 recited and the ethics statement was read. 6 Chairman Hill explained the procedure for the 7 presentation and called Christopher Withrow of NC 8 Virtual Academy to the podium.) 9 Mr. Withrow: Ms. Townsend-Smith called Good morning, committee 10 members. 11 before you today. 12 proud to be with you today to share the vision and the 13 mission of North Carolina Virtual Academy. 14 We thank you for the opportunity to come and speak We look forward to this and we're very Before you on the screen is our mission statement 15 that we have outlined within our application. 16 highlights that I'd like to mention of our mission statement 17 is that the purpose is to be an innovative school to provide 18 different types of learning environments and technologies to 19 students who may not have been exposed to these in the past. 20 The important Additionally, we are--we as a board are going to 21 hold ourselves as well as our management team accountable to 22 all the state policies and procedures and accountability, 23 which of course we will be accountable to the state of North 24 Carolina according to the policies and procedures set forth 25 by the Department of Public Instruction. KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 4 A brief history about North Carolina Virtual 1 2 Academy: 3 In 2005 I was employed for a school district, Warren County 4 Schools, as the chief technology officer. 5 I had previously been a band director for Wayne County Public 6 Schools, and so education of course has always been forefront 7 of my mission. 8 9 this process began roughly about seven years ago. During that time-- And while I was there, I looked at the way our learning was taking place in our school district and realized 10 that we had some shortcomings. 11 and our superintendent, "Let's try a different approach to 12 working with our students. 13 So I proposed to our board Let's create a virtual school." Now, we recognize that virtual education is 14 definitely not going to work for every child. 15 an opportunity for children who work in that type of environ- 16 ment to excel and succeed. 17 However, it's We had tremendous success in our--in our program. 18 Based upon that success, we realized that, you know, it's not 19 just Warren County Schools children that could benefit from 20 this, but also all children in North Carolina. 21 began the process of moving toward a virtual school 22 application. 23 Hence we So seven years ago, we put our first application 24 in for a virtual school. Fast forward to about three years 25 ago, realized the procedures and policies changed with our KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 5 1 General Assembly, we took the opportunity to apply again for 2 a virtual school. 3 opportunity to our children. 4 are children that can benefit from the options that are 5 afforded by virtual education. We all came together to again present this We believe wholeheartedly there As you can see, we are excited to be a part--or be 6 7 considered for the virtual pilot. We definitely believe that 8 two pilots--in the state of North Carolina two pilot virtual 9 charter schools is a really good thing. It gives the state 10 as well as the virtual school administrators an opportunity 11 to study the successes and be able to report back any 12 recommendations we have for the state department. So again, we look forward to collaboration with 13 14 DPI. We have met with Philip Price and the DPI staff and Dr. 15 Townsend and had a wonderful discussion that day about 16 reporting, financial reporting and student data reporting, 17 and realizing that there are changes with reporting in this 18 different type of environment, but we definitely look forward 19 to the collaboration of making this a successful experience. 20 Chairman Hill: Okay. So Joel and Deanna are 21 going to be capturing detailed notes. 22 through the question and answer section, they will summarize 23 the questions and the answers and then we'll move to the next 24 topic. 25 member of this committee to ask questions about the mission, And after we go So with that said, I will open the floor for any KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 6 1 purposes, and goals section of the application. Committee Member: 2 3 Yes, ma'am. Why did you choose K12, Incorporated to partner with? Mr. Withrow: 4 Well, based on my experience 5 that I had with Quest Academy, which is the virtual school in 6 Warren County Schools that I built in 2005, I've had exposure 7 to a lot of different vendors. 8 class.com, Adventa, Cambium Learning, Pearson, and so I've 9 had experience with working with different providers. Some of those would include And so based on the size of K12, its strength and 10 11 it being the lead largest provider of content and curriculum 12 in virtual learning in America, based on the quality of the 13 instruction they have and the alignment that they do, we felt 14 like it was in the best interest of our school district to 15 work with what we considered the industry leader. At the time, three years ago, we did--we were 16 17 aware of Connections, which is owned by Pearson, the ones who 18 make PowerSchool. They were operating in North Carolina, so 19 we evaluated them. But we ended up working with K12 because 20 we do believe that they are the number one vendor in the 21 space. Chairman Hill: 22 So the floor is open. I 23 don't necessarily need to recognize you, but just let's be 24 respectful of each other and let's not try to talk over each 25 other. So any other questions around the mission, purpose, KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 7 1 and goals sections? 2 (No response.) 3 Chairman Hill: 4 So let's move to the education planning section. Committee Member: 5 Martez, I have a question. 6 So the application calls for a description of the major 7 instructional methods. 8 sessions, data, innovations in digital learning, direct 9 instruction. So you talk about synchronous 10 But tell me, what exactly is going to be happening 11 in the online classroom, like what is the teacher expected to 12 do and what can the students and parents expect from inside 13 the classroom? 14 very globally, but I was wondering if you could describe it 15 more specifically. What does it look like? 16 teachers be doing? What will the parents know the teachers 17 are doing, et cetera? These things you've listed you've painted Mr. Withrow: 18 Absolutely. What will the And by the way, 19 I would like to recognize also--and please forgive me for 20 this. 21 with me so when they respond, you will know who is speaking 22 to you. 23 I would like to recognize the board members I have We have Mr. Steve Moody, Mr. Travis Mitchell, 24 Sarah (sic) Benbow. We also have online Sara Struhs. 25 our final board member--he's unavailable to be with us today. KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 And (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 8 1 He's sequestered on a naval base in California and is unable 2 to attend. 3 are parents here that are in support of both virtual charters 4 and we'd like to recognize them as well. I'd also like to recognize in the gallery--there Regarding the educational plan, I would like to 5 6 ask Mr. Travis Mitchell to speak on that. 7 more in-depth answer, we'll probably ask one of our 8 consultants to help out as well. Mr. Mitchell: 9 Thank you. And probably for a To give you a 10 high level overview of what a day looks like, the school day 11 will reflect the plan that is described in the individualized 12 learning plan, which is going to be assessment driven. 13 it's a data driven plan for each student. So For most of the students it will include regular 14 15 instructional sessions with a certified teacher in math, 16 reading, and language arts, and these sessions will be daily 17 sessions. 18 students, small group or one on one. 19 to spend roughly an hour each day in core--four core course 20 areas and up to an hour a day in art, music, or a language or 21 languages. 22 The sessions will begin with a classroom of Students are expected The synchronous instruction time will complement 23 the online lessons that students would receive and are 24 expected to complete. 25 will be scheduled to fit into a routine, so they will vary Synchronous instructional sessions KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 9 1 student by student, but there will be a routine. For instance, a student may have a small group 2 3 math instruction at 9:30 a.m. three days a week, work on math 4 independently one day a week, and receive tutoring one day a 5 week. 6 speak a little bit more to a day in the life of a student. 7 I'm going to ask our K12 representative, Mary, to Ms. Gifford: Good morning. I think Travis 8 really hit the highlights. But generally the individualized 9 learning time will be developed upon enrollment. It's going 10 to be based on prior assessments and other information such 11 as attendance patterns, areas of success, areas where 12 students are struggling. 13 looks like, like Travis described. 14 combination. 15 And that will drive what that day It's going to be the The expectation is that kids will spend about an 16 hour a day in each content area roughly. It's going to look 17 a little differently student by student. If I'm a student 18 who needs more help in math, I'm going to have more 19 synchronous, more small group, and probably one-on-one 20 tutoring with the math instructor. 21 math, but I need help in reading, I may have that kind of 22 level of support in reading. 23 If I don't need help in There will be some synchronous and some 24 asynchronous instruction. 25 the online school, which is kind of the nerve center. KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 Everything is delivered up through And (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 10 1 the nerve center will basically describe the sessions as well 2 as the online content and offline content a student should 3 do. 4 a day at a time. 5 specifically what they have to do to prep as well as what 6 they will do independently and what they will do 7 synchronously with an instructor. Parents may help by looking at that a week at a time or The teachers also plan their day with some office 8 9 And it really does lay out very hours built in as well as time for grading. It's important 10 that students receive regular feedback. 11 families and students and ask them what would make them more 12 successful in the online setting, universally they answer 13 more feedback from teachers. 14 in addition to instructional time, tutoring time, there will 15 be grading time. 16 feedback. And so within the teacher day, It's really important to provide that Committee Member: 17 Well, my question is not 18 really about the whole day. 19 tional methods. 20 an hour a day in instruction. 21 Like what is the student doing? 22 lecturing? 23 24 25 When we survey My question is about instruc- So you both mentioned an hour a day in core, Are we reading? What is inside that hour? Is it a lecture? Are we Like what are we doing in that time? I don't want the whole day. I just want to know if you have key instructional strategies that every teacher-- KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 11 1 or the secondary teachers will use these and the elementary 2 teachers will use these. 3 You know, what does it look like? Ms. Gifford: Yes, ma'am. So generally 4 what should be happening is the best practices from a brick 5 and mortar setting translated into a virtual setting. 6 it were a one-on-one tutoring session, it would be about 7 finding out where the student has gaps, which would be 8 informed by an assessment. So if 9 And so typically a student would take an assess- 10 ment and I as an instructor would see where the student has 11 not answered the assessment correctly. 12 one tutoring, also small group instruction, in on those gaps. 13 I would focus one-on- I would focus primarily on some of the areas that 14 are most closely in line with the state standards or things 15 that are cumulative in nature. 16 any singular gap is going to affect you downstream. 17 If you think of math, having And so the teachers would inform one on one as 18 well as small group instruction based on regular assessments. 19 We do develop customized pathways for students that involve 20 regular assessments to drive that instruction. 21 In a larger group, it would be very typical of 22 what you would see in any effective online class. 23 have a period of time where they are getting the students' 24 attention, where they are introducing content, where they are 25 checking for--checking whether or not the student understands KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 You would (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 12 1 the content, reinforcing it. There are times when they are 2 going to be using small groups within online sessions. 3 Committee Member: These are synchronous--- 4 Ms. Gifford: (interposing) These would be 5 synchronous, correct, synchronous--larger group synchronous. 6 And a lot of that is, again, the teacher actually doing what 7 is the steps of good instruction, getting their attention, 8 introducing--you know, the intro set, checking for under- 9 standing, the things you would normally do. 10 The teachers go through training in advance of 11 this to make sure that they understand how to manage a 12 classroom in the virtual setting. 13 there will be many observations of teachers with instruc- 14 tional coaches as well as the principal will observe the 15 teachers, provide coaching to the teachers to make sure that 16 those synchronous sessions are quality. 17 Committee Member: How does this work for K-3? 18 Ms. Gifford: So for K-3, it will depend on 19 the reading ability of the student. 20 specifically has things designed for emergent readers and 21 they have a lot of offline materials as well. 22 every K1-2 student gets a phonics tile kit. 23 have--they have a tile kit that has all of the different 24 phonemes in it. 25 independent work. And then additionally The K1-2 curriculum For instance, And so they A lot of the K through 3 in the home is not It is work driven by the learning coach at KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 13 1 home, which in many cases is the parent. The teacher will have different kinds of sessions 2 3 that they do with the students, a lot of smaller group, 4 listening to them learn to read, listening to how they're 5 forming words, those kinds of things. 6 driven by the learning coach in the home, though, at K1-2. 7 As they begin reading more, they become more independent. Committee Member: 8 9 10 It really will be very So it's less online, but you supply a lot of materials for those coaches to hopefully do the job you're assuming they're doing? Ms. Gifford: 11 Yes, ma'am. And in fact 12 while we talk a little about the online school kind of being 13 the nerve center and driving the instruction, particularly in 14 the lower grade levels, they will receive 40 to 60 pounds of 15 materials, offline materials. 16 important for them to be engaged in those offline materials 17 in those earlier years. And we really think it's About 50 percent of their time would be spent 18 19 online in those early grades and then in the middle 20 elementary, it would be up into the 50 to 60 percent. 21 middle school it would be 60 to 70 percent, and then in high 22 school it gets upward of 70 percent online. 23 lower levels they need to be offline in the stuff, if you 24 will. 25 Committee Member: KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 By But in those So the parents you're saying (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 14 1 are typically the learning coaches in the home; is that 2 correct? 3 4 5 6 7 Ms. Gifford: Yes, ma'am. It's typical for a parent to be a learning coach. Committee Member: Well, what if the parent is not, you know, providing that role like they should be? Ms. Gifford: So if a parent is not--well, 8 first of all we would hope that the parents would be 9 committed to this. This is indeed a lifestyle choice. This 10 is not for everyone. 11 levels, it does require the engagement of a loving adult, in 12 most cases a parent. 13 And particularly in the lower grade And so during the enrollment process this is 14 communicated very carefully to parents. The expectation of 15 the parents in the lower grades indeed is very different than 16 in the upper grades. 17 learning coach there and that they agree that there will be 18 some form of a learning coach available to the student during 19 instructional time. And it is important that they have a 20 Committee Member: How is that monitored? 21 Ms. Gifford: If I may, the teachers will 22 have conferences not just with the students, but with the 23 learning coaches. 24 instructional times to make sure that during the day the 25 teacher--the learning coach is available to talk with the And we do those conferences during KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 15 1 2 teacher. You know, they may be home six hours a day, but it 3 may not be while the student is learning. 4 will be trained to do is to affirm that the parents are 5 available during that instructional time for the student. 6 Ms. Nance: What the teacher I have two questions. Do you 7 allow your teachers to work for a traditional school system 8 in a school at the same time they're working for you? 9 Mr. Withrow: Ms. Nance, the instructors 10 that we will hire, they will be full-time instructors for 11 North Carolina Virtual Academy. 12 Ms. Nance: Okay. And my second question 13 is--it's really about EC or exceptional children. 14 difficulty understanding--what you're saying is a lot of your 15 students will choose this type of education because they are 16 not traditional students. 17 And a lot of those students would need IEPs and 504s. 18 I'm having They have other things going on. And some of the--sort of explain to me how you're 19 going to meet those needs and then how you're going to 20 provide all the compliance information that the EC department 21 for DPI requires. 22 Mr. Withrow: Well, I think all of our 23 students, not just the EC students, will have an IEP. So 24 every single one--we will have a structured plan for every 25 one of them. We are committed with EC in handling the EC KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 16 1 children. Yes, we do expect a good supply to come in, 2 whether they have anything from cyberbullying to they're 3 preparing to go to the Olympics and they need a different 4 time to work. But with EC, we will hire certified people who are 5 6 EC trained and qualified, and these experts will be the ones 7 who will handle the evaluations of the children. 8 be the ones who will be responsible for creating the plans of 9 how to deliver the education to them. 10 you could address that more in depth. Committee Member: 11 12 question. They will I believe that maybe Well, I have one easy How do you evaluate a student? 13 Mr. Withrow: Well, we--- 14 Committee Member: (interposing) If you're 15 doing home school and students who haven't been in a 16 traditional school system or currently in private schools, 17 they have not been--have not been analyzed by anybody to see 18 if they qualify for federal funds. 19 Mr. Withrow: That is absolutely true, and 20 that's part of the initial process with Child Find, which is 21 a federal requirement. 22 single child every single year to determine what needs and 23 services they may need. 24 mentioned that. 25 We will perform Child Find on every So far as--but assessments, you The children will be taking benchmark tests. KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 We (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 17 1 will do initial assessments. 2 assessments. 3 EOG assessments that's required. They also will be required to take any EOC and Committee Member: 4 We have the Study Island I understand that. I guess 5 what I'm feeling is a little bit with some of those special 6 children, somebody really needs to go in and look at them and 7 give the tests and--do you have some way that you're doing 8 that? Do you contract with people or what do you do? Mr. Withrow: Yes, ma'am. 10 Committee Member: Okay. 11 Ms. Gifford: Yes, ma'am. 9 Let me--- So the process 12 really starts upon enrollment, and Child Find should start at 13 the point of enrollment. 14 on Child Find. 15 trained on Child Find. 16 observations they have in their virtual classroom, telephonic 17 conversations, and then observations at kind of like the 18 beginning of the school year, events and things, where they 19 can observe students. 20 And so the teachers will be trained The regular education teachers will be And that will be a combination of During the enrollment process, families will be 21 asked if they've ever received services or if they currently 22 are under a current--an IEP. 23 collected and reviewed. 24 existing IEPs, an IEP will be--team will be convened to see 25 if a new IEP that reflects the virtual setting. Those documents will be An IEP team--for students who have KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 18 For instance, if an IEP currently contains 1 2 extended time, in the virtual setting that might look a 3 little bit different than it does in a brick and mortar 4 setting because the virtual setting is mastery based and not 5 necessarily time bound. So an IEP team will be convened. 6 A special 7 education teacher will be assigned to every student as well 8 as a regular education teacher for a student who has a 9 current IEP. The IEP will be convened. They will get their 10 procedural safeguards notifications in the mail like you 11 would traditionally. 12 convened in a synchronous classroom session, so it would be 13 online. 14 Typically that IEP meeting would be Some of the IEPs would be convened face to face. Related service providers would be looped in, 15 school psychologists if the students need evaluations, if 16 their evaluations are out of date. 17 related service providers across the state that would do the 18 appropriate evaluations in a face-to-face setting because 19 that's the most effective way to assess those students. 20 that information would be fed into that IEP team and would 21 inform the IEP decision. 22 There will be contracted And The related services might go on, you know, during 23 the school year. It may be that they need accommodations in 24 the classroom, which would be something the special education 25 teacher and the regular education teacher have to KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 19 1 accommodate. They may be a student who has a physical dis- 2 3 ability who would need some form of assistive technology. 4 They may need a translator--because they have some form of a 5 visual impairment, they may need an audio translator. 6 may need a very large keyboard if they are visually impaired. 7 So there will be different kinds of assistive technologies 8 that will be a part of this. They So kind of to serve these students well, it starts 9 10 with enrollment. 11 assessment, regular ed professional, special ed professional, 12 related service professionals, and then assistive technology 13 to make sure that the students' full range of needs are being 14 met. 15 It starts with a lot of evaluation and Committee Member: And to follow up on that, one 16 of the things that's very difficult for charter schools is to 17 keep up with all the compliance that's required by the 18 federal government so that you can receive the federal funds. 19 How do you--what do you have in place to make sure that you 20 have that done? 21 Ms. Gifford: So there are few things that 22 will be in place. There is a database that tracks every 23 single student that has a 504 plan or a special ed IEP. 24 Chris mentioned, everyone is going to have an individualized 25 learning plan that's additionally tracked. KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 As (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 20 But for the students that fall into those two 1 2 categories, there is a database and a software system that 3 will be used that actually tracks the required related 4 services: 5 who is the assigned provider, are they doing it, when is 6 their annual evaluation, have we had the discussion about 7 extended school year. 8 compliancy requirements are a part of that. is it 30 minutes a week, is it 40 minutes a week, All of those things that are Additionally, we'll be using some software that is 9 10 unique to North Carolina that drives what needs to be in the 11 IEPs, the behavioral plans and things like that. Committee Member: 12 Who puts all that information 13 into the data because it's the classroom teacher, I think, 14 that is dealing mostly with the students. 15 putting it in there, the information? Ms. Gifford: 16 Is that who is It will depend on--it will 17 depend on who the school chooses to give access to it. A lot 18 of the information--there will be, particularly in grades K 19 through 3, a lot of students who are receiving speech only. 20 And so the related service provider would be the one putting 21 that in there. 22 The regular ed teacher, the special ed teacher, 23 and any related service providers will certainly have read 24 access. 25 student at any point in time. They all need to know what's going on with that KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 21 The people who need to be providing input will 1 2 have write access as well. 3 tions within the classroom, then yes, the regular ed teacher 4 should be entering those. 5 providing more of those accommodations, the special education 6 teacher would enter those. 7 driven by that IEP. 9 If the special ed teacher is Ms. Nance: 8 If they are requiring accommoda- So it really depends on what is Okay. And I just have lots of questions, but this is--I don't know that you have an 10 answer for this one. 11 and I have students who sometimes take online classes in the 12 summer, and they do much better in the summer on those than 13 they do in the classroom. 14 someone helping them so much with that class that it's not a 15 true picture of what's happening for that child. 16 know if you have any way of monitoring that kind of a 17 situation. 18 I actually run a charter high school But we're concerned that they have I don't And then I know you have regional centers where 19 they go do the testing. 20 is for people to get--to really make that happen. 21 lot of ideas and they're good ideas. 22 struggle is how much they can actually be implemented. 23 And I just wondered how difficult it Ms. Gifford: You have a I think where I That's a fabulous question. 24 Good teaching is good teaching, and so what good teachers are 25 going to be doing is having those students in a lot of KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 22 1 synchronous sessions, whether one on one, small group, or 2 classroom based, and actually require student participation, 3 checking for knowledge. 4 classroom session--if I have 20 students in my Algebra I 5 class, if I am conducting that class appropriately, I will be 6 checking for understanding with the students. And again, even if it's a large The web based classroom has a polling function. 7 8 It has the ability to call on students individually. The 9 equipment the students will be using will include a micro- 10 phone so that they can be interactive with the teacher. 11 think it starts with good instruction and the teacher 12 checking for understanding along the way, irrespective of 13 what kind of session it is. I think also teacher feedback. 14 So I When teachers read 15 material--teachers are pretty well trained on what is student 16 driven and what is not. 17 based software called Turnitin. 18 long essays are run through Turnitin to verify that the 19 student has not plagiarized, but the teacher feedback is 20 going to be important. To be extra safe, there is a web All short answer essays or Phases of work for students--all phases of work 21 22 for students--you know, I think the teachers will be very 23 well trained on this, and it is something that good teachers 24 can pick up on. 25 ment. And again, it really relates to that engage- If the student is engaged with the teacher, the KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 23 1 student is going to do his own work and the teacher will be 2 able to see that it's his own work. 3 The ultimate backstop, however, will be the end of 4 instruction assessments since those are offered in a 5 proctored setting, and that really will be what determines if 6 the student has mastered the content. 7 Committee Member: I'd like to revisit the EC 8 situation because I do feel like you will have some EC 9 parents that think this will be a good fit for them for 10 11 various reasons, you know. And I know how difficult it is to make sure that 12 you're implementing that to the degree of the law, and I feel 13 like you've had the experience in other states. 14 me how you have served other EC students effectively to 15 provide a free and appropriate education in the least 16 restrictive environment, and are there any outstanding issues 17 or concerns or complaints that you've had and how you've 18 dealt with those. 19 Ms. Gifford: Can you tell So generally the special 20 education population in the virtual academies across the 21 country who partner with K12, the percentage runs slightly 22 above the state percentages usually. 23 percent enrolled in the virtual academies compared to usually 24 like 11, 12 percent for a state average. 25 It's usually 13 to 14 We do track them as a subgroup, as we're required KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 24 1 to for state testing. 2 families. 3 were provided timely and things like that. 4 that we are actively participating in monitorings. 5 you know, almost every one of the virtual academies across 6 the country is part of a seven year federal monitoring that 7 happens at some point in time. We want to understand if their related services We also make sure I think, Most state departments of ed are on a two to three 8 9 They do also--we give surveys to the year cycle for monitorings, and so those happen in some 10 states. I think of Arizona, for instance. Child Find is 11 something that is audited annually. 12 screening is touched by an auditor to ensure that it was done 13 timely and done completely. Every single 45 day So I think that there is evidence on the 14 15 compliancy side from state and federal departments of ed and 16 independent auditors. 17 externally from student performance as a subgroup on state 18 standardized assessments. I think there is also evidence As far as how we do, these students typically stay 19 20 at a longer rate. When we look at withdrawal rates of all 21 students, the special education students typically stay a 22 little bit longer than regular education students. 23 generally serve students from pretty much all of the 24 different disability categories. 25 some. There will be fewer in A lot of them, again, are speech only. KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 And we do A lot of them (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 25 1 are SLD students, a high percentage of autistic students. We do very effective--we're very effective at 2 3 having related service provision in the behavioral coaching 4 area and also in parent training in the behavioral coaching 5 area. 6 very good solution, but it does require a true behavioral 7 coach for the parent then as well as for the student. 8 that is one of those related service providers that is 9 recruited immediately, because again, we will get a lot of And having the students in the home sometimes is a 10 students in the autism spectrum. 11 things--Committee Member: 12 And Any other specific (interposing) Do you ever 13 feel like you need to recommend an alternative placement for 14 a student? Have you had those situations? Ms. Gifford: 15 There have been a couple of 16 cases where there have been recommended alternative 17 placements, that the IEP team has recommended alternative 18 placement. 19 It is rather rare, but it is somewhat--in some 20 states where the schools are not run--I think of like for 21 instance California where the virtual schools run under the 22 independent study law. 23 categories there in different things. 24 charter--open enrollment charter school like in many states. 25 In California there may be some cases of that because they And there are some different KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 It is not a true open (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 26 1 operate actually under a different law. 2 the independent study law, which has some different 3 restrictions. 4 5 6 Committee Member: culty in California with that? Ms. Gifford: They operate under So did you have some diffiI mean--(interposing) Actually, 7 there are no difficulties in California. There was--there 8 was a series of complaints filed by the teachers union, not 9 parents and students and not teachers teaching at the school, 10 but by the teachers union. And the department of education 11 summarily dismissed every single one of the complaints within 12 two weeks of receipt. 13 Chairman Hill: Yes, sir. 14 Mr. Davis: A couple of questions. First 15 one, going back to Dr. Colbert's, you described what a 16 typical day looks like. 17 students that don't meet the expectations that you have of an 18 hour per day per core, that are not meeting the expectations 19 of time spent? 20 What do you have in place for Having worked with virtual public schools, I see 21 that it's not for every student and I see that there are 22 students that really do struggle with being self motivated to 23 meet those expectations. 24 Mr. Mitchell: 25 I think one of the beautiful things about the pilot season that we're entering in with KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 27 1 this is that it goes back to the individual assessments. 2 Right at the beginning we have to understand the learning 3 styles of each one of those students. 4 together our intervention teams according to the 5 individualized learning plans, we've got to address style 6 delivery, program delivery. 7 And as we are putting One of the unique things that we'll be doing is 8 using a data dashboard that is looking at the engagement 9 level of our students. I think it's important to red flag 10 any disengagement by students earlier on so that we can 11 address and remediate those situations. 12 Part of the recommendations could be students 13 meeting with tutors one on one that might be more effective 14 pulling them in earlier--pulling them out and pulling them in 15 earlier with one-on-one tutoring sessions may increase levels 16 of engagement for those students who struggle earlier on. 17 In my own experiences with virtual learning, I 18 have seen that once students engage and once students have a 19 bridge to the instruction, the engagement level tends to be 20 high, but you've got to address it earlier on in the process. 21 I don't know if Mary has anything she wants to add. 22 Mr. Davis: Then secondly, addressing 23 state testing, there are a lot of concerns I have there 24 concerning security of test material, the actual 25 administration of testing, training of administrators and KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 28 1 proctors, meeting the EC accommodations, 504 accommodations. 2 Could you please address how you'll conduct state testing? Ms. Gifford: 3 Thank you. So state testing 4 is something that I believe K12 has as a core competency in 5 many states. 6 testing plans that we develop with our partner schools as 7 samples for other virtual schools, and they routinely 8 evaluate and come on site. Departments of education will actually use the It starts with good planning in the beginning. 9 10 Again, if we have all the information in that special 11 education database, we will know which students need 12 accommodations or not. It also starts with mapping where the students 13 14 live. 15 teacher hiring as well. 16 the map across the state and try to hire teachers in close 17 proximity to where the students live. 18 important because they will also be the test proctors. 19 And this is something that feeds in as soon as-Once students enroll, you look at That will become And so the testing plan goes into place, you know, 20 way before school starts, as soon as we start knowing where 21 students are enrolling. The sites are planned based on the 22 numbers of kids needed. Additional sites may be planned or 23 the layout of a plan may be planned--laid out based on 24 accommodations that are necessary. 25 With respect to test security, there will be a KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 29 1 test coordinator that will be hired by the principal. 2 test coordinator will ensure the training of all of the 3 proctors, the signing of the oaths, and things like that. 4 That person will also be ultimately responsible for the 5 security of the materials, both secure and nonsecure testing 6 materials. 7 There will be close inventories. There will be 8 training as to where they may be housed. 9 housed in your garage, for instance, things like that. 10 11 The They may not be They will have very close descriptions of that. We also need to in the virtual setting think a 12 whole lot about students' safety and security. These are 13 students who are not typically in settings like this on a 14 day-to-day basis. 15 dropping the student off and then picking the student up. 16 we have things like security bracelets for the students and 17 things like that to make sure that we're thinking of student 18 security as well. And in many cases the parent will be So 19 You know, test materials, the secure and nonsecure 20 materials, are returned on kind of a chain of custody kind of 21 approach where we have documents that travel with every 22 single box of materials that describe exactly who had custody 23 of it at what time and in what way was it taken care of. 24 is--it is a logistical orchestra, it is something wonderful 25 to watch, and it is a core competency. KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 It (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 30 1 We also have a software that is described in the 2 charter application. 3 Nirvana, and it indeed is Nirvana. 4 where every single student is with respect to testing 5 responsibilities. 6 We call it--it's called Testing It does allow us to track I would know--if I was a teacher in a testing 7 center and I was short two students in third grade writing to 8 hit my 95 percent mark, I would know that instantaneously 9 with a very interactive dashboard so that the people in the 10 school office would work to find those two students who need 11 to get to testing, also very good for security of students. 12 So between good planning in the beginning, hiring 13 teachers in the right places, planning the sites, and then 14 ensuring that the data is in the databases, both the special 15 ed database as well as the Testing Nirvana database, to 16 ensure that the students are in the right places at the right 17 time in taking assessments. 18 Chairman Hill: So Committee Members, we can 19 circle back if you have additional questions under the 20 education plan section. 21 sufficient time looking at governance, capacity, operations, 22 and financial planning. 23 24 25 But I want to ensure that we spend Committee Member: Could I ask one question before we leave it? Chairman Hill: KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 Yes, ma'am. (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 31 Committee Member: 1 Okay, because it's kind of 2 big here. 3 behavioral issues and discipline and suspensions, that sort 4 of nature with virtual. 5 process when you're dealing with a student with a suspension? 6 How have you done that or how do you plan to deal with that 7 in North Carolina--suspension and/or expulsion? So how are you going to ensure due Ms. Gifford: 8 9 You know, I know it's different dealing with So I'd like to do two things, if I may, one assuming a general ed student and one assuming 10 a special education student. If the student is special 11 education, there will be a manifestation hearing and the 12 things that would normally have to happen before it could go 13 to a suspension or an expulsion process. 14 is the ultimate arbiter of who stays in that school or not. 15 And so the policies that the board will adopt will describe 16 what is expected for an engagement perspective. The governing board I believe it will be informed by the work that the 17 18 board does with DPI and Philip Price here regarding 19 attendance and what attendance looks like in the virtual 20 setting. 21 firmly decided, it will be put in the board's policy manual. 22 Families will be made aware of it. 23 paths in there. 24 working to get them more engaged should they not be engaged. 25 I think that is still being decided. Once that is There will be escalation I think Travis described a little bit of But if they--if all of those attempts fail and KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 32 1 it's well documented, then there will be a suspension hearing 2 or an expulsion hearing depending on what the board would 3 like at the board level. 4 hearing, and the board would have to--for convenience sake, 5 we would figure how to get the board to the place most 6 convenient to the student. 7 student and the family to attend. 8 will actually be quite rare, especially given the law that is 9 associated with the pilot where the parent has to kind of 10 And that would be an in-person It can't be a hardship to the But I imagine that those declare intent for enrolling. 11 I think that there will be a lot that happens on 12 the front end regarding setting expectations and then again 13 following the policies that are determined for attendance. 14 But the board will be the ultimate arbiter and they'll have 15 policies in their handbooks. Chairman Hill: 16 17 governance and capacity. 18 committee members? Okay. Are there any questions from Ms. Nance: 19 So let's move to Well, I can start. I don't 20 mean to hog the questions. I just have a charter school, so 21 I kind of understand some of the things that you're facing. 22 And one of the things I see and was a little 23 confused about is you have a principal and an executive 24 director. 25 one place the salary was there and then in another--for one Can you explain their roles and some of their--in KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 33 1 and not for the other and--anyway, share. Mr. Withrow: 2 Sure. Ms. Nance, I would say 3 that the information for the salaries for both is listed in 4 the budget. 5 to the template or the web based system, the numbers got 6 shifted in different locations. 7 Unfortunately, when the information was uploaded And you'll see for example in the printed document 8 on page 109, that entire section is missing from the online 9 web portion even though it was submitted. So there will be 10 places that--the information was submitted. You just don't 11 see it because it's not there through the web based system. 12 Ms. Nance: Okay. 13 Mr. Withrow: But I would like to ask Mr. 14 Moody if he would discuss the executive director and 15 principal differentiation. 16 Chairman Hill: 17 please pull the mic up to the mouth. 18 Mr. Moody: And I'll remind everyone, Okay. Thank you. We see the 19 executive director as the leader, the leader of the charter 20 school, the face of the charter school, the liaison with the 21 Office of Charter Schools, the person who makes sure that the 22 policies of the board are complied with and are implemented 23 and that financial controls are met and the budget is 24 followed and all of those areas. 25 And the principal works to implement the education KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 34 1 service provider's plan and works with the teachers, training 2 and managing the staff and helping them provide the education 3 services to the individual students. Mr. Withrow: 4 I'd also like to add that one 5 of the differences is the fact that the executive director 6 will be an employee of the board. 7 be hired by the service provider. It's the--the board is really concerned about 8 9 The principal will be an-- making sure that compliance is met, that all policies and 10 procedures are followed. 11 we hire are going to be teachers of--employees of the board. 12 They're not going to be employees of the service provider, so 13 it's important that the board has governance over all aspects 14 to assure compliancy and all regulations are followed. 15 so that's really one of the key purposes of the executive 16 directors. 17 all these responsibilities. 18 We realize that the teachers that And They must manage the day to day to take care of Ms. Nance: So I'm hearing you say the 19 executive director is hired by the board, and the--everybody 20 else is hired by the--K12; right? 21 Mr. Withrow: No? No, ma'am. The executive 22 director--the executive director and the teachers will be 23 employees of the board. 24 Ms. Nance: Okay. 25 Mr. Withrow: (interposing) KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 The (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 35 1 administrators--Ms. Nance: 2 3 I'm sorry. I get confused. Mr. Withrow: 4 5 (interposing) That's okay. And the administrators will be the employees of the service provider. Ms. Nance: 6 Okay. Okay. And then--so 7 the ultimate responsibility for the school other than the 8 board is that executive director, and they report to you? Mr. Withrow: Yes. 10 Ms. Nance: Okay. 11 Chairman Hill: Any other questions regarding 9 12 governance or capacity? 13 (No response.) 14 Chairman Hill: Let's move to operations. 15 Committee Member: I have a question regarding 16 transportation. 17 where, you know, a family may have to transport to an 18 assessment center or they may have to be transported for a 19 hearing. 20 field trips and whatnot. 21 is going to be handled because a lot of these families will 22 have difficulty with that. 23 And I've heard a lot of different situations And then I was reading about some virtual clubs and Can you tell me how transportation Mr. Withrow: Right. Well, primarily we 24 are expecting that parents will be in participation of the 25 transportation and we will provide a web site where parents KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 36 1 can sign up for carpooling. 2 for the parents, not the students, to coordinate this. 3 We'll have social media sites We are committed that every student is not going 4 to be challenged to get to a location. 5 we have made provisions in our plan. 6 page 114, we have several categories that we address 7 financially how to assist students who are challenged in 8 getting back and forth to locations. 9 And having said that, In our budget plan on One of the things we're fortunate is our service 10 provider being so large as they are and having a presence in 11 so many states, they already have experience dealing with 12 hardships with transportation. 13 it's necessary that we provide some form of transportation 14 that it will be provided for, including up to if a child has 15 multiple day testing, for example an EOC, if it's a hardship, 16 that we will definitely make accommodations for them to have 17 overnight arrangements. 18 So we are committed that if We're also committed to having locations very 19 close to where the children are at. 20 child from Haywood County to drive all the way to Boone, 21 North Carolina to take a test. 22 locations close by. 23 We would not expect a So we will be having our But ultimately we are committed to if a child has 24 a hardship for transportation, we have made provisions in our 25 budget, again, on page 114. KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 And we also have a provision on (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 37 1 page 113 that addresses that specifically. In the event, which we don't anticipate, but if-- 2 3 in the event that we run short on those funds, we do have a 4 3 percent surplus in our budget that we can also reallocate 5 funds also. Also--Mr. Moody, anything you would like to add? 6 Mr. Moody: That pretty much covers it. 7 Ms. Nance: Okay. 8 Chairman Hill: Please. 9 Ms. Nance: I just have to ask questions 10 because it's hard for me to understand things sometimes. And 11 under Facility, you have a 3,000 square foot building in 12 North Carolina that serves as the administrative offices. 13 And I'm not a technology person, so Mr. Davis might can help 14 me. 15 all the world of IT stuff, where is that located? But anyway, all the infrastructure for doing this and Mr. Withrow: 16 Right. You're correct. We 17 will have a 3,000 square foot, or generally that size, space 18 that will be located in Wayne County in the area of 19 Goldsboro. 20 a place to store materials. 21 site. 22 And that will act as our administrative facility, It can also be used as a testing From the technology standpoint, that will be 23 provided by our service provider. 24 locations, one in Virginia. 25 off-site location in case of a hurricane, disaster, wherever KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 And they have two And they have an external, (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 38 1 in Virginia. Unfortunately, I don't remember where that's--I 2 want to say Chicago, but that may not be correct. 3 Okay. 4 backup, so if a hurricane, whatever were to strike--- It is? But that is an offline site, you know, near realtime Ms. Nance: 5 (interposing) I thought 6 about that, what would happen if anything went down, so 7 that's good. Mr. Withrow: 8 It wouldn't make any 9 difference because the other site would be up and running, 10 similar to what happened during 9/11 when the World Trade 11 Center was hit. 12 sites were up and running within one second. 13 anticipate the same type of functionality. Immediately in New Jersey their offline And we 14 Ms. Nance: Okay. 15 Chairman Hill: Any other questions on the Committee Member: Real quickly; as you 16 Thank you. operations? 17 18 mentioned, your facility is going to be in Goldsboro or Wayne 19 County. 20 chosen based on, you know, living in--the person who's going 21 to be in charge is going to be living in that area. 22 And I think I read in the application that was But then I looked at the counties that you're 23 looking at targeting. How were those districts chosen 24 because they're not--Wayne County was not one of the ones. 25 We're looking at what--I think it was Mecklenburg and Wake KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 39 1 and Guilford. Mr. Withrow: 2 Well, so far as the choice of 3 one county, you're right. 4 there. 5 have our hand on this--this school. 6 I am the board chair and I do live And the board recognizes that we absolutely want to However, we also realize that our--we can accept 7 students from any county in North Carolina. 8 really was part of the governance, but it's also that we 9 recognize that eastern North Carolina is underutilized or 10 11 So the location represented in the charter situation. However, when it came to the three schools that we 12 listed, or three school districts in the application, that 13 was really a function of the web based application form. 14 They only allow us to put in three districts. 15 have--if the form had allowed, we could have made up a 16 simulation of every school district in North Carolina. 17 Unfortunately, we only had to choose three. 18 We could And based on our evaluations, based upon our 19 polling data, these districts theoretically could provide the 20 most students of any of the counties. 21 make our simulation out of what a typical 1500 student load 22 would come from. 23 So we chose those to But the reality is we do anticipate that all--any 24 child in any county in North Carolina can apply. 25 definitely don't expect, as it shows in the application, 615 KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 And we (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 40 1 students are coming from Wake County because that would be 2 overrepresented. Chairman Hill: 3 4 Let's move to the financial plan section. 5 (Pause.) 6 Chairman Hill: Any questions? 7 Committee Member: Do y'all have any kind of 8 partnering or anything that's ever done with a local school 9 system to support them in any way while you're doing what 10 you're doing? 11 service and different kinds of things with the area they're 12 located. 13 I mean some charter schools do community Mr. Withrow: I would say that we would 14 definitely explore those type opportunities. 15 a functioning charter school yet, we have not broached those 16 arrangements. 17 other school districts as well, and for that matter 18 Communities in Schools, any other type of volunteer 19 organizations, civic groups, and whatnot, any way that would 20 benefit our students. 21 jump in on it because that's an area of his expertise. 22 Since we're not But definitely we are willing to work with I would like to ask Mr. Mitchell to Mr. Mitchell: Once again, I think we have a 23 wonderful opportunity to create a collaborative environment. 24 Because this is a pilot program, it is vitally important that 25 we include as many stakeholders across the state as possible. KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 41 1 So what we think is vitally important is that we fan out 2 across the state and that we begin to have conversations, 3 meaningful conversations, about what collaboration could look 4 like. There is a great opportunity for us to not only 5 6 engage school districts, but also those school districts that 7 have partnerships with grassroots organizations. 8 for us to serve the unique needs of our students, the program 9 delivery is one piece. 10 piece. 11 whole student. 12 In order Addressing academic needs is another But we really want to make sure that we address the And in order to address the whole student, we've 13 got to have other resource partners at the table to help--to 14 help undergird the academic experience. 15 virtual environment does not mean that unique needs of the 16 students completely go away. 17 Just because it is a So we want to make sure to engage the stakeholders 18 who are working with those students where they may be, the 19 school districts that are accustomed to dealing with students 20 in a particular geographic area, and then creating a map that 21 shows the overlay of those service organizations against 22 where our student populations are coming from. 23 Committee Member: Is that being done anywhere 24 else, any other schools that this--this company--from K12 25 that's partnered? KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 42 Mr. Mitchell: 1 I believe there's a very 2 unique partnership in Arizona. 3 YMCA, boys and girls clubs, and other community organizations 4 that are in partnership with the statewide charter. 5 it's a wonderful model for North Carolina. Committee Member: 6 I believe there are 20 plus I'm guessing somebody on the 7 phone wants to ask a question, maybe. 8 Chairman Hill: 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 I think So if you're listening in, you may need to take us off of speakerphone because we can hear--Committee Member: (interposing) Or did they want to ask a question? Chairman Hill: ---the pushback, the flowback, of if you have any questions, please chime in. Committee Member: I have a small question about 16 the budget with health insurance. 17 administrator the health insurance is $12,000 a year, but for 18 the teachers it's like $6,000 a year. 19 full-time employees; correct? 20 difference there? 21 Mr. Withrow: I notice that for the But the teachers are So why is there a big You're correct. The teachers 22 are full-time employees just like the executive director is. 23 I'm trying to find that line item where you're saying that 24 the salary differentiation is different. 25 Committee Member: KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 I believe it's on page 121, (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 43 1 health insurance $12,000 under Administrative for one person 2 it says, but $6,000--Mr. Withrow: 3 All right. What Mr. Mitchell 4 was explaining to me was the fact that it is--it is a 5 percentage of the salary is what--if I understood correctly. 6 Committee Member: The health insurance is? 7 Mr. Mitchell: It's just a pro forma 8 percentage of the salary. That's the delta. So the 9 executive director's salary is higher, and so what was 10 attributed against it was a projected cost of insurance at 11 the percentage rate. Committee Member: 12 I have a question about class 13 size. 14 what the class size max and mins are? 15 Could you--could you discuss your understanding of Mr. Withrow: Well, as we've stated in our 16 charter application that in the lower grades we are expecting 17 no greater than--which is based on also the state law--that 18 50 children per teacher or 50 students per teacher. 19 at our high school grades it's 150 to 1 teacher ratio. 20 Committee Member: And then Well, help me understand. 21 Does that mean one teacher to 150 students at one time or is 22 it one teacher to 30 students per section or--- 23 Mr. Withrow: Yeah. Essentially the 150-- 24 that does not mean they will be all at one time. 25 in a traditional semester based school, you're going to have KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 Just like (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 44 1 essentially 30 students or 25, whatever per class. And 2 that's the way it will be assigned out with--with our school 3 as well. 4 students. We'll have just one class all online with 150 Maybe Ms. Gifford can add more. 5 Ms. Gifford: (inaudible) per section. 6 Mr. Withrow: Yeah, there will be sections. 7 Ms. Nance: Can I ask--- 8 Chairman Hill: (interposing) Ms. Nance: And I realize our time is-- 9 Yeah, go ahead. 10 11 however you want to do it, but my--okay. I have seen a lot 12 of different ways that you can do--teach classes through 13 technology. 14 hearing one on one, small groups, and things like that. So I guess what I'm trying to visualize is I'm 15 When--most of my students who've taken an online 16 class do it where they never really talk--sometimes they'll 17 speak with the teacher one on one if they made the phone call 18 or if they are on the computer with that teacher. 19 But is the--do you have a way to do like an inter- 20 active distance learning center where the teacher--explain to 21 me the different forms. 22 never really talked to anybody. 23 Blackboard or one of those type things. 24 25 I'm old, and the online I took I It was all done through And then--but in my school I have an interactive distance learning center where we can put a class in there KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 45 1 and the teacher is somewhere else and they teach. 2 that too? Do you do Am I making sense because--- 3 Ms. Gifford: (interposing) 4 Ms. Nance: ---I'm not a good tech Ms. Gifford: Yes, ma'am, you make sense. 5 Yes, ma'am. person. 6 7 So I think the intent is that the students will be based in 8 their homes, not in a classroom. 9 teacher is replicating that experience virtually, and so the 10 teacher will be trained how to have classroom management in a 11 virtual setting with a class of like 20-ish students and 12 actually teaching them real time. 13 homes. 14 But the intent is that the They will be in their The teacher will be in her home. So they will have interaction. The expectation, 15 again, is that they will have regular interaction, in some 16 cases required interaction, depending on what that 17 individualized learning plan says. 18 Ms. Nance: So if I'm in my home and I've 19 got my computer in front of me and here's my screen, can I 20 see my teacher in real time and talk with her? 21 other children, are they in little screens around that I can 22 see them too or do I just hear them or I don't at all? 23 just--how does that work? 24 25 Ms. Gifford: variety of all of those things. KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 Yes, ma'am. And then the I It could be a Most likely what will happen (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 46 1 is the teacher will be able to see the student. 2 will be able to see the teacher. 3 each other--- The student The students will not see 4 Committee Member: (interposing) Each other. 5 Ms. Gifford: ---for security purposes. 6 Additionally, there is the ability to have students inter- 7 acting. 8 and they are in the outline phase where they're doing their 9 web map, their mapping of ideas, I would put them in little If I am having them write an essay, for instance, 10 breakout rooms. 11 And as the teacher, I would be able to see the little groups 12 of three and I would be able to see what they're doing. 13 I would have three kids in a breakout room. I would give them whiteboard privileges. 14 would be writing for each other. 15 each other real time. 16 they're saying. 17 and I would cause them to interact with each other. 18 They They would be talking with I would be able to listen to what I would be able to see what they're saying And then I'd pull the whole class back together, 19 all 20 of them back together, and I would have them reporting 20 out to each other on what they did, you know, just basically 21 converting good teaching practices from the brick and mortar 22 setting into a virtual setting. 23 Ms. Nance: In that chat room is there 24 discussion through writing, though? 25 Ms. Gifford: KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 It's not through verbal? There is both, ma'am. (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 47 1 Ms. Nance: And verbal? 2 Ms. Gifford: Yes, both verbal and writing, 4 Ms. Nance: Okay. 5 Ms. Gifford: Yes. 6 Chairman Hill: Okay. 7 Committee Member: I have a couple of questions. 3 yes. 8 I read--and I hate to go back to the educational plan, but I 9 have something under education and governance real quickly. There were several things in the educational plan 10 11 that referred to "We may offer" or "We plan to offer." 12 some of them were kind of gray whether you're going to offer, 13 you will offer, or they're just kind of maybes. 14 language was in there a lot. Ms. Gifford: 15 So That Can you tell me why? So if I may, the application 16 has very clearly outlined what is minimally required. I 17 think that what we've heard from the board is that they want 18 options depending on what that student population looks like. They're expecting certain kinds of students to 19 20 come, and so they are thinking that they may need more credit 21 recovery options. 22 course therapy--or course selection immediately rather than 23 in year two. There's some of this that they are going to phase 24 25 They may need a secondary occupational in. I think what we have heard from them is they have the KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 48 1 expectation that they will run a very compliant school out of 2 the gate and be able to serve all students well and then work 3 on customizing things further in year two and lay good plans 4 in year one for further customization. 5 able have what's minimally required for student success in 6 year one and work toward customization based on the students 7 who walk through that virtual door. 8 9 But the goal is to be So I believe what they were trying to do is lay out options that they have indeed thought about serving these 10 different populations. 11 but they're going to roll those plans out once they know who 12 actually enrolls. 13 14 15 16 And they have plans for serving them, Committee Member: Who wrote the--who wrote the application? Ms. Gifford: I think it was a collaboration. 17 Committee Member: Okay. 18 Mr. Withrow: Yeah, there were. There were 19 multiple people involved. 20 We also--our service provider was involved and then we also 21 worked with Eddie Goodall and his group and--to help create 22 this application and our board attorney. 23 sure that we had plenty of eyes looking on it because we 24 wanted to give you the best application we possibly could. 25 The board members were involved. Committee Member: KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 Okay. We wanted to make So will the board be (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 49 1 meeting monthly or quarterly? 2 mentioned both in there. Mr. Withrow: 3 I was not clear. It is. I think it It is both mentioned 4 in there. 5 quarter--once per quarter. 6 during the regular school cycle we will be meeting every 7 month. However, we are also stating that Committee Member: 8 9 Minimally, there is a call for at least a And where will you be meeting, in Wayne County? Mr. Withrow: 10 We're not--we haven't worked 11 out that part of it yet. It could be online, you know, a 12 virtual meeting, which also would allow the parents to 13 participate virtually as well. 14 see demographically, are scattered across the entire state, 15 so it could be a virtual meeting with parents virtually 16 involved and of course any member of the public for that 17 matter. The board members, as you can 18 Chairman Hill: Okay. 19 Committee Member: Just one final--oh, I'm Mr. Davis: I'm curious as to why you 20 sorry. Go. 21 22 chose to do a K-12 school as opposed to a 9-12 school, which 23 might be more comfortable for people understanding virtual 24 education. 25 virtual school sounds almost like public funded home Not to sound argumentative, but elementary KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 50 1 schooling. Mr. Mitchell: 2 I'm not sure this is a very 3 academic response, but I do know that digital natives are 4 early adopters of the digital space. 5 children have been that the use of mobile devices--if we're 6 going to do it as a pilot project, we also have to look at 7 the baseline assumptions that we're making. We know that kids from grades K through 3 are 8 9 My own experiences with using digital devices more than ever before. To get good 10 data off year one, I think it's important to adjust learning 11 styles and the delivery of the program to that incoming 12 kindergarten population. From there we can get 13 baseline data on engagement and usage. 14 Chairman Hill: One last question. 15 Committee Member: One final question that I 16 have. 17 things, so this is your chance to dispel any rumors or 18 mistruths, whatever. 19 Okay. So--and again, you know, we read lots of Can you tell me if you have been terminated--in 20 fact terminated by states, and if so, how many? 21 hear rumors of three, four, five different states who either 22 have terminated or are working to terminate relationship with 23 K12, and that's concerning. 24 25 Mr. Withrow: You know, we I guess what I would say to you is that K12 has not functioned in the state of North KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 51 1 Carolina nor has our charter as of yet. 2 Committee Member: Right. 3 Mr. Withrow: We are of course asking for a 4 positive response from you-all, so we don't have that 5 experience. 6 experiences that K12 has experienced, and one of their 7 representatives is here and they probably could address that 8 because I can't discuss how North Carolina's is because 9 they've not been utilized yet. However, I know that there has been other Committee Member: 10 Yeah. I'd like to hear about 11 K12 and their relationship in other states, if they've been 12 terminated or are in the process of being so. Ms. Gifford: 13 Yes, ma'am. There are no 14 charters that have been revoked that we have been partnered 15 with a nonprofit charter board. 16 have not terminated contracts. 17 contracts that have not renewed. 18 managing the school, K12 has continued as a curriculum 19 provider. Nonprofit charter boards There are a handful of And rather than continue as Like in Colorado, for instance, K12 still has 20 21 three schools that it manages in Colorado and one school that 22 it provides the curriculum to, but that contract was not 23 terminated. 24 contract to a curriculum contract. 25 contracts that have been terminated, nor any charters that It was--it was shifted from a management KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 But there are no (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 52 1 have been revoked. Committee Member: 2 Okay, so not charters 3 revoked, but are there states that are ending services with 4 K12 as a service provider? Ms. Gifford: 5 6 services to states. K12 does not provide managed We partner with--- 7 Committee Member: (interposing) Well, with--- 8 Ms. Gifford: (interposing) I'm sorry; so 9 we partner with districts or with charter schools. And so at 10 this point the states have not terminated those either. 11 There is discussion of potential ending of a--not a charter 12 school, but a district program in Tennessee at the end of the 13 year, but the law actually sunsets. 14 2015, the virtual law in Tennessee sunsets. 15 school could be closed if that--if that legislation is not 16 continued. 17 Mr. Withrow: And so on June 30th of And so that I'd also like to add, if I 18 may, as I saw Mr. Medley with his red card--I did want to 19 also let committee members know that we are--the board is 20 very committed to working with you and making this a 21 successful experience. 22 Dr. Townsend sent us the rubric on this past 23 Thursday, and the board has pored over the questions that 24 you-all had and we have worked on responses to them and would 25 love to give them to you when this session is over. KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 We want (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 53 1 to show you we are making the commitment that, you know, we 2 will do everything we can to make this the most successful 3 school in North Carolina. 4 Chairman Hill: I have one final question. 5 Could you--the K12 representative--could you elaborate in 6 terms of the difference between being a management organiza- 7 tion versus a curriculum provider? 8 address any challenges and successes that you may have had in 9 Pennsylvania? 10 Ms. Gifford: And could you also Absolutely, Martez. So K12 11 provides management and curriculum services typically to 12 charter schools, but to some districts, like as in the case 13 of Tennessee. 14 for, you know, recommending policies and actually getting 15 things done day to day in the school. 16 And that is where K12 has the responsibility K12 also provides curriculum to over 2,000 school 17 districts and charter schools across the state (sic). 18 are roughly between 40 and 50 charter schools where we have a 19 management relationship, but there are like 2,000 where K12 20 provides courses to them. 21 of courses to full-time courses, but K12 does not have 22 responsibility for managing, making policy recommendations, 23 or anything like that. 24 buckets that it falls into. 25 There And it could range from a couple So that is kind of the two different With respect to Pennsylvania, the charter is up KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 54 1 for renewal for one of our managed schools in Pennsylvania. 2 We have two schools we manage in Pennsylvania, and one of 3 them is up for renewal at the end of this fiscal year. And that school board is very responsible and went 4 5 through a very detailed RFP process for all of the different 6 components of the school, not just management, but all the 7 components of the school. 8 different contracts to different vendors for different parts 9 of running a school. And they have awarded eight K12 was awarded the curriculum contract for that 10 11 school moving forward beginning July 1 of 2015, providing the 12 charter is renewed. 13 chain of events that happens when a charter is up for 14 renewal. 15 charter being renewed, and K12 will be the curriculum 16 provider pursuant to that RFP moving forward. So all of this coincided with the normal They went through an RFP process in advance of the Chairman Hill: 17 Okay. Thank you. Thank you 18 very much. 19 summary review and allow the committee to discuss what your 20 pleasure may be in terms of making a recommendation to the 21 state board. 22 then call the roll in terms of what the recommendation may 23 be, so Deanna? 24 25 I would like to spend some time receiving a So let's spend maybe five to ten minutes and Dr. Townsend-Smith: Okay. So during the discussion there were concerns raised on if K12 had been KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 55 1 terminated in any state. Specific questions were raised 2 about the incident in PA. In the mission, purposes, and goals section there 3 4 were questions regarding the reasons for choosing the 5 particular EMO and on who helped to write the application. 6 There were also questions directed on the rationale for 7 opening K-12 instead of 9-12. In the education plan section, the committee 8 9 discussed the instructional method and strategies concerning 10 what the teacher does and student activities. 11 numerous EC concerns raised as well as how the educational 12 plan will work for K-3 students. 13 proposed seems difficult and needs further clarity. 14 Questions were directed to the applicant group to address the 15 concerns. 16 There were Implementation of ideas State testing compliance was explored during the 17 interview to understand how the school will comply with 18 testing requirements for the state. 19 were raised on the process and procedures of suspension and 20 expulsion of students. 21 questions regarding the areas of the application where they 22 stated that they may offer certain services. 23 Additionally, concerns The applicant group was also asked In governance and capacity the role of the 24 executive director and the principal was explored. 25 were also questions raised on where and how often the board KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 There (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 56 1 would meet to oversee the school. In operations there were transportation concerns 2 3 regarding transporting students to testing centers and other 4 locations. 5 with the location for both were raised in addition to backup, 6 if there was a breakdown in communication due to a storm, et 7 cetera. 8 particular location was chosen surrounding the rationale of 9 the districts chosen within the application. 10 The facility cost and technology infrastructure There were also questions raised on why the And finally, in the financial plan the partner- 11 ships were questioned, if the applicant group had formed 12 partnerships to involve stakeholders. 13 asked regarding the disparity between the administrator and 14 teacher health insurance differences in the budget. 15 size minimum clarifications was a question of the group, and 16 clarification on how students would interact with students-- 17 how students would interact with each other in different ways 18 was also explored. 19 20 21 Chairman Hill: Okay. There was a question Class I'll open the floor for any additional questions or comments. Ms. Nance: I actually have a question of 22 DPI, and I don't know if that's you, Martez, or Joel. 23 anybody looked at what it will cost DPI to be able to audit 24 these students actually being in wherever they're supposed to 25 be and doing their thing? KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 Has I know when they do our school, (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 57 1 they make visits. They come see the students in the seats. 2 And I don't know how DPI keeps up with that for this kind of 3 a setting. Dr. Medley: 4 If you heard the conversation 5 that began where there had been meetings between members from 6 the department with representatives from both the applicant 7 groups, there are some pieces that are being looked at as far 8 as what the funding is going to look like, the student 9 accounting, withdrawal rates, those type of pieces. So a lot 10 of that is being worked out to be presented to the state 11 board in January. Is there a specific analysis of what that is going 12 13 to cost per person or per school? I do not know if that 14 exists, and I don't think that has been calculated or 15 tallied. 16 of the schools, just like we would normally do as a depart- 17 ment for any of the charter schools. 18 to be incumbent upon each group to provide to us when 19 requested. 20 part of the charter agreement. There is going to have to be, you know, monitoring Some things are going And a lot of that is being packaged together as 21 Chairman Hill: Other comments or questions? 22 Ms. Taylor: Well, I don't think we can 23 ask them any more questions; right? 24 Chairman Hill: Well, we--- 25 Ms. Taylor: (interposing) KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 Or maybe--- (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 58 1 Chairman Hill: (interposing) We want to 2 spend maybe the next five, seven minutes and then figure out 3 what the will of the committee is. 4 Ms. Taylor: I'm still a little bit 5 concerned and maybe other--the committee can say if you've 6 heard something different. 7 happens in the home since we're putting a lot of responsi- 8 bility on the parent as a--as the learning coach. 9 there's a huge responsibility there. 10 I'm still concerned about what I mean Now, we're dealing with a typical home school 11 family, which could be a large percentage of these families 12 for all I know. 13 served in that role. 14 Those--I would assume many of those parents But it's just real discerning (sic) that we may 15 have students in a situation that might not be as structured, 16 especially when we're talking about young children, K-3, 17 which we know how critical it is for the social aspects of 18 the academics--it's more than just, you know, the--you know, 19 teaching reading and math. 20 teaching a child how to respond in a structured academic 21 environment. 22 another committee member who could speak up and share 23 thoughts on that or how you've interpreted it. 24 25 There's a lot that goes on in So I--you know, it's--you know, maybe there's Ms. Nance: Well, I know from my experience that--and we're supplemental, so we're very KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 59 1 different. We're not the full load. But there is-- 2 particularly in the summer--you were talking about summer. 3 There is an underestimation on the part of the family often 4 about the amount of time required. And I didn't get to ask, but I wanted to talk 5 6 about how do they really communicate the amount of time it 7 requires. 8 learn what's there to be learned, it requires most of the 9 same time commitment it would if you were going to show up in 10 It does require--to do it well as a student and to a traditional school. And so, you know, I think that is--- Ms. Taylor: 11 Right. Well, you know, I do 12 think we're--North Carolina is ready to look at a virtual 13 charter. 14 ready to look at it. 15 There is no doubt. And I think, you know, we're I think what scares me is the jumping in too big, 16 too fast, too large, too long, you know, because to me a 17 pilot is a pilot. 18 they indicated on their first screen, you know, we want to--I 19 think how they worded it, we want something refined, studied, 20 reported on. 21 as I'm assuming most stakeholders. 22 And we do need a pilot. We need some--as And that is what the state board wants as well So I do have a concern that we just are very 23 careful in how we do this because it's not necessarily that 24 we're just opening up a virtual charter school big time 25 forever and ever. We hope that's where we're going to go, KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 60 1 but this is a pilot. And I think we can keep that in our minds is that 2 3 it's a pilot, so that we need to be very careful on the 4 parameters and what we're setting up for the integrity of the 5 children's education. 6 for three years, but who's going to suffer if it doesn't go 7 well? I mean, you know, you can do a study 8 Committee Member: Right. 9 Ms. Taylor: You know, when you look at a 10 kindergartner four years from now and they're in fourth grade 11 or fifth grade and we let things go on that were not, you 12 know, in the best interest of the child. 13 to remember the children and that we're here to provide the 14 best education for the child. 15 first and foremost. 16 Ms. Nance: And I think we have And I think that needs to be See, I wondered if it were 17 possible to not necessarily start with so many grades where 18 if you chose a section of it, maybe in the middle or 5 19 through 8 or 9 or something right in there, where you--and 20 just did it on a little smaller scale. 21 I don't know how that works for them financially, 22 but it's where you're focusing all your attention more in one 23 area than trying to do it so broadly and then expand in both 24 directions, but if it's a pilot, start out where the first 25 year it's a little--it's just not such a broad spectrum. KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 61 And I'm hearing tons of promises, tons of 1 2 wonderful ideas, but they all aren't going to get implemented 3 in the first four years. 4 of things. You're spreading a tremendous span I don't know if that's a possibility. Chairman Hill: 5 The state board initially 6 recommended to the legislature that we establish a pilot I 7 believe from grades 6 through 12. 8 adopted in the budget directed us to establish a pilot for 9 grades K through 12. And the legislation So, you know, the applicants I suppose 10 could have suggested "We prefer to start at 9-12 and then go 11 down to 8" and so on and so forth. 12 application basically starts in kindergarten. 13 you raise a--Ms. Nance: 14 15 16 17 18 one does. But I think this And I think (interposing) I know this (interposing) I think you I just didn't know--Chairman Hill: raise a very, very good point. Ms. Nance: ---if that were a 19 possibility, that--I know when we're doing charter school 20 applications for traditional charter schools--do we really 21 get traditional charter schools--that we are--our advisory 22 board sometimes makes stipulations. 23 that--I realize there's law that's working with this one too. 24 25 Ms. Taylor: So I just didn't know Or if we have the luxury of having a pilot that's dealing with elementary and then maybe KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 62 1 perhaps we have a pilot that's dealing with, you know, 2 another clientele. 3 on all at one time. That is a wide range for someone to take 4 And again, I just--I think both of these 5 applicants certainly bring a lot to us to, you know, consider 6 with experience and whatnot. 7 about the children first. 8 is a tough call. 9 decision. 10 I just think we have to think And you know, it is a tough--this I wish I did not have to make this Committee Member: I do think we need to think 11 about the taxpayer as well because I'm not sure exactly how 12 this kind of education will impact the whole state with the 13 education of all the children because of some of the 14 variables that I've heard. 15 Chairman Hill: Okay. So I want to close out 16 the discussion with your comment unless there are other 17 comments that we want to put on the table. 18 Committee Member: Well, so much great can 19 happen for students in the online learning environment. 20 mean really it is--it can be engaging. 21 It can be productive. 22 talk a lot about learning is online, and you know, North 23 Carolina is ready in a lot of ways for this. 24 worries about it for sure. 25 I It can be personal. It's full of promise. And you know, I There are some My--you know, reading the application and then KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 63 1 listening to the board members talk, you know, I really 2 wanted to hear more specifics about how they were going to do 3 the job of teaching and learning. They talk a lot about assessment and, you know, 4 5 assessments are great inside the machine. But what is the 6 teacher doing because that's as critical in the online 7 environment as it is in the face-to-face environment: 8 is the teacher doing, where is she or he spending their time, 9 and what are the other extracurricular things, if you will, what 10 that they're going to have to do, run a club or lead this 11 thing or do that thing for the school. There's a lot of good promise--I think you called 12 13 it promise--and there is a lot of promise words in here. 14 I worry that the--in the conversation there weren't a lot of 15 specific examples of what those words mean or how that would 16 look or what the student would do, so--Chairman Hill: 17 But I think these are all great 18 comments and I want to ask what is the pleasure of the 19 committee. 20 each member to say yea or nay in terms of moving this forward 21 to the State Board of Education. 22 Ms. Nance: I'll ask Deanna if she will call the roll and ask And we're--just to be clear, 23 we're talking about moving forward with a pilot for the state 24 board to consider our recommendations--- 25 Chairman Hill: KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (interposing) Right. (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 64 1 Ms. Nance: ---in the final analysis--- 2 Chairman Hill: (interposing) 3 Ms. Nance: ---as a pilot. 4 Chairman Hill: I think it's very important Right. 5 for us to sum up all of the concerns and the--you know, the 6 challenges as well as the potential successes. 7 questions that have been put on the table I think will help 8 us to figure out how we monitor and, you know, provide 9 oversight while at the same time keeping our eye on the 10 performance of that student. 11 appropriate questions. And the So you all raised very, very 12 Dr. Townsend-Smith: Okay. 13 Mr. Davis: Move forward. 14 Dr. Townsend-Smith: Helen Nance? 15 Ms. Nance: I didn't want to be next. 16 Mr. Davis: I didn't want to be first. 17 Ms. Taylor: I don't want to go at all. 18 Ms. Nance: I know. 19 Dr. Townsend-Smith: (interposing) 20 Paul Davis? It's hard. I--- I can come back to you, if you like. 21 Ms. Nance: Okay. 22 Ms. Taylor: Come back to me. 23 Committee Member: We're just going to pass it 24 25 around the table a few times. Dr. Townsend-Smith: KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 Kevin Piacenza? (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 65 Mr. Piacenza: 1 2 It's hard for me to hear, so--Dr. Townsend-Smith: 3 4 I'm here. Okay. So we're asking for your vote to move forward--- 5 Mr. Piacenza: (interposing) 6 Dr. Townsend-Smith: ---with a recommendation. 7 Mr. Piacenza: I'm responding as to 8 recommending it just move on toward the board. 9 positive--I have a positive reaction to that. 10 Chairman Hill: He votes yes. 11 Dr. Townsend-Smith: Okay. 12 Yeah. I am I vote yes. Thank you. Andrew Broy? 13 (No response.) 14 Dr. Townsend-Smith: Liz Colbert? 15 Dr. Colbert: I think we have to move 16 forward, move it forward. 17 Dr. Townsend-Smith: Andrew Cox? 18 Mr. Cox: Yes. 19 Dr. Townsend-Smith: Okay. 20 with--oh, I need Helen and Becky. 21 Ms. Taylor: 22 The motion passes I do want to move it forward. I want to move it forward to the state board--- 23 Dr. Townsend-Smith: Right. 24 Ms. Taylor: ---and put it in their hands 25 to structure this so that both the applicant and the students KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 66 1 and the families will all be successful. 2 Dr. Townsend-Smith: Okay. 3 Ms. Nance: I agree. 4 Dr. Townsend-Smith: Okay, and then one last 5 That will be fine. person, Sherry Thomas? 6 (No audible response.) 7 Chairman Hill: Okay. Thank you for 8 presenting your information, and committee members, thank you 9 for your deliberation, the questions, and for moving this 10 forward to the state board. 11 break and we'll move to the next presenters. 12 much. KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 So let's take a seven minute Thank you very (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886 67 C E R T I F I C A T E I, Kay K. McGovern, do hereby certify that the foregoing pages 3 through 66 represent a true and accurate transcript of a digital recording of the proceedings held in Raleigh, North Carolina on Wednesday, December 17, 2014. This, the 5th day of January, 2015. _______________________________________ /s/ Kay K. McGovern Kay K. McGovern, CVR-CM Transcriptionist KAY McGOVERN & ASSOCIATES Suite 117, 314 West Millbrook Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27609-4380 (919) 870-1600 FAX 870-1603 (800) 255-7886