u.s. v. Osmakac. Case No. 
Exhibit 2 to Government's Motion in Limine Regarding Overhear Recordings
FILED UNDER SEAL

Transcript from Januarv 7. 2012

JC: [Ul] drop that car somewhere.

UCE: He's gonna drop the car at the target. The target changed. got too
many police. We drove by some district, what you call it? [Ul] some streets with, uh, clubs in it.
He said he has some good clubs up there that he saw, and today he?s gonna do it tonight.

KE: 0n Howard?

UCE: Is that where it was? We drove Friday.

KM: Howard and Armenia.

UCE: It's before because it was? because I think Ybor was still ahead of us. i

think it--l'm? not sure. Don?t ask me because-

JC: Is it where y/ all turned around?

UCE: No. No.

KL: Ybor runs a long way on the street, clubs on each end, 

Well, i knewyou were orrHoward. There's adome bars, on Howard and 
Armenia.

UCE: It was when we were-At one point we were by the highway. We were coming

back to get on the highway and he pointed out a one-way street that was coming out. He says
the clubs-

KE: That?s Howard. [Ul] Howard is a onevway.

UCE: Okay.

KE: it goes one-way when it 

UCE: Uh-u.
KM: Yes, sir.
UCE: Okay, so, so he pointed out. He says there's a bunch of clubs down there. He

says some of them are some redneck clubs with a, you country clubs
or something like that.

 

it: Not really.
UM: lt's a strip club.
UM: It?s pretty yuppie. 
UM: Two [Ull
KM: White yuppie 
UM: That could be-
KM: lt's upper income.
UCE: He might have just been saying it, I don't 
RR: You know, we can he went 
d?ut he's?why is  right now F's?going to get staged where those clubs

are. Because he?s?he's gonna stage that car 

RR: [Ul] He?s just out into 
KM: Kevin, do you want that out over the radio 
RR: He just went south. He made a turn 

UCE: He's gonna check it. He's trying to ?nd out what-what exit this is so he can get
back. So, what he's gonna do is drop that car off at where those clubs a cab from
there to go pick up his car and bring his car back here. We're gonna load up his car.

KM: Do we want to abort the green?they are up?they are on the way to do the
green Honda. Do we want to abort that?

JC: I'd say, yeah.

KE: How close are they?

KM: They?they just left.

JC: We don?t know when he's gonna get there.

KE: Yeah, I'd say we abort the green Honda.

KM: Okay. Do you want to put that command out, or do you want me to do it?

JC: Well, do we have a real time tracker on this?

RR: Yes. This one one, yes.

UM: Okay, alright.

JC: -'cause as long as it's moving we know he?s not at the green Honda, so we may

have a little bit of leeway.

KM: Your   

CC: What are they doing it? lust sweeping it to see what's in it? 

KM: [Ul] weapons, 

JC: Where are they?-where are they leaving from?

KM: This command post. A Task Force Of?cer and a Tech Agent have already left the

command post and are heading

JC:

KM:

UCE:

KM:

JC:

KE:

UCE:

KE:

UM:

KM:

UM:

KM:

KE:

JC:

KM:

UCE:

JC:

1C:

UCE:

Here the of?ce?

The?the command post at the of?ce.

Okay.

The keys are here but the Tech Agent can break in 

{Ulj just let them?just let them go, and just see where he goes.

is that alright?

That's ?ne.

Let?s see where he 

Yeah 

Your call.

They can get there before he 
Your call.

[Ul] Oh, shit {Ul} 

We'll just call him off if he looks like he might--

?than I go tell?lx/l?cPhersonil?H] what the plan is?

He's just gonna throw shit about people being on him all day [Ul]

Probably saw some cars but it wasn't us.

Everything goln alright?

I don't know because-

JC: The target thing?

UCE: No it?s just, it got ugly at ?rst, because he's like changing things as we were
going. Like changing as we were going, he's like, he wanted to do different things, and basically
I just [Ul] it?s getting a little too unorganized, why don?t we just call it, you know, 
[noise] [Ul] with the Holidays and everything, and he's like I don't want to wait a couple of days,
it?s gonna get hot. [Ul] [Noise] You know, he was kind of wishy-washy in all that stuff but
when uh, pulled over-l took him, we went driving around and we got off 275, like one
exit off 275?

JC: Uh-u.
UCE: We got off-vi pulled into the parking lot of some when I pulled

in the parking lot of the supermarket, opened the tailgate and showed him the bomb in the
back, and he?s 

KE: He didn't take any weapons with him, right?
UCE: No.
CC: Oh, the question was: Did you happen to search his bag? Do you know what?s

inside his bag?

UCE: That little bag he's carrying?

CC: Yes.

it was a galed- -.
KE: and a bottle of water 

UCE: Yeah, it was nothing. There was nothing in it.

CC: Because we were concerned thatuwe want to make sure he has no access to no
weapons.

UCE: No, there was nothing in that bag.

5

-  in background): The target?s changed. for sure

CC: Alright

[Pause]
UCE: You could tell Sara that she got heruwhat you call it, Video, his suicide video
JC: How?s he planning on getting that on the internet? Are you doing that?
UCE: No, l?m supposed to hold it for a couple of weeks till everything died down and

I'm supposed to give it the Bos?his 

JC: Hodzic
KE: Hodzic
UCE: Yeah, his Bosnian brother. I'm supposed to give it to the CH5 to give to the

Bosnian brother and tell the CH5. This is for the Bosnian brother.

JC: I wonder if we should change our interview strategy tonight. [Ul]
UCE: And the The 805?

KE: Where we, where we at on here?

UCE: The Bosnian [Ul] what to do with it or something like that.

[Ul conversation] 

 

. It sounds like it might be
somewhere on Howard Avenue based on where the subject and UCE were driving. Based on
how he described the street.

UM2: Hopefully they'll go, do it in an hour and come back.

[Ul conversation]

UCE: i gave him 20 dollars.

JC: For a cab or whatever.

UCE: Yeah, because I didn't know how much money? [break] {Ul} make sure he
had enough money and I didn?t want him to get fucking stuck up there just because he didn't
have enough money to get a cab. [Ul]

UM: He didn?t take any weapons with him did he?
UCE: No.
KE: Well there?s just a bunch of bars and restaurants there and I think too

many cops in Ybor and that's why he didn?t like Ybor. 

JC: is that where he pointed out the stuff? Or was it closer to here off of 
KE: Hey, he didn't take the pistol, right?
UCE: No.
KE: No, he didn?t take anything yet.
UCE: Took nothing.
TB: When you said he was wishy-washy. You say as far the target goes?
[Ull
UCE: Right? 
 Yeah,  are  a search of the?g?reveun car, we may want tomabort?that
to get it done.
UCE: He changed--he changed the target. He changed the target. The target was
definitely changed. 

UCE: [Ul] go down to Howard.
UCE: [Ul] he was changing [Ul]

 

TB: [Ui] I've got like muscle milk (Ul] 

UCE: [Ul] appreciate it, appreciate it.

KE: Hey Steve you?re breaking up. Are you talking to me?

JC: We got some trail mix.

UCE: No, it?s alright.

UCE: {Ul} I?m gonna have to pray with him probably next time. Next time he gets
here.

KE: And then the green car back here?

[Simultaneous conversation]
JC: Was that not the last prayer?

UCE: There's gonna be one at what you call it, there?s gonna be one at uhm, at uhm,
after midnight. If you [Ul] midnight 

JC: [Ul] hold on to that video [Ui] bottom line [Ui]

KM: Everything's ?ne. They have a tracker. Wittman put his. got his tracker laptop

$0:th followinethe I  

KE: [Ul] based on, what, what they were doing 

KM: He's heading to SoHo. He did leave the pistol, right?
UCE: Yes. Everything..l've got everything.

KM: Perfect. That was one question?-

KE:

KM:

KL:

CC:

KE:

RR:

KM:

UM:

KM:



RR:

KM:

1C:

KM:

UM:

UCE:

JC:

KM:

KL:

 [Ull case agent's 

Everyone?s been asking that.

[Noise] far so good.

Yeah, looking at midnight now.

water or anything [Ul]

I've got a water. Mine aren't coId but here, I?ve got three 
Kevin. Where?s the beer you promised?

That?ll be tomorrow.

That? ll come later.

That?ll be after the arrest goes down.

The case agent usualty buys 

Oh that?s right.

That?s true, the case agent usually pops for everybody.
Yeah, but the case agent? 5 an eteven.

That's ok.

[Ul] the case agent Is a S, A, yeah, is a or something
Yeah. That too.
The director 

He acted Iike he was nervous.

Huh?

When he was putting stuff on. He acted like he was nervous. He kept backing
away from 

UCE: Yeah.

CC: He looked nervous on the camera.

UCE: Yeah, he got excited. lthink he got excited when he saw the stuff.

KM: Oh yeah. You could tell. He was all like, like a, like a six year old in a toy store.

KL: What was he doin in the bathroom so long? Playin? with the gun? 
UCE: No, when.

RR: Howard and Armenia 

UCE: he was gonna, he was gonna pray, so he took a piss? so if he took a piss, he?s got

to wash everything.

KL: 

UCE: And then?and then after he washes everything-

RR: He has to clean himself.

UCE: . Yeah, .hirgeds to clean__himself,. cleans.himself,.he needs to do .-

[ritual cleaning] for prayers.

RR: And then we, we got him in the-
UCE: On the camera?

RR: Yeah. Praying.

UCE: Doing the wudu [ritual washing]?

10

UM1:

JC:

RR:

JC:

UCE:

UM:

KM:

KL:

KE:

KE:

UM:

KM:

KE:

KM:

KE:

RR:

KM:

RR:

KE:

Didn't we that part? At least when he was [Ui]

He was right here in this corder doing something with his hair.
He was just cleaning, still cleaning.

I guess so.

He did the wudu [ritual washing] in the what you call it, in the sink.
What?s wudu?

Ritualistic cleaning [Ul]

[Ul] down up, down up [Ui]

Let?s see what the tracker [Ul]

There's Howard there.

Uhum.

Well I bet there?s a gay bar or two down on Howard. Kevin?
What?

I just ?gured you?d know.

A gay bar on Howard? 

Armenia now and Southbound-

Yeah, ?cause that's one-way south? 

South on Armenia to go to 

Yeah, he can?t Now it makes sense.

11

UM:

RR:

KM:

RR:

KE:

JC:

JC:

UM:

UM:

RR:

I'll take six.

UM:

RR:

UCE:

[Ul]

Well, the bars are quite a ways down. He has to cross--
Yeah, they are way down.

Kennedy..

South Howard?s where all the [Ul]

[Noise]
[No Conversation]
[Ul] moving up there so he's coming this way.
[rustling]
You?re gonna turn your phone on
Yeah
I might have the command post start calling out the green Honda in [Ul]

[rustling]

[Ul] how many zeros? And you said that that? for how many seconds is that? 9k,

0k 
No, nothing.

From here, from here go from the pickup truck to the green Honda, set up

the green Honda, 

12

KL:

KM:

KL:

KM:

UM:

UM:

JC:

UM:

UM:

UCE:

KM:

And, Fifteenth

[Ul] their, their recorder

Actually I don?t think it moved

Right

[Ull

[lA rustling]

Okay

So I was just was seeing if younot

Yeah

{rustling}

[Ull

Let me know, let me know when you [Ul]

telling me one thing 

[rustling]

15

This draft transcript, in its current form, is for the sole purpose of review by the prosecuting attorneys
and should not be construed as a ?nal verbatim transcript. Further review may be necessary for. trial

purposes.

Case: 24).

Sessions: 1 of 7

Participants:

UM:

UF:

Unidentified male

UnideMi?ed female

Translation Key:

 

Ul: Unintelligible

lA: lnaudlble

SC: Simultaneous Conversation

CF: Faster you click 

JAB: 

CF: Pretty frickin? cool, right?

JAB: Yeah. 

CF: And then we used a - for that. So it should be ?ve recordings all total (Ul) CHS through
UCE.

TR: (UI) and while it won't make (Ul)
CF: (UI).

JAB: Beautiful.

CF: And that's all we have.

JAB: Thank you.

UF: Hey, how are you?

CF: Everything is right here.

JAB: You are wonderful.

CF:

JAB:

UF:

CF:

JAB:

UF:

UM:

JAB:

CF:

TR:

UF:

CF:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

JAB:

Although they re not quite of it is.
And then we have the enhanced forjust the 
(UI) go and do accounting (UI)
I'm sorry?
The enhanced It just the 

(UI)
(Ul)
Is that what we had?
me make sure
(UI) the issue is this other guy 
50 here you were successful (UI)

Do we still have that though?
the - on 12/7 so that's the only enhanced one that I have.
(UI) be able to ask for It?
I feel like more have been enhanced than that. But maybe that was -
This is the only one that have.

I have no idea.
And the was the car ride, correct?

Isn?t that when they were in the car together?
(Ul) what the hell dlfference does it make if we give that one back (Ul)

Or Is that the mosque situation or do you not remember?

UF:

JAB:

JAB:

CF:

UF:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

I can?t believe we still have that (Ul)

i don't remember.

You don't have to remember.

I was going to save that.



Oh my empty dip left (Ul) 
Where have you been it?s 

scraper and gum that's not mine.
Aren't they mints? 

And then noise] other stuff.

[Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

TR:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

TR:

(Ul) and what it may be (Ul)

And no one that you know of has actual summaries of these other than just having 
They? re all verbatim transcripts.

True.

Do you do you know where to ?nd those?

Yeah they? re over at Pat?s.

Or you can get them on yeah, you don?t have access to the S?drive.
Yeah i don't have access to your Share drive.

That?s right.

i have Headquarters shared drive.

Very well.

And Newark?s actually. Well, Newark loves me.



CF:

Well, maybe some day we will present to you the same amount of love that Newark does. I

would think that probably not but 

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

JAB:

TR:

JAB:

TR:

CF:

JAB:

Ha ha. I doubt it. Hey I can only handle so much anyway.

Yeah that's true.

Ha ha.

I don't know I think you can probably handle more than you know.
Thank you; that is all I needed.

0k.

Um, and then I?ll just get with the transcripts to look at to look at the duration and like how long
these things were and 

Ooh, and it's ok 12/ 5.
You?re a liar.

I'm sorry. I knew i had different 12/ S, not even deal with that

because 12/5 was the attempted one at the Mosque and that?s why we had that -
recording with him. [Background conversations and overlapping conversations]. And, uh, and
- but we didn't get anything 'cuz with just sat in the car, remember? That?s

when 

[Background conversation] on and on and on (UI) here's the thing; if you don't want us In your
life, (Ul) stay off the stupid website, don't even (Ul) you don't know about (Ul) AK-47 (Ul)

ls it really that long ago? [Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

12/5.

[Background conversation] don?t do all these things, that?s the way to get yourself in trouble.
(Uil 

Oh shit. _Holy fuck monkey, that?s that long ago.

[Background conversatan you seem like you?re making wise choices, you have a job, you?re
going to school [Ull chef (Ul)

[ml 3 month later [Ul] just now 

God why do 

that was, uh, [Background conversations and overlapping conversations]. So, you can put
that on there, i mean it's technically IDS ishis pocket. [Back ground
talk and noise].

JAB: Nothing came off of it.
CF: Nothing is on 

JAB: i shit, it was really that long ago? Well I?ve been here for three weeks now.
We been here the entire month of December.

CR: Good God woman.

JAB: know. .

CF: Enjoying this right?

TR: [Background conversation] You really want to do that?
JAB: Yeah actually. I?ve been having a blast.

TR: Yelled at him saying, quit doing this stuff, it's just stupid, quit smoking I mean I got all up
in his 

JAB: Haven?t you?

UM: was like, yes you we're not 

JAB: Haven?t it been more fun since i showed up though?
[Back ground talk and noise].

CF: l?ll give you that.

[Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

JAB: Ha. [Back ground noise]. Do you have like someone smiling in y0ur of?ce?


[Back ground talk and noises].

CF: For whatever reason, yeah. Well i give you all those, yeah. Alright. What are you working on


[Background conversations and overlapping conversations].
JAB: This.

CF: This?

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

And other timeline this is like my main tasking of the day.
Let me know if you i mean 12/5 

No. YouJust gave me what I need

[Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

JAB:

CF:

UF:

JAB:

UF:

TR:

JAB:

CF:

TR:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

UM1:

JAB:

CF:

UF1:

TR:

JC:

through the transcripts and get (Ul) gist of which one wants which. [Back ground talk] What's
the matter now? What's wrong?

Um, one of the tech guys wants to replace the he needs cover..so.
Went up 24/7 for 8 hours, everything

ok, know, it?s ole It's ok.

Oh I know it's ok, it?s just one more thing to have to deal with right now.

i was like, if you knew the manpower, like the [Ui] we were at headquarters 24/7,
Jacksonville was de?nitely there 

[several people are talking on top of each other].
lake, I know you're busy, can you share (Ul)

0k, thank you. I'll let you get back to real work then.
It's not really 

(Ul) so we did (Ul)

Ha.

Need anything else?

No. That is all i needed.

Give me a holler if you need anything right?
Thank you darling.

You?re very welcome.

Pardon me.

And first, his 

(Talking in background someone else.) I mean talking to him, it was 3 hours or something

like that, just steady stream of interfering (UI), it was just, what are you saying?

6

UCE:

JC:

UF1:

JC:

UF1:

NN:

UCE:

CF:

UCE:

JC:

Good deal.



Um, hello.

hours or something like that.

You look so much like him.

They going to make you stick around all weekend 

Oh no. No, no.

Yeah so you say.

Oh no, no, no. We?ve been talking about that, be done and disappear in (1A).

It was are you 

[Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

TR:

He blathered on for five minutes then one of us would you mean? And then he'd

blather on to what you?re saying? You?re trying to pull something out of him.

UFS:

CF:

[Simultaneous conversations]
Ha ha.

Hey Jaqueline?

[in the background, several people talking at the same time].

NN:

1C:

CF:

UCE:

JVB:

JVB:

CF:

JC:

JAB:

Do they think it?s going to be good enough?

(Ul) it made no sense (Ul)

Hey Jaqueiine?

Don't know (iA)

What did you write on the 302?

He said the sky is turning green and there are mushrooms out there.
Jaquellne? Jaqueline? [Background talk] 0n the 20" there was 
Yeah, that?s not far from (Ul)

Liar. he thought - on the 

the 

JAB: Thank you.

CF: Yes maam.

TR: He thinks we, US Government, caused the tsunami because we?re 
[Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

JAB: You got what you needed.

CF: She say I?m just a friend.

CF: She say I?m just a friend.

NN: i don?t say that, you say that.

[Background talk].

CF: Gosh well, you?re not you friends You sit close, doesn't mean you are close.
TR: Shut up and listen.

[There are many overlapping conversations)

UM3: Just benefits, not friends.

CF: Aah ok. But you say l'm just a friend.

UM: i mean, he was, he was just like you said heat the crap out of a little puppy dog or 
CF: With you, you got what i need. 

[Background talk and overlapping conversations].

[Laughter].

TR: (Ul) just listen!

JC: i was scared.

UF1: (Ul) little child bike home alone in the rain. Ha ha.

NN: (Ul) I know i get that all the time.

CF: Out of your fucking mind.

CF: Hey. Kenny is looking for cover for- Shit. He?s trying to replace 

NN: i did not want talk to anyone all day, was confinement.

CF:

UF:

Yeah. Oh. i don't know, hang on, i got to take this call man, hang on. [On the phone] Hey man.

don?t l?m not worried (Ull

[Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

CF:

TR:

JC:

UF:

UMS:

Hey let me call you back from a landline real quick, thanks. 

lwouldn't give my kid a gun and he doesn't deserve one either.

I would Ma gun alo?ng time before (Lil). I would  gun and let him like take
it to school with him a long time before uld run around with a gun.

That's so bad (Ul)

That?s true.

{Background conversations and overlapping conversationsUCE:
UCE:
JC:
UCE:
JC:

CF:

Yeah unfortunately tomorrow afternoon, it would be a long 



(On phone) Hey man how are you?

Yeah, Jake's dying to go back to see him. -
literally talked to every single one of them.



(in background) Hey what is he talking about? is he asking for this?
(On phone.) Yeah.

Franck

it's changed. The statutes that she had given 

Oh! don?t pay attention to any of those.

Sell 883?"?

[lever mind-then

I don't pay attention (Ul)

lwouldn?t either.

(On phone.) Oh my.

TR: (In background.) i can print the statutes that Sarah gave us but based on where we are 

128: What you think is, ok, whatever, here?s what i'm looking to do and both
know that we're, GS is going to be noncommittal, um, (Ui) you?re not there yet, you need


[Background conversations and overlapping conversations).

CF: (On phone.) Oh ok I was going to say, i talked to every team leader personally 
Ha ha. Alright, alright.

JZB: in background conversation) look at the best i can, many up what we have with
the elements, so that we can at least give them, and know even have it written and
say, sent'it up ahead of time (Ui) CPS know nothing is ever perfect because they all want it
ironclad, you know, but if we just say here are the what we 

UF: (Ul)
CF: (On phone.) Yeah, yeah, I hear you.

128: (in background.) And here?s what we intend to do at future meetings. Uh, in order to lock in the
following charges.

CF: (0n phone.) Holy shit.
[Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

TR: Um, i need to call Sarah right now?and that would probably take me most of the rest of the
day.

128: i'm not asking you to do it, l'm asking you for whatever the charge is. i?m going to do it.

TR: I don't know what it is. What l?m saying is, i would need to sit down with the statute 
JZB: 0k.

TR: And spend that time 

128: OK, enough said (Ui)

CF: (0n phone.) 0h ok, yeah, l?il talk to him and i'll see into it.

[Background overlapping conversations].

128: yeah ok, alright, that?s cool, i thought maybe you know based on ok.

CF: (0n phone.) Yeah, i?m sure don't see him around anywhere so l?m sure he's getting his

ass chewed somewhere. [Background and conversations].

10

UCE:

alright.

128:
CF:

UM:

Lone wolf whatever that they?d charge individuals that work (Ul)
[Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

shit, yeah. 0k good, I was telling you they were a breeze, good 
Yeah. Check Yeah.



Ok, I'm sorry Jay

It?s alright, no I I?m gonna do that and talk to 


[Talking to another person] At least to have an idea -

[Background conversations and overlapping conversations).

CF:

UCE:

CF:

TR:

We haven?t even made that phone call at noon so ..
Good you as a lawyer one of these 
yeah, copy that. 0k. [Laughter and overlapping conversations in the background].

In Wyoming, I don?t know the Florida You get a divorce, you get in a car wreck can-help

you need a will l'm good at 

CF:

UM:

CF:

Copy that.

Somebody sues you because they slipped and fell at your (UI)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. We?ll fix it. No, we'll fix it man. Um, we squared away for 9:00

here tonight? We still still got the three teams?

TR:

CF:

UF:

(Uli website, there's a picture of (UI)

four teams, shit, ok, ok, good. Um, any additional I know Liz brought it up to me
yesterday when I gave brief about, um, taking it back to normal shifts because she's
like, because she?s like honestly, those shifts we have are killing us and uh, I know you
and have already about, what, three or four times now. But, uh, you think we should just
change - and go with that? -

[Background talk]
Yeah sure, 

In the tech cut, just the tech cut

11





.IC:

UF:

UM:

UM:

UM:

CF:

TR:

JC:

CF:

CF:

TR:

CF:

Unless Dixon can go there?s no one here. I can't either. We got nothing. There?s absolutely no
one.

[overlapping conversations in the background].

I mean like, the only thing, the thing that?s bad just fully expecting the source to pay
i. mean (UI) ask for everything from him.

of logistical purposes. yeah I told her that. explained everything to her, I was
like hey, the team leaders perspective, what do you think? Like we can't do for -so
there?s not going to be consistency. And you know stuff like that. What do you think? And she?s
like, I?d still do it. I?d still change it. don't know, a Sam to 2pm? Holy shit.
[Background talk].

There he is.

Hi Sara, this is Taylor. i?m all right, how are you.

Well rested. Good 

Are you in a position to talk?

Yeah.

Well rested, good job

There is good and there is some bad.

0k.

The good is it did and probably went as well as (Ul)
Ul)

Urn, i think I think everybody is kind of wanting the 8-4, 4-midnight. midnight to 8am. 0k.
[Laughter and overlapping conversations in the background). .

(Ul) gun (Ul) the AK (Ul) the reason he wanted that is because he doesn?t think he can reload
fast enough he just wants to transition to other guns.

0k, I mean, you 
I think so, um. Bad aspect (Ul)
I hope so and that?s the other thing, i mean we need need to have

[Ul] he thinks the source is going to pay for everything.

Really?

12

.53

CF:

.3939

I don't have any money; I?m not gonna have any money

0k. Ok, I mean if it?s, yeah, I mean If It's not that big of a pain in the ass, if it's not too big,
if you have an

A strategy that we are trying to come up with; we?re working on legal help [Ul]
[Overlapping conversations in the background].

yeah,

One of the theories we are trying is about

0k.

the source pays him on Friday and owe him over $400.00

Well, that?s the team leaders are all good with it, like if you?ve already briefed them and
they?re cool with it, mean, fuck it, let?s ]ust wait. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Telling him you know well, I had some money [Ul] [overlapping conversations in the
background].

Yeah do that, it?s horrible. it's burning her guys

out and everything like that so I mean, I don?t know, man. Well, I know, I know. i?mm

TR:

CF:

Maybe (Ul) this guy is gonna need the money to get started you're gonna have to make (UI)
payment, and if we can maybe have that conversation coincide with when we know Sammy can 
come up with a few hundred bucks. 

yeah. [Background conversations and overlapping conversations]. for with you man. Get
Steve?s perspective and then see what he has to say and then we can make a decision after that.
Alright, thanks man. Yeah, yeah, I'm going to talk to him. Uh, alright, cool, we?ll fix it man, don't
worry about it. Alright, later.

UCE: (in background gonna be $1000 or $1000 plus change. Guns are $400 or
[Overlapping conversations In the background]. somebody/s got to come up with (IA)
(UCE keeps talking but he?s IA). 

TR:

UF:

We have the undercover told him was 3 guns and lot of money and a whole bunch of
money, I don't (Ullto the effect of gun Is guns is (UI) really
So, one of our theories, and a lot depends on you and US in terms of charge
on to steer him forward explosives, no guns or one gun and
explosives.

(In background conversation.) He?s not going to be around (UI) with the money, so what's the
answer to that?

13

UCE:



UCE:

SS:

UCE:

TR:

SD:

CF:

SD:

CF:

50:

(In background conversation.) Oh no, no, no, no, you give me money to start. i get started, you
don't getanything until you give me the balance. 

That could be months down the road, or even longer.

See the thing thing is. his thing was paying for it. was going to get my


So he's gonna pay the front end, the source is going to pay the back end.

No, he was always gonna pay the whole thing, this is a new thing, I?ve got to get him 


[Background conversations and overlappim conversations]. Yeah we do (Ul) but as we progress
[Background conversations and overlapping conversations] is and he did express sort of
the urgency in terms he didn't say ?sarne hour? or ?same day? like he did before but he did

express i want to 

Are you getting him money or what?

No l'm getting $5,000 from him 

Oh nice and you handed the uh, you handed the -and a .to the source today?
Yes.

Ok.

The (Ul) thing?

[Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

CF:

SD:

CF:

SD:

CF:

SD:



CF:

The what?

Did you already throw it out?

What?

The little mint thing.

That little mint thing. Oh yeah I did throw it out.
Oh.

That?s perfect to keep the screws in.

Oh, well, just leave them on my desk. Oh shit, i got to 

END OF SESSION 1

14

This is a test 00:00:15 Real timeThls draft transcript, in its current form, is for the sole purpose of review
by the prosecuting attorneys and should not be construed as a final verbatim transcript. Further review
may be necessary for trial purposes.

car. -00 24?
Sesslons: 2 of 7 
Participants:
UM: Unidenti?ed male
UF: Unidenti?ed female
Translation Key:
Ul: Unintelligible
lA: inaudible
Simultaneous Conversation
cs: 

SD: Alright, I'll be ready to go get the 

.


JC: $5,000 (un.

TR: (ln background conversation.) So in terms of interstate sure, sure.
0k good but we need to kind of knew that but this con?rms we got to from our
standpoint (IA) be able to (IA) we?ve got to have speci?cs

UCE: (talking in background, he is IA)
CF: Hey man, how are you?
UM-4: Good man, how you doing?

CF: Oh I'm hanging in.
UM: lnaudible from background

TR: So from our standpoint as well, we've got to be able and not only that. get day
before yesterday at work he asked the source, uh, to drive, the, the, vehicle borne explosives 
said be going to be that can bring that So, I seems clear is that
so wrapped up in doing losing (Ul)he?s just doesn't understand what?s

realistic, which works to our advantage but we don?t know if we feed him something completely off the
wall, we don't know if he'll bite because he?s so far out there tends to be more
toward the Whatever (UI) yeah, oh well now we got (a car bomb
at the I mean, so he?s 

50 as far as the money a amount of dollars.

Yeah. what we ended up doing, tricky is the source drove him to a pulled up,
met and target left separately (Ul)and all the was 
Yeah and that he?s fully completely, almost undoubtedly ready to do that. He has no 
There's a noon SVTC with Headquarters. (a vacuum cleaner in background?)

CF: new one.

TR: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um what the UC told him, is that he would have to do some (U8). what it?s
going to cost (Ul)..so what we anticipate is didn't seem to 

UF: And when it screws Y0u know what mean? dOn't it would be nice (Ul)
and that?s exactly what we 

UF: And then all of the little tricks and all of that (Ul)

JC: 50 then you?re still (Ul)

(Many other conversations in background.) (Sounds like CT DC Specialist PM in one of the conversations
- she?s discussing the bank scan software.)

TR: Exactly. Um, the other thing that we've been playing with and I don't know that he?ll go for
of our thoughts clea the gun, (UI) we?re thinking he wants the guns, he
wants to be able to see people die and if he's gonna die one of the thoughts that we had
was, these guns are so the explosives we can make can make 
can make for you the proposal as well and blow yourself up a few minutes
later(Ul) .device (Ul)..homemade grenades you can throw them the gun is in the higher
price range or something Think that plays with charges on it?

UM6: 
0k. 

NN: (Another background conversation. Sounds like PM and NN are discussing the bank scan software.)
But no, and that?s kind of like i could have probably 

(Many simultaneous conversations here.)

NN: (Ul)..But the thing is all You It's already serewed up before it hits Bank Scan. Right and
either they didn?t choose the right template or they did something wrong. And think that's even part

2

the problem and. um, lthink most people have more issues though beforehand and
I don?t really think we spend as much time on the beforehand part, um, and i know 

(Various conversations occurring cannot transcribe)

NN: (UI) you know what I mean and well, I mean that?s part of the reason, I was like oh my
the thing is all that 

CF: You've got to be kidding me.

TR: 0k. Alright. And i have a question in terms of not leading him too the two people that steers him more towards the government thing, not overtly, but just, the
source has previously had said what he says (Ul) well you told me before that you wanted to be
civilians what he said (UI), well you told me before you wanted to be a civilian 
understand you want to kill more people, can you think of anything else where possibly killing those
people Would reasonable to try 0k.

Rw: The U.S. Attorney will be here or his Deputy or whatever they call him.

TR: 0k. Hey Sarah, so you're aware of, says that. uh, you?re aware

RW: Is our standing order, do not be seen don?t even be in the

area.
Rw: Yteem.

CF: We're one burn away from bringing the whole thing for another month, what I want
to tell them.

Rw: We made a lot of great progress. Thanks to you. Thanks to everybody really but yesterday was
huge 

TR: 0k, if you hit my voice mail, just do the 

RW: 0k, Mr. former to dig in to of you guys, really, all
you can dig into the U.S. Code. We need to be telling them that the way we see it, we have these
violations, where do we need to push this all the way to fruition, what are you going to expect to have
us w'th the subject. We do not believe it's prudent to allow him to drive very far after picking up inert
weapons, the and a bomb vest, to get more than 200-300 yards from the undercover after
that drop is madeand-take him down. ls you feel that you have enough then to prosecute?
They want this ending, that?s great but, plus once we start laying out attempted use of a
WMD, and I don?t remember the title 18 code for that of the automatic weapons code, 
we need to lay out what we see for that today. And i want to do that with CT 5 today. Hey, here?s what
we?re looking at, this is what the sees is the potential charges based on what we know, and what say
them (Ul) put them on the spot. For what it? 5 worth so you guys understand the information over at the
U.S. Attorney?s of?ce. The U.S. Attorney is aware that the case exists but has no clue about what level



10

11
12

13
14

of detail we are asking (UI) potential delivery as early as next week, of and Stuff like
that with this that?s how bad it can be. That she's she?s not or is meeting her
supervisor who's not maybe putting it forward, I want what they refer at this 

1C: who her supervisor is that?s 
UM: That?s where it ends? Ha ha.

Rw: That's where it ends. Um. because how at this stage does the US. Attorney not know that this
case is being briefed to the President, they've got an undercover into it now. we just talked weapons
acquisition with and they anticipate delivery as early as next week, to bring this thing to fruition and
arrest. I think if I was the U5. Attorney, I'd be ripped about not knowing that. I wouldn?t get too wound
up about it.

CF: Yeah, but. what i'm saying. 0k you'd get pissed but i don?t think he?s gonna be
pleased to hear 

RW: But how do be like me keeping it from the I just forgot to tell you, this guy
wants to buy a bomb next week. Whatagain, dig into the, uh, Criminal Code for me.

CF: Hey did you email Kenny back 

RW: We got an hour and a half.

TR: I told Jay that I could probably do a really good job of that not doing anything. .
Rw: That?d be great.
TR: Not familiar 

RW: You need a couple of generic codes to throw at him about violations of possession and
attempted use, etc.

  

JC: Do we have a starting point as far as like what she?s been looking at?

TR: Yeah, I have the printout, yeah, but I'm not sure how current that I talked to her she's
not where she could get :?ii?i   )and let them know

Hey other day, urn, I've known this and I kind of have forgotten about it, I'm the

primary Duty Agent next week, um, do I need mean I..

kW: Yeah, find a replacement?
.lC: Yeah.
nw: Yes. cause I really think that depending on how tomorrow goes..

CF: (Ul) do 

RW: Next week will be very but, knowing Murphy, not that I believe in that, really, but
just joking around about it. something will come up, we?ll be like, well Jake you got a complaint call
about such and 

JC: meah that?s what I?m saying and it's like? to shirk my duties 

Rw: you ?nd far out do they have the Duty roster? i would look two weeks
out, call the person who?s got it then and say, hey, can we swap.

JC: Problem 
"for the holiday(Ul)
Finding someone for the holidays.

Yeah it?s a holiday (Ul)

5.35.3

 

e?

lC: Well call and tell Brett, say, hey, just, you got a secondary, he?s a primary.

TR: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
CF: Let Draper 
aw: i didn?t mean to get 

.lC: And i just wanted to draw attention to that so that if they call and i say, yeah, can?t do it. then
the SAC doesn?t call you or something saying, what the 

nw: No he?s aware of this one. -

JC: Well, I know  know what I?m saying  why didn?t Jake find a
replacement or something like that.

RW: Yeah, well, I guess it?s because he really had nothing better to do  annual leave sir.





14
15
16

17

5385

22

23
24

26

8



TR: Well i know, two years ago. three years ago, my ?rst Christmas took Tom Oates duty
'cuz he had use or lose and it had looked apparently hard as he could and then there was a
canvas and then there was an email that said if somebody doesn?t help him out, we?re going to draft
somebody else from the list 'cuz this guy is use or lose was about two said, oh yeah,

rm ping to do ?wetting somebody three months 

 

aw: Yeah and like Franco said, i think we got you covered, 
CF: Yeah.
aw: Either that or we could say, sucks for you man, we?re going to go make an arrest. You handle

that complaint call from the whackadoo talking about Bin Laden being in, uh, downtown Tampa.

and?

TR: 
m: 3 is not here.
1C: He's being 

TR: reviewing tapes or..The gun chargemt weak, not a lot of
(Unusurn, but multiple explosive devices would be big, really big, so? some way he left one, he wears


Ila. 

TR: See that's what i'm wondering, I mean, what I wondered is if we have the ability do you think it
wouh sell, of these guns costs you more than three or four?

UCE: Grenades? Grenade?s already in it.

TR: What's that?

UCE: Grenades are already part of it.

TR: Ole But what I'm terms 

You saying body 

Mummb

TR: No, no, no, what I'm saying ism to control what he gets, a gun complicates things a lot for

US.
Right.
TR: And I?m wondering if we can keep him, scare him away from the guns by saying, dude, you

know, you can?t give me anything, your buddy doesn?t have a lot of money, y0u guys can't afford a gun.
But with the money you have, I can get you severalw I can get you a vest with?fgur grenades.
you have the (UI) grenades and blow yourself up, I can't get you Do you think that would, unless
you can come up with 4 or 5 

JC: Yeah that was an initial request. With the source, he wanted to buy two AK's, nothing
at al about explosives, in every, every pipedream scenario he's had since 

 
   

Qt-

TR: How do we come up with enough money for them to pay for everything?

UCE: Not that guns aren't going to be that bad as far as price goes. I think the money and
guns is not the issue, 

JC: Kerry Myers keeps saying $3,000 
Who said that?
JC: Kerry 

TR: Well, what?s his name, Andy, said 4?6.

UCE: 4-6 what?
TR: Thousand dollars for automatic weapon of any shape or description on the black market.
UCE: Why?

TR: Because it?s illegal. And two they?re very limited suppiy.

UCE: can Call somebody who just laid 

TR: Yeah, I mean, find out, I mean, but, and maybe that?s a completely 

UCE: (lA)  

Plus I really don?t think he has any concept of how much it costs. He?s not even worried about

the money, you know that?s not 

TR: Well exactly, but we do. I 

ON



.lC: i know but I?m saying he's not going not going to say, oh, he?s not charging you $3,000
so l'm walking away, he's 

CF: I?m pretty 

JC: get Andy's point that on Southwest Border if you don't ask for enough, then
they think you?re a cop.

Right, right, 

JC: He's not the Southwest Border interacting with a bunch of other people who have tried to get
weapons.

Buttherea're expenwmuwtwl?testliythatmls costs $6,000, theysold it to him fort
FBI made this happen. And will happen. And everything that we can do?to
Mn our this case sucks, everything that we can do to strengthen it, we ought to do.
"Iqu riht now, the way that this is sitting, we have yet to envision a scenario where I wouldn?t advise
my dilent, ifl represented Sami, you've got a decent chance I would take it to trial. Right now, we have
 upwith 

Massacre:

TR:

 

RW:

RW:



RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

He didn?t know you know that. . .and you?re gonna need a down payment for their
server cause some of this stuff? -

(Coughing)
- -you shouldn?t be paying for it until you are getting paid for it, right?

The otherdude isn?tsyeah But somebody else is pay mg for it (LEI) (Noise) right
now it?s hard (U1) still if someone etse ispaying for it- its hard to get- started. You
know what I?m saying its-hard to get started;

(Noise)

Okay . . .it?s super possible.

Don?t say that!

Right!

(U1) there is no way around it. ..it?s not gonna happen

Right tight, and what he can say is. no. the other dude is taken care of
it}: Be like well the other dude is not here right now We?re supposed to be
limiting his involvement. I need somebody right now And l?m not. you

know. . .or I?ll go back and talk to - about it- -

the thing is -
- -Or - or whatever his (U1) yeah!

(UI) unless certain amount is there to start, (LT) it doesn?t make sense to me to get
some other (U1) It?s not going to happen like that. . .Whatever (U1) so it doesn?t- -

Two hundred bucks! Three hundred bucks!

the two hundred dollars is not gonna change anything, is what I?m saying so
what. what sense does it make for me to demand that cause?

It changes it legally?yeah.. Yeahs yeah WW

I understand, I understand what I?m saying but for us. for us to get stated--
But for his mindset- -

UCE:

RW 

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

UM:

UCE:

RW:



- -as law enforcement- -

- for his mindset.

- ~for us, for law enforcement.

Sure.

That?s- -that?s a beautiful thing. I?m just saying in a real world situation.
Yeah what his response is likely to be - -.

Just in a real world situation, period- -in a real world situation, period. How is
that, what sense does that make. in a real world situation? Other than what we
would like and promote what the purpose (UI) you know which 1 understand if
that?s what they?ve got, that?s the perfect thing. that?s when we would love to
happen but in a real world situation it?s. .. that doesn?t make sense in a real world
situation cause regardless of whether you know. I need money right now to
do something right now I?m still not doing anything until i get the ?ll-balance oi,
that-Md the down payment has got to be more than twenty (UI) 
pocket:

Why does it have 

Because it has to be enough to acquire the materials. it has to be enough to put
to have- -to have- -to have me ?nancially where I'm not leaving U1) that?s
where (UI)

A lot of (U1) 

That gun is more than that.

That gun! Yeah! But the bomb stuff, no.

(Background noises)

(U1)

(Background noises)

(U1) The gun thing I totally agree with (U1) I?m not fronting your operation (UI)
by'd?nsomema

(Background noises)

Uh! Hand grenades, we have grenades being made 100.

3

UM:
RW:



UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

lA:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

Yeah I heard that. Steve, thank you, (UI) yeah they're starting to work on them.
Yeah so I think that?s where that couple of hundred bucks (UD- -
(Background noise)

- -.but I need a little bit to get started acquiring materials from you cause these
guys aren?t front it so with man! the grenades it?s a couple hundred bucks for
materials and at least get, get started. (U I) (Noise) Good now we?ve got to talk to.
(IA) was even still okay that even after that at least he?s paid for a portion-of it
when it comes to the guns if the source is going to cover that portion of it. that?s
between you and the source. And that may be a that the three of you
have to have together or not, it?s tough, very dynamic.

It?s, I understand (UI)
(Background noise)
I?ve done this more times than I 

It?s beautiful, it?s beautiful and I would love if. if it was them that would
be the best possible way to do it. (IA) I don?tsec towns-(1A9.

(Background noise)



For what, get, you get three hundred bucks out of 1115 pocket to buy the pipes and
the vest and black powder?

(IA)
(Background noise)

(UI) We?ll need to, need to stall him; investing my time into it for doing
something, you need to come up with halfof the money. That way, ?rst of all it
covers me more in expenses and the second part is that I don?t, I?m not going to
take a loss, the second part is that I know that if you don?t. if you pull out you?re
out. You?ve lost it.

Right.

There's no.

You?re not getting back.

There?s no. there's no getting me back.
4

RW 

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

Right (IA)

Right so you?re invested, everybody is invested at this point. That?s why you do
that, that?s the reason we do that.

Uhm- -uhm.

Beam everybody is invested at this point. We?re all going forward. we're all
committed now, you know.

Well that?s why the, the source told me that as much money that if he?ll give up
three hundred of his own income this week and the source gives him the other
seven hundred to come up with a thousand for half of it. that?s okay.

Yeah but how do you, how do you separate those, how do you separate those
transactions? Don?t  We.

Well you don?t have to take any money. We?re not taking any money 
to begin with. you can. the source is gonna take care of you later

Nah. nah that?s not what I?m saying cause how do you separate those transactions
cause you're talking about two di??erent transactions. You?re talking about a
transaction that I?m, I?m gonna conduct with him but (U1 gonna conduct with
somebody else for three or seven hundred dollars.

Seven.
Or I start this thing.
Uhm.

How, you don?t separate, how. I mean me, I want to separate these transactions
two of them together you know take care of that and then come see me and
here's a thousand dollars to go, that?s one thing- If he gives his seven hundred
dollars to the CH8, the CH8 gives it back to me and says that?s. that?s one thing.

Or if he takes his three hundred and the CBS gives him his own seven hundred
and then.

Right that?s, that?s the only two ways, that?s, those are the logical ways that this
thing happens.

Right.
If he gives money to the CH8 or the CH8.

 

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UC E:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:





RW:

NN:
RW 

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW 

The CHS gives him.
The HS gives money to him.
To him.

One way or another I don?t, I can?t separate where piecemeal. where I'm getting
paid from.

would, you?ve got the experience. I would disagree with that based on their
relationship- -

that doesn?t make sense.

- -based on their relationshipdoes if? - if- - hey! He said he was
going to pay for it well if he says he can?t for all of it so you've got to pay for
some of it and he?s got to pay for some of it.

That?s not a conversation that I would have him. I wouldn?t have that
conversation with ha.

I think what he?s saying that an independent person he wouldn?t be working it out
and making the deal. It should be the source and the bad guy saying how they're
going to work it out. who's going to pay what share.

Good.
And then pay him fully.

Other than, well other than the backgron is that you helped out his family
before and they?ve been here for eleven years.

Oh.

And so there is a little bit of a trust factor there.
No me, me, and the. me and the CH8 are okay.
Right.

Our relationship is (IA)

That's why to me if he says well I can give you three hundred and he?s gonna
give you seven hundred and you can say okay well I trust him and good with you

UCE:

NN:

UCE:

RVV:



RW:

UCE:

RW:

RW:

JC:
RW:
JC:

UCE:

JC:

giving him three hundred and he?s gonna give the seven hundred then he?s gonna
tell me that.

l?m not gonna tell him that though. He should knew that before he comes to see
me.

Yeah, that?s, 1.

He would know that because he had the source already. That would be, that
wouldn?t be something that I'm not a -I would not educate him.

Right. Source has to tell him. Okay then the source has to be, so you. when, then
does it work if the source has to tell him, ?Hey. listenf You are gonna have to
give him the three hundred bucks." And that?s something Jake has the source tell
him. And I take care of the rest and then he comes here and says he said he was
going to take care of the rest and here?s three hundred of my money for you Is
that something you accept?

That?s. that?s (IA) that?s a feasible, that?s a feasible scenario. that?s a feasible
scenario.

That?s what you?re going to do, that way the source  to be coached Wha?todo.
M?s-feasible. Okay I agree.

I, I?m with you. I?m not arguing with you.

(Background lA voices)

You want to go at three o?clock with Ralph and explain to him the time for
tomorrow and everything?

Yeah that?s what we were just talking about.
Well I heard night time and all that stufTso (IA).

Like, one thing I told the source this morning was we were talking about 
trying to get Sammy (PH) to actually show up on time cause there isvahsolmely no

 . If it did happen he?d need a little bit more time.
[Pug . [Pause] Uhm? - you know the? -the problem with .you can?t call

him -
Right!

- -you know so you- - you kind of like go ?nd him somewhere you know.

RW:

UCE:

JC:
UCE:

.W?rv?J" 3" 

RW:

We?: 21v-

JC:



JC:

Exactly. (U1)
(Noise)

 em id-leavethe 
a? i" eg?a?ptearranged- place andnme? . "l-?ho k2
?9%qu .isznoegeingwwede

 

What we need to do is drive away for a while. chit chat some more, talk. I've got
to get- -I got to get more speci?cs for him.

between the time he shows up at work at 1% and the time
you have to be at Djumu?a, and I would be tUl) it?s just not enough time
W.

(Background noise)
Yeah.

So you would have to schedule it either early enough in the day Mullah
or just schedule it a?er everything is over late in the day.



(Background noise)

(U1) so why can?t we get it done early?

.m

can. Uh- -the only issue we?ve got is just do we depend on Sammy to be
reliable enough to show up. W?idem - 

(LA voices in background)

I don?t know man this poor guy he gets almost ?ve hundred bucks in his hand
tomorrow and he says you need me for another week? That?s a thousand bucks
why wouldn?t he show up? 

Well right but you?re a hardworking 
(IA voices in background)

RW:

UCEI?m, I?m trying to think if I?m a, if I?m a retarded fool who is hard up for
money and I don?t have a pot to piss in, another ?ve hundred dollars looks pretty
good.

That?s not logical boss, that?s not logical.
Yeah.

I didn?t say logical. 1 said hard up for money.
Yeah.

Anyone that's hard up for money anyways constantly didn?t have enough and
now he knows he?s got to acquire some money to get some. well no he thinks that
the other guy is going to pay for it. He?s told hey, I can?t cover the entire cost of it
now. now he's thinking well if he can?t cover the entire cost, I?ve got almost ?ve
hundred here and I work next week I?m not going to need the money once I go do
my thing so that? 5 almost a thousand dollars. That should be enough to get the
whole thing started, to give you I give the guy eight hundred bucks and I got my
stuff, I'm almost there.

[On the phone] Right. I know it by the time I got t'lJI t??emthommand



You?re not feeding him (U1)

Okay youWhe's got ?ve hundred bucks and (Lil) ifiae?s got 
he can -W 

[0n the phone] (UI) usually, don't you guys usually require it to be mailed, like
Fed-Ex to you, that?s usually what I do, I would follow up with a Fed-Ex, but if I
would have Fed-ex unless I overnight it. - -

knight!?  that?s a lot easier to  anA?

.Wdlifhem'am he?s  one 

[On-tth Well yeah I mean I, I don?t think we usually have the (UI) I think
it?s just usually the.

(1A voices in background)

 

RW:

RW:

JC:

UCE:

JC:

JC:

UCE:

8W.



UM:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

Well again more reason to make it tomorrow when he has to give you back
money so you can?t. (UI)

(IA voices in background)
Right that?s the source.

(U1) and don?t forget that I?m strapped right now. You're gonna have to pay him
certain things so he knows you?re serious.

(U1) 
And I?ll, I ?11 help you on the rest but (U1)

[0n the phone] Alright. Thank you so much. Bye.

(Noise)

You have to give him like four hundred bucks. Source says he wants three
hundred mid dollars or however much you know.

It?s got to be more specific than that.

(UI) He comes into the store. the source sits down. said he needs a thousand
dollars; it?s about half, maybe a little bit more. (UI) you have to ping him. I can?t
take care of this whole thing for you. We?ve all worked very hard for this -

(U1)

Maybe you can meet him tonight. He?ll pick you up right here outside the, outside
the building, outside the store or you?ll meet him where you met him last time or
whatever time is appropriate. (UI) the source has to be very speci?c that Amir
(PH) wants a thousand bucks, alright? I can only give you six hundred right now.
You have to pay him the other four.

(U1) 1 have already told him  
(IA voices in background)

And then when Sammy says well what about the other. if that's about half what
about the other thousand? Let?s worry about that later.

(U1)
We?ll worry about that later.
Hopefully we?ll be able to get that together but (UN

10

 

RW:

TR:

RW:


PC:
CH:

RW:

Can?t your- - can?t your ?'iend- -uh- - can?t your friend - sell some of
his stolen items? (Chuckles)

Well if he?s so worried about the other thoqu I mean, I mean (U1) I think 1 can
get it together. You get what you can and between us we?ll be able to make it
happen. Do you have anybody else you could ask? You know hopefully I'll have
a good week at the store and we?ll be able to.

Maybe your other brothers can still help you, even though they?re not in it. We?ll
?gure it out. We?re going to be able to make this happen but . . .

(IA) right now give him 400 dollars

Call he?s got thirteen grand doesn?t he?

(IA) my money, he wants you to give him four hundred dollars (IA)
(IA multiple voices in background)

You need to give him what you have right no?. four hundred dollars (IA) cause
he?s not going to front the money and then you take and he?s out four hundred
dollars. It?s not like you can return it (IA)

(1A voices in background)
You?d better help the supervisor out, that?s all I?m saying.
(IA voices in background)

He was clearing the cubes the other day. He scared I almost drew
down on him.

I cleared the other side. I didn?t see you go over.
You can?t clear my side too. I saw you come around. well I heard you and_then1.

So what?s the timing plan? Cause that conversation basically happens in the
morning (IA) at night again (1A).

You know what happens then (U1) 
I. . . .H. hi Isl

(Background Noise)

 

ll



UCE:

RW:

UCE:
UM3:
UCE:





UMZ:
UCE:

UCE:

RW 

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

But, now that now what you?re saying is that now (1A)
conversation (IA) now let?s drive around and kind of check things out You?re
talking and (IA)

You?re asking show me your target.

Well that?s, I think driving, I think just driving around even though maybe you?re
not as familiar as just for opsec to keep mobile so that its harder to follow you and
track you.

IOVI
Are you asking me- - asking you "What?s your target? 
Yeah.

That?s, that?s law enforcement. Show me your target. that?s law enforcement. To
get away from all that by saying like it?s basically it?s what type of target are we
looking at? Cause I don?t care what the target is. I mean truth, I mean nuth be told
no I don?t really give a. . ..

I want plausible deniability.

I don?t give a shit, give a shit. ?hat type of target are we looking at?? So that we
know that we bill for that target.

(U1)

So then start laying it out- - fucking- - get to him when you have, when you (IA)
(Noise)

(IA) I ain?t telling you what the target is.

Just out of sheer frustration trying to explain.

Well it?s just. it?s just. -it?s human nature. I feel sick to my stomach. I feel if it
does. . .Great! If it at least, we?ll have an idea of what we?re looking at.

Have you researched it? Is there security there? Is it a hard target? Is there? -is
there- - is it? What are its hours of operation?

Just, just so we get that layout of what you?re building for so, so we do that. if we
do that. 

(End of session 15)

12

This draft transcript, in its current form, is for the sole purpose of review by the prosecuting attomeys
and should not be construed as a final verbatim transcript Further review may be necessary for trial
purposes.

use: ?uoz4i

 

Sessions: 3 of 7
Participants:
UM: Unidenti?ed male PM: Pat Mahn UCE: Undercover Employee
UF: Unidentified female NN: Natasha Novikov SD: Stephen Dixon
TR: Taylor Reed 1C: Jacob Collins CO: Christopher Franck
Richard Worms
Abbreviations:
Ui: Unintelligible PH: Phonetic
lA: inaudible Technical notes
SC: Simultaneous Conversation
(background conversation)

TR: A situation where i don?t say, you know, we?ve at least got a chance of convincing one out of
twelve people to say the government caused this to happen. That?s all it takes, is one out of twelve. To
measure, room full of so people, you?ve to pick twelve. you only get three strikes to?to say that person
won't fit and you've only got certain reasons you can use strikes.

MN: (SC) (lAl You know what 

TR: One person and he doesn?t go to jail. i mean. that?s-that?s-that?s what we have to~l mean
that?s how good a case, i mean, we have to build. (SC) And?and the-and the other thing i was trying to
explain to these guys this morning, the chances of us getting in, much, if any, of his

-islow-

NN: (SC) but i had all this time and_. Surrounding 

TR: I mean, what happens between he and (Ui) is going to be 9596 of what he's going to try.
Because we can?t convict him based on the fact he?s got stupid ideas, we can?t wnvict him based on the
fact that he?he traveled to Afghanistan because that wasn't a crime. Tried to travel to Afghanistan.
Unless we can prove it. i mean, if we can prove it, yes, but if we can't prove it?

NN: (SC) Everybody you go and put a microscope on they? re expecting to-
(Ull

TR: ?or at least show probable cause. we rule of law is, you can?t convict
someone for A because they did 8.

JC: Do you know what I just thought of, though, and I meant to bring this up last night?

UF: Hold on one second.

.lC: if he brings up his travel or If there?s a way to get back to that travel to Turkmenistan, if he told
you in a recording that he was trying to join the Muj (PH), like he told our source?

UF: (SC Sweetl Thank you. I?ll make a copy and put it in the ?le.

JC: that?s a charge ruht there.

TR: That absolutely is a charge and see, and that, and than even if we can't sustain that charge to
convict him, then we get to present evidence, even if we know they?ll acquit, we get in front of thejury,
a (Ul Wound a key.

JC: Because that was one of the issues early on, before he even started asking for weapons, that he
actually had technically, already admitted a terrorist act, material support or whatever, because he

tried -
(0V) I got stop by later.
lC: ?he made an overt act to try to get into Afghanistan to join the mujaheddin.

TR: i mean I just ideas, I mean i don?t know if this would work, just in terms of his
experience, whatever, maybe you could say, "When did you, have you ever been to these places?" And
get him to brag, "Well, i tried to go to Afghanistan but I didn?t make it.? I mean, uh, that's
way to get him to talk about would 

JC: Well, I mean. he brought it up, so, I mean, there could be, but I need to tell you, I mean-

TR: (OV) I do too, I mean, it? yeah, I mean, and, if the opportunity arises. there(UI) lust would would be huge. That's a (UI) way to (UI)

(Ul background conversation)

IC: But yeah,.l mean i~l get it, me find out what?I?l don?t believe that they? re a
thousand dollars. (Ul)8ecause yeah, ?cuz a regular AK is like $400 and-

NN: (SC) No, you, (Ul)

JC: ?it's, I mean, for one, somebody who knows what they?re doing (UI) could take a 

UP: (SC) Uhm, also?(Ui)
UF: (SC) (Ul) 

JC: ~somebody knew halfway what to do they could take a regular AK, basic make it full auto (UI)
and (UI) we'll get a better 

(background conversation)

TR: And that?s true, but-

JC: But that-but the one's that he's given made to be a whole lot of 
safety and 

NN: (IA) (background conversation)

TR: Right and-and-and one of the things is, possessing an illegal weapon is a ?ve to seven year
charge, making it illegal like that, that?s a 20-year charge.

JC: Yeah.

TR: i mean which is one of the reasons it costs a lot of money because just to own?owning ok,
you're gonna get you ?ve, (SC) if i make it (UI) for you, i mean, which is another, I mean, 20 years adds a
lot of value to a product.

JC: Uh-huh. Well, we'll see if he's uh?(Ui)

TR: Uhm, have you s?have you?do we need to remind of the cubicle rules again? (Ul)
UF: (SC) The only thin?

TR: That?s uh, that's violating 

UF: 0k, listen, do you want Information or do you want me to get down off my desk?
TR: (0V) 1 do, i know i keep talking. Okay, so, Times Square, Shazad (PH)

UM: We are good.

UF: Um, and then also there's with the Baltimore (PH) which muht be relevant, um, he was a little
bold and he was targeting (background voice) Uhrn, so?the ?Cause i don't know the details of
it.

JC: Portland.
UF: Yeah, Shazad. i forgot, oh, the underwear bomber?

JC: The Portland.

TR: Po?Portland, henhe was trying to bomb 3 Christmas tree lighting ceremony.

(overlapping background conversation)
UCE: Portland wasn?t a lone wolf, was it? Was it more than one? Was it just one?
JC: Just one ?guy got arrested.
UCE: Oh yeah, yeah, 'cuz-
TR: Investigation 
UCE: Gotcha.

UF: Yeah I?m getting into both of them together. have a question. Do you have We 18 Okay,
that's (Ul)

TR: We-we have to?we don't-
NN: We probably will only need (Ul) one.
TR: Another question Jake as much for you, 'cuz it?s probably the source more than 

JC: Maybe we should call Jim Green and see if he can come down here because it would be helpful.

(background voices)

TR: Did you tell the source to bring back up the whole (Ul) thing. (Ui) Just in terms of, because,
that?s a better charge, Sarah said, the government building, not that we can?t charge plus it could help
us focus him and identify a target (noise) instead of any nuht club 

JC: We've got potential to do that anything with source Yeah, it's just giving him
complicated dlrection can be very dicey, because, he would take that and then say?
TR: (Ul)

JC: - and want you to go and do, you know, or some kind of crap like that, then we'd be
screwed. So, ye?ye, it?s, you know, the source is not an undercover, he's done a good job as a source
but he?s not an undercover.

TR: (0V) No, i?i somehow we?ve got to identify a target, i mean just in terms of
take down.

1C: (Swims)
TR: We can't have a - waiting (UI) for him to roll up somewhere.
UCE: What about the 

TR:

UCE:

UCE:

3519.393

UCE:

TR:

SD:

But we have to make sure he gets one. Right, because do we take him down?
(Ul) His entire?his entire targeting plan is in ?ux right now because- 

(0V) But. since it?s-since-

?it depends on what he 

But the problem is, if it?s not real explosives, 

Yeah Babyluse it.

Feels good, though don?t it? (laughs)

You have to get him for attempt. Possession of the stuff we're giving him is against the law.
.

Then we (UI) gun charge, and he'll get 5 years and he?ll serve 18 months.

He's an irrational guy, it?s not like us where you have an objective and do all the planning .

toward it. I mean, i don?t think he cares.

TR:

SD:

JC:

SD:

Only 18 months is dicey because (Ul)

(Ul) supposed to make him nervous.

He mu-i mean, he may come up with a speci?c night club or something like that.
(background conversation)

There?s nothing that?l just think?l think the problem you're going to run into is that riding

along in the car he see something and go there.

NN:

CF:

UCE:

TR:
with 13

(0V) Like i do all the time.

You?you do that all the time.

(background conversation)

(Ul) no one?s going to be able to answer these questions.

That?s it exactly, how?how can we identify the which is why, i mean, what I was just talking
ke, and (UI) that?s a good point, is the source, and~and i think that?that you if the source

could bring back up the whole, "You said no civilians," to get him on a military, to get him to tell him
what other military targets (Ul) could you use. You know a depot (Ul)

already said though about civilians he doesn't care. And he said, he didn?t care about
women and 

UCE: Collateral damage.
lC: damage.-.

TR: No, no, no, no, but the source cares. Ifthe source is paylng and the source says I'm not paying it
if you're not going to target civilians-

CF: I don?t think Sami is going to care when he starts spraying the crowd with bullets 

SD: The other thing is, I mean, he keeps talking about paradise, this is his way into paradise. So if he
sees heYbor and?and he drives by it, y0u know, some gathering of
like 6,000 kuffars (PH) or something, that he had no idea about. I mean that?s your way into paradise, it
doesn?t matter.

TR: Right.
(background voices)

CF: What else can be considered an overt act? Other than actually brandishing a weapon innin
public.

50: Unless you can get him so big like a or something like that, like 
.lC: Uhm. (Ul) money.

CF: That?s the idea. Start selling himself?

JC: Yeah.

TR: is there anywhere where there's a in a building that has a parking garage? Anywhere
downtown or somewhere? I don't know how we'd even-we can't?we can?t-

UCE: {Ull process-

TR: ?well, if, if?
UM: (Ul)
TR: -if for some reason he thought he could get into a garage where he could, don't 

CF: Are you talking about like World Trade Center parking in the garage and blow it up?
TR: 

UCE: Now-mow you?re going to (Ul) and that's your target.





CF: Yeah.

UCE: That's why you're doing that.
UM: Yeah totally.

CF: Yeah absolutely.

TR: Yeah absolutely, i mean, because without an identi?ed target and see that?s the thing, i mean,
to, to, charge him with attempted use of a destructive uh, device, we have to know what his target was.
We have to absolutely, positively know because one charge is, against a government institution, that
was the charge, or against an institution engaged in an act of commerce. His act would have had to have
an effect on inter?on interstate commerce. club does?

UCE: interstate or international?

TR: interninterstate. So, but if we can't identify the target, defense Just says, 'Weil he?s gonna blow
up a house. How do you know he was going to do that? He never told you what he's going to blow up.?
It?s not a Federal charge. And with that if we can't identify the target, we don't even get to court on
that. it gets thrown out because we don't have PCs.

SD: So what does it take to have him l?lD a target? Just he says it or what? i mean-

TR: Yeah, it would have to be a pretty ?rm commitment. i mean. and a consistent commitment, i
mean, and, it's not just, well, i think i?m going to when he heads out.

NN: Recruiting station, no gay bar, same difference.

TR: 

JC: Do we-do we have-

CF: Recruitim station and gay bar are same thing?

TR: l'm trying to find this  l?ts (Uil.

NN: Where's this gay bar going to be at so I just know what area to avoid?
.iC: You?ll find those Ybor 

TR: Ybor. (Ui) Ybor.

NN: Wait were they in Ybor? You told me i could?! was safe in Ybor.
UM: i was kidding you?re safe in Ybor.

UCE: (Ui) together. (Ul)

SO: I did and you are.

UCE:

SD:

NN:

UCE:

NN:

UCE:



wouldn't you be?

Either way, I wouldn?t want to be anywhere near.
Why wouldn't you be safe in Ybor?

What l?what I would think of doing too is 
(SC) (Ul) where all the gay bars are at.

?just for (Ul) get your?get your thought processes and uh, have a (SC) list?right new list out

what we have, as far as?

NN: (ow {un?gay bars ls Ybor.

UCE: -what actions do you know that (Ul) have. You have guns, you have explosives, we have


UF: (SC) 1 don't, but (Ul)

UCE: (Ul) so, l'll get that.

UCE: You know, I (Ul) (UI conversation) I mean?l mean, you kind of?you kind of start from there.

(Ul) (Ul conversation) (loud speaker announcement)

1C:
UF:
NN:
UCE:
CF:
JC:

UCE:

UCE:

UCE:

Shall we go and ask for a meeting?

(SC) i don't want to.

(IA). I thought the meeting was twelve. Pre?the 


Hey, you've got?you get on the commando.
(U1)

(UI) saying, no?no pressure. (UI)

Find out how well she's able perform in 
How well what?

How well she?s able to get us what we want.
Perform under pressure.

Exactly there we go. I like that better.

UCE:

TR:

UCE:

CF:

NN:
UF:

CF:

(loud speaker announcement)

You got what I need.

i think she'll succeed.

You?you got what I need (singing) (laughs) You say I'm just a friend.

You say he's Just a friend; (singing) 

Oh man, look what I started.

So, that?s why you don?t (UI)

No, that?s how he sings. That's not That?s?that?s how he sings it. 

what i 

NN:

UCE:

PM:

UCE:

PM:

UM:

UF:

CF:

TR:

CF:

TR:

(pause) (Ul background conversations)
(Ul)

(latching)

Did i scare you?

Yes, you did.

I'm sorry.

it?s okay.

Do you know where the rule book is.
lgotoneon mydesk. mydesk, but] haveoneonmydesk.
What do you have?

Federal Criminal Codes and Rules.

What year?

Uh, 2011.

Oh can i have that?

Uh, you certainly may not.

What?

CF:

NN:

CF:

PM:

NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:


NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:

You. you can use it for this evolution.

Thank you.

Here you go fine sir.

Muchas gracias. Didn't know who had a new one. That?s awesome.
Oh baby, got what I 

Sing with me now.

?you say he?s just a say he?s just a friend. Oh baby 
(pause) (baclground voices)

What you doing?

(mumbles)

. stuff?

Yeah.

Want to help me make some packets? You don't have just.-.
What?

Make some packets.

What kind of packets?

(Ul) three new - Those stupid packets. Not that you need 

i could probably take a break.

From what you?re doing?

Yep. Help you out a little bit 

Yeah, could you? Yeah, what was thinking.
Oh yeah de?nitely.

Andnand then what did they say 

No, if anything (Ul) Grey and I even said 

Not even a response? That?s?that?s what i thought if you?d help me do (Ul) stuff?

10

NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:

NN:

UM:

NN:

JC:

PM:

NN:

JC:

PM:

PM:

NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:

CF:

But either way, could you get me the schedule?
i don't have a schedule, I just 

Well 

(Ul) over Christmas like President?s day, you had (Ul) get Holiday pay. You might think?

Right.
I know my name is not going 
Right and I would have made sure I was (Ul) too.

(Ul)

i don?t know what the requirements or education or anything like that but i don't know.
(Ul) (whispering) Well i just don?t want (Ul) helping or offering to help.

(Ul) You are 

Well you haven't been here.

Well even then when 

What?s that? Awesome, thank you.

Yeah, and you help everybody all the time.
Whatever.

I know.

(Ul) the time, so l?m just like 

I?m just going to putt and do up?
0k yeah I?ll come over for a little bit.

But don't (Ul) ljust thought maybe, uh?

I de?nitely will, we can chit chat.

0k.

(pause) (background conversation)

You, ugh, yeah, oh, I know.

11

think we?ll be oic But, we?re?I appreciate you worrying about us.
(pause) (background voices)

Okay.

Waiting on you.

Oh I didn?t know.

Pre meeting before your meeting?

(background conversation)

That?s all 'we do is meeting before the meeting.

I thought it was noon that your SVT was.

Meeting after the meeting, the meeting during the meeting.
(background voices)

(end of session three)

This draft transcript, in its current form, is for the sole purpose of review by the prosecuting attorneys
and should not be construed as a ?nal verbatim transcript Further review may be necessary for trial

 

purposes.
Case: - (ID 24)
Sessions: 6 of 7
Participants:
UM: Unidenti?ed male
UF: Unidenti?ed female
Translation Key:
Ul: 
PH: Phonetic
SC: Simultaneous Conversation
NN: I heard food.
UMI: Yeah, He?s taking [Ul] statement 
UM2: The empire [PHJ?the empire and all of them with him on.
UF2: heard 
UM1: [Ul] twelve of the month.
MZ: Yeah, leaving tomorrow, 12:30am.
UM3: 
MZ: Oh, there's a reason. (Ul) story behind that.
UMZ: I think the story (Ul) tell anyone. 
M2: 50 how are you doing, (Ul) fired up, yep. 0h 
NN: lthought (Ul) mistake {chuckles}
UM: (UI) wants to do it, yeah. never 
M2: You had drones, don?t you? You have drones? Probably operating from, along with your, uh,

torture chamber the wrong 

UP:

M2:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UF:

UF:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UF:

UM:

UM:

MZ:

UMS:

MZ:

UMS:

UM:

UMSwonder why?
You got what?what?-what else?

(Ul) where the waterboard all that the (Ul) Yeah, man,


(Ul) actually I rather be (Ul) 'cause it happened 



Alr?uht, bye-bye. [background conversation] 

(Ull

[chuckles]

(Ul)

(Ul) alright. background conversation] [noise]

(UI) and. uhm, (Ul) we're gonna ?nd [background conversation]
It?s really good, yes. 

Yes, It would be. Yeah.

That is a gap (PH) I don't know (Ull on these people leave comments, so it
must be hard.

0k. They need a 

Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.-.no, actually they? re very 

Yeah, do that Be cool, okay. Yeah.

Yeah, we haven't like 

You doing the other, um, 

Well we have that playing in background] Yeah, mean, (Ul) 
(UI).

(Ul) had it all cleared up.



Cool.

UM:
UM:

MZ:

UM7:

M2:
UCEmy, uhm, 

Yeah?

Uh, last night i Right, yeah, the only thing there is stuff no. you'ye got

to recon?gure here 

0k.

onu- you can?t [noise]
What do we do about that, that possession of 

Thought you guys have a meetim.

We are.
Not an of?cial meeting


Yeah.

Rich was gone that?s why I there was kind of, somewhat of an officiai one.
50. (UI) died: rim now (UI) maybe she 

I might 

Why?

I already did 
Where you going?
Huh?

Back to your meeting?
What's that?

It shows Rich's green 
Yeah, when was 
What?s that?



Okay.

UM:
UM:
UM:
UM:
UM:
UM:
UM:
UM:
NN:

UM:

NN:
UM:
NN:
UM:
NN:
UM:
NN:
UM:
NN:
UM:
NN:
UM:
UM:
NN:

UM:

Yeah, (UI) tomorrow (UI).



Yeah, yeah, exactly.

That thing 

(UI).

I mean, yeah?

(UI).

Yeah, (UI) trying to ?gure that out actually (UI). [background conversation] 
[clears throat]

Is someone else coming? I didn't [badground conversation] but I don't know (UI) phone
number (UI) He said -over there (UI) one thIng (Ul) but I (UI)

Right. nght, right, right, but I mean like -

(UI).

(UI) start caning you (UI) whatever It is 

Like Frank 

It?s not that they 

probany (UI)

But when did they know about it, though?

(Ul) house.

They reached (UI) or no? I mean how do [background conversatan
But that?s awesome. I was starting with what she had said before.
Right.

50, I don?t know If they're off of?two-three-three-two

Six, two.



Yeah.

NN:

UM:




UM:

NN:

UM:

NN:

UM:

NN:

UM:

UM:

NN:

UM:

NN:

UM:

NN:

UM:

NN:

UM:

UM:

UF:

UM:

UM:

UM:

So, maybe I wouldn't even know (UI). Uhm. (U1).
But, 

(Ul) that?s why 



Huh?

He 

I haven?t heard WI).

(UI) to do something. He-but I do think (Ul) he thinks he?s an about cheating the I

just (UI)





No, I don?t know but I?m saying?

My guess is (UR).

(Ul) drop off to? You think (Ul) drop off?



drop off.



No, and if they get-



Everyone? does [loud speaker announcement]
(UIJ

Alright, cool, yeah. They?re in that room right there, okay?
I already know who 

Where is your sladdng brother?

He had some errands to run, so-

They? re gonna need those, uhrn, grenades or not?

UM:

NN:

UCE:

UM:

NN:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UCE:

Well, he is not going to the??
Yeah.

(Ul) I'm gonna call him and 
Oh, (Ui) how you doing? 

You guys know each other?
Yeah, we met the other day.
Okay. Yeah.

How many do you need?
They're both Marines too, yeah.
Uh, 



Semper Fi.

So, he ran out. He?s not going to the meeting. (Ui) you?re not going either?

He's, uhrn-

You guys going and grab lunch?

I think we were talking, uhm, yesterday with 

Yeah.

Where you guys going? When are you going? You?re not saying? [background conversation]

Yup.
Are you gonna bring 

Uh-huh.

They want something put together.

I an get a grenade.

No, Vii?homemade.

No, i think they're homemade, son. You know, they?re?theYre 

UM:

UCE:

UM:

UCE:

JS:

UCE:

JS:

UCE:

JS:

UCE:

15:

MN:

15:

UM:

UCE:

NM:

15:

MN:

15:

UCE:

JS:

UM:
UM:

UCE:

JS:

(Ul) ATP (Ul)fuses, and then some bolts, ohm-everything

(Ul) worn and expensive, you know?

Uhohuh.

We?we have? right now we're having money issues.

Gotcha.



Uh-huh. Black powder, uhm 

How do you light them?

Match, uhrn, lighter. Do you wanna see one ofthese things work?
No. [chuckles] No. (on) there is no place to demonstrate. (un.
Down here 

Yeah, right over here where we all can stand here with binoculars.
You have to watch and tape it [chuddes]

If there?s a place to demomtrate I might 

Yeah, you know, he's trying to get crazy now.

(Ul) group schedule?

Unfortunately yeah. Saturday. (Ul) yeah.



I might work 

How big are they gonna be 

How big do you want them?

Well, I was just trying to get an Idea so can express the size, you know?
Grenadesize? About the size of a baseball.

The size of a baseball?

Round or (Ul) shape.

15:

UP:

NN:

UCE:

JS:

UCE:

UM:

UCE:

JS:

UCE:

.lS:

UCE:

NN:

UCE:

JS:

UCE:

JS:

UCE:

UCE:

UCE:

JS:

Depends on how much tape you put on them [simultaneous background conversatan
My lawyer 

Your lawyer? mat sounded like not a good thing.

That?s where you get (Ui) the stronger the?the device.

Scrap metal around it, inside of it or?

88's on the inside of it 88?s or ball bearings, whatever 



Not that we've ever done this before.

[chuckles] 

About a sell phone size?

Uhrn, cell phone size, baseball size, 



(Ui) grenade?grenade.

Something that's not 

Whatever works for you, brother. [badrground conversation]

This is -this is (UI) dry.

UH-huh.

(Ul) dry (Ul) dry. have to 

There is a civilian method of uh it?s called [bacicground conversation]
(ur) cell phone (un. [chudkles] i wonder if they would let us, uhrn, i would loveto go to show.
How is that 

I'd love to (Ui) show.

Let me give your, uhm, 



You don't act like (Ui) fucking bragging. (Ul) like ~for the -like air dub 

File Number:

Requesting Of?cial and Of?ce:
Task Number(s) and Date Completed:
Name and Of?ce of Transcriber:

Name and Of?ce of Reviewer:

Source Language:
Target Language.

Source File Information
-Recording:
-Date:

Panicipants: 4
Unidenti?ed male
Unidentified female

Abbreviations:
Unintelligible
Transcriber remarks
Phonenc

UNCLASSIFIED

UNITED Sums DEPARTMENT or JUSTICE.
FEDERAL BUREAU or leasncnIoN

 

Tampa Division
5525 Gray St
Tampa FL 33609

SA 1. Collins. TP
LSMS 294445

Ruth Rojas. ORA
LA Timothy P. Goring. TP
English

English

1D24 Session 14
l2/22-23/201 
VERBATIM TRANSCRIPTION
UNCLASSIFIED

File:
Rounding;

1D24 Session 14

Noises. unintelligible background convasation]



Ken Mitchell. please call 1067.

[Noiscs, uninndligible backgmund conversation]

 

File;

Recording:

UF:
UM:

UM2:

UM:



UM:

UM:

UM:

UM:

1024 Session 14

(U1)

(Ul) badXUl); 0k talking about when: they go 
[Tm  onus/twat: 

Yeah. 

[TYme noise 
(5011' - - .--  

 

exam
[m  n. 

 

if  

a.  


Breathing. Ul conversagion continue?
No 
W04. $3393.]

  

File:
Recording:

 

1D24 Session 14

UM:

 

UM:
UM:
UM:
UM:
UM:
UM:
UM2:
UM:
w]
UP I [Ul] fag; weekend. I'll br-l?m going to be down them.
M)
UM: you?re down there.
up Becauseifhecancall down mm i   
UM: Yeah, you can just 
[Noises, unintelligible background conversation]
UM:
UM:

 

File:

Recording:

UM:
UMZ:
UM:


UM:

CF:

CF.
UM:

NN:

UM:

UM2:
UM:
CF:

NN
TR:
UCE:
CF:

IDZ4 Session 14

commuting}
(U1). Yeah. Rowan 01m?



Oh.  I 3013 (U1) 

 

MML:


Hamd?b 

 (phonetic) 
mm

(In background) See you later. buddy.

 sun: W4 U1)

He's talking to himself.

(In background) (U1) Yeah. (U1)

He does that a lot. (Laughs) Especially in his sleep. [Laughs]
(In background) (UI) I got (UI) tomorrow 

(In background) Yeah.



In baclgmund) Laughs) You would know.
Heavy sleeper. [Laughs]

Oh my God. thirty-seven emails. [Ul]

You missed the lunch. man.

I know. man. I had to run a couple errands. Like. you know. pay bills and make
sure I don?t get kicked out of my place.

 

CF: 
SD. 3

CF: 
SD: 
ucq?
SD 



 

i  too.

1  other guy 

Ola-"r1 
And how?could we find out??nd out if the tech guys are done with that? 


Someone that exit with it (UI)

There?s nothing being done with ma: [Ul] 

Go on  and see?

Yeah, just a safe area for right now.

Okay.

Ring: 

 Never-2.. leave your proper relief. Something like
that? D'd I get that right?

To  my post until 
Unless my relieved.
unless properly relieved.

 

   

    



  me. 

 of the day.

[Cleats' Yes. I will walk my post in a military manner, keeping always 
on    everything that takes place within sight or hearing.

9 

File;
Recording:

UCB:

UM:

Session [4

Ah. that was a good one.

(Clears throat)

SD:
UCECF:
SD:

SD:

CF:

Yes.

What :5 a military (Ul) they never de?ned that (U ,v
I would not be the poster son of military man.

[Laughs]

Yes, you would.

No. I wouldn?t.

Hey. you shaved. I thought you were growing the Jihad: heard.
I did shave.

What happened to your beard?

[1.11]

What was wrong with the beard? You?d grow it big?it would have be a red beard
too.

 

lknow

You?d have a - beard.

Dude at the mall red beard. That would be cool. You remember that dude at the
mall?

Th-the one you slept with in the bathroom?

Me? 

No. the one you was swapping swip?swips-sptt [till
That?s not the one 1 saw.

Ah, yeah. I remember him.

File:

Recording:

UCE:
CF:
NNzi
UCE:
CF:
UCE:
NN
CF:
UCECF:

NN:

lD24 Session 14

The one you was swapping spit with.

Yeah. that dude was awesome.



Do you remember?

He said I had kind eyes and that just worked for me.
My first, my 

I heard it was a turkey sandwich. 

imam!

First sunen'or. that Saturday. that Saturday that-that we were commanded to meet
with the 

She showed me a picture of the birthday cake she made you.


Yes.

Who?

Oh. Sarah? [Chuckles] Sandwich cake? [Laughs]

Yeah, she?s like. just a and I?m 

[13081153.

The sandwich cake, yeah.

I?m like-I?m like. that wouldn't work out 'cause we'd do anything lUl] and I?d
probably eat all of it.

And she cut her toe open. She cut her toe open making it for me too. 'Cause I
guess she Opened the oven or something and like brought her toe across and
like just completely sliced it open.

1 just looked at the thing and I was like. ?How in the hell you make a sandwich
cake??

She made a sandwich cake for me.

Betty spacial.

 



SD:

CF:

UCE:

1024 Session 14

That was an ongoing?that was a?that was a running joke my?in my class
because I got so tired ofeating the normal shit and. in line,  eat the
same thing over and over.

Yeah, you had a turkey sandwich that day.

 

I just went straight to the sandwich bar and made a huge My sandwich was
like that fucking big. 80. that was the ongoing joke in the class. Every 1 was
eatlng asandwieh. So shemade me asandwich cake.  I thought
that was very sweet of her. Nobody 
Hey. it's Steve Dixon. How are you? [Unintelligible response]



Good.  [Unintelligible response]
Did you  the last night?

Okay. No. no. nOpe. We're good.

I?m sorry?

Did you see recording that 

He did. y.

I was just curious

Was there video?

it might as well not be. It?s-it?s all black. I mean. you could-you could see

his white  and I'm sure if you freeze frame maybe you can possibly make him
out. 1?s shit.

  

Yeah, it?sjust too dark.
From that thing?

67?

File:
Recording:

CF:
1C
TR:
NN
UM:
UCE:


UCE:

UCE:

CF:

JC:

CF:

JC:

SD:

CF:

UM:
CF:

SD:

lD24 Session 14

Yeah, I mean, I can play it right?l can bust it out. It?s-It?s?it?s real-
lt's not a big deal.

That?s okay.

No, I want to see it.

I was just curious. It was just curiosity. 

the door 1 saw it a few times when the door opens.

That?s what I?m saying. If you freeze frame you can probably get a picture of his
a. ?aw.

When?when the door was open. I mean?

Yeah. yeah.

When the door opens it lights?the whole truck lights up I 
Even that would be useful.

l?I skipped through it. so I lt?it was black the enure ume.
Okay.

I could see his white 

Gotcha.

see his hands moving and stuff, but I can?t make out his face.

.  Okay. Awesome. Alright, thank you.

(WI.  

So I mean. What?s up man?
Hey.

So. I mam 3mm -lik__el  could go through it and see if I can freeze
mamctm(un .   . . 

   



 1 have to leave to go try to get a tracker. the vehicles.
I)



File: 
Recording: lD24 Session 14

UQE: That means it does have 

But. uh, it?s not-itlo?it?s not" it's not like the other one was.

JC:  from yesterday said that he went to Seven-Eleven
after!? . .

No, you can?t No, you can't leave.

Ugi: Yeah?

so; You?ve  here.

Udi: Ym?ge  stay here.

SD: You can go with me to the recruiting of?ce.

UCE: What?s the recruiting of?ce?

Huh?

UCE: 

JC: Dispatch somebody local

CF:  ?1 

JC:  

CF: come on up.

UM: Um. to, 

Do  gurveyslurpee?


SD: One of the Air Force guy saw some guy walk out, some mid-eastern guy walk out
of  shop right beside.
[Noise] 

CF: Heyzdo we know what time it was last night, 1W

 

File:

RecordingJC:


JC:

  

ID2414

Scanning around with a camera.

It was after he broke off store.

Okay. just soon after about like eight o?clockish?
Yeah.

So I?m just going to go up there, ?cause the guy?the Air Force guy has a picture
of the guy, so I just want to make sure that it?s not him. Not our guys.

W9:

Ifit?s someone else he?s going to recruit, shoot up the recruiting of?ce,
we?re not won'ied. We just want to make sure it's not our guys.

Oh yeah. I could honestly give a shit less about that.

That's  go getdown. We cut-we can leave some weapons there if they
wantlo. 

We.  our says-
 pm.

Pm Thank you.
On Busch Boulevard.

?j

Hey, bro. what?s going on? Hey. I got a question for you. do
you-actually, you know what? I, I already?l just answered it so don?t worry
about it. 5] All right. thanks, that was easy for you. [Chuckles] Later.

 that was, if it was Dave saw Davis, it was Liz, so I can just give Liz a
can. 

background conversation]
Did you review the northeast request, Jake?
No 

31cm. it lastnigm.




File:
Recording:
NN:

UP:

CF:

TR:

(?Fi



CF:

TR:

CF:


CF: i

CF:

lD24 Session l4

Are you all going over to 0h.

Are . 

Hey. how?d everything go with US attomey)
Fine.

Yeah?

He was really cool.

actually Bobby who showed up. or was it 

I thought he might be miffed 'cause Rich said that he hadn?t heard about it before
yesterday. But he was totally cool. offered a few things and then said. 

He?s a cool dude. though.
been in touch with him every day lUl]

Hey. Liz. it's Chris. How are you? Good. good. I got a quick question for you.
I was looking over this sur-surveillance log from last night and it said. uh.
after. after the. ah. the CH5 mt l'm somt. after the whole thing went down
and everything like that. you guys saw him go into a Seven-Eleven or saw his car
at a Seven-Eleven. is that correct? [inaudible response. Noise] Fil?tieth and Busch
and he do you know if he went inside or did he Okay. But he
got?he just got gas?

(In W) On what 1?

Yeah. yeah. no. I got it. I gotcha. No. it's that it was just brought up that he went
to a Seven?Eleven. so everybody is like, ?What the hell did he go in and do What
did he-what was he doing?? So he bought gas. that makes sense. Okay. so it was
Fiftieth and uh. where? Fiftieth and Busch. okay. 1 apprecnate ll. That's all I
needed. [hasdible response] That could be his?that could be his brother. I mean
H?his brothers go out and party and stuff like that. so l'ni sure that was one of
them. Yeah. that?that doesn't seem like our boy?s normal hangom. so. [Laughs] I

wouldn?t think so, but. oh. whatever. Inaudible response] Cool. I appreciate it.
Yes. Yeah, yeah. I am. All. all will be here, um if. if you'd like to
attend to .uh. you know give-give the a little. uh. you 

brief afterwards. that would de?nitely be welcome. Yeah. yeah. yeah. Same?plaee
that Link gave you guys your brief. Yeah, yeah. of course. Of course, eah. I
mean. we?ll, lt?ll robably go on for a while 'cause we have

which l?m sure it's going to take a while. And then. um
obviously the brie?ngs will take a little bit. So. after we, uh. alter we knock that
out then. I mean. we'll. we?ll be here. So. If you can make it cool. I?m sure you?re

File:
RecordingCF:
RW:

CF:

CF:

TR.

CF:

lD24 Session 14

going to give them some.m-useful hints. I?m going to try and pass on
everything. you know. I?ve heard from you and Steve and everything like that. but
it?dprobt. ly better coming from you guys. so. [lnaudible response] Uh. was.

yes. [1 response] Yeah, it will and l'm?l'm de?nitely going to go over all
this. so. Thanks a lot. Liz, I appreciate it. [Noise] (Signs; 

Where you at? I heard you happened to say he ~lust got gas Was that 

Yeah. yeah.

[Ul] that the Seven-Eleven thing? Just gas?

That's?yeah. That's what she said.

He didn't look like he went in?

Well. he went in but there [Ul] she said he went in. was in there for a minute and
then came out. So. I mean. we can send somebody in. over to go talk.

No. I?m. .. I?m comfortable. Appropriately expend resources where necessary. He
went for?he didn?t have time to buy a phone. he went and paid for gas. 

Yeah.

That?s through visual only though.
 Yep. Tha-that's cool.
You good with that?

Yes. sir. 

 That?s our story and I?m sticking to it 

hundred percent. uh?okay.
[Ull senator.

Saves me some time. so I appreciate that. Okay. what the hell else was i doing?
Oh. yeah. Email.

Sir?

Somebody was just really complimentary of how how much over the last
few days the reporting continues to be to have him on surveillance. I just wanted
to pass on to you that whatever the teams have been 



?l

File:

Recording:

0?
4. .. ..

CF:

ID24 Session 14

them to keep doing 

That's what I'm trying to do tonight because we?re n'pping out surveillance
tonight.
I know.

And that?s potentially bad. but that?s why I was just talking to Liz. I was like hey,
if you 

 
   

.. 
The lessons learned from the other team, because they?ve been doing it right.
Exactly.
That was the thing, so
You know what they?ve doing right?
They?re backing off.

that?s the lessons learned. And I

 sent methis nice long e-mail that she asked me to shame with

everybody, so I?ll; going to print that off and do that.
So anyways. Good job, Chris Franck.

lt ain'tme, man.

[Endof recording]




UM: Unknown Male

UF: Unknown Female

U1: Unintelligible

PH: Phonetic

IA: lnaudible

Overlapping conversation

- - Interrupted Speech

Second Conversation
ellipsis

(12/23/2011) (00:22:51)

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

UCE:

tat

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

Session 16 (12/23/2011) (00:22:51)
Yeah, yeah. Good.

 conversation?wc could do that today. That?s a long
g? . . .

Right.

That?s not (background conversation) (U1) ?ve minutes or ten minutes (U1), no
that?s .lls, that?s guys sit down make sure what we are talking about sol
canng (U1)  (backgrotmd noise)

You know and we need some place where we can have a conversation. We can
actually do thatinthecartruth?tlly. Wecandothat inthecataslongasit?s
comfortableas long es-lxlek of a truck . . . (background noise)

Right your trunk or back ofthe truck (UI)

Yam ofall thosethingaWeotlm-da)?
Yet



Yeah, yep. Throw them up on the back of the truck.



Uh. .

move; you got 04.: back ofthe truck too. and
 Youtnow, [Ul]-goingto need time to do mom



 Hey, what?s up? Oh yeah, one second. Oh.  
Well,.again  again, yeah, you don?t want to spend

- start getting into other stu?? that you don?t want to jam you up on 

something 

.. But I?ll get to it?, but that?s, that?s 0?

So basically cut the meeting out and then tonight it would be  

What happens though, um, what happens though with the people to
get you to trying to kill the plan that we had where 



UCE:

1it'g


. 2M
.5.


RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

to meet tomorrow, we?ll have the short conversation, Okay, I?m doing stuff.? or
?This is what you?re gonna need to do, you?ve got to get your money together.?

 i. you  you know, mMeekb  money;
- ?on?t know if you have [Background conversation]

 
 

 

   

(UK)  get (UI) cool. - '2  have got a week to?the money

 - a 1?11 Come to see you me you then. you
  give me in: details ofit and I?ll (WW 111 30:11] go-
rugo-mn) Wants and start momma (background noise)

Right.

You know.

 

Does that still open the door back up for him to say well I is paying for it 'so
you?ve got your money. Didn?t you get it ?om him already? He?s supposed to be
paying for it, no?

No, no, no, I didn?t.

Cause he?s already today said, ?You?re gonna have to give me this.?

Right that?s  (0V)

He may still  he may still pull that four hundred out of his pocket and hey I, got
paid today here?s the four hundred  

Well, what I?m saying what I?m saying to that, what I?m saying to that; that
?rst plan that we had that adds this to this thing (pause) wouldn?t solve the
problem that we?re having right now. The scenario that you came  you came up
with just now, solves the problems that we?re having right now but eliminates the
meeting.

That?s the only thing I will say.

And, and I?m, and I think you at least what I heard last night, was the fewer
meets the better the way this relationship is kind of set up because . .. 

I?m goqju with it, 1-. (0V)

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

JC:

UCE:

JC:

  

I knowiyou are. Yeah, yeah, six of one half dozen (11% his mindset  The
fewer times you guys are (0V)

 

 the better he feels about not 
(0V) Sure.

inadvertently dragging himself into it and being recognized and seen together
and  (0V)

Sure operationally, operationally you and me, it doesn?t hurt us at all, but actually
it?s not a bad thing for us to get operationally, operationally as far as the, the
um how more realistic our operation is on, on outside of what law enforcement
wants, realistically for our operation the fewer meets is better and, and what
we?ve discussed is  (0V)

They tell us  (0V)
It?s better.

Law enforcement wise. i .3 more meetsmiiette? (0V)

 

Exactly, exactly, exactly right, exactly for what people were saying earlier today
the plan that we had before, when we were coming up before, would have
satis?ed what they were asking for but it?s not optimal for, for  to a

   (0V)

It gives him  it has more ofa chance of him taking mime hundred bucks he
gets (0V)

Yes sir, yes sir, yes sir. (0V)

(0Vsomething else with it. (0V) and I don?t like that.

 

Well then and also it creates a situation that they also didn?t want, where he has to
actually just go and get the money from  source to give to you possibly. (0V) 

Yes.

 and, and that?s what, and they de?nitely said they didn?t want that to happen.
(0V)

3

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

Right, yeah, we de?nite, yeah we don?t want actual money moving. They prefer
that, hejust gives you, ?nd a way to get him, him give you a salary which he?s
earned legitimately.

And that secondary, that secondary if we did  that
down payment medium then what will happen a?er, the money still comes
directly from the source. I mean but still it?s  (pause) you?ve eliminated that,
getting that money out of his hands. That?s the only thing that you don?t, but you
can still, I mean you can still  (0V)

Okay.

He doesn?t have to actually be the one that pays me ?cause he doesn?t have to get
it from the source. You know on that second meeting, on that third meeting or
whatever that will be, whatever the next (Background noise) But you know

what happens though is  his pocket, you have money

Exactly. No I?d rather get the ?ve hundred tomorrow and get that. Now the
question would be, now that you have your down payment and you?re gonna do it
for him and get him the stu?; how long is it gonna take you to get it and when is

mien meet? Cause the next meet for me, the next time you and I get together I
will have your stuff. (0V)

m1)

You need to have money. (0V)

Exactly.

If I?ve got the stuff and you don?t have any money, you just  (0V)
You don?t get the stu??. (0V)

 you don?t get the stu? and you come back.

I?ll see you later.

And I?ll see you later.

Sure.

Um  when does that meethappen? Is that  ?Does it take you two weeks to get
You say, I?ll  you know what the best time for me about January,
the ?rst week sometime in January I can have it all put together and ready for



you.

UCE: It can be whatever  whatever we want it to be. That doesn?t matter. It can be
doneinaweek.  

 

RW: Right We can do it next Thursday. (0V)

UCEnext Friday.

UCE: mamas  can be done in two weeks, 1 mean that?s  that?s. ..
WOW

RW: It?s kind of, all depends, some of that depends on what tomorrow  what

happens tomorrow night if he?s  even though he says, ?Oh, I don?t really have a
timeline, but having been on a surveillance that?s good. It?s better cause they may,
they may get on me again and I won?t be able to do anything.? 

UCE: What he expressed and whatI  howlunderstood whathe expressedwasthat
the sooner the better because right now he?s clean and clean, but he doesn?t know
how long that?s going to last.

RW: Right. I remember hearing that
UCE So. ..
TR: Well, maybe you can  I mean if that comes up again maybe you can work that

to our advantage. You know let him know, If you?re clean, don?t do anything
besides come to work and sit at home and you?re less likely to draw attention.?
(0V)

Idid,lsaidthat.

   

RW: Quit, don?t drive quit driving erratic, don?t  don?t you know don?t
don?t  I mean did he like bunker down . . . (0V)

UCE He?s always driving erratic.

RW: [laughs] Did he bunker down in the seat with you at all driving?

UCE (1A) Yeah.

RW: See that draws attention to me  I would think  stop it because you?re drawing

attention to yourself. People driving by even if they?re not the police think that?s



weird that there?s a guy that keeps sinking down in the seat and they?re just.
That?s weird.

  

 

TR: He does that all the time 
RW: Oh, no worries (UI).
UF: (laughs) (0V)
RW: Anyway, to me that would be like, ?Would you cut that out you?re 
attention to us.?
JC: Alright. (0V)
UF: Looks suspicious. (0V) [6:39]
RW: ?Get your head get your head off a swivel. You look suSpicious, relax, but
 (0V)
C: Okay.
RW: Okay. (0V)
JC: Alright, I?ve got one thing to, to address here. (0V)
RW: Mot to make a phone call.
. 
RW: I didn?t (UI)
RW: Oh no, no, you?hadla go'od train of? we had a good ?ow going here. (0V)
JC: If  ifthe source says, ?Hey AMIR wants athousand bucks I can I I

can only pay him 600, you need to  we think we?ve got any
holes in the story in terms of like ?When did you talk to and ?Did you
talk to him over the phone?? That kind of thing  I think  my thought is I
think you can play that by just saying, ?Yeah, I talked to him on the phone.?





JC:
UCE
JC:
UCE
JC:

UCE
JC:

UCE


UCE
JC:
UCE
RW:

CE:

and you know. But he sells regular stuff and you?re just talking about a down
payment so or something like that. (0V)

The gist of it is AMIR called me, that?s going to be, AMIR called me this
morning said  said, L: in,  said on the phone (UI)  
it?ll be a thousand. It?ll be a thousand  Okay. (0V)

told him I?m good for six hundred now, you need to pay him four hundred.?

  

Yeah.
Some  does that work?
Yeah, yeah and  (0V)

So we don?t have to  we don?t have to have a made up transaction between
source and you before then. (0V)

Right, sure- (0V)

It?s just he committed six hundred. You?re good with that because of you guys
relationship, but needs to pay the other four.

Right. I think ifhe says its thousand I?m ?ne, you know. so  um  yeah, so]
told him i  e?s gonna  that I told him that he?s gonna give four
hundred and the other six, that I?ve got six and that they can sit there and
hash it out however they want, but like dude I?m getting paid four hundred
dollars. I?m going to take my entire paycheck that I?m getting away from me, you
andI  you know  whatever it (0V)

 

You still have ninety for gas.  (0V)

Yeah, whatever they hash out, whatever they hash out between them. (0V)
That would be like the just right amount, so he?s squeaking by. i
If it ends up, if it ends up you know that. . .. (0V)

It also shows good intent  every  he was willing to cough up almost his entire
paycheck to get this thing going. (0V)

We can talk  we can talk about his whole paycheck. Then, we can talk about". . .
you know  three hundred dollars or whatever it is they can the two of them can
square that away and then, you know  (pause)

7

RW:

JC:
RW:
JC:

RW:

JC:

RW:

JB:
RW:

RW:

RW:
JB:
RW:
JB:
JC:

RW:

UCE:

JC:

Well, we?ve got to square it away just I know  I know what you?re saying, but
he can?t go any lower than three. I think for that it?s kind of (0V)

And I don?t think they?ll be a problem with that.
Yeah.

When we talked to the source this morning he said the only reason he?s showing
up is because of you  you know and that business being an avenue . .. (0V)

1t (01) makes your money for him.

Just access  access  (0V) Yeah. He thinks he doesn?t even care aboutthe
money. It?s just you know  I?m sure the money is good, but  (0V)

I?d like to break here and the three ofus go see the SAC real quick, and kind of 
give him  up before we call RALPH and tell RALPH about it.

Think about your option of RALPH will be (UI) direct (0V)

Oh, I can  yeah, ifwe can do one direct yeah we cando that too:Um,
but we want to tell STEVE ?rst. 

Yeah. absolutely I want  I want to tell  He'sjust been saying when he
wants to go before the four ?fteen, should I set, say maybe three thirty or three
forty ?ve at the latest?

We can probably do it in twenty minutes. We need to go up and see the boss.
Okay, okay.

And say we?re gonna SVTC with CID one last time at three thirty

Right.

So we want to give you the heads up.

Perfect, yeah that?s great.
Alrigh? got the thing pulled up, prayer times, we'll look 

Yeah.

 

Yeah, I think  the thing is  the rest ofthe prayers are pretty close all the way
to Isha which is seven thirty so maybe a?er Isha would be the easiest thing unless

57

RW:

UCE:

JC:

you want to meet him right before and like you all on the ?y stOp and pray
somewhere. Um -. . ., but that?s something to consider and then ?gure out 
(0V)

You comfortable praying with him?


Well, the biggest thing is to ?gure out where you want to meet so that you know
cause the source is gonna tell him, talk to him and this is where usually meet him
at this time (U1).  

We?ll be in the FIG room right?

Yep. (background conversation UI)

 

We can work on the prayer time and everything.
Who?
(background conversations) (UI)

 

CH:

CH:
TR:
CH:

TR:
CH:

(background conversations) (UI)

He didn?t say he  did he was hejust blowing smoke or did he he
didn?t say he actually met with somebody back when he ?rst got and
that can?t be con?rmed he did or didn?t. (0V)

He was in the area where he said he was.
Right? right, right-


- mum, and

  

Yeah, oh yeah, because he said he wants a 

7

CHcomes out ve a handgun, you know, on the corner, he is
coming out, you know I?m still looking for a handgun, handguns are a little bit
?harder to get because they?re all 

Do you give him a handgun?

Right.

Handgunwillbe lt?sum 
who wants the handgun for? It is pre . .. pre anything 

Right.

Just to have one  (0V)
Well you can talk thatup, butjust in terms (0V)

I?m not givinghimahandgun. I (0V)

 

CH:

CH:

UCE

CH:

UCE
CH:

Right and I understand it. I Imdetstand it. The focus is now  is between and just
talking about how your saying the source saying, ?I?ll give him six hundred,
you?re gonna give him four hundred.? and then you come and saying, need a
deposit you know take the six hundred that-that the source (0V)

?1 know where he?s going.

Take the six hundred the source gives me to start the thing, um  I?ve got some
shit I?ve got to do with my car. I?ve got  you know I?m gonna to keep this four
hundred .. . I?ll keep (U delivery. You need your
deposit.

Right.

You need your deposit, the four, six hundred if the source goes to him saying 
(0V)

He?s gonna try to talk me out of that thin hundred dollars?

What I?m saying is the source, how the source states, you now you give him four
hundred I?ll square the other six hundred. (0V)

H)

  

TR: So, the two keys are; one: the source has to make it absolutely clear he doesn?t
have any extra money.

CH: Right at this time I have no extra money. (0V)

TR: (0V) and (UI) the second key is  (0V)

CH: We'll work on this.

TR: . .. taking anything less than a thousand  (0V)

CH: Right.

TR:  and the only place that any extra money is coming off the table is from our
gull-

CH: Right.

TR: So, either you?re not getting   I?m not getting started or you?re giving
me four hundred bucks. I mean, 

UCE If I?m not taking it out of my pocket.

TR: The hard  (0V)

CH: I?m not taking it out my pocket and I?m not taking it out of his pocket. If you

want to keep us out, you give me four hundred dollars to start this process, good
faith you know deposit?

You know because if the somcmsaying I have six
hundred dollars to give  (0V) -

TR: The weak link is the source because he, he.

CH: Right.

TR: Because he, he has a hard time being direct.

CH: Right.

TR: And, and.

CH: So if he feels that he?s already given you the six hundred dollars or he has the six

hundred dollars and he?s already said yeah my brother will take care of it. He?s
already said, he?s already said my brother will take care of it so when it comes



down to the deposit we Want to get the cash out of pocket so he can?t
go to that drug dealer if he?s met one and purchase a handgun because you didn?t
provide him with one timely enough

 

   

CH: Timely enough.
CH: Oryou can?t gethim agunsohe?s liker
 '2    we?ve already taken care of that, he?s already said he?ll
give you six hundred dollars so the brother will give you six hundred dollars.
TR: His response then is that?s not enough, I need a grand to get started
CH: Right.
 Well that?s when-he could say well okay then maybe I don?t need all that stu??,

downgrade me to the next level of junk.

 

m; Well that?s what I mean (IA)
We?ve already taken away your Uzi, we?ve already, I mean that?s.
UCE That?s another problem. 
TR: Otherwise 

  
  
 

CH: ?xj?xo?m   wilt. wewant
to get that cash from him.  

    

Hwy 
. . .

 

 

?u

 

 

 
  
   

4? ,JMWto-tmq
 
. ?w -, hugely?.

4- 


up

w; What does the thbusand dollars 

 

UCE: (U)

NN: That?s what, I mean he wanted to know if its to give me i
 . A

(U) Right there, there?s the di??erence, right there is you shoot it up.

13 

TR:

TR:

 

. In]: because, 
(IA voices all talking at once)

 

TR: Okay here you go, FRANK, you?ve worked all week. Here?s your ?ve dollars.
You can do whatever you want with that ?ve dollars.

CF: dollars, 

 STEVE . . .

UCE: (UI) got ?ve 
UM3: (UI)

 

(Overhead paging, PAT MAHN please dial one one one eight, PAT MAHN,
extension one one one eight)


CH: Right, right, right, rightunderstand. Now, now (U1) I (U1) what you?re saying (UI)

CH:  but Mimi? have Six hundred bucks 


  L-  

 



 

 

(IA voices talking in background)
  . .- 
  




  

(IA voices talking in background)

TR: The long and short of it is, the bottom line is that you don?t have to understand
why (UT).

. .
131?; i 
V.  'n?nn. .

TR: Every single  one of that six hundred (U1) (IA UF in
background) your boss says the United States Attorney (U I) they?re the ones who
take the court case, case to court and they say it matters so it matters.
the end of the day that?s kind of where  i I

 

TR: Is it absolutely positiver a U1) probably not (UI)

(IA voices in background)

 -  ?AI-Fanny. convergence, I?m not sure (IA)
UF: (IA) It takes two days to drive here, right?
 Right.
 Two or three days and so two or three days to get back and you?re already, you?re
out of pocket
TR: But giving the money for doing the work. The guy has earned the money. Once

he?s earned the money he can do whatever he wants.



 

CH:
TR:

CF:

CF:

TR:

UM3:

TR:

TR:
TR:

CH:

UM4:

UCE:




And that?s the point.

Talking about before what we were saying last night (Ul) he works for a week
he?s gonna make like three or four hundred dollars. 

l'm gonna work.

Yeah that?s what we?re, tomorrow who?s going to pay (Ul) we?re gonna say four
hundred bucks.
(U1)

Absolutely, it doesn?t matter. See you?re not listening STEVE. Yeah he?s working
for the store because.

We?re telling the source to let him go.

Absolutely, no doubt but once the source gets the money, it?s his money. He can
choose to do whatever he wants with it, that?s the point. Once it?s in his pocket he
can say I?m gonna go buy hamburgers an ??iemnobody is
forcing him to.

    

I)
(IA voices in background)

He can part with that money, it?s no longer his (IA) all day long, it?s his, it?s his.
He can do whatever he wants. And he?s sitting there with four hundred dollars in
his pocket. . . piece of shit broke down last week (IA)

(IA voices talking simultaneously in background)

Once. once he gives it to him it?s his money whether we orchestrated it or not, it?s
still his money even though he?s got (IA). 

Um this guy here, new guy.
Oh yeah the lawyer.

The new guy, you were, you were with the bomb techs and some of us earlier we
were looking at this um hand grenade thing, right? They can make some han
grenades that are somewhat functional and kind of show 

Ia

 

UCE:

TR:

UCE:

TR:

UCE:

UCE:

UCE:

UCE

UCE
TR:

kind of show him how to do that, how to use thand everything
and have a demonstration (Ul)

 If that happened to me, I, 1 don?t know  the ether"-

  

c;   
Why?

Waly do one, I would say let him see it go off.

Why don?t we, why don?t we do that? And then deliver it like you know and like
we got you that or something like that, we can deliver we got you that but point
out two basic points. We got two basic, we got two basic even like two days
before and if we deliver like three days after.

Like two little ones we can try out

Yeah, this is how it works, take it and throw it, okay that?s how it works, right?
Well now you know how the grenades work. This is so guns work this way, you
know this is it, this one here, um this is how you load and unload it. l?m not
bringing a live gun to you, basically cause I don?t trust you that you?re going to
pull steal my shit if I give you a loaded gun.

I?ve got two grenades and a gun and if you leave I?ve got nothing and I?m dead.

Right, exactly so this is why you bring a non functional gun, this gun doesn?t
function. This is how it works. The gun works this way. This is how you quick re-
load the magazines, you know. This is the grenade. The grenade goes thisiway.
Bring a, bring a um bring a the trimmer magazine mechanism for, the trigger
mechanism for the explosive, for the bomb. This is how you load it up and how
everything works, you know.

Yeah.

The battery, the battery goes in here. The switch goes this way. This is howit all
works.

Speaking of which.
Now you know how everything works.
I?m ?nished then I have something to talk about.

1 7

(IA voices in background)

 

UCE You know how everything works. This is how everything works, right? Now you
know how everything works. Load it the car, take you home and in three days I?m
gonnamyou so I don?t have to put the locks up on you and show you
how it works. 1?11 deliver it to you, hand itw to you. of stuff,

here?s everything. I got my money?

    

 may; 

(IA voice in background)
(End of Session 16)

UCE:

CH:

UCE:

CH:

LF:

SD:

CF:
SD:

LF:
SD:

UCE:

SD:

UCE:

SD:
CF:
SD:

Session 1702/23/20?) (00:22:51)
i like all that but I mean I would still have the other vest for the take down.

ldon?t think he?s gonna have a vest put on him, 1 can show him how to wear it
but I think, I think he?s gonna take it off.

I think.. who is gonna put it on.
You think he?s going think, I think he?s gonna put it on.

I, I think he?s so paranoid and, and, and that?s the one concern I have with the
practice session cause he?ll think he?s gonna be caught if we practice. He?ll think
the fuckin? spy satellites will see. Which, which 

Oh, that?s true. I didn?t think of that.
I mean, 1 don?t know but that, that?s one concern. i mean I.

lcansee lie-robsthebankandgets
-

And that?s okay.

He would still get in paradise because it?s extra secure. And I think he would put
the vest on and just go.

I would like 

you know, as soon as,



as soon as he gets it.

1 think so too.

And that?s why..

I, l, 1 think he?ll do it you know?

If he?s stopped and killed in a traf?c stop it doesn?t matter he?s still going to
paradise. 80..
We talked about it yesterday.

SD:
LF:
SD:

Si?il??a

UCE:

CH:

UCE:

he said he?s extrernely..
Huh?


Yesterday or the day before we talked about ah, ah.. upstairs, Kerry Myers said
it?s not practical, put the battery into something in there. It?s not so much, the time
What about, okay that?s not possible, what about once you put the batteries
in, if you take them out and they are, you?re gonna fuckin? blow up. This is, 
mean, onoethis thing isarmedyoutryanddisarm it,you gotaprettygoodchance
of blowin? yourself up.

Yeah, I mean you can?t.
But what if they are tryin? to prep..
Like ?ea market city in Webster.

in a situation where if you arm this thing you?ve got to use it or you?re fucked.
Either it?s not gonna work, or it?s gonna go off one way or the other and so one of
onceheputs inthebattery, sucks

button and die or shoot somebody. Kerry Myers said well it doesn?t work that
way. The circuit isn?t burnin' it?s juice until you push the button. That is pretty
common sense Okay, ?ne. But what about once you put the batteries-in and
connect the switch, connect everything togetha'. if you pull it apart, anybody
who?s kinda hooked there, the, the batteries on a battery cable or plugged
something 
device. Dangerous to pull it apart, you pull this thing apart. once you, that?s it
man. You pull it apart and it?s, dang near as good as pushin' the button. And a
huge risk, it makes him think, once he plugs it in he?s committed it and if he
believes it, that shows his intent. If you?re ready, once we do this we?re nottakin?
this thing Th, th, that?sjust ah..

voices in background]

Okay, yeah, that would be great. l?d wanna see it, once you get back there. 
would..accidentally.. I might have issues; I might have issues with that.

Well his property, there is plenty of places to go [Ul] instead of a tree stand? 
sniper?
That?s de?nitely what i heard ah Alfonso talking about yesterday at lunch.



UM:

CH:

SD:

CH:

CF:

NN:
CF:

CF:
CH:
CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:

UCE:

CF:
CH:

Lmean. ..
Oh yeah so.
There is one way in, and one way out.

He was throwing out the idea of wanting to well. No he didn?t say exactly
that but.

Yeah.

1 think he said that Rich said something about it, that is probably
American Middle East drug companies

1 gotta live with these guys.

[Low audio]

Well what do they do for that explosive Did they have any kind ofuaining
for us to view 


button to initiate the device. You kind of meant it, once you push that little red
button. you mean. . .and that?s what everybody was talking about.

How many years? What did he get?

I don ?t talk to Miller about that.

voices in background]

no, no its not, that right. That?s right



You going to have recordings tonight? CHS, you gonna go?[Ul]

1 don?t know. 1 don?t really want 

You mother fuckers keep giving him a device. We gotta keep transcribing so.




1 think, 1 think you pulled it off better than me actually because 

3

I see a lot of Ricky Martin.

UCE:

UCE:

CH:

CF:

CF:

SD:
CF:

CF:

NE:

CH:

NE:

NE:

NE:

NE:

Ricky Martin, ah, you know what, yeah.

Oh my God, yeah.

You?re actually, you?ve actually got a point there 

Damn.

voices]

You can rock it betterthan I can. Do you seediathappening? Lasttwonights [Ul]
[Laughter in background, IA voices]

[Ul] Nobody can say that okay you don?t put a suicide vest on unless you fucking
mean the shit.

01' you drank a lot of whiskey.
Well that was one, two times so.
[Ull

[Background voices]

Oh you?re going to the hot tower.
How do I know this and you don?t?
[Background voices]

Are they doing SVCT from headquarters?
Yes they are.

They're dialing in from upstairs?
No they?re coming down.

Oh okay good. So they?ll be in that conference room cause we?rejust going to
keep them on the line for a couple of minutes?

Yes.

Okay sounds good, thank you.
I think he knew that they were.
0h Bienkowski.

l/

UCE:

NE:
TR:
NE:

NE:
JC:

JC:

TR:

JC:

JC:

UCE:

JC:

UCE:

JC:

UCE:

SD:
CF:

There you go.

Yeah whatever you say.

Thank you, thank you Taylor.

What am I chopped liver?



This won?t even bother.

ithink I'm going to write you guys a guide. 
Did you ever talk to Jenny Smith 

No, I?m trying to get a hold of what?s her name 
What about Ryan Hatch?

What about him?

Somebody at ITOS knows him.

[Background voices]

Did we talk anymore about the meeting location.
Negative.

That?s what I?m asking. That?s what we?ve been sitting here trying to
brainstorm on how we?re going to do that. We?re going to give him the grenades,
you know and take him to a low ?eld and show him how it works.

Yup.

Blow a few of them, give him, show him how a gun works, you know and um and
um send him on his way 

Good idea. You can send him Iikejust a couple of grenades and lave fun with
them 

We're gonna do, we?ve gonna, we?ve got a video tape 
live ones.

Yeah. [Chuckles]



UCE:

JC:
CF:

JC:

CF:
JC:

UCE:

CF:

NN:
CF:

UCE:

PM:

UCE:

CF:
PM:

You?re laughing like, you?re laughing we?rejoking. Do you see a smile on my
face? i am dead serious.

I?ve never, I?ve never seen a smile on your face. 


[Background conversation]

[ur] Button down shirt.

My, my CHS was called my Amir this morning. Amir wants a thousand dollars
down payment. 1 only pay six hundred dollars. You need to pay him four hundred
dollars. pay him 

Okay and everyone is cool with that 

Right okay so that?s what we?Like everybody else let?s get this shit over with and get this" .
Get this out of my division. [Chuckles] Out of my division.

As long as you get me my press release. As long as you get me my press release


[lA voices]

ilm do you remember looking award shows, backgrounds 
1 don't want to play anymore, get it done and get it done now.
Alternatively, take the six hundred dollars and ?y out of here Semi.
Hey, You like melike him.

But you don't give her any paper that?s all messed up.

Exactly 

he doesn?t give me any paper.



PM:
CF:
PM:

CF:

Exactly and so it?s never messed up.

page 17 is done and they said that was pretty 
Oh yeah you told me and then walked off with it [Ul]
Did 



1 can carry about twenty ?ve pounds, I used to carry like twelve, that was my
favorite, when he talked how he used to carry twelve pounds, damn man 

1 did a lot of [Ul] stuff in there. Can you guys get that worked out?
We?ll get it worked out.

Or are you very busy getting ready to go?

Or English.

Hi Sara this is Taylor.

We, we need to ?gure out where you?re meeting and what time.

wen what do you know? How handy is that?

Tomorrow, not today?

it?s going pretty well. Um we had a really good teleconference um I think
everybody agrees that um we?ve come up with a pretty workable scenario . . .

voices talking simultaneously]

. . .just so you can know it?s goingto be at ah UCE will have total, the CH8 
need one thousand dollars down payment The CHS is going to tell Sam, and
the target that UCE needs a thousand dollars. I told him 1 have been struggling, I
came up with six hundred they?re going to have to come up with the rest. The
target will have just been paid a bit more than that he?ll earn this week. He?ll have
it in his pocket. It?s his money. He can do whatever he wants and then.late_r in the
day UCE is going to show up for this meeting and while the UCE and target are
together alone the UCE is going to say look, he says you?re going to give me so
much money and you?re going to come up with the other four hundred or you
know we?ll have to wait [Ul]

[Simultaneous conversation]

'7

CF:



JC:

UM4:

UF:

CF:
SD:

fomorrow, tomorrow. We haven?t detennined, we?ve got an issue with a 
that?s a big deal for the target. He doesn?t always show up for work early and 
beforethatbutourgoal istodo 
We?ve just got to 

Onemorething[Ul]


And I explained well we?ve got the looks like we've just talked to her so


[Simultaneous conversation]

Well which, whichever one you know. She was actually at the SVTC today, but
she was actually at [Ul] Do you have that number? I, okay.

So we were at this training last week that was it. Well not many people 
Terri?c um let?s see, Bobby O?Neill should come to the SVTC 

knowit
was like okay you know, how did you go about getting yourjob here. We all had
to go on-line pan of the process. You guys we all like turn around and

like 

[Simultaneous conversation]

Is that the thing where they were talking about a change.

Right. right, right.

[Simultaneous conversation]

You don?t have the, but either way you still had to go on-line and 

Yeah, yeah and Chris Hileman should be here and not to. He?s great, Chris
Johnson 

I?m not a tech guy.
Oh, oh cause I am? Actually I might as well apply for it at this point.

Well you have all these things around you so that makes you more of a tech? guy
than me. 021 why didn?t you see the credit card?



CF:

SD:
CF:

UM:

CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:
CF:

SD:
CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:

Alright, oh we?ve still got to 3a I guess we don?t

really have to but.
No cause it can stay in for the next.

Yeah actually you know what yeah it can so fucking leave it. Yeah, why don?t 1
take this out?



Okay you need, you need the charger, right?
Yeah I need the charger.

You have, you have one of these at home, right?
No, take that thing too.

You don?t? You don?t have this at home?

No its.

You don?t have a home charger? That?s for your blackberry.
Oh it?s one; it?s one that ?ts my blackberry?
Yeah, yes.

Yeah I should, yeah.

Okay cause i need to put this back out. This is Terry Rawls? that I stole so 
goes in there. All you need to do is plug that in there.

Alright. yeah.

And you?re good.

i know how it works.

Okay. .

Alright.

And they you?ve got one for the - too?
I do not have a - charger.

[Background noise]

CF:

SD:
CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:
CF:

JC:

JC:

This is the older blackben-y one, you know it?s thicker and everything like that so
this one goes like that

But that's the one that we charge our new blackberries on?
Yes.

Well actually here.

Yes this is the one you have your, see, your blackberry is charged on this one.
Yeah see if it will 

Yeah it will. Yeah that?s, that?s our new blackberry one. .
Okay.

But that?s the old kind so yeah you don?t, use the thick one.
Alright.

So, so this goes for-

Alright.

And that one goes for [lA]

[Background noise and IA voices in background]

Yes in factwedid talkaboutthatsoand um is rightnow
is probably no niore than i think so. think so, and i think it?s real similar to
what you said that the more good convexsations we have, the more intense and if
We can get him, you know reaching into his own pocket and take that to money to
you knowwalkintothesom'ce. Hewantstogo?x hiscarandhewantsto 
mean it's his money. Once it?s in his pocket and he earned it, he can do whatever
he wants.

voices in background]
I mean I think it sounds good.
Right.

i don ?t think he'll ever go for it, because, as controlled an environment as it is
[Ul] explosives and live weapons [Ul]

JC:

UCE:

JC:
CH:
JC:
CH:

JC:
TR:

Yeah, yeah and l, and that?s a really good idea. We mentioned that language [Ul]
yeah and he, he did get a good I think he did good a so something 

No but they don?t care though, it?s, it?s not like they don?t, they don?t care
about if he 

Yes that?s not the problem. The problem 

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

If. it?.

Right.

So what if 

Yeah exactly, yeah.

Oh. but I?ve got a friend in Knoxville division [Ul]

That?s exactly what bothers him is we can get back out there 
voices talking simultaneously in background]

Yeah, he did in fact we, we were scrambling to get there on time. He was already
in there and all the charges that he was mentioning. I think were things that 
and then and then when. when, theAsac was 

(End of session 17)



Abbreviations:
(SC)

(0V)

(IA)



Simultaneous conversation
Overlapping voices
Inaudible

Transcriber?s notes

Qession 20 (Background noise and IA voices in background)

UM:

UP:

UF:

UF:



UF2:



UF:

(muf?ed background conversation)
(1A), uhm . . .

(1:14 clicking noise).

(mu?led background conversation)
(noises)

(IA) water?

[laughs]. I don?t. know.

(M) the only thing is that (IA) this.
(IA) this (IA) water-

I need a signature on (1A).

Really? Yes! (laughs). (IA).

I promise.

(laughs).

.butthreeofthemareaA)
(IA) question?

(muffled background conversation)
(laughs)-

Let me get (IA):



UF:

UFI:

UF:

UM:

UM:

UF:

UM:

UF:

UM:

UF:

UM:

UM:

(laughs).

(simultaneous inaudible conversation).
(IA) want you to 

(laughs).

(IA) the RA (IA).

(muf?ed background conversation)
(IA) waiting for you to go and wear it?
(IA).

(laughs).

(IA).

(inu?led background conversation)
I?m smarterthan either of (IA)
(muf?ed backgmund conversation)
You might 



-him and . . . Did I even really 


drive. Yes!

(IA) like 

(IA) gonna, take my (IA) and go away.
(muf?ed backgnound conversation)
(background noises)

(caughing)

(sneezing)

(IA). (muf?ed voice)

9

(Overhead page: JAY BENKOWSKI please dial three, zero, zero, one. JAY
BENKOWSKI, three, zero, zero, one.)

(Background noise IA voices in background)

UM: (1A) used to (IA).
UF: (1A) 

(muf?ed background conversation)

(background noises)
UP: I like to point (IA).

(mu?Ied background conversation)
UF: One (IA).

(muf?ed background conversation)
UP: I need (IA).

(knocking noise)

(muf?ed background conversation)
UF: (IA).
UF3: Uh . . . I didn?t!
UF: When you (IA). (IA) get you (IA).
UFZ: Umm, couldn?t you (IA) so?er?
UM: (IA). .

(possiny typing noises)

(noises)
UF: (IA).
UM: (IA).

(muf?ed background conversation)
UF 2 Uh, (IA). Jake!

3

UF:
UF 1 
UM:

UP:
UM:
UF:

UF:

UM:
UF:

UM:
UF:
UM:
UF:
UFI:
SD:
UM:

UMZ:
UMI:
UM3:

(muf?ed background conversation)

Yeah, (IA).

(IA). How you doing?

(IA), (IA). supposed to.

(muf?ed background conversation)

Yeah. (IA) writing this novel.

Right now, no, no, for the love of God.

Hey, (IA).

(simultaneous inaudible conversation)

(IA).

(noises)

(IA).

(IA) from.

(muf?ed background conversation)

(IA).

I have one.

(IA) again?

Yeah, (IA).

l-li!

We?re gonna have you pull resources to (IA) now.
I had 

(muffled simultaneous conversations)

Yes, (IA) we?re trying to settle (IA) and the best (M).
It doesn?t matter. If (IA) closed this thing 

-Exact.ly!-

UM4: 

UF2: (IA) called (IA).
UM3: (IA).

UF 1: Did you see 
UMZ: It is (IA).

UP: I don?t (IA).

(muf?ed background conversation)

UM: (IA).
UF: (IA).
(muffled background conversation)
C: Howdy, howdy.
UF: Hi.
(Backgound noise IA voices in background)
SD: Trying to set it up now and the best news I heard all day (IA)
(IA voices in background)
CF: It?s absolutely right.
TR: Those are not at a forty-?ve degree angle.
JC: Do you anticipate any emergency NSLs 
UFI: No, (IA).
UMI: (IA) Jim (PH) (IA).
(banging noise)
UM2: (IA).
UF: (IA) will come (IA) that.
CF: (Ul)
UF: Wow, what just. happened?



UF:
UF2:

PM:

CF:

UF:
TR:
UM3:
TR:
UF3voices)

Wow, listen to that. She knows how to address 
(Laughs) (UI) He?ll be here watching over us though.
(Laughs) (U1)

(IA voices)

Are you guys pretty sure that nothing is going to go on tonight, the meet willbe
tomorrow?

CHS recording tonight is going to be recovered. We just discussed that.

-. 

From the stuff the printer (Ui)
You know earlier.

i've got to call KENNY.

Earlier.

Thank you.

Earlier, like ten minutes ago we said, ?Man, we shouldn?t do this today,? and
Chris Franck said, ?Yeah, we should. I?ve got to have something to harass Pat
with.?

Exactly, it?s like you know what some of these nights aren?t mined quite yet so.

You ass. No was just gonna let Tammy Kraszka take the night off because she?s
so, so tired.

She likes overtime.



A-and What?sa-7
A - is similar to, eh . . .

(til)?

it?s a that is similar to.

5

UF3:

CF:

UF3:

CF:
PM:
CF:
PM:

CF:
PM:
CF:
PM:
CF:
PM:

CF:

PM:

CF:

PM:
CF:

PM:

l-low canthe-andthe-notrneet up?

They do, but - is something like this . . .

Uhum.

And he just kind ofmte at something and then you 
Anathe_ 
Yeah, exactly. So essentially it?s the same thing.

Oh, so they don?t have to be in the car? Now last night, were last night - and

Yes last night was -,

0n the 

0n the CH8 (imaging noise) and then you had?he had a?au
Then how does it go on and 01??

They do?em straight?

How did we end up with seven sessions?

(muffled background conversation)

I think it?s. either, either he clicks it on and on or it just automatically does that
cause 1, l?ve done UC recordings where it just cuts offa?er a certain point and
then it starts a new session.

Because we can?t match it up. We have two hours on 
(muffled background conversation)

Yeah, yeah. it?s all on the device (SC) 

And the - has eight sessions.

it?s the device. The device will hold, what, 1 don?t know how it does it but it will
just say okay this session?s ended, a new session starts.

(inuf?ed background conversation)
Okay, okay.

7

CFPM:

PM:

Some, 1 mean when it, obviously when it?s shut on and off then it?s um then that?s
obviously it starts off with a new session.

(laughs).

Right.

SC) sometimes it willjust cut it 011' maybe if it?s been going for like an hour, two
hours, it automatically cuts off when 

Well, like one of them you hear him say, "l?wenty ?rst, two thousand eleven.?
You don?t hear the beginning but then you get five seconds on one of them?and it
says this is Special Agent.

(1A voices in background talking simultaneously)

Right, honestly. from what I?ve heard of how these devices work or I?ve acmally
watched someone do them, it?s usually they turn them on say that they?re starting
the recording

Right.

And then they say.

They do a preamble.

(1A) Right and then they do one at the end.

Right, right that I?ve seen.

And then they shut it off. So wouldn?t it be the same way like cause you know
how all of sudden you realize okay there?s nothing going on and wouldn?t be shut
off?

Well, this is weird. They?re ?ve seconds worth.

Well sometimes you, wouldn?t you turn it on thinking that you might have 
something and you don?t?

I don?t know if you have two things.

But if you have to do the preamble 1 don?t what, how about that but I know I?ve
gone to make a call and he turned it on, did the preamble.

Right.

9

PM:

PM:
CF:
PM:

JC:

PM:

JC:

PM:

JC:

PM:

JC:

PM:

JC:

PM:

And then alternate it, pick up the phone when you try calling him then he?s like
alright pick up the phone and then he had to end it or whatever but 1 don?t, you
know, I don?t know how that works. That?s the only thing I can, I don?t (IA).

1 know. ltjust doesn?t make sense why they?re not, this one?s not ?tting because
we've been able to pick it up, all the others.

ls somebody wearing something or 

(IA voices in background talking simultaneously)

was going to say (Ul) he's the messenger. Like all ofa sudden (U1)
Yeah exactly, exactly. Any idea how 

I just, rough estimate is be back. back here by seven so (1A)

Bight or nine? Okay.

(IA voices)

Do you recall Sara SWeeney lookingatsomeofthetechcuts? And wantingtoget
some stuff from Miami? Red wolf or wimtever?

I?ve got em.

Has anyone started on the transcripts?

Just. just Tuesday morning. Were you able to start on the 
Tiger one, the one that.

Red tiger one. We haven?t gotten very far on that?

Yeah.

But the total of all four (Ul)

Okay.

We have JEFF SHULER right now and got stuff (Ul) from Miami. We
were having a little trouble making it ?t our equipment. making if compatible. 1
have a list of everything (U1) so whatever you need. They, I told them the way I
(Ul) as long as they were all done, incorporated (Ul) before she came back
because there won?t be any more tech cuts until she comes back, right? Cause
she?s the one (UI)



NN: Well not that for me it probably (U1) a big deal because I have had work holidays.

CF: Yeah.
NN: And I have (U1) stu??where it?s kind ofa big deal 

CF: No expensive uhm it was just nobody saw it coming so that?s why. If it was
like expected like hey sorry I?m not going to be home but i had to make a phone call like a
couple days before I wasn?t cause my dad?s like hey still coming home on the And like
it?s like the I?m like no and Phi not coming home at all.

NN: (Ul) might get any money back ?om ?ying?
CF: No they just credit, I mean 1 have a credit.
Oh  good. Cause usually you know how it is, it?s like.

CF: Yeah, no give you a credit uhm it?s good for like a year which I?ll use it in a
year.

NN: Yeah you will 
CF: So.

NN: Well you guys when I don?t know how your whole availability thing works but when you
let?s say work more than supposed two hours availability (U1) put down that hey I
worked ?ve hours availability. Does that mean that later on in the year you. . . you don?t have to

work as much availability?

CF: Yeah. . .yeah technically. As long as you..you average two hours a day then it?s ?ne.
Like you don?t have to work avp every single day. Like right now all of us have worked
probably enough avp for the next like three months So in theory we canqu work our eight
hours for the next three months, Don?t get me wrong that?s probably what after this is done then
yeah.

NN: That. . .that is more and bene?cial because we need you now. Every it?s not
always like that.

CF: That brings me back to the whole availability cause guess what I haven?t pulled anything
less than a 12 hour day in like well except there?s like the weekends and stufflike that
it?ll be like ?ve or six hours. 

NN: Right.

CF: Either way an over-age. Now i don?t need to sit here two extra hours when
have nothing going on that?s it. big boy rules and the reason, I think the reason we do

1 

u.s. v. Osmakac, Case No. 

Exhibit 1 to Government?s Motion in Umine Regarding Overhear Recordings

FILED UNDER SEAL

Trangrigt from Qgcember 24. 2011

SD: Yep, just walked in the door.

UF: Alright, thanks.

SD: Alright, thanks. Bye.
Hello.

MA: Hi man. So what have we got? Two of em?

SD: Yes.

MA: Okay. Two is better than three.

SD: Yes.

MA: Okay. Alright, was starting to ?ll them out. Oh, let?s see. Alright. [lnaudlble] Here. . .
uhh. . . case agent, consensual, body recorder. Intercept date is today?

SD: Yeah. Yep.

MA: 12/24/11. Tampa, Florida. It will be downloaded today. Okay.

(Phone rings)

SD: Hey.

(lnaudlble voice on other end of phone)

 

 

sojust

Oh, okay. Uh huh. Oh. Okay. We won't, yeah, okay, to know. Alright okay, 

 

SD:
cool. Okay, I will let you know. Alright, have a good night. Bye.
MA: Man i thought this was already..l thought yesterday?s recordings sealed the deal.
50: Yesterday, which one?
MA: The cash and the video and all that.
SD: 0h, with the CH5.
MA: Yeah.

M.

 

 

 

SD: Or with the UC you mean?

MA: Yeah.

SD: Day before yesterday?

MA: Yeah. yeah.

SD: nah, well, not quite.

MA: Not quite.

50: Yeah. I don?t know actually. it looked pretty good. Actually, no, I 

MA: They need a little bit more?

SD: Yeah, and they? re still . .. Part of the problem is they want to catch him in the act. The attorneys
do and stuff, but the problem is you can?t show up at a night club with an AK 47 in the middle of
a night club and pretend to start shooting people, or mean people 

MA: Right.

SD:  would get killed just a stampede Just to get away from him.

MA: Right.

SD:  so it?s not. Alright what do I need to sign?

MA: Print. Print. Signature. Let's Yeah. it?s going to be recovery of recorder is the reason.

SD: For accepted custody.

MA: Yeah.

so: Alright.

Inaudible

SD: What time do you want to use?"? 

MA: uhh..what 

SD: Okay.

MA: Well, what time you accepted it here?

50: 1710.

MA: Okay, and yeah.

 

 

 

SD: i don?t.

MA: Okay. Then just put his name on there. We'll get the number.
MA: I know we've got it. Oh here it is right here.

SD: So intercept date.

MA: 23317. 23317. Sami Osmakac.

SD: That?s below the 5 number?

MA: Yeah. Just do it like that, it?s fine.

Okay.

MA: 2  11. Okay. think that?s . . . I think you?ve got everything.
SD: Okay

MA: i think you got eveiything. l?ll ?ll that time in once I download them.
SD: Alright, there you go.

MA: And you're going to need wave copies and all of that stuff, right?
SD: Yeah, whatever you guys normally do.

MA: Whatever we . . . the normal thing? Okay.

SD: Yup.

MA: Who was the person on call for that? The stem person? Pat here or??
SD: have no idea.

MA: [inaudible] will know. Okay.

MA: Okay, alright, we?ll get it rolling.

SD: What else do you need?

MA: No. l?m going to get this knocked out so I can go.

so: Alright.

MA: That?s it man. l?ll make you. . .

 

 

SD: Once you do the copies . . .

MA: Yeah, i'll make four copies for you and one copy for whoever the person is going to be and that
one copy will be in the wave format.

SD: Okay, Okay.

MA: So . . .

SD: Alright.

MA: it?s probably going to be an hour or so.

SD: Alright. i can . . . i?li wait there?s . . . that way we can . . . that way you can give them to me and i
can. . .

MA: Right, okay. [inaudible]

07:47 (Long break in conversation)
11:43 (Ul Background conversation starts)

SD: [dialogue is very faint in the background] (Ul) the guy (Ul) last night (Lil) lguess the finch (Ul) if
we haven?t erased it (Ul) they might be able to pull something up off it. But if it happens again (Ul) But
the good thing is the main thing we needed last night was (Ul) But Jake and were actually talking aha-n.
it. if we can, after this is over, we're gonna try to run i think he?s (Ui) natural at it, and as long as we
didn?t target any Palestinian we?d be ?ne.

CF: (Ul) person would have to testify (Ul) all over the place.
SD: I think he might. (Ul) something like that he could make some money on.

CF: (Ul) this thing goes to trial or not.

 

CF: What?s up buddy?

MA: Alright man, how you doing?

CF: Good, Good.

MA: (Ul) you know how long these are? Pretty long..meetings?

SD: No, honestly i don't we got there at probably probably 5 hours a 
roughly.

MA: Okay, we?ll have to put it on DVD.

CF: 0h no, Pat said something to Vic about one of the key fobs they were listening to with
the disk and it came up with something from before so maybe it wasn't completely erased, or something
like that.

SD: She said something about 
MA: I think she left me a message about 
CF: Yeah, 

MA: You know what l?m sometimes when you get a copy, if you like download it to the C:
drive it wili list all of them, and sometimes yOu might click on the wrong thing, and i know we?ve got a
bunch of yours 

CF: 0h (Ul)

MA: it Yeah they might've clicked on that one and brought that one up and copied it
instead of clicking on the right thing.

CF: Sorry to drag you in tonight 

MA: i had my sister call my I was l'm going to get on the phone with her.
CF: Oh Shit..Mike what time did you get here?

MA: Right at 

CF: Okay

MA: it?s working out alright.

SD: The big 

CF: Use your 

Wing is last night he went to talk to 
CF: he broke up with 

SD: He he showed him the ?ag or something and said ?are you in or not? and Hodzic said 
need some time to think about it? and Sami is like need to know now? and Hodzic said give me some
time to think about it? and Sami said "if you're not in then you're out? The good thing though at least
hopefully, at least according to what Sami told .- it?s good for and we can run this down
before the dumb he said in his he said he's got a bunch of boxes of
stolen stuff whenever they need cash go return it to apparently now he gave Sami
a video camera last night that he stole from best and now Sami?s going to use 

6

CF: To make his video?

SD: Yeah and he?s already planning on what he?s going to he and the CH5 talked abou
it today and the CH5 said Sami is going to start out about the Jews-. (Ul) are idiots because they are no


CF: Dude I can't wait to see going to give that to the so dude what great
evidence is that shit 

SD: Yeah

CF: Holy When he shows up talking about how he can?t wait to die and commit this attack
and shit like 

SD: Yeah we?ll make sure the CH5 asks for it 

CF: Yeah, fucking tell be like hey, ifyou need somebody, to you know distribute that or
something like i know just give it to me and Hi take care of 

SO: He'll do 

CF: Either way, if we got our hands on say there is a pretty fair chance of that happening
if all this goes what

SD:  as long as he doesn't give it to 
CF: Right they broke 

SD: not like said told the CH5 Hodzic is still a good guy, he?s just not
in the right place or something like Where Dennison i don?t know.

MA: Is this what she's been using?
CF: Yes.

MA: The black 

 

 

CF: no it?s the one with the Yeah, the yellow one.
MA: That?s not the right size though.
CF: Oh it's i thought there was another one. Should be over 

MA: I was saying don't think is the She has this one here but (Ul) This is the one I
that used last 

CF: That one doesn?t look like it's going to ?t 
MA: No thatbecause I don?t see another 

7

MA: was telling this is a little up okay, but these speakers are already
highlighted dark, so usually that doesn't happen until after l?ve downloaded so by looking at that it
makes me think that its already been downloaded they should be be like a white
speaker.

CF: well you already hooked it up right?
MA: I said we'll just look at the date it might be acting a little
CF: What the fuck is going on?

MA: This is what is saying three hour and ?fteen, sixteen so we?ll just let it roll
and see what we come up with. it?s just going to take longer to long

CF: And this is the ?nch that?s going on now?
MA: Yeah I went ahead and did its one WAV format and the other just be

CF: well you can make them all ifyou?re just making one WAV like
if you're making the WAV copy, you can make them all WAV ifyou instead of just making
copy of the other and stuff like the only one that need to be i guess not WAV are the just
so we can have but there is no video on this so.. shit just make them all fuck save
you a step

MA: That will be we'll do it all in one shot 
CF: Give me your 

SD: huh?

CF: Give me your 

SD: Why?

CF: You know 

 

 

 

 

 

 .. . - 
CF: God damn 
SD: Because as soon as I send this l'm going to play it.
CF: God are you fucking kidding 
SD: What kind of phone do you have?

CF: Not one that has fucking angry birds on so why don?t you give me your 

puposes.

Sessions: 1 of 7





UF:

Unidentified male

Umdentified female

Translation Key:

 

 

 

 

 

Ul: Unmtelliglble
lA; lnaudlble

SC: Simultaneous Conversation

CF: Faster you click 

JAB: 

CF: Pretty frickln' cool. right?

JAB: Yeah.

CF: And then we used .or that. So it should be 5 recordings all total CHS through UCE
CF: 

JAB. Beautiful.

CF: And that?s all we have.

JAB: Thank you.

CF. Everything is right here.

JAB. You are wonderful.

CF. Although they're not quite of it ls.

And then we have the enhanced forjust the 

l?m sorry?

 

?JAB: The enhanced copies. is it just the 

CF. me make was the- on 12/7 so that's the only
enhanced one that have.

JAB. Whave been enhanced than that. But maybe that was-

CF: This is the only one that have.
JAB: (Ul)
I have no idea.

JAB. And the was the car ride, correct?
CF: 

JAB: isn't that when they were in the car together? Or is that the situation or do
you not remember?

ldon?t remember

JAB don?t have to remember.

Ok I was going to save that.
JAB: (Ul)
CF: Oh my empty left (Ul) scraper and gum that's not mine.

JAB- Aren?t they mints? (Uli.
CF And then .
JAB: And no one that yoo know of has actual summaries of these other than just having 



CF They're all verbatim transcripts.
JAB: True.
CF Do you you know where to find those?

Yeah they're over at Pat's.
CF: Or you can get them on yeah, you don't have access to the 5 drive.
JAB: Yeah I don't have access to your Share drive.

CF: That's right.

 

 

 

JAB: have Headquarters shared drive.
CF Very well.
And Newark?s actually. Well, Newark loves me.

Well, maybe some day we will present to y0u the same amount of Joye that?Neward does. I
would think that probably not but 

JAB Ha ha. I doubt it. Hey I can only handle so much anyway.

CF. Yeah that?s true
JAB: Ha ha
CF. I don?t know i think you can probably handle more than you know.

JAB: Thank you. That is all needed.
CF: 0k

JAB: Um, and then I'll just get with the transcripts to look at to look at the duration and like how long
these things were and 

Ooh, and it's ok 12/ 5.
JAB. You?re a liar.

l'rn sorry. I knew I had different 12/ S, was the attempted one at the
Mosque and that's why we had recorder And, uh, and but we didn't get
anything 'cuz (Ul) with just sat in the car, remember? That?s when 

JAB. is it really that long ago?
6' 12/5.
JAB: Oh shit. Holy fuck monkey, that?s that long ago. God why do 

CF: 50 that was, uh, so, you can put that on there, mean it's technically IDS is, uh, is a-e
had in his pocket. 

JAB: Nothing came off of it.
CF Nothing is on 

I shit, it was really that long ago. Well I've been here for 3 weeks now. I've
been here the entire month of December. know.

CF: Enjoying this right?

 

 

 

JAB: Yeah actually. l?ve been having a blast. Haven't you? Haven't it been more fun since i showed
upthough?

CF: I'll give you that

JAB: Ha. Do you have like someone smiling in your office? 


CF. Fer whatever reason, yeah. Well I give you all those, yeah. Alright. What are you working on


This.

CF: This?

And other timellne this is like my main tasking of the day
Let me know it you need anything. I mean 12/5 

JAB: No Maybe what I need (Ul) thrOugh the transcripts and get (Ull gist of which one wants which.
What's the matter now? What's wrong?

Um, one of the tech guys wants to replace the- he needs cover. so.
JAB: ok, know, it?s ok. It?s ok.
CF- Oh know it?s ok, it's just one more thing to have to deal with right now.

JAB: 0k thank you. I'll let you get back to real work then.

CF: it?s not really 
Ha.
CF: Need anything else?

JAB No. That is all 1 needed.
Give me a holler if you need anything right?
JAB Thank you darling.

CF: You're very welcome.

UH: Pardon me.

JC: (Talking in background with someone else.) i mean talking to 

UCE: Good deal.

 

 

 

JC:

UH:

JC:



NN:

UCE:

CF:





TR:
try



Um, hello.

hours or something like that.

You took so much like him.

They 30mg to make you stick around ail weekend 

Oh no. No, no.

Yeah so you say.

Oh no, no, no. We?ve been talking about that, be done and disappear in (IA).
it you 

He blathered on for 5 minutes then one of us you mean? And then he?d blather on to

what you're saying? You?re trying to pull something out of him.

(SC).

UF3:

CF:

NN:

UCE:

NB:

NB:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB.

CF:

CF

Ha ha.
HeyJaquehne?

Do they think It?s going to be good enough?

Don't know (1A)

What did you write on the 302?

He said the sky is turning green and there are mushrooms out there.

Jaqueline? Jaqueline? On the 20?" there was 

Liar. thought-n the .
-n the 20'h

Thank you.

Yes maam.

You got what you needed.
(UI) just a friend

You say i?m just a friend.

 

 

 

NN:

CF.

TR:

UM3:

CF



NN:



CF:

NN:

CF:

ldon't say that, you say that.

Gosh well, you're not you friends You close, doesn?t mean you are close.
I help him listen

Just benefits, not friends. (There are many overlapping conversations gomg on now)
Aah ok. But you say I?m just a friend. With you, you got what i need. 

(Ul) little child bike home alone in the rain. Ha ha.

I know i get that all the time.

Out of your fucking mind.

Hey, Kenny is looking for cover for- Shit. He's trying to replace-

I did not want talk to anyone all day, was confinement.

Yeah. Oh. i don?t know, hang on, i got to take this call man. hang on. Hey man. Hey Rob. hey

let me call you back from a landline real quick, thanksUCE:

.lC:



TR:

i wouldn't give my kid a gun and he doesn't deserve one either.

(Ul) gun before a long time take to school with him a long time before, (U1).
That's true.

Yeah unfertunately tomorrow afternoon, it would be a long 

(On phone.) Hey man how are you? literally talked to every single one of them.
(ln background.) Hey what is he talking about? Is he asking for this?

(On phone.) Yeah. 

Franckl

I think it?s changed. The statutes that she had given 

Oh don?t pay attention to any of those.
i wouldn't either.
(On phone.) Oh my

(in background.) I can print the statutes that Sarah gave us but based on where we are 

 

 

NN:

CF.

TR:



CF:



NN:

CF:

CF:

NN:

CF:

ldon?t say that. you say that.

Gosh well, you're not you friends You sut close, doesn?t mean you are close.
i help him listen

Just benefits, not friends. (There are many overlapping conversations gomg on now)

Aah ok. But you say l?mjust a friend. With you, you got what I need. 

(Ul) little child bike home alone in the rain. Ha ha

i know i get that all the time.

Out of your fucking mind.

Hey, Kenny is looking for cover for- Shit. He?s trying to replace-

I did not want talk to anyone all day, was confinement.

Yeah. Oh. i don't know, hang on, lgot to take this call man. hang on. Hey man. Hey Rob..,hey

let me call you back from a landline real quick, thanks.

TR:

JC:

UMS:

TR:

CF:



CF:

JC

TR

UCE:

JC:

CF

TR:

I wouldn't give my kid a gun and he doesn?t deserve one either.

(Ul) gun before a long time take to school with him a long time before, 
That?s true.

Yeah unfortunately tomorrow afternoon, it would be a long 

(On phone.) Hey man how are you? literally talked to every single one of them.
(in background.) Hey what is he talking about? Is he asking for this?

(On phone.) Yeah.

Franckl

think it?s changed. The statutes that she had given 

Oh I don't pay attention to any of those.
i wouldn't either.
(0n phone.) Oh my

(In background.) I can print the statutes that Sarah gave us but based on where we are today,.

 

 

 



123 What you think is, ok, whatever, here's what l?m looking to do and both
know that we?re 

(On phone.) Oh ok. I was going to say. i talked to every team leader personally 
Ha ha. Alright, alright.

128. (in background conversation.) The best can, marry up what we have with the elements, so that
we can at least give them, and know even have it written and say, assembled up ahead of
time (Ui) know nothing is ever perfect because they all want it ironclad, you know. but if we just say

CF: (On phone.) Yeah, yeah, i hear you.

118: (in background.) And here?s what we intend to do at future meetings. Uh, in order to (UI) the
following (Ul)

CF: (On phone Holy shit.

(in background conversation.) Urn, i need to call Sarah right now?and that would probably take
me most of the rest of the day.

128: l'm not asking you to do it, l'm asking you for whatever the charge is. l?m going to do it.
TR: i don?t know what it is. What l?m saying, i would need to sit down with the statute 
128: Ok.

TR: And spend that time 
CF: (On phone.) 0h ok, yeah, I?ll talk to him when i see him.
128: Enough ok, alright, that?s cool, thought maybe you know based on ok.

CF: (On phone.) Yeah, l?m sure don't see him around anywhere so i?m sure he's getting his

good alright. Yeah. Check. Yeah. We haven?t even made that phone copy that
0k. Copy that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. We'll fix it. No, we'll fix it man. Um, we squared away for
9:00 here tonight? We still still got the 3 teams? teams, shit, ok. ok, good. Um, any
additional know Liz brought it up to me yesterday when i gave brief about, um,
taking it back to normal shifts because she?s like, yes, because she's like honestly, those shifts we have
are killing us and uh, know you and have already about, what. 3 or 4 times right now. But,
uh, you think we should just change and go with that? Yeah sure. 0k. of
logistical purposes. yeah i told her that. explained everything to her, i was like hey, the team leasers
perspective, what do you think? Like we can?t do for so there's not going to be 
And you know stuff like that. What do you think? An 5 e?s like, l?d still do it. l'd still change it. 
don?t know, Sam to 2pm? Holy shit. Yeah. Yeah. 0k. Um, i think think everybody is kind

 

 

 

 

 

1 ct wanting the 8-4, 4-midnight, midnight to 8am. 0k. 0k, I mean, you hope so and that's
2 the other thing, i mean we need need to Ok, I mean if it's, yeah, i mean
3 il? it?s not that big of a pain in the ass, if it?s not too big, if you have yeah,
4 yeah. 0k. Well, that's the team leaders are all good with it, like if you've already briefed them
5 and they?re cool With it, mean, luck it, wait. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah
6 do that, it?s harrible. it?s burning her guys out and
7 everything like that so I mean, i don't know, man. Well, know, know. l'm with
8 you man Get Steve 5 perspective and then see what he has to say and then we can make a decrsron
9 after that. Alright, thanks man Yeah, yeah, l'm going to talk to him. Uh, alright, cool, we'll fix it man,
10 don?t worry about it. Alright, later.
11 UCE: (in background gonna be $1000 or $1000 plus change. Guns are 5400 Or
12 got to come up with (keeps talking but he?s IA)
13 (In background conversation.) We have the undercover told him was I?d like 3 guns
14 and lot of don't gun is really guns is (Ul) So one of
15 Our theories. and a lot depends on you and in terms of charge on to steer him forward
16 no guns or one gun and explosrves.
17 SS: (in background conversation.) He?s not going to be around with the money, so what?s the
18 answer to that?
19 UCE: (In background conversation.) Oh no, no, no, no, you give me money to start. lget started, you
20 don't get anything until you give me the balance. 
21 SS: That could be months down the road, or even longer.
22 UCE: See the thing thing IS, his thing was paying for rt. was going he?s going to pay the front end, the source is gorng to pay the back end.
25 UCE: No, he was always gonna pay the whole thing, this is a new thing, I'TR: (Another background conversation.) Yeah we do (Ul) but as we progress and he did
28 express sort of the urgency in terms of he didn?t say 'same hour? or ?same day' like he did before but he
29 did express i want to do.. .
30 Are you getting him money or what?
31 No l'm getting $5.000 from him 
32 CF: Oh nice and you handed the uh, you handed the- and a-to the source today?
33 Yes.
8


 

 

 

10

11

CF.
SD:

SD.
CF:
50'
CF:
SD.
SD.

CF:

OR.

The thing?

The what?

Did you already throw it out9

What?

The little mint thing.

That little mint thing. Oh yeah I did throw it out.
Oh.

That's perfect to keep the screws in.

Oh, well, I just leave them on my desk. Oh shit, lgot to 

END OF 1

My

 

 

 

 

This is a test 00:00:15 Real timeThis draft transcript, in its current form, is for the sole purpose of revrew

by the prosecuting attorneys and should not be construed as a final verbatim transcript. Further review
may be necessary for trial purposes.

Case: -ID 24)
Sessions: 2 of 7

Participants:

UM- Unidentified male

UF: Unidentified female

Translation Key:

Ul: Unintelligible
IA Inaudible
SC: Simultaneous Conversation

 

so: Alright, be (my
1c: $5,000 

TR: (In background conversation.) So in terms of interstate sure. We kind of
knew that but this confirms we got to from our standpoint 

UCE. (talking in background, he is IA)

CF: Hey man, how are you?

Good man, how you domg?

CF: Oh l'm hanging in.

TR: 50 from our standpoint as well, we?ve got to be not only that, get day before

yesterday we asked the source, uh, to drive. the, the, vehicle said be willing to be
that you can bring that So, I seems clear is that so wrapped up in
doing losing doesn't understand what's realistic, which works to our advantage but
we don't know if we feed him something completely off the wall, we don?t know if he'll so far
Out there really, tends to be more toward the 
Whatever (Ul) yeah, oh. lmean, so 

 

 

 

 



the money 

TR: Yeah, what we ended up doing, tricky is the source drove him to a pulled up,
met and target left separately was Yeah he?s fully completely,

almost undoubtedly ready to do that. There's a noon SVTC with Headquarters. (a vacuum cleaner
in background?)

new one.

TR: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um what the UC. what it?s going to didn't seem to
that's exactly what 

it: So then you're still (Ul) down payment?

{Many other conversations in background.) (Sounds like CTOC Specialist PM in one of the conversations
- she?s discussing the bank scan software.)

TR: Exactly. Um, the other thing is we could play with and i don't know that he'll go for of
our thoughts the gun, he wants to see people one oi the thOughts that
we had was, these guns are so the closest we can make can make
explosives can make for you the gun is in the higher
price range or something Think that plays with charges on it?

UM6: tun.
um: 0k. 

NN: (Another background conversation. Sounds like PM and NN are discussing the bank scan software.)
But no, and that?s kind of like (UI). I could have probably (UI).

(Many simultaneous conversations here.)

NN: (Ul)..8ut the thing is all You It's already screwed up before it hits Bank Scan. Right and
either they didn't choose the right template Or they did something wrong. And I think that's even part
of the problem and, um, I think most people have more issues though beforehand and
I don't really think we spend as much time on the beforehand part, um, and know 

(Various conversations occurring - cannot transcribe)

NN: (Ul) you know what i mean and well, I mean that's part of the reason, I was like oh my
the thing is all that 

CF: You've got to be kidding me.

TR: 0k. Alright. And I have a question in terms of not leading him too the two people that steers him more towards the government, not overtly, but just, the source
has prevrously had said what he says (Ul) well you told me before that you wanted to be a

 

 

 

Civilian what he said well you told me before you wanted to be a civrlian understand

you want to kill more people, can you think of anything else where possibly killing those people 
Would reasonable to try 0k.

Rw: The US. Attorney will be here or his Deputy or whatever they call him.

TR: 0k. Hey Sarah, so you're aware of, says that, uh, you?re aware
RW: ls our standing order, do not be seen about..- don?t even be in the
area

We?re one burn away from bringing the whole thing for another month, what I want
to tell them.

Rw. We made 3 tot of great progress. Thanks to you. Thanks to everybody really but yesterday was
huge 

OK, if you hit my vorce mall, Just do the 

RW: 0k, Mr. former FBI to dig in to of you guys, really, all
you can dig into the US. Code. We need to be telling them that the way we see it, we have these

weapons, the and a bomb vest, to get more than 200-300 yards from the undercover after
that drop is made and take him down. is you feel that you have enough then to prosecute?
They want this Hollywood ending, that?s great but, plus once we start laying out attempted use of a
WMD, and i don't remember the titling code for that of the automatic weapons code,
we need to lay out what we see far that today. And i want to do that with CTS today. Hey, here's what
we're looking at, this is what the FBI sees is the potential charges based on what we know, and what say
them (Ul) putting them on the spot. For what it's worth so you guys understand the information over at
the US. Attorney?s office. The U.S. Attorney is aware that the case exists but has no clue about what
level of detail we are asking (UI) potential delivery as early as next week, if and stuff
like that with this that?s how bad it can be. That she's she?s not or is meeting her
supervisor who's not going to be putting it forward, i want what they refer at this stage .

JC. who her supervisor that?s 
That?s where it ends? Ha ha,

Rw; That?s where it ends. Um, because how at this stage does the US Attorney not know that this
case is being briefed to the President, they've got an undercover into it now, we just talked weapons
acquasmon With and they anticipate delivery as early as next week, bring this thing to fruition and arrest.

 

 

think if I was the us. Attorney, I'd be ripped by not knowing that. I wouldn?t get too wound up about
it.

CF: Yeah. but, what I'm saying. 0k you'd get pissed but I don't think 

Rw: But how do be like me keeping it from the I just forgot to tell you. this guy
wants to buy a bomb next week. What? Yeah, yeah, we've been working for a month on it.

RW So again, dig into the, uh, Criminal Code for me.

CF. Hey did you email Kenny back, speaking 

Rw: We got an hour and a halt.

TR: I told Jay that I could probably do a really good job of that not doing anything.
That?d be great.

TR. (Ull. Not familiar 

RW: You need a couple of generic codes to throw at him about violations of possession and attempt
of use. etc

1C: 00 we have a starting paint as far as like what she's been looking at?

Yeah, I have the printout, yeah, but I'm not sure how current that I talked to her she?s
she forgets 

JC: Hey other day, urn, I've known and I kind of have forgotten it, I'm the primary
Duty Agent next week, um, do I need 

RW: Yeah, find a replacement?

1C: Yeah

RW Yes. cuz I really think that depending on how tomorrow goes, next week Will be very 
CF: (Ul) do 

Rw. Next week will be very but, knowing Murphy, not that I believe in that, really. but
just joking around about it, something will come up, we'll be like, well Jake you got a complaint call
about such and 

JC: Yeah that's what I?m saying and it's like I want to my duties 

nw; you find far out do they have the Duty roster? I would look two weeks
out, call the person who?s got it then and say, hey, can we swap.

1C: Problem 

 

 

 

Finding someone for the holidays.
1C: Yeah it's a holiday duty 

1C: Well call and tell Brett, say. hey, just, you got a secondary, he's a primary.
TR: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

CF: Let Draper 

Rw; I didn?t mean to get 

lC. And i just wanted to draw attention to that so that if they call and i say, yeah, can't do it, then
the SAC doesn?t call you or something saying, what the 

Rw: No he?s aware of this one.

JC: Well, I know know what l?m didn't Jake find a replacement or
something like that.

RW: Yeah, well, i guess it's because he had nothing better to do (Ul) annual leave sir.

TR: Well i know, two years ago, three years ago, my ?rst Christmas took Tom Oates duty
?cuz he had use or lose and it had looked apparently hard as he could and then there was a
canvass and then there was an email that said if somebody doesn't help him out. we?re going to draft
somebody else from the list 'coz this guy is use or was about two said, oh yeah. I'm
going to do somebody three months 

RW. Yeah and like Franco said. i think we got you 
CF: Yeah

RW: Either that or we could say, sucks for you man, we're going to go make an arrest. You handle
that complaint call from the whackadoo talking about Bin Laden being in, uh. downtown Tampa

TR: Jake do you have that printout that Sarah gave us? is not here

JC: He's being 

TR. reviewing tapes or?

JC: 

TR: The gun charge, do you get weak, not a lot of but multiple explosive devices

would be big, really big, so some way he left one, he wears one, that's a much bigger charge than lUl).

TR. See that?s what l'm wondering, i mean, what I wondered is if we have the ability do you think it
would sell, of these guns costs you more than three or four 

 

 

 

UCE: Grenades? Grenade's already in it.
What's that?

UCE: Grenades are already part of it.

TR: 0k. But what l'm terms 

UCE: You saying body (Ull?

TR: No, no, no, what I'm saying is let's try to control what he gets, a gun complicates things a lot for
us.

UCE Right

TR: And I'm wondering if we can keep him, scare him away from the guns by saying. dude, you

have a lot of money, you guys can't afford a gun.
But with the money you have, I can get you several other choices, I can get you a vest with (Ull
grenades. you have the (UI) grenades and blow yourself up, i can?t get you Do you think that
w0uld, unless you can come up with 4 or 

JC. Yeah that was an initial request. With the source, he wanted to buy two AK's, nothing
at all about explosives, in every, every pipedream scenario he's had since 

TR: How do we come up enough money for them to pay for everything?

UCE: Not that guns aren't going to be that bad as far as price goes. i think the money and
guns is not the issue, 

JC: Kerry Myers keeps saying 
UCE: Who said that?

JC: Kerry 

TR: Well, what?s his name, Andy, said 46.

UCE: 4-6 what?

TR: Thousand dollars for automatic weapon of any shape or description on the black market.
UCE: Why?
Because it?s illegal. And two they?re very limited supply.
can call somebody who 
TR- Yeah, i mean, find out. I mean, but, and maybe that?s a completely 
6

 

 

 

 

UCE: (IA)

JC: Plus I really don?t think he has any concept of how much it costs. He?s not even worried about

the money, y0u know that?s not

TR:



Well exactlyknow but l'm saying he?s not going not going to say, oh, he?s not charging you $3,000

so I'm walking right.

CF: l?m pretty 

get Andy?s point that on Southwest Border if you don't ask for enough. then

they think you?re a cop.

TR: Right, right. 

10 He?s not the Southwest Border interacting with a bunch of other people who have tried to get

automatic weapons.

TR:

But there are expert witnesses that will testify that this costs $6,000 . they sold it to him fort

FBI made this happen. And will happen. And everything that we can do to
strengthen our this case sucks, everything that we can do to strengthen it, we ought to do I

mean right now, the way that this is sitting,
my client, il represented Sami, you've got
not yet we have not yet come up with 

END OF 2

we have yet to envision a scenario where I wouldn?t advise

a decent chance I would take it to trial. Right now, we have

 



 

 

 

purposes.
Sessions: 3 of 7
Participants:

UM: Unidentified male
UF. Unidentified female

Translation Key:

 

  
 

UI: Unmtelligible

lA; inaudible

SC: Simultaneous Conversation

TR: Situation where i don?t say no, we've at least got a chance of convincing one out of twelve

people to say the government caused this to happen. That's all it takes, one out of twelve. To measure,
room full of 50 people, you ve to pick twelve, you only get three strikes to say that person won
you've only got certain reasons you can person and he doesn't to jail. i mean,
what we have mean that's how good a case we have to build. And the other
thing i was trying to explain to these guys this moming, the chances of us getting in, much, if any, of the
is low. What happens between he and (UI) is going to be 95% of what he's
going to try. Because we can?t convict him based on the fact he?s got stupid ideas, we can?t convict him
based on the fact that he traveled to Afghanistan because that was in we can prove it. i
mean if we can prove it, yes, if we can't prove it, or at least show probable cause. we

..the rule of law is, you can?t convict someone for A because they did 8.

JC: 00 you know what ljust thought of, though. and i meant to bring this up last night? if he brings
up his travel or if there's a way to get back to that travel to Turkmenistan, if he told you this morning
that he was trying to tom the like he told our source, that?d be a charge right there.

TR: That absolutely IS a charge and that, and then even if we can?t stay in that charge to convuct him,
then we get to present evidence, even if we know they'll acquit, we get in front of the iury, a
a key.

JC: Ok that was one of the issues early on, before he even started asking for weapons, that he
actually had technically, had already admitted a terrorist act, material support or whatever, because he
tried an overt act Afghanistan to tom the muiaheddin.

 

 

 



mean I just ideas, I mean i don't know if this would work, just in terms of his
experience, whatever, maybe you could say, when did you, have you ever been to these places and get
him to brag, well, I tried to go to Afghanistan but I didn't make it. I mean, uh, that's ..some
way to get him to talk about would 

JC: Well, I mean, he brought it up, so, I mean, there could be, but I need to tell 

I do too, I mean, yeah, I mean, and, just if the opportunity arises, therejust would 

JC: But yeah, I mean I get let ?nd out they?re (Ul) 
?cuz a regular AK is like $400 and it's 

TR. And that?s true, 

It But the one?s that he's given made to be a whole lot at safety and


TR. Right and one of the things is, is that the Illegal weapon that (Ul) charge, making it illegal like
that? That?s a 20?year charge, I mean which is one of the reasons it costs a lot of money because lust
ok gives you a live, if I make it (Ul) for you, which is another, I mean, 20 years adds a lot of
value onto a product. (Ul) remind of (Ul) rules 

TR: you?re violating 
0k, listen, do you want information or do you want me to get down off my desk?
(Ull.

UFI: Um, and then also there?s (Ul) which might be relevant, urn, (Ull targeting, urn, though
the underwear bomber? 

1C: Portland
Portland, he was trying to bomb 3 Christmas tree lighting ceremony.
One 

UCE: Portland was a lone wolf, was it just one?
Just one guy got arrested.
Oh yeah, 

TR: 

UF1: Yeah I?m getting it (UI) have a question. Do you have Title 18 

 

 

 

AU.)TR: Another question Jake as much for you because (Uli the source more than Did you tell
the source to bring back up the whole (Ui) thing. Justin terms of, because, that's a better charge, Sarah

said. the government building, not that we can't charge but that could help us focus him and identity
targets 

We've got to pitch him to do that anything him complicated direction can be very
dicey, because, he w0uld take that and say, and want you to go and do, you know. or some kind
of crap like that. then we'd be screwed. 50, source is not an undercover, he?s done a good job as a
source but he?s not an undercover.

TR. No. somehow we've got to identify targets in terms of take down. We can't
have a rovmg SWAT team. We have to make sure have to make sure he gets one, because
do we take him down?

UCE: His entire targeting plan is in flux right now because, depends on what he 
TR. The problem is, if it?s not real explosives, 

UCE Yeah Baby! Feels good don't it? (laughs)

TR: of the stuff we're giving him is against the law.



TR: (Ul) gun charge, (UI), (Ul) get 5 years and (Ull .18 months,

SD. He?s an irrational guy, it's not like us where you have an objective and do all the planning

toward it. i mean, I don?t think he cares
TR: Only 18 months is dicey because.
it: i mean, he may come up with a specific night club or something like that.

SD: I think the problem you're going to run into is that riding along in the car he might see
something and go there.

(People talking over one another)
(Ul) no one's going to be able to answer these questions.

TR: That's it exactly, how can we identify which is why, i mean, I was talking with Jake, and
that's a good point, is the source, and I think the source could bring back up the whole he said no
Civilianstell him what other military targets a depot

.

SD: He didn?t care about women and 

UCE: 

 

 

 

 

JC: 

No, no, no, no, but the source cares. if the source is paying and the source says I'm not paying it
if you?re not gomg to target 

CF: i don't think Sami is going to care when he starts spraying the crowd with bullets 

sees heYbor and he drives by it, you know, some gathering of like 6.000
kuffar or something. .he's had no idea about. I mean that's your way into paradise. it doesn't matter.

TR: Right.
CF: What else Other than actually brandishing a weapon In a 

SD: Unless (Ul) so big like a or something like that, like they did in Dallas.

Start selling himself?
Yeah
TR: is there anywhere where there?s a in a building with a parking garage? Anywhere

downtown or somewhere? don't know if, for some reason
he thought he could get into a garage where he could, don?t 

CF: Are you talking about like World Trade Center parking in the garage and blow it up?
TR: 

UCE: Now you're going to the extreme 

CF: Yeah.

UCE: That's why you?re doing that.

CF: Yeah totally.



Yeah absolutely,

Yeah absolutely, i mean, because without an identified target and see that's the thing, i mean,
to, to, charge him with attempted use of a destructive device, we have to know what his target was. We

have an effect on 

UCE: lnterstate or international?

 

 

 



TR: Interstate. But if we can't identify the target, defense just says well he?s do you do
know he was going to do that, he never told you what he?s going to blow up. lt?s not a Federal charge.
. It gets thrown out

SD: 50 what does it take to (UI) target, like he says it or what?

TR: It would have to be a pretty firm commitment and a consistent commitment, I mean, and, it's
not just, well, i think I?m going to when he heads out.

NN: (Ul) no gay bar, same difference.

CF: (Ul) station and gay bar are same thing?

NN: Where?s this gay bar going to be at so I just know what area to avoid?
JC: You'll find those Ybor 

NN: Wait where they at in Ybor? You told me I was safe in Ybor.

was kidding you?re safe in Ybor.
SD: I did and you are. Why wouldn't you be.
NN. Either way, I wouldn?t want to be anywhere near.

there. (IA)

JC: Shall we join the meeting?

NN: (Ul) twelve, 

UCE: 

TR: Find out how well she's able perform in 
UCE: How well what?

How well she's able to get us what we want.
UCE: Perform under pressure.

Exactly there we go. like that better.

think she?ll succeed.

UCE: You got what I need (singing) (laughs)

 

 

 

 

CF:

NN:

CF:

CF:

CF:



CF:

TR:

CF:

CF:

CF:

TR:

CF:

PM:

NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:

NN:







NN:

PM:

You say he's just a friend (singing)


Oh man, look what I started.

No, that?s how he sings.

what I 
Federal Criminal Codes and Rules.
What year?

Uh 2011

Oh can i have that?

Uh, you certainly may not.

You, you can use it for this evolution
Here y0u go fine sir.

Muchas gracias. Didn?t know who had a new one.

Oh baby, got what I say he?s just a baby you."

What you doing?

No

FIG stuff?

Yeah.

Want to help me make some packages? You don't have 
What?

those stupid Not that you need 

I could probably take a break.

From what you?re domg?

Yep. Help you out a little bit 

Yeah that?s what I was thinking.

 

 

 

Oh yeah definitely.

And then what did they say 

No, (Ul) Grey and I even said 

Not even a response? I thought if you?d help do 

But either way, could you get 

I don't have a schedule, I just 

Well 

Holiday I know my name is not 
Right and I would have made sure I was (UI) too.

ldon't know what the requirements or education or anything like that but Well I just don't

want (UI) helping or offering to helpWell you haven't been yet.

Well even then when I 

You help everybody all the time.

Whatever,

I know. I'm just going to putt and do up?
0k yeah l'll come over for a little bit.

But don't (Ul) Ijust thought maybe, uh, we can chit chat.
I definitely will.

0k.

lthink we'll be ok.

(UH

Yeah oh I know.

You could 

I think we'll be ok but I appreciate you worrying about us.

Waiting on you?

 

 

 

 

TR:

NN:



NN.

TR.

Oh i didn?t know.

Pre meeting before your meeting?

That's all we do is meeting before the meeting.
i thought it was noon that your SVTC was.

Meeting after the meeting, the meeting during the meeting.

END OF SESSION 3

 

 

 

purposes.

Sesslons: 6 of 7
Participants:

UM: Unidentified male
UF: Unidentified female

Translation Key:

 

Ul: Unlntelligible

lA: lnaudible

Simultaneous Conversation
NN: I heard food.

He'stakinglUl).
UFZ. lheard(Ul),

MZ: Yeah, leaving tomorrow, 12:30am. Um, 

Ml: (Ul) (Ul) story behind that. So how are you doing,

NN: 

(Ulla You had drones, don't you? You have dr

ha, ha. 
UM4: 

UMS Yes It would be. Yeah,

MZI That '5 a seat?) I don?t know these people leave comments 

0k 

M2: Oh yeah, yeah. actually they?re very 

UMS. Yeah You domg the other, um, 

 

(Ul) fired up, yep. OhlUll.

ones? Probably operatung from, along with your,
uh, torture chamber Where else. the waterboard all that stuff..

 

M2: Well we have that 

Right. yeah, the only thing there is stuff no, you?ve got to reconfigure here
(Ui)

UM7: 0k.

M2: on-fades 

UCE: Where do you look at? That possessionof a?

NN. Thought you guys have a meeting

80: We are. Not an official meeting.
NN: 
Yeah

Rich was gone that's why I there was kind of, somewhat of an official one.
(Ul) right now Where you going?

UMP: Huh?
At your meeting?

50: What's that?

NN: It shows Rich's green Right. Right, right, right, but I mean like (Ul) whatever it IS
not that they when would we know about though? (Ul) or no? I mean how
do they.?

UCE: (UI) last October 

123: That's awesome. I was starting at what she said before so ldon?t know if their off of
all about Allah and the one and only (IA)

UF3: why the whole 

(There is a meeting, overlapping conversations. Hard to understand what they are saying. UCE does
not take part in the meeting.)




UF3: Huh? I have 
UMP: (Ul)

UF3 (iA)

 

 

don?t know but i?m you don?t think it's (Ui) drop off too? (Ul)
drop off? (Ui) drop off. 

UCE: Alright, cooi, yeah, they?re in that room right there.

15: Where?s your slackin? brother?
SD: He had some errands to run, 
They going to need those uh, grenades or not?

NN: Well he?s not going to the (UI). (background)
SD: Yes.

UCE: What?s goin' on sir?

15. Hey.

NN: i?m going to call him (background)

so You guys know each other?
15: Yeah we met the other day.
15: How many do you need?
SD: You're both Marines too.

15: Very good. Semper Fi.

UCE. Yes Sir.
(Ul) huh?
NN: He ran out. he's not going to the meeting, you not going either? You guys going to grab lunch?

Where you guys gomg, when are you going, 

UCE: i think we were talking 

JS: 

UCE- He was saying they're homemade grenades somebody puts together.

JS: I can get they?re homemade but they?re made in a grenade factory (iA) 
some (IA) and then some all of the (UI) everything.

UCE: (IA) They look worn and inexpensive? 'Cause right now we have money 

3

 

 

 

 

 

IS:

UCE.

JS:

UCE:

JS.

UCE:

IS:

NN.

IS.

UCE.

NN:

15.

NN:

JS:

UCE 

IS:

UCE:

JS:

UCE:

JS:

UCE:

JS:



NN:



I see. Gotcha.
(IA)

That?s easy (IA) black powder (IA) a little bit of (IA)
How do you light them?

Match or lighter. (IA) 00 you want to see one ofthese things work?
(IA) ..there IS no place to demonstrate.

(IA) ..pIenty of places. We could go out on the 
Yeah right over here where we can all stand here with binoculars!
You have to watch and tape it.

(IA) Yeah, you know, he's trying to get crazy now.

(IA) schedule?

Unfortunately yeah, Saturday. (IA).

(IA).

Imight work (UI). A couple hours (IA).

Ha, ha, ha. 0k, ok. That?s easy

It?s nothing, even the other one is nothing.

Grenades came up (IA).



How big will they be?

big do you want them?

lust want to get an idea so will be able to express the 
Grenade-Sized? Size of a baseball? Depends on how much tape you put on 
My lawyer (IA).

Your lawyer?

Well that sounded like not a good thing.



 

 

 

 

 

10

11

12

13

14

15

UCE:

JS:



UCE:

lS:

UCE:

JS:

NN:

UCE:

JS:

UCE 

JS:





(IA) Shrapnel around it? Inside it?

885 on the outside of it, 885 or ball bearings whatever 
(IA). Not that we?ve ever done this before.

Cell phone 

Cell phone, baseball, 

(IA).

(IA).

Whatever works for you brother. (IA).

(IA).

(IA) Well there is a civilian method it?s called 
Wonderful if they'd let would love to go 
Give you you're 3 

(IA).

IA).

END OF SESSION 6

 

 

 

 

File Number:

Date of Recording:

UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE

FEDERAL BUREAU OF INVESTIGATION

5525 West Gray Street
ampa. H. 33609

12/22-23/201 

I?imc of Recording:



CD 

Language:

1 ranscriber:

2 of4
English

Ruth Rojas  ORA

TRANSLATION




UM

AWLlnaudible



Phonetic

Noise notations or 'I'ranslator?s Notes
Simultaneous conversation
Overlapping Voices

Recorded Message

Iinglish

 

CD a W24: 2 

l?his draft transcript. in its current form, is for the sole purpose of review by the
prosecuting attorneys and should not be construed as a linal verbatim transcript. Further review
may be necessary for trial purposes.
(Session l4)
l/ A Background Nni se-?Backgro und cmiverxalium')
(Overhead paging. Ken Mitchel! Please call 106 7)
(Movement. 'ljyping. and Breathing)
(Na conversations until I 0:53)
'l'R Al humdila
Cl" Humdila
UM bet they?re coming home rehabbcd.
Cl? (Other language/NOT ENGLISH)
NN He's talking to himself. He does that a lot.
UM Yeah.
NN Especially in his sleep. Laughs.
You a light sleeper or a heavy sleeper?
NN Heavy sleeper. Laughs.
Oh my God. thirty-seven emails. (lA)
UCE You missed the lunch man.

l? know man. Had to run a couple errands. Like. you know. pay bills and make sure I
don't get kicked out of my place.

I gotta go, I got a errands gotta run to.
UCL And how could we ?nd and ?nd out the tech guys that done with that?

(IA) Someone exit with it.

 

eon 20m 

UM
l'R
UCli
'l(M)

Not sure.

Cause there?s nothing being done with that (M)
Go patrol and see'.?

Yeah. just a safe area for right now.

Okay.

Never. never leave your post. unless proper relief.
right'.?

Something like that. Did i get that

In never quit my post until

Unless properly released

its properly releaved

will pass on to the sergeant in the yard if not (IA) for the guard.
80. now the sentry release me all. Of?cer of the day

Yes

i will walk my boots in military manner. keeping all (IA), conserving everything that
takes place (IA).

That was good.

Philip?s (lA) military man.

Yes. what is a military man'.?

Then there was a bond (M)

I would not he the poster (lA) military man.
Yes you would.

No I wouldn?t.

Hey you shaved thought you were going to HA) beard.

 

CD a 11m: 2 on? 

SD I did shave.

What happened to your beard? What was wrong with the beard. You'd grow big. It
would have be a red beard too.

er 

SD I know

CF You'd have 21- heard.

UCli Dude at the mall red heard. that would be cool. Remember that dude at the mail.
0- l'he one you slept with in the bathroom.

SD Me

No. the one you was swapping swip. swips. spit with.

SD That?s not the one I saw

Awe. yeah. I remember him.

UCli 'l he one you was swapping spit with.

Yeah. that dude was awesome.

UCE Do you remember.

Cl" He said i had kind eyes and thatjust worked for me.

UCE My ?rst. my ?rst

NN I heard it was a turkey sandwich, but.

t'irst (IA). that Saturday. that Saturday that we sere commanded to meet with the IS
She showed me a picture of the birthday cake she made you.

81) Yes.

Cl? Oh. Sarah. Sandwich cake Laughs.

NN Yeah. she's like. look (IA) and I?m like

 

 

 

Cl) lD24: 2 of4



Nl\'

Cl"

NN

(TlUCI:

he sandwich cake. yeah.
l?m like. that wouldn't work out cause we'd do anything to (M l'd probably eat all of it.
And she cut her toe open. She cut her toe open making it for me toe. Cause I guess she
opened the oven or something like this. like brought her tow across and just completely
sliced?i'ropen.

ljust looked at the thing and was how the hell did you make a sandwich cake

She made a sandwich cake for me. That was an ongoing, that was a running joke in my
class because got so tired of eating the normal shit and in line to eat the same thing over
and over.

Yeah. you had a turkey sandwich that? day.

I just went straight to the sandwich bar and made a huge (1A). My sandwich was like that
(IA) big. So. that was the ongoing joke in the class. Every (IA) I'd get I was eating a
sandwich. So she made me a sandwich cake.

i thought that was very sweet of her. Nobody (IA).

Hey. it's Steve Dixon. How are you? Good. Hey, did you guys ?nish with the truck
today?

Did you see the (M)

l'm sorry.

Okay. no. no. nope. We?re good.

Did you see recording that (lA)

He did

was just curious.

Was there good video?

Its. it might as well not be. it?s all black. I mean, you could. you could see his white
shirt and I?m sure il'you freeze frame maybe you can possibly make him out. But. it's
shit.

But yeah

video

 

CD It 102410?! I

Yeah. it?sjust too dark.
(I I: From that thing?

Yeah. I mean. I can play it right. I can bust It out It?s real

If It?s not big deal.

'l hat?s okay.

NN No. I want to see it.

It's out the door (IA) I saw it a l'ew times when the door opens.
lhat's what I?m saying. Il?you freeze frame you can probably get a picture or twu.
When the door was upen. I mean.

Yeah. yeah.

ll(?l? When the door opens it lights up. (IA) truck lights up (IA).

Even that would be useful.

(IF I skipped through it, so I guess. I mean. it was black the entire time.

.IC Oka).

CF I could see his white shirt and see his hands moving and stuff. but I can't make out his
face.

SD Okay.

SD Awesome.

SD Alright, thank you.

Cl" 80 I mean. it's.
Cl" What's up man'.?
UM He).

Cl" 80. I mean it?ll. like I said I could go through it and see it'l can freeze Irame a picture.

 

 have to leave to go try to get a (IA) vehicles.
that means it does (IA)

But uh. it's not like the other one was.

Surveillance from yesterday said that he went to seven-eleven
ligure out where that (lA) what it was.

No. you can't take the heat.
Well you now. you can't leave.

Yeah

You're stuck here.

You could go with me to the recruiting of?ce.
What?s the recruiting ol'licc'.?

Dispatch somebody local

Was that being

Yeah. Come slurpee?

One ol'the Air Fume guy saw some guy walk out.
Gyro shop right beside

Hey. do we know what time it was last night Jacob (IA).
Scanning around (IA) with a camera.

It was alter he broke ofl'(lA) store.

Okay. so just soon alter about like eight o'clockish?
Yeah

So I?m just gonna go up there. He?s a busy

so ljust wanna make sure that it?s not him. Not our guys. so.

That he (IA). Could you

some mid-eastern guy walk out oi?thc

guy and the airport guy had picture ol?the guy.

 

 

 

SD

SD

(7F
?l 

("l5

CF
TR

JC



NN
CF
'lll? it?s someone else he?s gonna recruit. shoot up the recruiting of?ce (IA 

We're not worried. We just wanna make sure it?s not our guys.

Oh yeah. HA) eould honestly give a shit less about that.

Yeah? that?s ?ne. We could leave some weapons there il?they want to.

Seven-fifty pm.

Seve~lifty pm. 'l hank you.

Bush Boulevard.

a telephone call - Hey bro. what?s going on? Hey I got a question for you, Um. do
you, actually you know what. I uh already. I just answered it. Don't worry about it
Laughs. ?l'hanks. that was easy for you. I know. Hang-up

Now. that was. ii'it was Dave saw David. it was Liz. so I can just give Liz a call.

Did you review the northeastern question?

No

She sent it last night.

Oh yeah. i remember that.

Are you going to the 

Aye. how'd everything go with uh. US attorney?

l-?ine

Yeah'.?

He was really cool.

Did. was it actually Bobby who showed up? Or was it?

Yeah. I thought he might be miffed cause Rich said that he hadn't heard about it until
yesterday. He was totally cool. offering a few thing and then said oh. (IA) Sara's been in
touch every day (1A).

He's a cool dude. though.

 

 

 

 it ?523the telephone - lley Liz it?s Chris. llow are you?.? Good. good. got a quick question
lor you. Um. I was looking over this surveillance log from last night. lt said. ah. alter.
alter the uh. meet. I?m sorry, alter the whole thing went down and everything like
that. you guys saw him go into a seven-eleven or saw his car at a seven-eleven. is that
correct'.? ?ftieth and Bush and he didn?t. do you know if he went inside or did he ust.
okay. But hejust got. hejust got gas.

Oh. boy.

Yeah. yeah. i know. I gotcha gotcha. And that?s that it wasjust brought up that he
went to a seven eleven. so everybody is like. what the hell did he go in and do. what did
he. what was he doing. so He bought gas. that makes sense. Okay. so it was liltieth and
ab. where? liil'tieth and Bush. okay. appreciate. That?s all i needed. That could be his.
that could be his brother. mean his brothers go out and party and stuff like that. so I'm
sure that was one of them. Yeah. that doesn't seem like our boy?s normal hangout. so
Laughs. I wouldn't think so. but oh what ever. (fool. I appreciate it. Yes, yeah yeah. I
am. All four teams will be here. um if you?d like to attend to uh. you know give. give
the team leaders a little uh. you know. Uh, brief afterwards, that would de?nitely he
welcome Yeah. yeah. yeah. Same place that I gave you guys your briel'. Yeah. yeah ol?
course. Oi'coursc. yeah. I mean, we?ll. It?ll probably go on for a while cause we have
four teams. we gotta get them all radios. Which l'm sure it's gonna take a while.

mean. we?ll be here. So, if you can make it cool. [?31 sure you're gonna give them some
useful hints. I'm gonna try and pass on everything. you know. I?ve heard from you and
Steve and everything like that. but it probably better coming from you guys. so. Awe. 
was yes. Yeah, it will and I'm de?nitely gonna go over all this too. l'hanks a lot Liz. I
appreciate it.

Where you at. heard you having to say hejust got gas. Was that the

Yeah. that

Was that the sevettoeleven thing? Just gas?

I hat's. yeah that?s what she said.

He didn't look like he went in?

Well. he went in but there (IA) she said he went in, was in there for a minute and then
came out. So. I mean. we can send somebody in and over to go talk.

No. don't feel comfortable. Appropriately (IA) resources were unnecessary. He went
for, he didn't have time to buy a phone and went in to pay for gas.

Yeah.

 

 

 

 

 

RW
Cl"
RW
(31?
RW
Cl-
("'l'R
Cl"
TR

Cl"

lLl??lL .: 4

That?s through visual only though.

Yep. that's cool

You good with that?

Yes sir.

?l?hat?s our story and l'm sticking to it (M).

A hundred percent. A- okay.

(lA) senator.

Saves me some time. so appreciate that.

Okay. what the hell else was doing? Oh, yeah. Email.

Sir.

Somebody was just really complemented how well. how much of the last few days the
reporting continues to be (I A) and surveillance. And just wanted to pass on to you that
whatever the teams have been doing

'l'hat?s

(IA) let! them to keep doing (IA)

?l?hat's what l?m trying to do tonight because we're ripping out surveillance tonight.

I know.

And that's potentially bad. but that?s why I wasjust talking to Liz. I was like he); il'you
could

Yeah. and that?s exactly (IA)

Meet that breed

The lessons learned from the other teams. because they've been doing it right.
Hxacdy.

That was the thing. so

You know what they're doing right?

 

 

 

 



LU mm: 2014

TR They're backing off
lhey?re not like (M)

(T That's the lessons learned. And I need to print. Liz sent me this nice {ting email that she
asked me to share with every ody, so I?m going to print that of?f'and dn that.

IR 30 anyways. Good juh? Chris truck.
Aye, it ain't me man.

(Session 14) End

 

 

 

UM: Unknown Male

Ul?: Unknown Female
Typing 

Ul: 

Phonetic

1A: lnaudiblc

(M: Speaking simultaneously

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - .

(12/23/20?) (00:22:51)

 

RW:

UCl-j

RW:



RW:



RW:
RW:
RW:
RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCli.

RW:

UCE:

RW:

ll(?lir

RW:



Well he didn't know you know about it cause you're gonna need a down payment
{or their server cause some ol'this stufT?A)

(Someone coughs in background)
Yeah (Ul) somebody else (1A)
(Background noises 

Okay.

Right.

here?s no way around that.

Right. right and what he can say is well no the other dude is taken care ol?. he like
well the other dude is not here right now. We're supposed to be limiting his
involvement. I need somebody right now. And I?m not. you know. I. I?ll go back
and talk to bout it.

Yeah.
whatever his (IA)
Ul 

Yeah.

I?m not certain about this guy because it doesn?t make sense to get some other
(Ul) It?s not going to happen. Whatever (Ul) so it doesn't

Two hundred bucks. three hundred bucks.

HA) is not gonna change anything. (Ul) that?s what I?m saying so what. what
sense does it make for me to demand that cause.

lt changes it legally.

No. no, no.

(IA) Yeah. yeah. yeah.

I understand. I understand what I'm saying but for us. for us.
But for his mindset.

As law enforcement.

 

RW:

Ch:



UCL.

RW:

UCL:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCILL

RW:

UCL:

RW:

RW:

Cl;

RW:

W:

With his mindset.

For us. for law enforcement.

Right. right.

That's. that?s. it's a. it?s a beautiful thing. l?mjust saying in a real world situation
Yeah what his is likely to be.

Justin a real world situation, period. in a real world situation. period. how is that.
what sense does that make. in a real world situation? Other than what we would
like in. for law enforcement purposes. you know. which understand it? that's
what they've got. that's the perfect thing, that?s what we would love to happen but
in a real world situation it?s. that doesn?t make sense in a real world situation
cause regardless of whether we. you know. need money right now to do
something right now l?m still not doing anything until I get balance (Ul) and the
down pawn-ha: got to be more than (Ul)

Why does it have 

BMW-W8 to be enough (Ul) it?s got to be enough to put you. to have. to have.
an?' financially where I'm not leaving (Ul)

A lot 

(Ul) is more than that.

That gun. yes. but the bomb stuff. no.

(Background noises)

L31)

(Ul) the gun later (Ul)

(Background noises.)

The gun thing I totally agree with (Ul) I?m not fronting your operation (Ul)
(Background noises)

hand grenades. we have grenades being made too.

Yeah I heard that so (Ul) yeah they're starting to work on it.

Yeah so think that?s where that couple hundred bucks 

 

 

RW:

RW:

Ii:

RW:



RW:

IA:



RW:

(ICE:

RW:



W:

(Background noise)

But I need a little bit to get started acquiring materials from you cause these guys
aren?t from it so with that. with the grenades it?s a couple hundred bucks for
materials and at least get, get started. (LII)

(Background noise 

Good now we've got to talk to. (IA) was even still okay that even after that at
least he's paid for a portion of it when it comes to the guns if the source is going
to cover that portion of it. that?s between you and the source. And that may be a
conversation that the three of you have to have together or not. it?s tough. very
dynamic.

It?s. understand (IA)
(Background nosic)
I've done this more times than (IA).

It?s beautiful. it?s beautiful and I would love if. if it was (IA) that would be the
best possible way to do it. (IA)

(Background noise)

For what, get, you get three hundred bucks out ol?his pocket to buy the pipes and
the vest and black powder?

(IA)
(Background noise)

We?ll need to. need to stall him. investing my time into it for doing something.
you need to come up with hall'of the money. That way, ?rst of all it covers me
more-in expenses and the second part is that I don't. I ?m not going to take a loss.
the second part is that I know that if you don't. if you pull out you?re out. You've
lost it.

Right.

?I?hcre's no.

You?re not getting back.

?I?here?s no. there's no give me backs.

Right om

 

 

 



RW:

UCIL:

RW:



RW:



KW:



RW.

UCli:

RW:

UCiti

RW:

UCE:

RW:

Right so you're invested, everybody is invested at this point. That?s why you do
that. that's the reason we do that.

Mm hm.

Everybody is invested at this point. We're all going forward. we're all
committing. you know.

Well that's why the. the source told me that as much money that if he'll give up
three hundred of his own income this week and the source gives him the other
seven hundred to come up with a thousand for half of it. that?s okay.

Yeah but how do you, how do you separate those, how do you separate those
transactions?

Well you don?t have to take any money. We're not taking any money to begin
with from the source, you can. the source is gonna take care of you later.

Nah. nah that?s not what I'm saying cause how do you separate those transactions
cause you're talking about two different transactions. You're talking about a
transaction that I?m. I'm gonna conduct with him but (Ul) gonna conduct with
somebody else for three or seven hundred dollars.

Seven.
0r 1 start this thing.
Mm hm.

How, you don?t separate, how, I mean me, I want to separate those transactions
(Lil) two of them together you know take care of that and then come see me and
here?s a thousand dollars to go. that?s one thing. If he gives his seven hundred
dollars to the CH5. the gives it back to me and says that?s. that's one thing.

Or tl? he takes his three hundred and the CH8 gives him another seven hundred
and then.

Right that?s. that's the only two ways. that's. those are the logical ways that this
thing happens.

Right.
?he gives money to the CNS or the Cl IS.

CHS gives him.

 

 

UCE:

RW:

liCti:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCl.i:
Ul?:

RW.
Lin

RWT

Ul";
RW:
UCE:
RW:

RW:



The Cl is gives money to him.

To him.

One way or another 1 don?t, I can't separate where piecemeal where I'm getting
paid from.

I would. you?ve got the experience. would disagree with that based on their
relationship.

That doesn't make sense.

Based on their relationship. To me. to me it does if. if hey he said he was going to
pay for it well it' he says he can?t for all of it so you?ve got to pay for some ol? it
and he?s got to pay for some ol'it.

That's not a conversation that I would have with him. 1 would have it (M)

I think what he?s saying that an independent person he wouldn't be working it out
and making the deal. It should be the source and the bad guy saying how they 're
going to work it out. who?s going to pay what share.

Good.
And then pay him fully.

Other then. well other than the background is that you helped out his family
before and they?ve been here for eleven years.



And so there is a little bit ol'a trust factor there.
No me. me. and the. me and the CH8 are okay.
Right.

()ur relationship is (IA)

'l?hat's why to me if he says well I can give you three hundred and he's gonna
give you seven hundred and you can say okay well I trust him and good with you
giving him three hundred and he's gonna give the seven hundred then he?s gonna
tell me that.

I?m not gonna tell him that though. He should know that before he comes to see
me.

 

 

 

Uh:

UCE:

RW:

UClz'

RW:

UCEl'i:

JC:
UM:

RW:

UCE:

Yeah, that's. l.

He would know that because he had the source already. That would be. that
wouldn?t be something that l?m not educate. I would not educate him.

Right. Source has to tell him. Okay then the source has to be, so you. when. then
does it work if the source has to tell him hey listen you're gonna have to give him
the three hundred bucks and that?s something JAKE has the source tell him. And
I'll take care of the rest and then he comes here and says he said he was going to
take care of the rest and here's three hundred 01' my money for you. ls that
something you accept'.?

l'hat?s. that's (lA) that's a feasible, that?s a feasible scenario. that?s a leasible
scenario.

that?s what you're going to do. that way the source has to be coached.
(Ul) Okay I agree.

I. I'm with you. I'm not arguing with you.

(Background lA voices)

You want to go at three o?clock with RALPH and explain to him the time for
tomorrow and everything?

Yeah that's what we were just talking about.
Well I heard nighttime and all that stuff so (IA).

One thing 1 told the source this morning was we were talking about (Ul) trying to
get SAMMY (PH) to actually show up on time cause (Ul) but il?it did happen
he'd be a little bit more calm. Um you know the, the problem with WAl'l (PH) is
you can?t call him. (Ul)

Right.

You know so you how. you kind ol" like go lind him somewhere you know.
lixactly. (Lil)

(IA voices)

What we need to do is drive away for a while, chit chat some more. talk l( 
l'vc got to get. you?ve got to get more speci?c for him.

(Ul)

 

UCli:

RW:

JC:

RW:

JC:

RW:

UClir

RW:

UM3:

RW:

Ul";

RW:

(Background noise)

So you would have to schedule it either early enough in the day (Ul) orjust
schedule it after everything is over late in the day.

(Background noise)
(IA voices in background)
So why can't we get it done early?

We can um the only issue we've got isjust do we depend on SAMMY to be
reliable enough to show up.

(IA voices in background)

I don?t know man this poor guy he gets almost ?ve hundred bucks in his hand
tomorrow and he says you need me for another week? That?s a thousand bucks
(Ul) why wouldn?t he show up?

Well right but you're a hardworking (Ul)
(IA voices in background)

No I'm. l?m trying to think if I?m a. ifl'm a retarded fool who is hard up for
money and I don?t have a pot to piss in. another live hundred dollars looks pretty
good.

l'hat's not logical  that's not logical.
didn?t say logical. I said hard up for money.
Yeah.

Anyone that's hard up for money anyways. constantly didn?t have enough and
now he knows he?s got to acquire some money to get some. well no he thinks that
the other guy is going to pay for it. He's told hey I can't cover the entire cost ol?it
now. now he?s thinking well if he can?t cover the entire cost. I've got almost live
hundred here and work next week l?m not going to need the money once I go do
my thing so that? almost a thousand dollars. 1 hat should be enough to get the
whole thing started. to give due. I give the guy eight hundred bucks and I got my
stuff. For almost there.

Right I know it by the time I got (Ul)

You're not feeding him (Ul)

 

 

JC:
Ul?:

JC:
ill??

RW:

RW:

JC:

UM:

1C:

Ul":

JC:

UCE:

UM:

RW:

He?s got live hundred bucks and (Ul)

(Ul) usually, don't you guys usually require it to be mailed. like Fed-bl to you.
that?s usually what do. 1 would follow up with a Fed-Ex. But il" would have
lied-ex unless I overnighted it. 

'l'hat's a lot easier to go (Ul)

Well yeah I mean l. I don?t think we usually have the (Ul) I think it?s-just usually
the.

(IA voices in background)

Well again more reason to make it tomorrow when he has to give you back
money so you can?t. (Ul)

(IA voices in background)
Right that?s the source.

(Ul) and don't forget they're strapped right now. You?re gonna have to pay 
certain things so he knows you?re serious.

(Ul)

And I?ll. l'll help you on the rest but (Ul)

(1A in background) alright thanks so much. bye.
(IA multiple voices in background)

You have to give him like four hundred hundred bucks. Source says he wants
three hundred and ?fty dollars or however much you know.

It's got to be more speci?c than that. (Ul) He comes into the store. the source sits
down, said he needs a thousand dollars. it?s about half, maybe a little bit more.
you have to ping him. 1 can't take care of this whole thing for you. We've all
worked very hard for this

(Ul)

Maybe you can meet him tonight. He?ll pick you up right here outside the. outside
the building, outside the store or you'll meet him where you met him last time or
whatever time is appropriate. (U I) the source has to be very speci?c that AMIR
(PH) wants a thousand bucks. alright? I can only give you six hundred right now.
You have to pay him the other four.

9

 

 

 

UCL:

RW:

lJCli'

RW:
l?R.

RW:

lR;

RW:

PC:



UMZ:

RW:

UM:

TR:

'l R:

Ul)
(IA voices in background)

And then when SAMMY says well what about the other. if that's about hall" whal
about the other thousand? Let?s worry about that later.

(Ul)
We?ll worry about that later.
Hopefully we'll be able to get that together but (Ul)

Can't your. can't your friend ah can't your friend sell some ot' his

stolen items? (Chuckles)

Well il'lie's so worried about the other thousand mean. I mean (Ul) I think can
get it together. You get what you can and between us we?ll be able to make it
happen. Do you have anybody else you could ask? You know hopefully I'll have
a good week at the store and we?ll be able to.

Maybe your other brothers can still help you, even know they're not in it. We'll
ligure it out. We?re going to be able to make this happen but . . .

he?s got thirteen grand doesn?t he?
(lA) my money. he wants you to give him four hundred dollars (IA)
(lA multiple voices in background)

You need to give him what you have right now, four hundred dollars (IA) cause
he?s not going to from the money and then you take ol'l'and he?s out four hundred
dollars It?s not like you can return it (IA)

(IA voices in background)
You?d better help the supervisor out, that?s all I?m saying.
voices in background)

He was clearing the cubes the other day. He scared the. almost drew down on
him.

cleared the other stde. i didn?t see you go over.

You can't clear my side too. I saw you come around. well I heard you and then 1.

l0

 

 

RW:





UCli.



CE:

UM3:

RW:

RW:

UCE:

UMZ:

Uce:

UCli;



UCE:

RW:

So what's the timing plan? Cause that conversation basically happens in the
morning (M) at night again (IA).

You know what happens then (IA)
(lA voices in background)

But now that conversation, now what you?re saying is that now (IA) conversation
(lA) now let?s drive around and kind ot'check things out. You?re talking and (IA)

You?re asking show me your target.

Well that's. 1 think driving, I think just driving around even though maybe you're
not as familiar asjust for opsec to keep mobile 56 (Fat its?iiarder to follow you and
track you.

[Simultaneous talking]
Are you asking. me asking you what's your target.
Yeah.

'1 hat's. that?s law enforcement. Show me your target, that?s law enforcement. ?l 0
get away from all that by saying like it's basically it?s what type of target are we
looking at cause I don't care what the target is. 1 mean truth. I mean truth be told
no 1 don't really give a.

I want plausible deniability.

(Lil) don?t give a shit. give a shit, what type of target are we looking at so that we
know that we build for that target.

(I ll)

So then start laying it out fucking and get to him when you have. when you 
(IA voices in background)

(M) I ain?t telling you what the target is.

Just out of sheer frustration trying to explain.

Well it'sjust, it'sjust it's human nature. I feel sick to my stomach. feel ?it
does. great. ifit doesn't at least we?ll have an idea ol?what we're looking at.

Have you researched it, is there security there? is it a hard target. is there. is it.
what are it's hours of operation?

ll

 

 

[105;

do thal.

(End ol'scssion IS)

 

RW:







UCli;





RW:

UCli:

RW:

UChz

UCL:

RW:



Session 16 (12/23/20l I) (00:22le 
Yeah. yeah.

If we do that today that?s a long conversation.
Right.

?I'hat's not ?ve minutes or ten minutes. no that's, that's you?ve got to sit down

(Ul 
(lA voices in background)

You know and we need some place where we can have a conversation. We can
actually do that in the car truthfully. We can do that in the car as long as its
comfortable (Ul)

Right your trunk or back ol'the truck. (Ul)
Yeah (IA) back of the truck. (Ul)
lA voices in background)

Well and again you don?t want to spend too long in the back. start getting into
other stuff that you don?t want to jam you up on something so sure.

But I'll get to it so but that?s. that's.
So basically cut the meeting out and then tonight it would be.

What happens though. what happens though with the people they're trying to get
you to (IA) that we have where we've got to meet tomorrow. we'll have the short
conversation. Okay l?m doing it so this is what you?re gonna need to do. you?ve
got to get your money together. We?ll give you. you've got a week to get your
money together

(lA voices in background)

(Ul) you know which give me the details ofit and HI (IA) I'll go. I?ll go IA) up
materials and start (IA).

Right.

You know.

 

RW:

liCli:
RW:
UCli.
RW:

UC 

RW:


RW:

UCE:
RW:


RW:


RW:

UCE:

KW:

Does that still open the door back up for him to say well is paying for it so
you?ve got your money. Didn't you get it from him already? He?s supposed to be
paying for it, no?

No. no. no. I didn't.
Cause he's already today said you're gonna have to give him.
Right that's.

He may still. he may still pull that four hundred out ofhis pocket and hey I got
paid today here's the four hundred.

Well what I?m saying. what I?m saying to that. what I'm saying to that; that first

plan you had said (IA) to this thing wouldn't solve the problem that we're having
right now. The scenario that you came up with just now solves the problems that

we're having right now but eliminates the meeting.

Yeah.
'l'hat?s the only thing will say.

And I?m. and I think you, at least what heard last night was the fewer meets the
better the way this relationship is kind of set up because.

(Ul)

Yeah. yeah. six ol?one half dozen of the other too but in his mindset the fewer
times you guys are together the.

(Ull
Right the better he feels about.
Sure.

Not inadvertently dragging himself into it and being recognized and seen together
and.

Sure operationally. operationally you and me. it doesn't hurt us at all but actually
it?s not a bad thing for us to get operationally. operationally as far as the. the um
how more realistic our operation is on. on outside of what law enforcement wants.
realistically for our operation the fewer meets is better and. and what we?ve
discussed is.

They tell us.

 

 

 

UCli:

RW:

UCL:

W:

[105:

RW:

UCli.

JC:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCli;



it's better.
Law enforcement wise the. the more meets 

Exactly. exactly. exactly right, exactly for what people were saying earlier
today the plan that we had before. when we were coming up before. would have
satis?ed what they were asking for but it's not optimal for. for (1A)

It gives him. it has more ol'a chance of him taking the live hundred bucks he gets
tomorrow.

Yes sir. yes sir. yes sir.
And go do something else with it.
Correct, yes sir.

Well then and also it creates a situation that they also (1A where he has to
actually just go and get the money from the source to give to you possibly.

Yes.
And. and that?s what. and they definitely said they (Ul)

Right yeah we de?nite. yeah we don?t want actual money moving. 'l'hey prel'er
that. he just gives you. ?nd a way to get him. him give you a salary which he's
earned legitimately.

And that secondary. that secondary if we did a secondary that down payment
medium then what will happen after. the money still comes directly from the
source. I mean but still it's. you've eliminated that. getting that money out ol his
hands. '1 hat?s the only thing that you don't. but you can still, I mean you can still,

Okay.

He doesn?t have to actually be the one that pays me cause he doesn?t have to get it
from the house you know on that second meeting, on that third meeting or
whatever that will be. whatever the next one. But you know what happens though
is that (IA) what happens.

Exactly. No I?d rather get the ?ve hundred tomorrow and get that. Now the
question would be, now that you have your down payment and you're gonna do it
for him and get him the stuff; how long is it gonna take you to get it and when is
your next meet? Cause the next meet for me. the next time you and I get together 
will have your stuff.

 

 

 

 

UCli:

RW:



RW:

UCli:

RW.



RW:

UCE:



UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:



RW:

UCE:

RW:

CE

(Ul)

You need to have money.

Exactly.

If I?ve got the stuffand you don?t have any money. youjust.
You don't get the stuff.

We'll. you don?t get the stuff and you come back.

I'll see you later.

And l'll see you later.

Sure.

Um when does that meet happen? Is that. does it take you two weeks to get the
stuff. you say I?ll. you know what the best time for me about January. the ?rst
week sometime in January I can have it all put together and ready for you.

It can be whatever. whatever we want it to be. That doesn?t matter, it can be done
in a week.

Right. We can do it next Thursday.

(Ul)

Next Friday.

it can be done in two weeks. I mean that?s. that's.

it?s kind of. all depends, some ol?that depends on what tomor. what happens
tomorrow night if'he's. even ifthough he says oh I don't really have a timeline
but having been on a surveillance that's good. It?s better cause they may. they
may get on me again and I won't be able to do anything.

What he expressed and what i. how 1 understood what he expressed was that the
sooner the better because right now he's clean but he doesn?t know how long
that's going to last.

Right. remember hearing that.

So.

 

 

UCL



UCE
RW:


RW:

l'R:
RW:
Ul?:
RW:

JC:
Ul?:
RW:
.lC:
KW:
JC:

UCE
RW:

Well maybe you can. mean if that comes up again maybe you can work that to
our advantage. You know let him know il'you're clean. don?t do anything besides
come to work and sit at home and you're less likely to draw attention.

I did. I said that.

Oh perfect. Quit. don?t drive erratically. quick driving erratic. don't you know
don?t. don?t mean did he like hunker down . . .

He's always driving erratic.
Did he hunker down in the seat with you at all driving?
(lA) Yeah.

See that draws attention cause I would think stop it because you?re drawing
attention to yourself. People driving by even ifthey're not the police think that's
weird that there?s a guy that keeps sinking down in the seat and they're just.

hat's weird.

He does that all the time.
Oh no worries.

(Chuckles)

Anyway to me that would be like would you cut that out you?re drawing attention
to us.

Alright.

Looks suspicious.

(jet your head off. get your head offa swivel. You look suspicious. relax.
Okay.

Okay.

Alright I've got one thing to, to address here.

(IA) got to make a phone call. SAC okay?

So

i didn't (IA) Oh no. no, you?re line. I didn?t want to interrupt. we had a good (IA)
we had a good HA).

 

 

 

JC:



JC:

JC:
UCE

JC:

UCE
JC:

UCli


UCli

UM3:

UCL:


L'Clt.?

lf. ifthe source says hey (PH) wants a thousand bucks can only. i. can
only pay him six hundred. you need to get the four hundred. Could we think
we've got any holes in the story in terms ol'like when did you talk to and
did you talk to him over the phone. that kind of thing. I think. my thought is 

think you can play that by just saying yeah i talked to him on the phone and
you know. But he sells regular stuff and you?re just talking about a down payment
so something like that.

The gist of it is called me. that?s going to be called me this rooming
said, said okay but he said on the phone (IA) okay it'll be a thousand. it'll be a
thousand (lA) okay.

told him I?m good for six hundred now. you?re gonna pay him four hundred.
Yeah.

Some. does that work?

Yeah. yeah and that?s.

Cause we don?t have to. we don?t have to have a made up transaction between the
source and you before then.

Right. sure.

Because he committed six hundred. You?re good with that because of your all?s
relationship but needs to pay the other four.

Right. I think if he says a thousand I?m ?ne you know so um yeah so I told him
that. that he's gonna, that told him that he?s gonna give four hundred (lA) that
I've got six and that they can sit there and hash it out however they want but like
dude l?m getting paid four hundred dollars. I?m going to take my entire paycheck
that l?m getting and I you know whatever it is.

You still have ninety for gas.

Yeah whatever they has out. whatever they has out (Ul)
That would be like (Ul)

if it ends up. if it ends up you know that.

It also shows his intent. every, he was willing to cough up almost his entire
paycheck to get this thing going.

Yeah there you go.

 

 

UCE

RW:

JCT
RW:

JC:

RW:

JC:

RW:

18;
RW:

18:

RW:

RW:
JB:
RW.
.18:

UM4:

RW:

t~ he can take it out of his own paycheck then he can talk about you know three
hundred dollars or whatever it is they can the two of them can square that away
then you know.

Well we've got to square it awayjust I know. know what you?re saying but he
can't go any lower than three. I think for that it's kind of.

And don?t think they'll be a problem with that.
Yeah.

So when we talked to the source this morning he said the only reason he?s
showing up is because at you. you know and that business being an avenue.

It makes money for him. just access.

Access. yeah. He thinks he doesn't even care about the money. It?s just you know.
I?m sure the money is good but.

l'd like to break here and the three of us go see the SAC real quick. We?ve got
give him this heads up before we call RALPH (PH) and tell RALPH about it.

Think about your option of RALPH.

I can. yeah. if we can do one direct yeah we can do that too. Um but
we want to tell S'l?liVE ?rst.

Yeah absolutely i want. I want to tell him. He?sjust been saying when he wants to
go before the four ?fteen. Should I set. say maybe three thirty or three forty ?ve
at the latest?

We can probabl do it in twenty minutes. We need to go up and see the boss.
Okay. okay.

And say we?re gonna with CPD one last time at three thirty

Right.

So we want to give you the heads up.

Perfect. yeah that's great.

(Ul) We pulled up prayer times (IA)

Yeah.

 

 

UCli:







JC:
RW:

CH:

TR:
CH:

l?R:

CH:

UClz'
CH:
UCE
UM3:

UCli

One to one something.

The thing is the rest of the prayers are pretty close all the way to lsha which is
seven thirty so maybe a?er lsha would be the easiest thing unless you want to
meet him right before and like you all on the ?y stop and (Ul) somewhere um but
that's something to consider and then ?gure out where.

(Ul)

Well the biggest thing is to ?gure out where you want to meet so that you know
cause the source is gonna tell him, talk to him and this is where usually meet him
at this time (IA)

We'll be in the HO room right?

Yep.

Perfect. 'l?hree thirty. we can work on the prayer time and everything.
voices. background noise)

He didnjust blowing smoke or did he say he actually met
with (M) and that can't be confirmed he did or didn?t.

Ul) was in the area where he said he was.
Right. right.

Like they might have 400 bucks.

(IA voices)

Yeah alright well yeah because he said he wants to a handgun. he wants a
handgun and if it comes out you have a handgun you know on. on the (M) comes
out you know I?m still looking for a handgun. handguns are a little bit harder to
get cause they?re all registered cause they?re all registered and.

Do you give him a handgun?

Right.

Handgun will be useless (Ul) pre. pre anything.
Right.

Just to have one.

 

TR:

UM:


UP:


UCli


IR:

CH:

CH:
TR:
CH:

(Ill:

l'R:

Well you can talk that up but just in terms of.
I?m not giving him a handgun.
You can?t understand (IA)

Right and understand it. understand it. The locus is now is between we were
just talking about how your saying the source saying I?ll give him six hundred.
you?re gonna give him four hundred and then you come and saying 1 need a
deposit you know take the six hundred M)

I know where he's going.

lake the six hundred the source gives me to start the thing um ?vc got some shit
l?ve got to do with my car. I?ve got, you know I'm gonna keep this four hundred.
I?ll keep on delivery. You need your deposit.

Right.

You need your deposit, the four. six hundred cause il'the source goes to him
saying.

He?s gonna try to talk me out of that four hundred dollars?

What I'm saying is the source. how the source states you now you give him tour
hundred l?ll square it.

There's two keys: on one the source has to make it absolutely clear he doesn?t
have any extra money.

Right at this time I have no extra money.

And the second key is.

We'll work on that.

?l?aking anything less than a thousand.

Right.

The only place that any extra money is coming oti? the table is from our guy.
Right.

So either you?re not getting anything. l'm not getting stained or you?re giving me
four hundred bucks. I mean (Ul)

 

 

 

 

Transcript Key

JVB: SSA John V. Bienkowski (JZB is a typo?should be JVB) (HQ Supervisor, coordinated HQ
support)

RW: SSA Richard Worms, (Squad 4 Supervisor)

JC: Jacob Collins (FBI SA, case agent)

TR: Taylor Reed (FBI SA, co-case agent)

CF: Chris Franck (FBI SA, tech equipment, brief surveillance)
SD: Steve Dixon (FBI SA, alternate source agent, vouchers)
SS: Sharon Smith (FBI Analytical Support)

JS: Joseph Spano (FBI Analytical Support)

NN: Natash Novikov (FBI Forensic Accountant)

PM: Patricia Mahn (FBI Admin Support, assisted with ERT)
JAB: Jaclyn A. Bullman (FBI Admin and Analytical Support)
MZ: Mark Zajac (FBI Analytical Support)

 CH: Christopher Hileman (Investigative Assistance)

UCE

0.5. v. Osmakac, Case No. 
Exhibit 2 to Government's Motion in Limine Regarding Overhear Recordings

FILED UNDER SEAL

Transcrigt from Januag 7I 2012

JC: [Ul] drop that car somewhere.

UCE: He's gonna drop the car at the target. The target changed. got too
many police. We drove by some district, what you call it? [Ul] some streets with, uh, clubs in it.
He said he has some good clubs up there that he saw, and today he's gonna do it tonight.

KE: On Howard?

UCE: Is that where it was? We drove Friday. 

KM: Howard and Armenia.

UCE: It?s before because it was? because I think Ybor was still ahead of us. I

think not sure. Don't ask me because-

JC: Is it where Vail turned around? 

UCE: No. No.

KL: Ybor runs a long way on the street, clubs on each end, 

 We", i knewyou were on'Howa?rd. There's aiow?'tm bars, on Howard and 
Armenia.

UCE: It was when we were?At one point we were by the highway. We were coming

back to get on the highway and he pointed out a one-way street that was coming out. He says
the clubs-

KE: That?s Howard. [Ul] Howard is a one?way.

UCE: Okay.

KE: it goes one-way when it 

UCE: Uh-u.
KM: Yes, sir.
UCE: Okay, so, so he pointed out. He says there's a bunch of clubs down there. He

says some of them are some redneck clubs with a, you country clubs
or something like that.

 

JC: Not really.
UM: It's a strip club.
UM: it?s pretty yuppie. 
UM: Two [Ui]
KM: White yuppie 
UM: That could be..
KM: It's upper income.
UCE: He might have just been saying it, i don't 
RR: You know, we can he went 
I he?s?why is he?tiiaTcaII?right now hTs-g?oing to get staged where those clubs

are. Because he?s?he's gonna stage that car 

RR: [Ui] He?s just getting out into 
KM: Kevin, do you want that out over the radio 
RR: He just went south. He made a turn 

UCE: He's gonna check it. He's trying to ?nd out what?what exit this is so he can get
back. So, what he?s gonna do is drop that car off at where those clubs a cab from
there to go pick up his car and bring his car back here. We're gonna load up his car.

KM: Do we want to abort the green?they are up?they are on the way to do the
green Honda. Do we want to abort that?

JC: l'd say, yeah.

KE: How close are they?

KM: They?~they just left.

JC: We don't know when he's gonna get there.

KE: Yeah, I'd say we abort the green Honda.

KM: Okay. Do you want to put that command out, or do you want me to do it?

JC: Well, do we have a real time tracker on this?

RR: Yes. This one one, yes.

UM: Okay, alright.

JC: -'cause as long as it's moving we know he?s not at the green Honda, so we may

have a little bit of leeway.

 KM: Your 
CC: What are they doing it? Just sweeping it to see what's in it? 
KM: [Ul] weapons, 
JC: Where are they~~where are they leaving from?
KM: This command post. A Task Force Of?cer and a Tech Agent have already left the

command post and are heading

JC:

KM:

UCE:

KM:

1C:

KE:

UCE:

KE:

UM:

KM:

UM:

KM:

KE:

JC:

 

KM:

UCE:

JC:

JC:

UCE:

?Ean I go teilTVl?cPhersonai-l] what is?

Here the of?ce?

The-the command post at the of?ce.

Okay.

The keys are here but the Tech Agent can break in 

[Ul] just let them?just let them go, and just see where he goes.

[Ul] Is that alright?

That's fine.

Let's see where he 

Yeah 

Your call.

They can get there before he 
Your call.

[Ul] Oh, shit [Ul] 

We'll just call him off if he looks like he might--

He's just gonna throw shit about people being on him all day 

Probably saw some cars but it wasn?t us.
Everything goin alright?

i don't know because-

JC: The target thing?

UCE: No it's just, it got ugly at ?rst, because he?s like changing things as we were
going. Like changing as we were going, he's like, he wanted to do different things, and basically
I just [Ul] it?s getting a little too unorganized, why don't we just call it, you know, 
[noise] [Ul] with the Holidays and everything, and he's like i don't want to wait a couple of days,
it's gonna get hot. [Ul] [Noise] You know, he was kind of wishy-washy in all that stuff but
when uh, I pulled over?-l took him, we went driving around and we got off 275, like one
exit off 275?

JC: Uh-u.
UCE: We got ofnt pulled into the parking lot of some when pulled

in the parking lot of the supermarket, i opened the tailgate and showed him the bomb in the
back, and he?s 

KE: He didn't take any weapons with him, right?
UCE: No.
CC: Oh, the question was: Did you happen to search his bag? Do you know what's
inside his bag?
UCE: That little bag he?s carrying?
CC: Yes.
it was a glad. I .a
KE: and a bottle of water 
UCE: Yeah, it was nothing. There was nothing in it.
CC: Because we were concerned that?we want to make sure he has no access to no
weapons.
UCE: No, there was nothing in that bag.

CC: Alright

[Pause]
UCE: You could tell Sara that she got hernwhat you call it, Video, his suicide video.
JC: How's he planning on getting that on the internet? Are you doing that?
UCE: No, I'm supposed to hold it for a couple of weeks till everything died down and

I'm supposed to give it the Bos~his 

JC: Hodzic
KE: Hodzic
UCE: Yeah, his Bosnian brother. I'm supposed to give it to the CH5 to give to the

Bosnian brother and tell the CH5. This is for the Bosnian brother.

JC: I wonder if we should change our interview strategy tonight. [Ul]
UCE: And the The 805-

KE: Where we, where we at on here?

UCE: The Bosnian [Ul] what to do with it or something like that.

[Ul conversation] 
KE  phone in background): The target's changed for sure. It sounds like it might be
somewhere on Howard Avenue based on where the subject and UCE were driving. Based on
how he described the street.

 

UM2: Hopefully they'll go, do it in an hour and come back.
[Ul conversation]

UCE: i gave him 20 dollars.

JC: For a cab or whatever.

UCE: Yeah, because I didn?t know how much money? [break] [Ul] make sure he
had enough money and I didn?t want him to get fucking stuck up there just because he didn't
have enough money to get a cab. [Ul]

UM: He didn?t take any weapons with him did he?
UCE: No.
KE: Well there?s just a bunch of bars and restaurants there and I think too

many cops in Ybor and that's why he didn?t like Ybor. 

JC: [Ul] is that where he pointed out the stuff? Or was It closer to here off of 

KE: Hey, he didn't take the pistol, right?

UCE: No.

KE: No, he didn?t take anything yet.

UCE: Took nothing.

T8: When you said he was wishy-washy. You say wishy-washy as far the target goes?

[Ull

UCE: Right~ 

 Yeah,  we are ma?g a search of   we may want-touabortTh?atb- h? 

to get it done.

UCE: He changed--he changed the target. He changed the target. The target was
de?nitely changed.

UCE: [Ul] go down to Howard.
UCE: [Ul] he was changing [Ul]

TB:

UCE:

KE:

JC:

UCE:

UCE:
here.

KE:

JC:

UCE:

[Ul] I?ve got like muscle milk [Ul] bananas..

[Ul] appreciate it, appreciate it.

Hey Steve you?re breaking up. Are you talking to me?
We got some trail mix.

No, it?s alright.

[Ul] I?m gonna have to pray with him probably next time. Next time he gets

And then the green car back here?
[Simultaneous conversation]
Was that not the last prayer?

There?s gonna be one at what you call it, there?s gonna be one at uhm, at uhm

I

after midnight. If you [Ul] midnight 

.lC:

KM:

[Ul] hold on to that video [Ul] bottom line [Ul]


Everything?s ?ne. They have a tracker. Wittman put his, got his tracker laptop

JP enQIMns. So tj?'ts followinsshe trackerayM/l I 

KE:

KM:

UCE:

KM:

[Ul] based on, what, what they were doing [Ul]

He's heading to SoHo. He did leave the pistol, right?

Yes. Everything..i?ve got everything.

Perfect. That was one question?-

KE:

KM:

KL:

CC:

KE:

RR:

KM:

UM:

KM:

KE:

RR:

KM:

JC:

KM:

UM:

UCE:

JC:

KM:

KL:

Everyone?s been asking that.

[Noise] far so good.

Yeah, looking at midnight now.

[Ul] water or anything [Ul]

I?ve got a water. Mine aren?t cold but here, I?ve got three 
Kevin. Where?s the beer you promised?

That?ll be tomorrow.

That?ll come later.

That?ll be after the arrest goes down.

The case agent usually buys 

Oh that?s right.

That?s true, the case agent usually pops for everybody.
Yeah, but the case agent's an eleven.

That?s ok.

WMLcaseasent?

[Ul] the case agent ls a S, A, yeah, is a S-A-C or something
Yeah. That too.
The director [Ul]

He acted like he was nervous.

Huh?

KL: When he was putting stuff on. He acted like he was nervous. He kept backing
away from [Ul]

UCE: Yeah.

CC: He looked nervous on the camera.

UCE: Yeah, he got excited. I think he got excited when he saw the stuff.

KM: Oh yeah. You could tell. He was all like, like a, like a six year old in a toy store.
KL: What was he doin in the bathroom so long? Playin? with the gun?

UCE: No, when..

RR: [Ul] Howard and Armenia [Ul]

UCE: he was gonna, he was gonna pray, so he took a piss? so if he took a piss, he's got

to wash everything.

KL: 

UCE: And then?and then after he washes everything-

RR: He has to clean himself.

UCE: Yea_hs__be_n?eds to ieanhimself. Soj?enhe he needs to do wudu__-

[ritual cleaning] for prayers.

RR: And then we, we got him in the?
UCE: 0n the camera?

RR: Yeah. Praying.

UCE: Doing the wudu [ritual washing]?

10

UM1:

JC:

RR:

JC:

UCE:

UM:

KM:

KL:

KE:

KE:

UM:

KM:

KE:

KM:

KE:

RR:

KM:

RR:

KE:

Didn't we [Ul] that part? At least when he was [Ul]

He was right here in this corder doing something with his hair.
He was just cleaning, still cleaning.

guess so.

He did the wudu [ritual washing] in the what you call it, in the sink.
What's wudu?

Ritualistic cleaning [Ul]

[Ul] down up, down up [Ul]

Let?s see what the tracker [Ul]

There?s Howard there.

Uhum.

Well I bet there?s a gay bar or two down on Howard. Kevin?
What?

I just figured you?d know.

 

A gay bar on, Howard? [Ul]

Armenia now and Southbound-

Yeah, ?cause that's one-way south- 

South on Armenia to go to 

Yeah, he can't Now it makes sense.

11

UM:
RR:
KM:
RR:

KE:

JC:

JC:
UM:

UM:


I?ll take six.

UM:
RR:

UCE:

[Ull

Well, the bars are quite a ways down. He has to cross--
Yeah, they are way down.

Kennedy..

South Howard?s where all the [Ul]

[Noise]
[No Conversation]
moving up there so he?s coming this way.
[rustling]
You?re gonna turn your phone on
Yeah
I might have the command post start calling out the green Honda in [Ul]

[rustling]

how_many zeros? And younsmaid that that? for how is that? 0k,

 

0k 
No, nothing.

From here, from here go from the pickup truck to the green Honda, set up

the green Honda, 

12

KL:

KM:

KL:

KM:

UM:

UM:

JC:

UM:

UM:

UCE:

KM:

And, Fifteenth

their, their recorder
Actually I don?t think it moved

Right

{Ull

rustling]

Okay

So I was just was seeing if younot
Yeah

[rustling]

[Ull

Let me know, Iet me know when you 
[Ul] telling me one thing 

[rustling]

15

This draft transcript, in its current form, is for the sole purpose of review by the prosecuting attorneys
and should not be construed as a ?nal verbatim transcript. Further review may be necessary for. trial

 

purposes.
Case: - (ID 24) 
Sessions: 1 of 7

Participants:

UM: Unidentified male

UF: Unidenti?ed female

Translation Key:

Ul: Unintelligible

IA: lnaudible

SC: Simultaneous Conversation

CF: Faster you click 

JAB: 

CF: Pretty frickin? cool, right?

JAB: Yeah. 

cr: And then we used a -for that. So it should be ?ve recordings all total (uu Cl-lS through
UCE.

TR: (UI) and whiie it won?t make (Ul)
CF: 

JAB: Beautiful.

CF And that?s all we have.

JAB: Thank you.

UF: Hey, how are you?

CF: Everything is right here.

JAB: You are wonderful.

JAB:

UF:

CF:

JAB:

UF:

UM:

JAB:

TR:

UF:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

Atthough they re not quite of it is.
And then we have the enhanced forjust the 
30 and do accounting (UI)
I'm sorry?
The enhanced it just the 



Is that what we had?
me make sure
(Ul) the issue 15 this other guy (Ul)
So here you were successful (UI)

Do we have that though?
the - on 12/7 so that?s the only enhanced one that I have.
(Ul) be able to ask for it?
i feel like more have been enhanced than that. But maybe that was -
This is the oniy one that I have.
(U1).
have no idea.
And the was the car ride, correct?

Isn?t that when they were in the car together?
(Ul) what the he" difference does it make if we give that one back (Ul)

Or is that the mosque shuatton or do you not remember?

UF:

JAB:

JAB:

CF:

UF:

JAB:

CF:

I can?t belleve we still have that (Ul)

I don't remember.

You don't have to remember.

Ok I was going to save that.



Oh my empty dip left (Ul) 
Where have you been it's 

mice scraper and gum that's not mine.
Aren't they (UI).

And then nolse] other stuff.

[Background conversations and conversations].

TR:

JAB:

JAB:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

(Ul) and what it may be (Ul)

And no one that you know of has actual summaries of these other than just having 
They? re all verbatim transcripts.

True.

Do you do you know where to ?nd those?

Yeah they' re over at Pat?s.

Or you can get them on yeah, you don?t have access to the S~drlve.
Yeah I don?t have access to your Share drive.

That's right.

I have Headquarters shared drive.

Very well.

And Newarlrs actually. Well, Newark loves me.

(Ul)

CF:

Well, maybe some day we will present to you the same amount of love that Newark does. 1

would think that probably not but 

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

JAB:

JAB:

TR:

CF:

JAB:

Ha ha. ldouht it. Hey I can only handle so much anyway.

Yeah that?s true.

Ha ha.

i don't know I think you can probably handle more than you know.
Thank you; that is all I needed.

Ok.

Um, and then I'll just get with the transcripts to look at to look at the duration and like how long
these things were and 

Ooh, and it?s ok 12/ 5.
You're a liar.

l?rn sorry. I knew i had different stuff.-.ok 12/ 5, not even deal with that

because 12/5 was the attempted one at the Mosque and that's why we had that -
recording with him. [Background conversations and overlapping conversations]. And, uh, and
- but we didn't get anything 'cuz (Ui) with just sat in the car, remember? That?s

when you.-.

[Background conversation] on and on and on (Ul) here?s the thing; if you don?t want us in your
life, (Ul) stay off the stupid website. don?t even (Ul) you don't know about (Ul) AK-47 (Ul)

is it really that long ago? [Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

12/5.

[Background conversation] don't do all these things, that?s the way to get yourself in trouble.
(Ull 

Oh shit. lioly fuck monkey, that's that long ago.

[Background conversation] you seem like you?re making wise choices, you have a job, you're
going to school (Ui) chef (Ul)

{Ull a month later [Ul] just now 

God why do 



that was, uh, [Baclgmund conversations and overlapping conversations]. So, you can put
that on there, I mean it's technically IDS ishis pocket. [Back ground
talk and noise].

JAB: Nothing came off of it.
CF: Nothing is on 

JAB: I shit, it was really that long ago? Well I've been here for three weeks now.
I?ve been here the entire month of December.

CR: Good God woman..

JAB: I know. .

CF: Enjoying this right?

TR: [Background conversation] You really want to do that?
JAB: Yeah actually. I've been having a blast.

TR: Veiled at him saying, quit doing this stuff, it's just stupid, quit smoking mean I got all up
in his 

JAB: Haven't you?

UM: I was like, yes you we?re not 

JAB: Haven?t it been more fun since I showed up though?
[Back ground talk and nobe].

CF: l?Il give you that.

[Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

JAB: Ha. [Back ground noise]. Do you have like someone smiling In your office?


[Back ground talk and noises].

CF: For whatever reason, yeah. Well I give you all those, yeah. Alright. What are you working on
-

[Background conversations and overlapping conversations].
JAB: This.

CF: This?

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

And other timeline this is like my main tasking of the day.
Let me know if you need'anything. i mean 12/5 

No. YouJust gave me what I need

[Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

JAB:

CF:

UF:

JAB:

CF:

UF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

UM1:

JAB:

CF:

UF 1:

TR:

JC:

through the transcripts and get (Ul) gist of which one wants which. [Back ground talk] What's
the matter now? What?s wrong?

Urn, one of the tech guys wants to replace the? he needs 
Went up 24/7 for 8 hours, everything

ok, know, it's olc it's ok.

Oh i know it?s ok, it?s just one more thing to have to deal with right now.

was like, if you knew the manpower, like the [Ul] we were at headquarters 24/7,
Jacksonville was de?nitely there 

[several peOpIe are talking on tOp of each other].
Jake, i know you?re busy, can you share (Ul)

0k, thank you. Hi let you get back to real work then.
It?s not really 

(Ul) so we did (Ul)

Ha.

Need anything else?

No. Thath all i needed.

Give me a holler if you need anything right?
Thank you darling.

You're very welcome.

Pardon me.

And first, his 

(Talking in background with someone else.) I mean talking to him, it was 3 hours or something

like that, Just steady stream of interfering it was just, what are you saying?

6

UCE:

JC:

UF1:

JC:

UPI:

NN:

UCE:

CF:

UCE:

1C:

Good deal.



Um. hello.

hours or something like that.

You look so much like him.

They going to make you stick around all weekend 

Oh no. No, no.

Yeah so you say.

Oh no, no, no. We?ve been talkirc about that, be done and disappear in (IA).

It was are you 

[Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

TR:

He blathered on for ?ve minutes then one of us would you mean? And then he'd

blather on to what you're saying? You?re trying to pull something out of him.

UF3:

CF:

[Simultaneous conversations]
Ha ha.

Hey Jaqueline?

[In the background, several people talking at the same time}.

JC:

CF:

UCE:

NB:

NB:

CF:

JC:

JAB:

Do they think it?s going to be good enough?

(Ui) it made no sense (UI)

Hey .Iaqueline?

Don't know (lA)

What did you write on the 302?

He said the sky is turning green and there are mushrooms out there.
Jaqueline? Jaqueline? [Background talk] On the 20"? there was 
Yeah. that?s not far from (Ul)

Liar. thought - on the 

cr: the 

JAB: Thank you.

CF: Yes maam.

TR: He thinks we, US Government, caused the tsunami because we?re (Ul)
[Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

JAB: You got what you needed.

CF: She say I'm just a friend.

CF: She say I'm just a friend.

MN: I don?t say that, you say that.
[Background talk].
CF: Gosh well, you?re not you friends You sit close, doesn't mean you are close.

TR: Shut up and listen.

UM3: Just bene?ts, not friends. [There are many overlapping conversations]
CF: Aah ok. But you say l'm just a friend.

UM: I mean, he was, he was just like you said beat the crap out of a little puppy dog or 
CF: With you, you got what I need. 

[Background talk and overlapping conversations].

[Laughter].

TR: (Ul) just listen!

JC: was scared.

UF1: (Ul) little child bike home alone in the rain. Ha ha.

NN: (Ul) i know I get that all the time.

CF: Out of your fucking mind.

CF: Hey. Kenny Is looking for cover for - Shit. He?s trying to replace 

NN: i did not want talk to anyone all day, was confinement.

Yeah. Oh. i don?t know, hang on, i got to take this call man, hang on. {On the phone) Hey man.

idon?t i?m not worried [Ui]

[Background conversations and overlappins conversations].

CF:

TR:

JC:

UF:

UMS:

Hey let me call you back from a landline real quick, thanks. 

i wouldn?t give my kid a gun and he doesn?t deserve one either.

i-wouid give?a gun akin/game before would  gun and. let him like take

it to school with him a long time before gran atom"! with a gun.

That's sobaa?run

That?s true.

[Badgersme and overlapping conventionsUCE:
UCE:
JC:
UCE:
JC:

CF:

Yeah unfortunately tomorrow afternoon, it would be a long 



(0n phone) Hey man how are you?

dyingto go back to see him. -
literally talked to every single one of them.

M)

(in background) Hey what is he talking about? is he asking for this?

(On phone.) Yeah.

Franck

lthink it's changed. The statutes that she had given 

Oh?l don?t pay attention to any of those.

Sax-awn?

News mind-then
I don?t pay attentiun (ill)
i wouldn?t either.

(On phone.) Oh my.

TR: (In background.) i can print the statutes that Sarah gave us but based on where we are 

123: What you think is, ok, whatever, here's what l'm looking to do and both
know that we're, CTS is going to be nonoommittal, um, (Ul) you?re not there yet, you need


[Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

CF: (0n phone.) Oh ok. i was going to say, i talked to every team leader personally 
Ha ha. Alright, alright.

128: (in background conversation) look at the best i can, marry up what we have with
the elements, so that we can at least give them, and know even have it written and
say, sent'it up ahead of time (Ul) CTS (Ul) know nothing is ever perfect because they all want it
ironclad, you know, but if we just say here are the what we 

UF: (Ul)
CF: (On phone.) Yeah, yeah, I hear you.

128: (In background.) And here's what we intend to do at future meetings. Uh, in orderto lock in the
following charges.

CF: (0n phone.) Holy shit.
[Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

TR: Um, i need to call Sarah right now?and that would probably take me most of the rest of the
day.

128: l?m not asking you to do it, l'm asking you for whatever the charge is. l?m going to do it.

TR: I don't know what it is. What l'm saying is, I would need to sit down with the statute 
123: Ok.

TR: And spend that time 

128: OK, enough said (Ul)

CF: (0n phone.) Oh ok, yeah, l?ll talk to him and l'll see into it.

[Background overlapping conversations].

128: yeah ok, alright, that?s cool, i thought maybe you know based on ok.

CF: (0n phone.) Yeah, l?m sure don't see him around anywhere so l?m sure he?s getting his

ass chewed somewhere. [Background and overlapping conversations].

10

UCE:

alright.

JZB:
CF:

UM:

Lone wolf whatever that they?d charge individuals that work (Ui)
[Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

shit, yeah. 0k good, I was telling you they were a breeze, good Godmalright,
Yeah. Check. Yeah.



Ok, I'm sorry Jay

It?s alright, no I I?m gonna do that and talk to 


[Talking to another person] At least to have an idea -

[Background conversations and overlapping conversations).

CF:

UCE:

CF:

TR:

We haven't even made that phone call at noon so ..
Good you as a lawyer one of these 
yeah, copy that. 0k. [Laughter and overlapping conversations In the background].

In Wyoming, I don't know the Florida You get a divorce, you get in a car wreck I canuhelp

you need a will I'm good at 

CF:
UM:

CF:

Copy that.
Somebody sues you because they slipped and fell at your (UI)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. We'll fix it. No, we'll fix It man. Um, we squared away for 9:00

here tonight? We still still got the three teams?

TR:

CF:

UF:

(Ul) website, there's a picture of (Ul)

four teams, shit, ok, ok, good. Um, any additional I know Liz brought It up to me
yesterday when I gave brief about, um, taking it back to normal shifts because she?s
like, because she?s like honestly, those shifts we have are killing us and uh, I know y0u
and I have already about, what, three or four times now. But, uh, you think we should Just
change - and go with that? 

[Background talk]
Yeah sure, 

In the tech cut, just the tech cut

11

Ul1C:

UF:

UM:

UM:

CF:

TR:

CF:

Unless Dixon can go there?s no one here. I can?t either. We got nothing There?s absolutely no
one.

[overlapping conversations in the background].

i mean like, the only thing, the thing that?s bad just fully expecting the source to pay
I. mean (Ui) ask for everything from him.

of logistical purposes, yeah I told her that. explained everything to her, I was
like hey, the team leaders perspective, what do you think? Like we can't do for-so
there?s not going to be consistency. And you know stuff like that. What do you think? And she's
like, I?d still do It. I'd still change it. don't know, 0 Sam to 2pm? Holy shit.
[Background talk].

There he is.

ill Sara, this is Taylor. l'm all right, how are you.

Well rested. Good 

Are you in a position to talk?

Yeah.

Well rested, good job

There is good and there is some bad.

0k.

The good is it did and probably went as well as (Ul)
(U0

Um, I think I think everybody ls kind of wanting the 8-4, midnight to 83m. 0k.
[Laughter and overlapping conversations in the background]. -

(Ul) gun (UI) the AK (UI) the reason he wanted that is because he doesn?t think he can reload
fast enough he just wants to transition to other guns.

Ok, I mean. you want.u.olc

I think so, um. Bad aspect (Ul)

I hope so and that?s the other thing, I mean we need need to have
[Ul] he thinks the source is going to pay for everything.

Really?

CF:

5.49.3519

I don?t have any money; I'm not gonna have any money

0k. OK, I mean if it?s, yeah, I mean if it's not that big of a pain in the ass, if it?s not too big,
if you have an

A strategy that we are trying to come up with; we're working on [Ui] legal help [Ui]
[Overlapping conversations in the background].

yeah,

One of the theories we are trying is about

0k.

the source pays him on Friday and owe him over $400.00

Well, that?s the team leaders are all good with it, like if you've already briefed them and
they?re cool with It, mean, fuck it, let's just wait. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Telling him you know well, I had some money [overlapping conversations in the
background].

Yeah do that, it?s horrible. it?s bumlng her guys

out and everything like that so i mean, I don?t know, man. Well, I know, i know. 

TR:

Maybe (UI) this guy Is gonna need the money to get started you're gonna have to make (Ui)
payment, and if we can maybe have that conversation coincide with when we know Sammy car. A
come up with a few hundred bucks.

yeah. [Background conversations and overlapping conversations]. i?m with you man. Get
Steve's perspective and then see what he has to say and then we can male a decision after that.
Alright, thanks man. Yeah, yeah, i?m going to talk to him. Uh, alright, cool, we'll fix it man, don't
worry about it. Alright, later.

UCE: (in background gonna be $1000 or $1000 plus change. Guns are $400 or
[Overlapping conversations in the background]. somebody?s got to come up with (IA)
(UCE keeps talking but he?s iA). -

TR:

UF:

We have the undercover told him was 3 guns and lot of money and a whole bunch of
money, I don?t (Ul)to the effect of gun Is guns is (UI) really
So, one of our theories, and a lot depends on you and CB in terms of charge
on to steer him forward explosives, no guns or one gun and
explosives.

(In background conversation.) i-Ie's not going to be around with the money, so what's the
answer to that?

UCE:

UCE:

SS:

UCEbackground conversation.) Oh no, no, no, no, you give me money to start. i get started, you
don?t geranything until you give me the balance. 

That could be months down the road, or even longer.

See the thing thing is, his thing was paying for it. was going to get my


So he?s gonna pay the front end, the source is going to pay the back end.

No, he was always gonna pay the whole thing, this is a new thing, We got to get him obligated:


[Baclground conversations and overlapping conversations]. Yeah we do (Ul) but as we progress
[Background conversations and overlapping conversations] is and he did express sort of
the urgency in terms he didn't say ?same hour' or ?same day? like he did before but he did
express i want to 

Are you getting him money or what?

No l'm getting $5,000 from him 

Oh nice and you handed the uh, you handed the - and a .to the scurce today?
Yes.

Ok.

The (Ul) thing?

(Background conversations and overlapping conversations].

CF: The what?

SD: Did you already throw it out?

CF: What?

SD: The little mint thing.

CF: That little mint thing. Oh yeah i did throw it out.

SD: Oh.

SD: That?s perfect to keep the screws in.

CF: Oh, well, ljust leave them on my desk. Oh shit, i got to 
END OF SESSION 1

14

This is a test 00:00:15 Real timeThis draft transcript, in its current form, is for the sole purpose of review
by the prosecuting attorneys and should not be construed as a final verbatim transcript. Further review
may be necessary for trial purposes.

can _l 014l

 

Mons: 2 of 7

UM: Unidentified male
UF: Unidenti?ed female
Tm Key:
Ul: Unintelligible
lA: lnaudible
Simultaneous Conversation 
cw: 
SO: Alright, be ready to go get the 55.0%.
.lC: $5,000 
TR: (In background conversation.) So in terms of interstate sure, sure.

0k good but we need to kind of knew that but this con?rms we got to from our
standpoint (lA) be able to (IA) we?ve get to have Speci?cs

UCE:

CF:

um:

CF:

UM:

TR:

(talking in background, he is IA)
Hey man, how are you?

Good man, how you doing?

Oh I'm hanging in.

Inaudible from background

So from our standpoint as well, we've got to be able and not only that, get day

before yesterday at work he asked the source, uh, to drive, the, the, vehicle borne explosives 
said be going to be that can bring that So, I seems clear is that
so wrapped up in doing losing (Ul)he?s just doesn't understand what?s

UV 5WNH



realistic. which works to our advantage but we don't know if we feed him something completely off the
wall, we don?t know if he'll bite because he?s so far out there tends to be more
toward the Whatever (Ul) yeah, oh well now we got (a car bomb
at the I mean, so he's 

50 as far as the money a amount of dollars.

TR: Yeah, what we ended up doing, tricky is the source drove him to a pulled up,
met and target left separately (Ul)and all the was 
Yeah and that he's fully completely, almost undoubtedly ready to do that. He has no 
There's a noon SVTC with Headquarters. (a vacuum cleaner in background?)

CF: new one.

TR: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um what the UC told him, is that he w0uld have to do some what it?s
going to cost (Ul)..so what we anticipate is didn't seem to 

UF: And when it screws You know what I mean? I den't it would be nice (UI)
and that?s exactly what we 

UF: And then all of the little tricks and all of that (Ul)

JC: (Ul) So then you?re still (Ul)

(Many other conversations in background.) (Sounds like CT DC Specialist PM in one of the conversations
- she's discussing the bank scan software.)

TR: Exactly. Um, the other thing that we've been playing with and i don't know that he?ll go for
of our thoughts the gun, (UI) we're thinking he wants the guns, he
wants to be able to see people die and if he's gonna die one of the thoughts that we hac
was, these guns are so the explosives we can make can make 
can make for you the proposal as well and blow yourself up a few minutes
later(Ul) .device (Ul)..homemade grenades you can throw them the gun is in the higher
price range or something Think that plays with charges on it?

UM6: 
um: 0k. 

NN: (Another background conversation. Sounds like PM and NN are discussing the bank scan software.)
But no, and that?s kind of like i could have probably 

(Many simultaneous conversations here.)

NN: (Ul)..But the thing is all You It's already screwed up before it hits Bank Scan. Right and
either they didn't choose the right template or they did something wrong. And think that's even part

the problem and, um, I think most people have more issues though beforehand and
I don't really think we spend as much time on the beforehand part, um, and I know 

(Various conversations occurring - cannot transcribe)

NN: (UI) you know what I mean and well, I mean that?s part of the reason, I was like oh my
the thing is all that 

CF: You've got to be kidding me.

TR: 0k. Alright. And I have a question in terms of not leading him too the two people that steers him more towards the government thing, not overtly, but just. the
source has previously had said what he says (UI) well you told me before that you wanted to be
civilians what he said well you told me before you wanted to be a civilian 
understand you want to kill more people, can you think of anything else where possiny killing those
people Would reasonable to try 0k.

RW: The U.S. Attorney will be here or his Deputy or whatever they call him.

TR: 0k. Hey Sarah, so you're aware of, says that, uh, you're aware
RW: Is our standing order, do not be seen don't even be in the
area.

Rw: Yeah.

CF: We're one burn away from bringing the whole thing for another month, .that?s what I want
to tel them.

aw: We made a lot of great progress. Thanks to you. Thanks to everybody really but yesterday was

huge 
TR: 0k, if you hit my voice mail, just do the 

RW: 0k, Mr. former FBI to dig in to of you guys, really, all
you can dig into the U.S. Code. We need to be telling them that the way we see it, we have these
violations, where do we need to push this all the way to fruition, what are you going to expect to have
us with the subject. We do not believe it?s prudent to allow him to drive very far after picking up inert
weapons, the and a bomb vest, to get more than 200-300 yards from the undercover after
that drop is ma him down. Is you feel that you have enough then to prosecute?
They want th' Hollywood en 'ng, that? 5 great but, plus once we start laying out attempted use of a
WMD, and I don't remem the title 18 code for that of the automatic weapons code,
we need to lay out what we see for that today. And I want to do that with CT 5 today. Hey, here?s what
we?re looking at, this is what the FBI sees is the potential charges based on what we know, and what say
them (UI) put them on the spot. For what it?s worth so you guys understand the information over at the
US. Attomey?s of?ce. The US. Attorney is aware that the case exists but has no clue about what level

 
 



detail we are asking (Ul) potential delivery as early as next week. of and stuff like
that with this that?s how bad it can be. That she's she?s not or is meeting her
supervisor who's not maybe putting it forward, i want what they refer at this 

1C: who her supervisor is that?s 
UM: That?s where it ends? Ha ha.

aw: That?s where it ends. Um, because how at this stage does the us. Attorney not know that this
case is being briefed to the President, they've got an undercover into it now, we just talked weapons
acquisition with and they anticipate delivery as early as next week, to bring this thing to fruition and
arrest. 1 think if i was the us. Attorney, I?d be ripped about not knowing that. lwouldn?t get too wound
up about it.

CF: Yeah, but, what l'm saying. 0k you?d get pissed but I don't think he's gonna be
pleased to hear 

RW: But how do be like me keeping it from the i just forgot to tell you, this guy
wants to buy a bomb next week. What?

 

aw: So again, dig into the, uh, Criminal Code for me.

CF: Hey did you email Kenny back 

Rw: We got an hour and a half.

TR: I told Jay that I could probably do a really good job of that not doing anything. -
Rw: That?d be great.
TR: Not familiar 

Rw: You need a couple of generic codes to throw at him about violations of possession and
attempted use, etc.

JC: Do we have a starting point as far as like what she?s been looking at?

TR: Yeah, i have the printout, yeah, but I'm not sure how current that I talked to her she's
not where she could get and let them know

Hey other day, um, I?ve known this and I kind of have forgotten about it, l'm the

primary Duty Agent next week, urn, do I need mean 

4

24

25
26

27

nw: Yeah, find a replacement?
JC: Yeah.
aw: Yes. cause I really think that depending on how tomorrow goes.


CF: (Ul) do 

RW: Next week will be very but, knowing Murphy, not that i believe in that, really, but
just joking around about it, something will come up, we'll be like, well Jake you got a complaint call
about such and 

JC: meal: that?s what l?m saying and it?s like? to shirk my duties 

aw: you ?nd far out do they have the Duty roster? I would look two weeks
out, all the person who?s got it then and say, hey, can we swap.

it: Problem -
"in the holiday(Ul)

Finding someone for the holidays.
Yeah it's a holiday Will)? (Ul)

5.33



1C: Well call and tell Brett, say, hey, just, you got a secondary, he?s a primary.
TR: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

CF: Let Draper 

nw: didn't mean to get 

3C: And I Just wanted to draw attention to that so that if they call and i say, yeah, can?t do it, then
the SAC doesn?t call you or something saying, what the 

RW: No he's aware of this one. -

1c: Well, know know what l?m saying manly didn't Jake find a
rephcement or something like that.

aw: Yeah, well, i guess it?s because he really had nothing better to do  annual leave sir.

mil-own 



12
13
14

15

27

3

TR: Well I know, two years ago. three years ago, my ?rst Christmas took Tom Oates duty
?cuz he had use or lose and it had looked apparently hard as he could and then there was a
canvassand then there was an email that said if somebody doesn?t help him out, we're going to draft
somebody else from the list 'cuz this guy is use or lose.hat was about two said, oh yeah,
for ?ling to do went-ting somebody three months 

Yeah and like Franco said, i think we got you menthm

CF: Yeah.

RW:

Kw:  Either that or we could say, sucks for you man, we're going to go make an arrest. You handle
that  call from the whackadoo talking about Bin Laden being in, uh, downtown Tampa.

0

11!: 

 is not here.
He?s being 

reviewingtapes or?

TR: ..The gun chargemet weak, not a lot of
(Ullgum, but multiple explosive devices would be big. really big, so? some way he left one, he wears
 sa 

 

3

TR: See that?s what I'm wondering, I mean, what I wondered is if we have the ability do you think it
woukl sell, of these guns costs you more than three or four?

UCE: Grenades? Grenade?s already in it.

TR: I What? that?

DOE Grenades are already part of it.

TR:  Ole But what I'm terms 

You saying body 

mummb

TR: No, no, no, what I'm saying itho control what he gets, a gun complicates things a lot for
us.

Right.

TR: And I'm wondering if we can keep him, scare him away from the guns by saying, dude, you
know, you can?t give me anything, your buddy doesn?t have a lot of money, yOu guys can't afford a gun.
But with the money you have, I can get you severam I can get you a vest withgpur grenades,
you have the (UI) grenades and blow yourself up, I can't get you Do you think that would, unless
you can come up with 4 or 5 

1C: Yeah that was an initial request. With the source, he wanted to buy two nothing
at al about explosives, in every, every pipedream scenario he's had since 

 

TR: How do we come up with enough money for them to pay for everything?

UCE: Not that guns aren't going to be that bad as far as price goes. I think the money and
guns is not the issue. 

JC: Kerry Myers keeps saying $3,000 

Who said that?

JC: Kerry 

TR: Well, what? 5 his name, Andy, said 4?6.

UCE: 4-6 what?

TR: Thousand dollars for automatic weapon of any shape or description on the black market.
UCE: Why?

TR: Because it?s illegal. And two they?re very limited supply.

UCE: I can Call somebody who just  

TR: Yeah, I mean, find out, I mean, but, and maybe that?s a completely 

.IC: Plus I really don't think he has any concept of how much it costs. He?s not even worried about
the money, you know that?s not 

uce; "Mai If 

 

TR: Well exactly, but we do. 

NV



JC: I know but I?m saying he?s not going not going to say, oh, he?s not charging you $3,000
so I'm walking away, he's 

CF: I?m pretty 

.iC: get Andy?s point that on Southwest Border if you don't ask for enough, then
they think you?re a cop.

TR: Right, right, 

1C: He?s not the Southwest Border interacting with a bunch of other people who have tried to get
wtqmatir: weapons.

Til: But there are expert wimesses thath testliythat this costs $6,000 they sold it to him fort
FBI made this happen. And will happen. And everything that we can doto
?remen our this case sucks, everything that we can do to strengthen it, we ought to do.
men) riht now, the way that this is sitting. we have yet to envision a scenario where i wouldn't advise
my Qiient. if! represented Sami, you've got a decent chance I would take it to trial. Right now, we have
not  have not yet come up with 

molar 2

 

RW:

RW:



RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:



UCE:

RW:

He didn?t know you know that. . .and you?re gonna need a down payment for their
server cause some of this stuff- -

(Coughing)
- you shouldn?t be paying for it until you are getting paid for it right?

The odaer-dndeisnitayea? but somebody else is paying for it (U1) (Noise) right
now it?s ham (U1)  eise it- its hard to get started. You
imowwhat ?I?m sayingits hardto 

(Noise)

Okay super possible.

Don't say that!

Right!

(U1) there is no way around it. ..it?s not gonna happen

Right. right, and what he can say is, no. the other dude is taken care of
itr?.? Be like well the other dude is not here right no?. We?re supposed to be
limiting his involvement. 1 need somebody right now And I?m not. you
I?ll go back and talk to - about it- -

the thing is -
- -Or - or whatever his (U1) yeah!

(UI) unless certain amount is there to start, (Cl) it doesn?t make sense to me to get
some other (U1) It?s not going to happen like that. . .Whatever (Ul) so it doesn?t- -

Two hundred bucks! Three hundred bucks!

the two hundred dollais is not gonna change anything, is what I?m saying so
what. what sense does it make for me to demand that cause?

It changes it legally-yeah.. yeah, yeah 

I understand, I understand what rm saying but for us. for us to get w-

But for his mindset- -

UCE:

RW 

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

UCE:

RW:

CF:

- -as law enforcement- -

- for his mindset.

- -for us, for law enforcement.

Sure.

That?s- -that?s a beautiful thing. I?m just saying in a real world situation.
Yeah what his response is likely to be - -.

Just in a real worid situation, period- -in a real world situation. period. How is
that, what sense does that make, in a real world situation? Other than what we
would like and promote what the purpose (UI) you know which I understand if
that?s what they've got, that?s the perfect thing that?s what we would love to
happen but in a real world situation that doesn?t make sense in a real world
situation cause regardless of whether you know I need money right now to
do something right now I?m still not doing anything until I get the {UH-balance o? .
Mend the down payment has got to be more than twenty (U1) histh


Why does it have to?

Because it has to be enough to acquire the materials, it has to be enough to put
you. . . to have- -to have- -to have me ?nancially where I?m not leaving (U1) that?s
where (U1)

A lot of (U1) macaw

That gun is more than that.

That gun! Yeah! But the bomb stuff, no.

(Background noises)

(U1)

(Background noises.)

(U1) The gun thing I totally agree with (U1) I'm not fronting your operation (Ul)
Wartime?

(Background noises)

Uh! Hand grenades, we have grenades being made too.

3

UM:

RW:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

IA:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

Yeah I heard that. Steve, thank you, (Ul) yeah they?re starting to work on them.
Yeah so I think that?s where that couple of hundred bucks 
(Background noise)

- -.but I need a little bit to get started acquiring materials from you cause these
guys aren?t front it so with mam! the grenades it?s a couple hundred bucks for
materials and at least get, get started. (UI) (Noise) Good now we?ve got to talk to.
(IA) was even still okay that even after that at least he?s paid for a portion of it
when it comes to the guns if the source is going to ?net that portion of it. that?s
between you and the source. And that may be a that the three of you
have to have together or not, it?s tough, very dynamic.

It?s, I understand (UI)
(Background noise)
I?ve done this more times than I 

It?s beautiful, it?s beautiful and I would love if. if it wasmm that would
be the best possible way to do it. (IA) I don?r?see minim.

(Background noise)

For what, get, you get three hundred bucks out of his pocket to buy the pipes and
the vest and black powder?

(1A)
(Background noise)

(UI) We?ll need to, need to stall him; investing my time into it for doing
something, you need to come up with halfof the money. That way, ?rst of all it
covers me more in expenses and the second part is that I don?t, I'm not going to
take a loss, the second part is that I know that if you don?t. if you pull out you?re
out. You?ve lost it.

Right.

There's no.

You?re not getting back.

There?s no. there?s no getting me back.

4

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

Right (1A)

Right so you?re invested, everybody is invested at this point. That?s why you do
that, that?s the reason we do that.

Uhm- -uhm.

Boo-nan everybody is invested at this point. We're all going forward. we?re all
committed now, you know.

Well that?s why the, the source told me that as much money that if he?ll give up
three hundred of his own income this week and the source gives him the other
seven hundred to come up with a thousand for half of it, that?s okay.

Yeah but how do you, how do you separate those. how do you separate those
transactions? Don?t  amsacn'ons.

well you don?t have to take any money. We?re not taking any money 1W
Mtheamreeto begin with. you can, the source is gonna take care of you later

Nah. nah that?s not what I ?m saying cause how do you separate those transactions
cause you're talking about two di?'erent transactions. You?re talking about a
transaction that I?m, I?m gonna conduct with him but (Ul) gonna conduct with
somebody else for three or seven hundred dollars.

Seven.
Or I start this thing.
Uhm.

How, you don?t separate, how. I mean me, i want to separate those transactions
two of them together you know take care of that and then come see me and
here?s a thousand dollars to go, that?s one thing- If he gives his seven hundred
dollars to the CH8, the CH8 gives it back to me and says that?s, that?s one thing.

Or if he takes his three hundred and the CH8 gives him his own seven hundred
and then.

Right that's, that?s the only two ways, that?s, those are the logical ways that this
thing happens.

Right.
If he gives money to the CH8 or the CH8.

 

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:





RW:

NN:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW 

The CHS gives him.
The HS gives money to him.
To him.

One way or another I don?t, can?t separate where piecemeal. where l?m getting
paid from.

I would, you?ve got the experience. I would disagree with that based on their
relationship- -

that doesn't make sense.

- -based on their relationshipdoes if? - if- - hey! He said he was
going to pay for it well if he says he can?t for all of it so you' ve got to pay for
some of it and he?s got to pay for some of it.

That?s not a conversation that I would have him. wouldn?t have that
conversation with his.

I think what he?s saying that an independent person he wouldn?t be working it out
and making the deal. It should be the source and the bad guy saying how they?re
going to work it out. who's going to pay what share.

Good.
And then pay him fully.

Other than, well other than the background is that you helped out his family
before and they?ve been here for eleven years.

Oh.

And so there is a little bit of a trust factor there.
No me, me, and the. me and the CH8 are okay.
Right.

Our relationship is (1A)

That's why to me if he says well I can give you three hundred and he?s gonna
give you seven hundred and you can say okay well I trust him and good with you

UCE:

NN:



RW:



RW:

UCE:

RW:

RW:

JC:
RW:
JC:

UCE:

JC:

giying him three hundred and he?s gonna give the seven hundred then he?s gonna
tell me that.

I?m not gonna tell him that though. He should know that before he comes to see
me.

Yeah, that?s, 1.

He would know that because he had the source already. That would be, that
wouldn?t be something that I'm not - -I would not educate him.

Right. Source has to tell him. Okay then the source has to be, so you, when, then
does it work if the source has to tell him, ?Hey. listen! You are gonna have to
give him the three hundred bucks.? And that?s something Jake has the source tell
him. And I?ll take care of the rest and then he comes here and says he said he was
going to take care of the rest and here?s three hundred of my money for you Is
that something you accept?

That?s. that?s (IA) that?s a feasible, that?s a feasible scenario. that?s a feasible
scenario.

That?s what you?re going to do, that way the source has to be coached mm.
 Okay I agree.

I, I?m with you. I?m not arguing with you.

Background voices)

You want to go at three o?clock with Ralph and eXplain to him the time for
tomorrow and everything?

Yeah that?s what we were just talking about.
Well I heard night time and all that stuFFso (IA)

Uh, one thing I told the source this morning was we were talking about (U1)
trying to get Sammy (PH) to actually show up on time cause there 
 . if it did happen he'd need a little bit more time.
. [Pause] Uhm- - you know the- -the problem with late .you can?t call
him -

Right!

- ~you know so you? - you kind of like go ?nd him somewhere you know.

UM: Exactly. (U1)
(Noise)
aspeet?e? piece  ma
 

RW: What we need to do is drive away for a while. chit chat some more, talk. I've got
to get- -I got to get more speci?cs for him.

UCE: between the time he shows up at work at 19 and the time
you have to be at Djumu?a, and I would be and? (U1) it?s just not enough time
M.

(Background noise)

I Yeah.

UCE: So you would have to schedule it either early enough in the day W33
or just schedule it a?er everything is over late in the day.

wm-Mx? 

(Background noise)
RW: (UI) so why can?t we get it done early?

JC:



JC:

can. Uh- -the only issue we?ve got is just do we depend on Sammy to be
reliable enough to show up. WMFM

(IA voices in background)

I don?t know man this poor guy he gets almost ?ve hundred bucks in his hand
tomorrow and he says you need me for another week? That?s a thousand bucks
(UI) why wouldn?t he show up? 

Well right but you?re a hardworking 
(IA voices in background)

RW:

UCEI?m, I?m trying to think if I?m a. if I?m a retarded fool who is hard up for
money and I don?t have a pot to piss in, another ?ve hundred dollars looks pretty
good. 

That's not logical boss, that?s not logical.

w. u. Yak.

I didn?t say logical. 1 said hard up for money.
Yeah.

Anyone that?s hard up for money anyways constantly didn?t have enough and
now he knows he?s got to acquire some money to get some, well no he thinks that
the other guy is going to pay for it. He?s told hey, I can?t cover the entire cost of it
now. now he's thinking well if he can?t cover the entire cost, I?ve got ?ve
hundred here and I work next week I?m not going to need the money once 1 go do
my thing so that? 5 almost a thousand dollars. That should be enough to get the
whole thing started, to give you I give the guy eight hundred bucks and I got my
stuff, I?m almost there.

[On the phone] Right. Iknow it by the time I got l; )Wmd



You?re not feeding him (U1)

Okay yonWhe?s got ?ve hundred bucks and (UI) ifhe?s got ?ve-hundred
lie-cm go get-Aha: was):

[On the phone] (U1) usually, don?t you guys usually require it to be mailed, like
Fed-Ex to you, that?s usually what I do, I would follow up with a Fed-Ex, but if I
would have Fed?ex unless I overnight it. - -

it gumbo likely? that's a lot easier to gaingtohuy-an?t
from somebody. ?ght

.Wellifhe-mtsa pistols he?snot-going togetone fromme

[Gumbo-phone! Well yeah I mean I, I don?t think we usually have the (U1) I think
it?s just usually the.

(1A voices in background)

 

RW:

RW:

JC:

UCE:

JC:

JC:

UCE:

UM:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

Well again more reason to make it tomorrow when he has to give you back
money so you can?t. (U1)

(IA voices in background)

Right that?s the source.

(U1) and don?t forget that I?m strapped right now. You're gonna have to pay him
certain things so he knows you're serious.

 

And I?ll, I'll help you on the rest but (UI)
[0n the phone] Alright. Thank you so much. Bye.
(Noise)

You have to give him like four hundred bucks. Source says he wants three
hundred and dollars or however much you know

it?s got to be more speci?c than that

(U1) He comes into the store. the source sits down. said he needs a thousand
dollars; it?s about half, maybe a little bit more. (UI) you have to ping him. 1 can?t
take care of this whole thing for you. We?ve all worked very hard for this -

(U1)

Maybe you can meet him tonight. He?ll pick you up right here outside the, outside
the building, outside the store or you?ll meet him where you met him last time or
whatever time is appropriate. (U1) the source has to be very speci?c that Amir
(PH) wants a thousand bucks, alright? I can only give you six hundred right now.
You have to pay him the other four.

(U1) 1 have already told him WeWowdm??M)
(IA voices in background)

And then when Sammy says well what about the other. if that?s about half what
about the other thousand? Let's worry about that later.

(U1)
We'll worry about that later.
Hopefully we?ll be able to get that together but (Ult

10

 

 

RW: Can?t your- - can?t your friend- -uh- - can?t your friend sell some of
his stolen items? (Chuckles)

TR: Well if he?s so worried about the other thousand mean, I mean (UI) I think I can
get it together. You get what you can and between us we?ll be able to make it
happen. Do you have anybody else you could ask? You know hopefully I'll have
a good week at the store and we?ll be able to.

RW: Maybe your other brothers can still help you, even though they?re not in it. We?ll
?gure it out. We?re going to be able to make this happen but . . .

CH: (IA) right now give him 400 dollars

PC: Call - he?s got thirteen grand doesn?t 

CH: (IA) my money, he wants you to give him four hundred dollars (IA)

(IA multiple voices in background)

CH: You need to give him what you have right new. four hundred dollars (IA) cause
he?s not going to front the money and then you take off and he?s out four hundred
dollars. It?s not like you can return it (IA)



(IA voices in background)

RW: You?d better help the supervisor out, that?s all I?m saying.
(LA voices in 

UM: He was clearing the cubes the other day. He scared I almost drew
down on him.

TR: I cleared the other side. I didn?t see you go over.

TR: You can?t clear my side too. I saw you come around. well I heard you 1.

RW: So what?s the timing plan? Cause that conversation basically happens in the
morning (IA) at night again (1A).

UCE: You know whathappensthen (Imam-dim
r. . ml . I 8  IMEI .I

(Background Noise)

11

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:
UM3:
UCE:





UM2:
UCE:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

But, now that now what you?re saying is that now (1A)
conversation (IA) now let?s drive around and kind of check things out. You?re
talking and (1A)

You?re asking show me your target.

Well that?s, I think driving, I think just driving around even though maybe you?re
not as familiar as just for opsec to keep mobile so that its harder to follow you and
track you.


Are you asking - - asking you.  your target? 
Yeah.

That?s. that?s law enforcement. Show me your target. that's law enforcement. To
get away from all that by saying like it?s basically it?s what type of target are we
looking at? Cause I don?t care what the target is. I mean truth, I mean truth be told
no I don?t really give a. -

I want plausible deniability.

I don?t give a shit. give a shit. what type of target are we looking So that we
know that we bill for that target.

(U1)

So then start laying it out? - fuckin - - get to him when you have, when you (IA)
(Noise)

(IA) I ain?t telling you what the target is.

Just out of sheer frustration trying to explain.

Well it?sjust. it"s just? -it?s human nature. I feel sick to my stomach. I feel if it
does. . .Great! If it doesn't. .. at least, we?ll have an idea of what we're looking at.

Have you researched it? Is there security there? Is it a hard target? Is there- -is
there- - is it? What are its hours of operation?

Just, just so we get that layout of what you?re building for so, so we do that. if we
do that. 

(End of session 15)

l2

This draft transcript, in its current form, is for the sole purpose of review by the prosecuting attorneys
and should not be construed as a final verbatim transcript Further review may be necessary for trial
purposes.

ease: ?uow

 

Sessions: 3 of '7
Participants:
UM: Unidenti?ed male PM: Pat Mahn UCE: Undercover Employee
UF: Unidenti?ed female NN: Natasha Novikov SD: Stephen Dixon
TR: Taylor Reed 1C: Jacob Collins CO: Christopher Franck
RW: Richard Worms
Abbreviations:
Ui: PH: Phonetic
IA: inaudible Technical notes
SC: Simultaneous Conversation
(background conversation)

TR: A situation where i don?t say, you know, we?ve at least got a chance of convincing one out of
twelve people to say the government caused this to happen. That?s all it takes, is one out of twelve. To
measure, room full of 50 people, you?ve to pick twelve, you only get three strikes to?to say that person
won?t fit and you've only got certain reasons you can use strikes.

NN: (SC) (IA) You know what  

TR: One person and he doesn?t go to jail. i mean. that?s-that?s-that?s what we have to-l mean
that? 5 how good a case, I mean, we have to build. (SC) And?and the?and the other thing i was trying to
explain to these guys this morning, the chances of us getting in, much, if any, of his 

is low.

NN: (SC) but I had all this time Surrounding 

TR: i mean, what happens between he and (Ui) is going to be 95% of what he?s going to try.
Because we can't convict him based on the fact he's got stupid ideas, we can?t convict him based on the
fact that he?he traveled to Afghanistan because that wasn't a crime. Tried to travel to Afghanistan.
Unless we can prove it. I mean, if we can prove it, yes, but if we can't prove it?

NN: (SC) Everybody you go and put a microscope on it..'Cause they?re expecting to-


TR: -or at least show probable cause, we rule of law is, you can't convict
someone for A because they did 8.

1C: Do you know what ljust thought of, though, and I meant to bring this up last night?

UF: Hold on one second.

JC: If he brings up his travel or if there's a way to get back to that travel to Turkmenistan, if he told
you in a recording that he was trying to join the Muj like he told our source?

UF: 

JC: that?s a charge r?ht there.

TR: That absolutely is a charge and see, and that, and then even if we can't sustain that charge to
convict him, then we get to present evidence, even if we know they?ll acquit. we get in front of the Jury,
a (UI badground a key.

1C: Because that was one of the issues early on, before he even started asking for weapons, that he
actually had technically, already admitted a terrorist act, material support or whatever, because he

tried-
NN: (0V) i got stop by later.
IC: ?he made an overt act to try to get into Afghanistan to join the mujaheddin.

TR: i mean I just ideas, I mean I don't know if this would work, just In terms of his
experience, whatever, maybe you could say, "When did you, have you ever been to these places?? And
get him to brag, ?Well, I tried to go to Afghaan but I didn?t make it.? I mean, uh, that?s
way to get him to talk about would 

JC: Well, I mean. he brought it up, so, I mean, there could be, but I need to tell you, I mean?-

TR: (0V) I do too, I mean, it? yeah, I mean, and, just Ifthe opportunity arises. there(Ui) just woold bemthat would be huge. That?s a (UI) way to (UI)

(Ui bacicround conversation)

JC: But yeah.) mean I-I get it, me find out what?H don't believe that they?re a
thousand dollars. (Ul)Because yeah, ?cuz a regular AK is like $400 and-

NN: (SC) No, you, (UI)

JC: -it?s, I mean, for one, somebody who knows what they?re doing (Ul) could take a 

UP: (SC) Uhm, also?(Ul)
UF: (SC) (Ul) 

JC: ~somebody knew halfway what to do they could take a regular AK, basic make it full auto (UI)
and (UI) we'll get a better 

(background conversation)
TR: And that?s true, but--

it: But that?but the one?s that he's given made to be a whole lot of 
safety and 

NN: (IA) (background conversation)

TR: Right and?and~and one of the things is, possessing an illegal weapon is a ?ve to seven year
charge, making it illegal like that, that's a ZMear charge.

1C: Yeah.

TR: I mean which is one of the reasons it costs a lot of money because just to own?owning ok,
you?re gonna get you ?ve, (SC) make it (UI) for you, I mean, which is another, I mean, 20 years adds a
lot of value to a product.

JC: Uh-huh. Well, we'll see if he's uh-(Ul)

TR: Uhm, have you s?have you-do we need to remind of the cubicle rules again? (Ul)
UF: (SC) The only 

TR: That?s uh, that?s violating 

UF: 0k, listen, do you want information or do you want me to get down off my desk?
TR: (0V) i do. know keep talking. Okay, so, Times Square, Shazad (PH)

UM: We are good.

UF: Um, and then also there's with the Baltimore (PH) which be relevant. urn, he was a little
bold and he was targeting (background voice) Uhm, so?the (UI). ?Cause I don't know the details of
it.

JC: Portland.
UF: Yeah, Shazad. forgot, oh, the underwear bomber?

JC: The Portland.

TR: Po-Portiand, he-he was trying to bomb 3 Christmas tree lighting ceremony.
(overlapping background conversation)

UCE: Portland wasn't a lone wolf, was it? Was it more than one? Was it just one?

JC: Just one guy got arrested.

UCE: Oh yeah, yeah, 'cuz-

TR: investigation 

UCE: Gotcha.

UF: Yeah I'm getting into both ofthem together. I have a question. Do you have Titie 18 Okay,
that's (Ui)

TR: We?we have to?we don? 

NN: We probabiy will only need (Ui) one.

TR: Another question Jake as much for you, ?cuz it?s probably the source more than 

1C: Maybe we should call Jim Green and see if he can come down here because it would be helpful.
(background voices)

TR: Did you tell the source to bring back up the whole (Ui) thing (UI) Just in terms of, because.
that's a better charge, Sarah said, the government building. not that we can't charge plus it could help
us focus him and identify a target (noise) instead of any nuht club 

JC: We've got potential to do that anything with source Yeah, it?s Just giving him
complicated direction can be very dicey, because, he would take that and then say??

TR: (Ul)

JC: - and want you to go and do, you know, or some kind of crap like that, then we?d be
screwed. So, ye?ye, it's, you know, the source is not an undercover, he's done a good job as a source
but he's not an undercover.

TR: (0V) No, i-I somehow we?ve got to identify a target, I mean just in terms of
take down.

1C: (sighing)
TR: We can't have a - waiting (Ui) for him to nail up somewhere.

UCE: What about the 

have to make sure he gets one. Right, because howmhow do we take him down?
UCE: (Ul) His entire?his entire targeting plan is in flux right now because-
TR: (0V) But. since it?s-since?

UCE: ~it depends on what he 

TR: But the problem is, if it's not real explosives, 

CF: Yeah Babyl

TR: He has to by to use it.

CF: Feels good, though don?t it? (laughs)

TR: You have to get him for attempt. Possession of the stuff we?re giving him is against the law.
UCE: (Ul)

TR: Then we (Ul) gun charge, and he'll get 5 years and he?ll serve 18 months.

SD: He's an irrational guy, it?s not like us where you have an objective and do all the planning
toward it. I mean, i don?t think he cares.

TR: Only 18 months is dioey because (Ul)

SD: (Ul) supposed to make him nervous.

JC: He mu?l mean, he may come up with a speci?c night club or something like that.
(background conversation)

SD: There?s nothing that?I just think?i think the problem you?re going to run into is that ridi7ig
along in the car he might see something and go there.

NN: (0V) Like I do all the time.

CF: You?you do that all the time.

(background conversation)

(Ul) no one?s going to be able to answer these questions.

UCE:

TR: That?s it exactly, how?how can we identify the which is why, i mean, what I was just talking
with Jake, and (Ul) that?s a good point, is the source, and~and i think that?that you If the source
could bring back up the whole. ?You said no civilians," to get him on a military, to get him to tell him
what other military targets (Ul) could you use. You know there's-there's a depot (Ul)

already said though about civilians he doesn't care. And he said, he didn't care about
women and 

UCE: Collateral 
JC: 

TR: No, no, no, no, but the source cares. lfthe source is paying and the source says l?m not paying it
if you're not going to target civilians?

CF: i don't think Sami is going to care when he starts spraying the crowd with bullets 

SD: The other thing is, I mean, he keeps talking about paradise, this is his way into paradise. So if he
sees heYbor and?and he drives by it, you know, some gathering of
like 6,000 kuffars (PH) or something, that he had no idea about. mean that?s Your WW W0 Paradise. it
doesn?t matter.

TR: Right.
(background voices)

CF: What else can be considered an overt act? Other than actually brandishing a weapon in?in
public.

SD: Unless you can get him so big like a or something like that, like 
JC: Uhrn. (Ul) money.

CF: That's the idea. Start selling himself?

.IC: Yeah.

TR: is there anywhere where there's a in a building that has a parking garage? Anywhere
downtown or somewhere? I don't know how we?d ever?we can't?we can?t?

UCE: (Ul) process?

TR: ?-well, if. if?

UM: (Ul)

TR: -if for some reason he thought he could get into a garage where he could, i don't 
CF: Are you talking about like World Trade Center parking in the garage and blow it up?

TR: Momm?

UCE: Now?now you?re going to (Ul) and that?s your target.



ONNOUI

CF: Yeah.

UCE: That's why you?re doing that.
UM: Yeah totally.

CF: Yeah absolutely.

TR: Yeah absolutely, I mean, because without an identi?ed target and see that?s the thing, i mean,
to, to, charge him with attempted use of a destructive uh, device, we have to know what his target was.
We have to absolutely, positively know because one charge is. against a government institution, that
was the charge, or against an institution engaged in an act of commerce. HB act would have had to have
an effect on inter?on interstate commerce. NU: club does

UCE: Interstate or international?

TR: inter-interstate. 50, but if we can't identify the target, defense Just says, 'Well he's gonna blow
up a house. How do you know he was going to do that? He never told you what he?s going to blow up.?
It's not a Federal charge. And with that if we can't identify the target, we don't even get to court on
that. It gets thrown out because we don?t have PCs.

SD: So what does it take to have him l-lD a target? lust he says it or what? I mean-

TR: Yeah, It would have to be a pretty firm commitment, I mean, and a consistent commitment, I
mean, and, it's not just, well, I think i?m going to when he heads out.

NN: Recruiting station, no gay bar, same difference.
TR: lmean?I mean, hewould needtosaylt.

Do we?do we have-

Recruiting station and gay bar are same thing?

TR: I?m trying to find this out. l?ts 

NN: Where's this gay bar going to be at so Ijust know what area to avoid?
1C: You?ll find those Ybor 

TR: Ybor. (Ul) Ybor.

NN: Wait were they in Ybor? You told me i could?! was safe in Ybor.

UM: was kidding you?re safe in Ybor.

UCE: (Ul) together. (UI)

SD: i did and you are.

UCE:

50:

NN:

UCE:

NN:

UCE:



wouldn't you be?

Either way. I wouldn?t want to be anywhere near.
Why wouldn't you be safe in Ybor?

What I?what I would think of doing too is 
(SC) (Ul) where all the gay bars are at.

?just for get yam?get your thought processes and uh, have a (SC) list?right now list out

what we have, as far as?

NN: (0V) (un?gay bars Is Ybor.

UCE: -what actions do you know that (Ul) have. You have guns, you have explosives, we have


UF: (SC) I don't, but (UI)

UCE: (Ul) so, I'll get that.

UCE: You law, I (UI conversation) I mean?I mean. you kind of?you kind of start from there.

(Ul) (UI conversation) (loud speaker announcement)

JC:
UF:
NN:
UCE:
CF:
JC:

UCE:

UCE:

UCE:

Shall we go and ask for a meeting?

(SC) I don?t want to.?

(IA). I thought the meeting was twelve. Pre?the 
(UI).

Hey, you've got?you get dIhs on the commando.
(UH

(UI) saying, no?no pressure. (UI)

Find out how well she?s able perform ln 
How well what?

How well she's able to get us what we want.
Perform under pressure.

Exactly there we go. I like that better.



UCE: You got what I need.
TR: I think she'll succeed.
UCE: You-you got what I need (singing) (laughs) You say I'm just a frlend.
CF: You say he's just a friend; (singing) 
NN: Oh man, look what I started.
UF: So, that?s why you don't (Ul)
CF: No, that?s how he sing. That?s not That's?that?s how he sings it. 
what I 

(pause) (UI background conversations)
NN: (Ul)

(laughing)
UCE: Did I scare you?
PM: Yes, you did.
UCE: I?m sorry.
PM: It?s okay.
UM: Doyouknowwheretherulebookls.
CF: 
UF: What do you have?
CF: Federal Criminal Codes and Rules.
TR: What year?
CF: Uh, 2011.
TR: Oh can I have that?
CF: Uh, you certainly may not.
TR: What?

(loud speaker announcement)

CF:

CF:

NN:

CF:

PM:
NN:
PM:
NN:
PM:
NN:
PM:
NN:

PM:


NN:
PM:
NN:
PM:
NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:

You, you can use it for this evolution.

Thank you.

Here you go fine sir.

Muchas gracias. Didn't know who had a new one. That?s awesome.
Oh baby, got what i 

Sing with me now.

?you say he?s just a say he's just a friend. Oh baby 
(pause) (background voices)

What you doing?

(mumbies)

- stuff?

Yeah.

Want to help me make some packets? You don't have just-.
What?

Make some packets.

What kind of packets?

(Ul) three new Thosestupid packets. Not that you need 

i could probably take a break

From what you're doing?

Yep. Help you out a little bit 

Yeah, could you? Yeah. that?s-that?s what i was thinking.
Oh yeah definitely.

And~and then what did they say 

No, if anything (Ui) Grey and i even said 

Not even a response? That's?that's what I thought if you?d help me do (UI) stuff?

10

NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:

UM:

.lC:

PM:

JC:

PM:

NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:

CF:

But either way, could you get methe schedule?
I don't have a schedule, I just 

Well 

(Ul) over Christmas like President?s day, you had (Ul) get Holiday pay. You might think?

Right.
I know my name is not going 
Right and I would have made sure I was (Ul) too.

(Ul)

i don?t know what the requirements or education or anything like that but don't know.
(Ul) (whispering) Well i just don?t want (Ul) helping or offering to help.

(Ul) You are 

Well you haven?t been here.

Well even then when 

What?s that? Awesome, thank you.

Yeah, and you help everybody all the time.
Whatever.

I know.

(Ul) the time, so I'm just like 

l'm just going to putt and do up?
0k yeah l?ll come over for a little bit.

But don't (Ul) ljust thought maybe, uh?

definitely will, we can chit chat

0k.

(pause) (background conversation)

You, ugh, yeah, oh, I know.

11

think we?ll be ok. But, we're?I appreciate you worrying about us.
(pause) (backgrOund voices)

Okay.

Waiting on you.

Oh I didn't know.

Pre meeting before yOur meeting?

(background conversation)

That?s all 'we do is meeting before the meeting.

I thought it was noon that your SVTC was.

Meeting after the meeting, the meeting during the meeting.
(background voices)

(end of session three)

12

This draft transcript, in its current form, is for the sole purpose of review by the prosecuting attorneys
and should not be construed as a ?nal verbatim transcript Further review may be necessary for trial

 

purposes.
Case: (lo 24)
Sessions: 6 of 7
Participants:
UM: Unidenti?ed male
UF: Unidenti?ed female
Translation Key:
UI: Uninteiilgible
PH: Phonetic
SC: Simultaneous Conversation
NN: I heard food.
UM1: Yeah, He?s taking [Uli statement 
UMZ: The empire [PHI?the empire and all of them with him on.
UF2: i heard 
UM1: [Ul] twelve of the month.
MZ: Yeah, leaving tomorrow, 12:30am.
UM3: 
MZ: Oh, there's a reason. (Ul) story behind that.
UMZ: i think the story (Ul) tell anyone. 
MZ: So how are you doing, (Ul) ?red up, yep. Oh 
NN: ithought (Ul) mistake [chuckles]
UM: (Ul) wants to do it, yeah. i never 
MZ: You had drones, don?t you? You have drones? Probany operating from, along with your. uh,

torture chamber (Ul) the wrong 

UP:



UM:

UM:
UM:
UF:
UP:
UM:
UM:
UM:
UF:
UM:
UM:

M2:

UMS:

MZ:

UMSwonder why-
You got what-what?what else?

(Ul) where the waterboard all that the (Ul) Yeah, man,


(Ul) actually I rather be (Ul) 'cause it happened 



Alright, bye-bye. [background conversation 

(Ull

[chuckles]

(Ull

(Ul) [background conversatan [noise]

(UI) and, uhrn, (Ul) we're gonna ?nd [badrground conversatan
(UI). It?s really good, yes. 

Yes, lt would be. Yeah.

That is a gap (PH) I don't know (Ul) on these people leave comments, so it
must be hard.

0k. They need a 

Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.-.no, actually they re very 

Yeah, do that (UI). Be cool, okay. Yeah.

Yeah, we haven?t like 

You doing the other, um, 

Well we have that playing in baclcround] Yeah, mean, (Ul) 
(UI).

(Ul) had it all cleared up.

(UI).

Cool.

UM: 
UM: Yeah?

MZ: Uh, last night I Right, yeah, the only thing there Is stuff no, you'ye got
to recon?gure here (UI).

UM7: 0k.

MZ: onn- (Ul) you can't [noise]

UCE: What do we do about that. that possession of 

NN: Thought you guys have a meetingare.

UM: Not an of?ctal meeting.

NN: 

UM: Yeah.

NN: Rich was gone that?s why I there was kind of, somewhat of an of?cial one.
So. (Ul) check right now (Ul) maybe she 

UM: I might 

NN: Why?

UM: I already did 

NN: Where you going?

UM: Huh?

NN: Back to your meeting?

SD: What's that?

NN: It shows Rich?s green 

UM: Yeah, when was 

UM: What? 5 that?

UM: 

UM: Okay.

UM:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UM:

NN:

UM:

NN:

UM:

UM:

NN:

UM:

NN:

UM:

NN:

UM:

UM:

NN:

UM:

Yeah, (Ul) tomorrow 



Yeah, yeah, exactly.

That thing 



i mean, yeah?



Yeah, (UI) trying to ?gure that out actually [background conversation] 
[clears throat]

ls someone else coming? I didn?t [background conversatan but I don't know (Ul) phone
number (um) He said?overthere (un one thing but I 

Right. nght. right, right, but mean like -



(Ul) start you (Ul) whatever it is 

Like Frank 

It?s not that they 

probably (Ull

But when did they know about it, though?

(Ul) house.

They reached or no? I mean how do they-..? [background conversatlon]
But that?s awesome. I was starting with what she had said before.
Right.

50, i don?t know if they're off of?two?three-three-two

Six, two.



Yeah.

UM:

NN:

UM:

NN:

UM:

NN:

UM:

UM:

UF:

UM:

UM:

UM:

So, maybe wouldn't even know Uhm. 
But, 

(Ul) that?s why 



Huh?

He 

haven?t heard 

(UI) to do something. lie-but I do think - (Ull he thinks he's all about cheating the law.~ I

just (Ull





No, i don't know but l?m saying?

My guess is 

(Ul) drop off to? You think (Ul) drop off?



(Ul) drop off.



No, and if they get-



Everyone does [loud speaker announcement]
(UI)

Alright, cool, yeah. They're in that room right there, okay?
i already know who 

Where is your slacking brother?

He had some errands to run, so-

They? re gonna need those, uhm, grenades or not?

NN:

UM:

NN:

UM:

SD:

15:

SD:

15:

SD:

15:

UM:

.IS:

UM:

NN:

UCE:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UCE:

Well, he is not going to the?
Yeah.

(Ul) I'm gonna call him and 
Oh, (Ul) how you doing? 

You guys "know each other?
Yeah, we met the other day.
Okay. Yeah.

How many do you need?
They?re both Marines too, yeah.
Uh, 

(UI).

Semper Fi.

So, he ran out. He?s not goingtothe meeting. (Ul) you're not going either?

He's, uhm?

You guys going and grab lunch?

I think we were talking, uhm, yesterday (Ull.

Yeah.

Where you guys going? When are you going? You're not saying? [background oorwersation]

Yup.
Are you gonna bring 

Uh-huh.

They want something put together.

I can get a grenade.

No, I?ll?homemade.

No, lthink they're homemade, son. You know, they?re?tth -

UM:

UCE:

UM:

UCE:

.lS:

UCE:

JS:

UCE:

.lS:

UCE:

NN:

.lS:

UM:

UCE:

MN:

15:

MN:

15:

UCE:

JS:

UM:

UM:

UCE:

15:

ATP (Ullfuses, and then some bolts, Mum?everything.

(Ul) worn and expensive, you know?

Uh-huh.

We?we have?right now we?re having money issues.

Gotcha.



Uh-huh. Black powder, uhm 

How do you light them?

Match, uhm, Do you wanna see one of these work?
No. [chuckles] No. there is no place to demonstrate. 
Down here 

Yeah, right over here where we all can stand here with blnoculars.
You have to watch and tape it [chuckles]

If there?s a place to demonstrate I might 

Yeah, you know, he?s trying to get crazy now.

(Ul) group schedule?

Unfortunately yeah. Saturday. (Ul) yeah.



work 

How big are they gonna be 

How big do you want them?

Well, was Just trying to get an Idea so I can express the slze, you know?
Grenadesize? About the size of a baseball.

The size of a baseball?

Round or shape.

l5:

UF:

NN:

UCE:
JS:

UCE:

UM:
UCE:
JS:
UCE:
JS:
UCE:

NN:

UCE:

JS:

UCE:

l5:

UCE:

UCE:

UCE:

Depends on how much tape you put on them [simultaneous background conversation]
My lawyer 

Your lawyer? That sounded like not a good thing.

That?s where you get the strongerthe?the device.

Scrap metal around it. inside of it or?

88?s on the inside of it 88?s or ball bearings, whatever 



Not that we've ever done this before.

[chuckles] 

About a dell phone size?

Uhm, cell phone size, baseball size, whatever."



(Ui) grenade-grenade.

Something that?s not 

Whatever works for you, brother. [badcrOund conversation]

This is ?this is (Ul) dry.

UH-huh.

(Ul) dry (Ul) dry. i have to 

There is a civilian method of uh It?s called [badrground conversatan
(Ul) cell phone [chuekles] i wonder if they would let us, uhm, i would love to go to show.
How is that (Ull?

I'd love to (Ul) show.

Let me give your, uhm, 



You don?t act like (UI) fucking bragging. (UI) like ~for the -?like air club 

File Number:

Requesting Of?cial and Of?ce:
Task Number(s) and Date Completed;
Name and Of?ce of Transcriber:

Name and Of?ce of Reviewer:

Source Language:
Target Language.

Source File Information
-Recording:
?Date:

Participants:
Unidenti?ed male
Unidentified female

Abbreviations:
Unintelligible
Transcriber remarks
Phonetic

UNCLASSIFIED

UNITED STATES OF JUSTICE
FEDERAL BUREAU OF INVESTIGATION

    

Tampa Division
5525 Gray St
Tampa FL 33609

SA J. Collins. TP
LSMS 294445
Ruth Rojas, ORA
LA Timothy P. Goring. TP
English
English
2D24 Session 14
12/22~23/201 1
VERBATIM TRANSCRIPTION
  

File?

Recording 11324 Session 14

Hoists, unintdligiblc background conversation]



UF: Ken Mitchell, please call 1067.
[Noisea unimdlig?wlc background conversationyawFile;

Recording:

UF:

UM:

UM2:

UM:



UF:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UM:

UMZ:

UM:

UMZ:

UM:

1024 Session [4

(U1)
(U1) (coughs).xhey7m hiking about when: they go 
I don?! know  

   
Xah. 

 

 

.. it -- 1:

(mink;an (unmitman,

(U .in. . ml;
[01  Bncalhing. Lil conversation congnuch
No (313

fUI-dnnuygjsa?on. wLunght?r]


Recording: 1024 on 14

UM:

UM:

UMI:

UM:

 

UP: I weekend. I'll be?l?m going to be down there.
UM: you?re down that.
UF: Becausejrhecancalxdownm' 

UM: Yeah, you can just 

 

[Noiscs, unintelligible background conversation]

UM:

UM:

 

File:

Recording:

UM:
UMZ:
UM:


UM:

CF:



UM:

NN:

UM:

UMZ:
UM:
CF:
UM:
NN:
TR:
UCE:
CF:

1024 Session 14

conversation].

(Ul) Yenh. Rowan on??

0h. Iaot a (U1) 
APWM)

Hamdith)

wa-

(ln background) See you later. buddy.

 sun: mamdl?l  U1)
He's talking to himself.

(In background) (un Yeah. (on

He does that a lot. (Laughs) Especially in his sleep. [Laughs]
(In background) (U1) 1 got (Ul) tomorrow (Ul)

(ln background) Yeah.



(ln baclground) (Laughs) You would know.
Heavy sleeper. [Laughs]

Oh my God, thiny-sevcn emails. 

You missed the lunch. man.

I know. man. I had to run a couple errands. Like. you know. pay bills and make
sure I don't get kicked out of my place.

4/

File:

Recording:  14'



  

I 

 



[um-?incommnm

And howeould we find out-?nd out if the tech guys are done with that? "mt 3?

 

Umi.

Someone that exit with it 

l?mgot?w.

There's nothing being done with that [Ul] 
Go on  and see?

Yedi.  just a safe area for right now.



we 
 

leave your proper relief. Something like
that?  I get that tight?

3?
I.

To  my post until 
Unless Merly relieved.


..  unless properly relieved.
 I will pass on tothe sergeant ofthc guard. an of?cer of the

 

  


  me. 

Of?ce: of the day.

[Cl?fs Yes. I will walk my post in a military manner, keeping always 
on   everything that takes place within sight or hearing.

(Q

File;

 

Recording; lD24 Session 14

UCE: Ah. that was a good one.

UM: (Cleans throat)

SD: Yes.

UCE. What lb 21 military (Ul) they never defined that t?tJl ,t

SD: 1 would not be the poster sort of military man.

(Lauytsl

CF: Yes. you would.

SD: No. I wouldn?t.

F: Hey. you shaved. I thought you were growmg the Jihad: beard.

SD: I did shave.

UCE. What happened to your beard?

NN: 

UCE: What was wrong with the beard? You?d grow it big?it would have be a red beard
100.

CF:    I

SD. 1 know

CF: You'd have a - beard.

UCE: Dude at the mall red beard. That would be cool. You remember that dude at the
mall?

F: Th-the one you slept with in the bathroom?

SD: Me? 

No. the one you was swapping swip?swips?spit 

SD: That?s not the one 1 saw.

CF: Ah, yeah. I remember him.

File:

Recording:

UCE:
CF:

UCE:
CF:
UCE:
NN
CF: -

UCE:

NNIE

SD:
UM:
CF:
NN
UCB:
CF:
NN

CF:

NN

CF:

NN:

JD24 Session 14

The one you was swapping spit with.

Yeah. that dude was awesome.

I 

Do you remember?

He said I had kind eyes and that just worked for me.
My ?rst. my 

I heard it was a turkey sandwich, 

Imam

First su?gior. that Saturday. that Saturday that-that we were commanded to meet
with the 

She showed me a picture of the birthday cake she made you.


Yes.

Who?

Oh. Sarah? [Chuckles] Sandwich cake? {Laughs}

Yeah, she?s like, just a and I?m 

[laughs]

The sandwich cake, yeah.

I?m like?I?m like. that wouldn't work out 'cause we?d do anything lUl] and I'd
probably eat all of it.

And she cut her toe open. She cut her toe open making it for me too. ?Cause I
gueSs she opened the oven or something and like brought her toe across and
like just completely sliced it open.

just looked at the thing and was like. ?How in the hell you make a sandwich
cake??

She made a sandwich cake for me.

Pretty sgpciai.

 

Ftle:

CR

SD:
UCE:
CF:
UCE:

   

lD24 Session 14

That was an ongoing?that was a?that was a runmng joke my?ln my class

because 1 got so tired of eating the normal shit and. in line, eat the
same thing over and over.

 
 

Yeah, you: had a turkey sandwich that day.

 

Ijust weat straight to the sandwich bar and made a huge My sandwich was
like that. fucking big. So. that was the ongoing joke in the class. Every was
 Soshemademeasandwich cake. Wlthought
that was Very sweet of her. Nobody 

Hey. it?s Steve Dixon. How are you? [Unintelligible response}



Good [Uninmmgime responst
Did you  the tan night?

Okay. No. no. nope. We?re good.

I?m way?

Did you see recording that 

He did.

I was just curious?

Was there video?

It?s.. it might as well not be. It's?it?s all black. I mean. you could?you could see
his  and I?m sure if you freeze frame maybe you can possibly make him
out.  shit.

But yeah.

Video?

Yeah, it?sjust too dark.

From that thing?

67?

File;

Recording:

CF:
JC
TR:

NN

UCE:
CF:
UCE:

CF:
JC:
CF:
IC:
CF:
SD:

CF:

UM:

CF:

SD:

1024 Session 14

Yeah, I mean, I can play it right?l can bust it out. Irma-avg real-
lt's not a big deal.

That?s okay.

No, I want to see it.

I was just curious. It was just curiosity. 

[Ul] thetdoor [Ul] I saw it a few times when the door opens.

(5 what I?m saying. If you freeze frame you can probably get a picture of his,

.4

When?when the door was open. I mean?

Yeah. yeah.

When the door opens it whole truck lights up 
Even that would be useful.

skipped through it. so I {L'n it-it was black the entire umc.
Okay.

I could see his white 

Gotcha.

see his hands moving and stuff. but I can?t make out his face.

.2  Okay. Awesome. Alright, thank yOu.

I a? 

So mean. What?s up man?
Hey.

So. I mean-rl?xns?re-Iike I said, could go through it and see if I can freeze
frame a picture (UI)  

 


(QWJIUU I have to leave to go try to get a tracker. the vehicles.
(UI)

to

File: .
Recording: Session 14

That means it does have 

CF: But, uh. it?s it's not like the other one was.
JC: from yesterday said that he went to Seven-Eleven
No, you can?t No, you can?t leave.

uc?: Yeah? 

so; You'irc  here.

You?ll:  stay here.

SD: You can go with me to the recruiting of?ce.

UCE: What?s the recruiting office?

m; 

JC: Dispach somebody local

CF:   

1C: Yed? 

    

CF: 1 mug?  .

,Yeah, come on up
Um.  to, 
Do  my?
UM: No. its. 
CF: on gym] Did he buy a slurpee?

SD: One of the Air Force guy saw some guy walk out. some mid-eastem guy walk out
of  Gyro shop right beside.
[Noise] 
CF: Hey,? we know what time it was last night. 10:?

 

?le:

Recordingsum..- Va: 

3.9.29

 
JC-

1D24 Session 14

Scanning around with a camera.

It was after he broke off store.

Okay, just soon a?erabout like eight o?clockish?
Yeah.

So I?m just going to go up there, ?cause the guy?the Air Force guy has a picture
of the guy. so I just want to make sure that it?s not him. Not our guys.

So"; If it?s someone else he's going to recruit. shoot up the recruiting of?ce.
we?re not worried. We just want to make sure it's not our guys.


mi?: -

That?s  gogatdowu. Wem?wecanleave some weapons thereifthey
wantto. 

Seven-?y pm

Seven-fifty pm. Thank you.

On Busch Boulevard.

Hey, bro. what's going on? Hey. I got a question for you. do
you-actually, you know what? I, I already?1 just answered it so don't worry

about it. right. thanks, that was easy for you. [Chuckles] Later.
{Note} that was, if it was Dave saw Davis, it was Liz, so I can just give Liz a

 background convemttiou]
Did you review the northeast request, Jake?
No 

 1mm mutant.


JC: 



File:
Recording:
NN:

UR

F:

TR:

(?D24 Session 14

Are you all going over to Oh.

.. - 

   
 

Are 
Hey. how?d everything go with US attorney?
Fine.

Yeah?

He was really cool.

Did?was it actually Bobby who showed up. or was it 
I thought he might be miffed 'cause Rich said that he hadn't heard about it before
yesterday. But he was totally cool. offered a few things and then said. 

He's a cool dude. though.
been in touch with him every day [Ul]

Hey. Liz. it's Chris. How are you? Good. good. I got a quick question for you.
I was looking over this sur-surveillance log from last night and it said. uh.
after. after the. uh. the I'm sorry. after the whole thing went down
and everything like that. you guys saw him go into a Seven-Eleven or savt his ear
at a Seven-Eleven. is that correct? [lnaudible response. Noise] Fit?tieth and Busch
and he do you know if he went inside or did he Okay. But he
got-he just got gas?

(In W) On what?

Yeah. yeah. no. I got it. I gotcha. No. it?s that it was just brought up that he went
to a SevenvEleven. so everybody is like. ?What the hell did he go in and do? What
did he?what was he doing?" So he bought gas. that makes sense. Okay. so it was
Fiftieth and uh. where? Fiftieth and Busch. okay. I apprecrate it. That's all 1
needed. [Inwdible response] That could be his?that could be his brother. I mean
li-his brothers go out and party and stuff like that. so l?m sure that was one of
them. Yeah. that?that doesn't seem like our boy?s normal hangout. so. [Laughs] I

wouldn?t think so, but. oh. whatever. Inaudible response] Cool. I appreciate it.
Yes. Yeah, yeah. lam. All, all will be here, um if. if you'd like to
attend to .uh. you know give?give the a little. uh. you 

brief afterwards. that would definitely be welcome. Yeah. yeah. yeah. Same?placc

that luh gave you guys your brief. Yeah. yeah. of course. Of course, eah. 

mean, we?ll. It?ll robably go on for a while 'cause we have 
which I?m sure it?s going to take a while. And then. um

obviously the brie?ngs will take a little bit. So. after we, uh. after we knock that
out then. I mean. we?ll. we?ll be here. So. If you can make it cool. I?m sure you?re



File;
RecordingRW:

CF:

CF:

TR.

CF:

lD24 Session 14

going to give them some,m-useful hints. I?m going to try and pass on
everything. you know. I've heard from you and Steve and everything like that. but
it'dprobably better coming from you guys. so. llnaudible response] Uh. was.
yes. response] Yeah, it will and l?m?l?m de?nitely going to go over all
this. so. Thanks a lot. Liz, I appreciate it. [Noiscl (Sight) 0y.

Where you at? I heard you happened to say he iust got gas. Was that 
Yeah, yeah.

[Ul] that the Seven-Eleven thing? Just gas?

That's?yeah. That?s what she said.

He didn't look like he went in?

Well, he went in but there she said he went in, was in there for a minute and
then came out. So. I mean. we can send somebody in. over to go talk.

No. I?m. . I?m comfortable. Appropriately expend resources where necessary. He
went for?he didn't have time to buy a phone. he went in and paid for gas-

Yeah.

That?s through visual only though.

(In  Yep. Tha-that?s cool.

You good with that?

Yes. sir. 

 That?s our story and I?m sticking to it [Lil].
hundred percent. uh-okay.

lUll senator.

Saves me some time, so I appreciate that. Okay. what the hell else was I doing??
Oh. yeah. Email.

Sir?
Somebody was just really complimentary of how how much over the last
few days the reporting continues to be to have him on surveillance. I just wanted

to pass on to you that whatever the teams have been 



it?

?le:

Recording:

CF:

1D24 S?ssion 14

them to keep doing 

That?s what I?m ?ying to do tonight because we?re ripping out surveillance
tonight.
I know.

And that's potentially bad, but that's why I wasjusx talking to Liz. I was like hey,

if90u 

 

The lessons learned from the other teams, because they've been doing it right.
Exactly.

That was the thing, so

You know what they?re doing right?

They?re backing off.

that?s the lessons learned. And 1

'tb 


So anyways. Good job, Chris Franck.
CF: It  me. man.

[End of recording]



UM: Unknown Male

UF: Unknown Female

U1: Unintelligible

PH: Phonetic

IA: lnaudible

Overlapping conversation

- - Speech

Second Conversation
ellipsis

(12/23/2011) (00:22:51)

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

UCE:

m-
UP:
UCE

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

Session 16 (12/23/2011) (00:22:51)
(UTemmas??ou) Yeah, yeah. Good

 conversation? we could do that today. That?s a long
.. . .

Right.

That?s not (background conversation) (U I) ?ve minutes or ten minutes no
that?s W?s guys sit down make sure what we are talking about sol

mgedbkan)  (background noise)

You know and we need some place where we can have a conversation. We can
actuallydo thatinthecartruthfully. 
comfortableas long as. back of a truck . .. (background noise)

Right your trunk or back ofthe truck. (UT)

You?: ofall those things  other day?

Yak



Yeah, yep. Throw them up on the back of the truck.





mavenxou got on: back ofthe truck too. and

 Youknow, [Unugoing to need time to do new

[hm Hey, what?s up? Oh yeah, one second. 011,  
Well,.again  again, yeah, you don?t want to spend

- start getting into other stuff that you don?t want to jam you up on

something 
But 1?11 get to it?, but that?s, that?s 

So basically cut the meeting out and then tonight it would be . .. 

What happens though, um, what happens though with the people to
get you to trying to kill the plan that we had where 



to meet tomorrow, we?ll have the short conversation, Okay, I?m doing stuff.? or
?This is what you?re gonna need to do, you?ve got to get your money together.?

. iv . a you  you know, mwmeek?ee?fwt? money:
 mn?t know if you have [Background conversation]

 
 

 

  
  
 

     
 

l?nf?

'4 

 
 

-:

UCE:    (UI) cool. have got a week to?the money
mm?" 001113 to 338 YOU-  you then, you

 giveme [the details ofit and [?11 - I?ll gotl?ll go-

l'llgo and start (Unmtun. (background noise)

RW: Right

 


.1 i. . 3o . . 

UCE: You know.

 



:4 - .


RW: Does that still open the door back up for him to say well I is paying for it so

you?ve got your money. Didn?t you get it ?om him already? He?s supposed to be
paying for it, no?

UCE: No, no, no, I didn?t.

RW: Cause he?s already today said, ?You?re gonna have to give me this.?

UCE: Right that?s  (0V)

RW: He may still  he may still pullthatfourhundred out ofhis poeketandheylgot
paid today here?s the four hundred  

UCE: Well, what I?m saying what I?m saying to that, what I?m saying to that; that

?rst plan that we had that adds this to this thing (pause) wouldn?t solve the
problem that we?re having right now. The scenario that you came  you came up
with just now, solves the problems that we?re having right now but eliminates the

meeting.
RW: 
UCE: That?s the only thing I will say.
RW: And, and I?m, and I think you at least what I heard last night, was the fewer

meets the better the way this relationship is kind of set up because  
UCE: I?m goqti with it, I-- (0V)

.. 

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

JC:

UCE:

JC:

  

I know?you are. Yeah, yeah, six of one half dozen his mindset  The
fewer times you guys are (0V)

 

-i . 12.5,; L3 3
 the better he feels about not 
(0V) Sure.

 inadvertently dragging himself into it and being recognized and seen together
and  (0V)

Sure operationally, operationally you and me, it doesn?t hurt us at all, but actually
it?s not a bad thing for us to get operationally, operationally as far as the, the 
um  how more realistic our operation is on, on outside of what law enforcement
wants, realistically for our operation the fewer meets is better and, and what
we?ve discussed is  (0V)

They tell us  (0V)
It?s better.

Law enforcement wise, more (0V)

 

Exactly, exactly, exactly right, exactly for what people were saying earlier today
the plan that we had before, when we were coming up before, would have
satis?ed what they were asking for but it?s not optimal for, for  to a

 (0V)

It gives him  it. has more of a chance of him taking MW hundred bucks he
gets (0V)

Yes sir, yes sir, yes sir. (0V)

(0V)  and go do something else with it. (0V) and I don?t like that.

 

Well then and also it creates a situation that they also didn?t want, where he has to
actually just go and get the money from the source to give to you possibly. (0V)

Yes.

 and, and that?s what, and they de?nitely said they didn?t want that to happen.
(0V)

3

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

Right, yeah, we de?nite, yeah we don?t want actual money mOVing. They prefer
that, hejust gives you, ?nd a way to get him, him give you a salary which he?s 
earned legitimately.

And that secondary, that secondary if we did we: -: ndary that
down payment medium then what will happen after, the money still comes
directly ?om the source. I mean but still it?s  (pause) you?ve eliminated that,
getting that money out of his hands. That?s the only thing that you don?t, but you
can still, I mean you can still  (0V)

 

Okay.

He doesn?t have to actually be the one that pays me ?cause he doesn?t have to get
it from the source. You know on that second meeting, on that third meeting or
whatever that will be, whatever the next (Background noise) But you know
what happens though is  his pocket, you have money
(U1) happens.

Exactly. No I?d rather get the ?ve hundred tomorrow and get that. Now the
question would be, now that you have your down payment and you?re gonna do it
for him and get him the stuff; how long is it gonna take you to get it and when is

?next meet? Cause the next meet for me, the next time you and I get together I

will have your stuff. (0V)

m1)

You need to have money. (0V)

Exactly.

If I?ve got the stuff and you don?t have any money, you just . .. (0V)
You don?t get the stuff. (0V)

 you don?t get the stu? and you come back.

I?ll see you later.

And I?ll see you later.

Sure.

Um when does that meet happen? Is that  ?Does it take you two Weeks to get
the'stu?'?? You say, l?ll  you know what the best time for me about January,
the ?rst week sometime in January I can have it all put together and ready for



you. 

UCE: It can be whatever  whatever we want it to be. That doesn?t matter. It can be
doneinaweek.?  

 

RW: Right. We can do it next Thursday. (0V)

UCEnext Friday.

UCE: ih?m??b  can be done in two weeks, I mean that?s that?s. ..
WOW

RW: It?s kind of, all depends, some of that depends on what tomorrow  what

happens tomorrow night if he?s . . . even though he says, ?Oh, I don?t really have a
timeline, but having been on a surveillance that?s good. It?s better cause they may,
they may get on me again and I won?t be able to do anything.? 

UCE: What he expressed and what I  howl understood what he expressed was that
the sooner the better because right now he?s clean and clean, but he doesn?t know
how long that?s going to last.

RW: Right I remember hearing that.
UCE 
TR: Well, maybe you can .. . I mean if that comes up again maybe you can work that

to our advantage. You know let him know, If you?re clean, don?t do anything
besides come to work and sit at home and you?re less likely to draw attention.?

   

(0V)
I did, I said that.

RW: Quit, don?t drive quit driving erratic, don?t  don't you know don?t
don?t  Imean did he like bunker down . . . (0V)

UCE He?s always driving erratic.

RW: [laughs] Did he hunker down in the seat with you at all driving?

UCE (1A) Yeah.

RW: See that draws attention to me  I would think . .. stop it because you?re drawing

attention to yourself. People driving by even if they?re not the police think that?s

5

weird that there?s a guy that keeps sinking down in the seat and they?re just.
That?s weird.

    

TR: He does that all the time 

RW: Oh, no worries (U1).

UF (laughs) (0V)

RW: Anyway, to me that would be like, ?Would you cut that out you?re drawing
attention to us.?

JC: Alright. (0V)

UF: Looks suspicious. (0V) [6:39]

RW: ?Get your head off  get your head off a swivel. You look suspicious, relax, but
 (0V)

JC: Okay.

RW: Okay. (0V)

JC: Alright, I?ve got one thing to, to address here. (0V)

RW: Mot to make a phone call.


RW: I didn?t (U1)
RW: Oh no, no, you?re 
    .
RW: We hadla gdod train of-- we had a good ?ow going here. (0V)
JC: If ifthe source says, ?Hey AMIR wants a thousand bucks I can I  I

can only pay him 600, you need to W00.?2.we think we?ve got any
holes in the story in terms of like ?When did you talk to and ?Did you
talk to him over the phone?? That kind ofthing  I think  my thought is I
think you can play that off by just saying, ?Yeah, I talked to him on the phone.?

(9



JC:
UCE
JC:
UCE
JC:

UCE
JC:

UCE

JC:
UCE
JC:
UCE
RW:

UCB:


s;
4.4.

and you know. But he sells regular stu?? and you?re just talking about a down
payment so  or something like that- (0V)

The gist of it is AMIR called me, that?s going to be, AMLR called me this
morning said  said, said on the phone  i
any it?ll be a thousand It?ll be a thousand  Okay. (0V)

told him I?m good for six hundred now, you need to pay him four hundred?
Yeah.

Some  does that work?

Yeah, yeah and that?s?mz?u(OV)

So we don?t have to  we don?t have to have a made up transaction between
source and you before then. (0V)

Right. sure- (0V)

It?s just he committed six hundred. You?re good with that because of you guys
relationship, but SAMI needs to pay the other four.

Right. I think ifhe says its thousand I?m ?ne, you know. so  um  .

told him c. M, e?s gonna  that I told him that he?s gonna give four
hundred and [Ul] the other six, that I?ve got six and that they can sit there and
hash it out however they want, but like dude I?m getting paid four hundred
dollars. I?m going to take my entire paycheck that I?m getting away from me, you
andl  you know whateverit  (0V)

 
 

You still have ninety for gas.  (0V)

Yeah, whatever they hash out, whatever they hash out between them. (0V)
That would be like the just right so he?s squeaking by. .
If it ends up, if it ends up you know that. . .. (0V)

It also shows good intent  every  he was willing to cough up almost his entire
paycheck to get this thing going. (0V)

?agenda

We can talk we can talk about his whole paycheck. Then, we can talk aboui 
you know - .. three hundred dollars or whatever it is they can the two of them can
square that away and then, you know  (pause)

7

 

RW:

JC:
RW:
JC:

RW:
JC:

RW:

JB:
RW:

RW:

RW:
JB:
RW:
.18:
JC:
RW:

UCE:

JC:

Well, we?ve got to square it away just I know  I know what you?re saying, but
he can?t go any lower than three. I think for that it?s kind of (0V)

And I don?t think they?ll be a problem with that.
Yeah

When we talked to the source this morning he said the only reason he?s showing
up is because of you  you know and that business being an avenue . .. (0V)

It (U1) Mes your money for him.

Just access  access  (0V) Yeah. He thinks he doesn?t even care about the
money. It?s just you know  I?m sure the money is good, but  (0V)

seethe .13
give him ??eads up before we call RALPH and tell RALPH about it.

Think about your Option of RALPH will be (U1) direct (0V)

Oh, I can . .. yeah, if we can do one direct SVTC, yeah we can do that too: Urn,
but we want to tell STEVE ?rst (0V)

Yeah absolutely I want  I want to tell  He'sjust been saying when he
wants to go before the four ?fteen, should I set, say maybe three thirty or three
forty ?ve at the latest?

We can probably do it in twenty minutes. We need to go up and see the boss.
Okay, okay.

And say we?re gonna SVTC with CTD one last time at three thirty

Right.

So we want to give you the heads up.

Perfect, yeah that?s great.

Alrigth got the thing pulled up, prayer times, we?ll look 

Yeah.

 one something.

 

Yeah, I think  the thing is  the rest ofthe prayers are pretty close all the way
to Isha which is seven thirty so maybe a?er Isha would be the easiest thing unless



RW:

UCE:

JC:

you want to meet him right before and like you all on the ?y StOp and pray
somewhere. Um . ., but that?s something to consider and then ?gure out 
(0V)

You comfortable praying with him?


Well, the biggest thing is to ?gure out where you want to meet so that you know
cause the source is gonna tell him, talk to him and this is where usually meet him
at this time a

We?ll be in the FIG room right?

Yep. (background conversation UIcan work on the prayer time and everything.
Who?

(background conversations) (U l)

(background conversations) (UI)

He didn?t say he  did he was hejust blowing smoke or did he he
didn?t say he actually met with somebody back when he ?rst got and
that can?t be con?rmed he did or didn?t. (0V)

He was in the area where he said he was.
Right. right, right
(L1)

  





he 

Yeah, oh yeah,  he said he wants 

7

 

UCE
CHcomes out

ve a you know, on the corner, he is
coming out, you know I?m still looking for a handgun, handguns are a little bit
warder to get because they?re all 

Do you give him a handgun?

Right.

Handgunwillbe  
who wants the handgun for? It is pre  pre anything

Right.

Just to have one  (0V)
Well you can talk that up, butjust in terms (0V)

l?mnotgivinghimahandgun (0V)

Right and I understand it. I understand it. The focus is now  is between andjust
talking about how your saying the source saying, ?I?ll give him six hundred,
you?re gonna give him four hundred? and then you come and saying, need a
deposit you know take the six hundred that-that the source (0V)

?1 know where he?s going.

Take the six hundred the source gives me to start the thing, um  I?ve got some
shit I?ve got to do with my car. I?ve got  you know I?m gonna to keep this four
hundred  I?ll keep (U delivery. You need your

deposit.
Right.

You need your deposit, the four, six hundred if the source goes to him saying 
(0V)

He?s gonna try to talk me out of that four hundred dollars?

What I?m saying is the source, how the source states, you now you give him four
hundred I?ll square the other six hundred. (0V)

H)

TR:

CH:
TR:
CH:

CH:
TR:

CH:

UCE

CH:
TR:
CH:

You know because if 1' 15:?

So, the two keys are; one: the source has to make it absolutely clear he doesn?t
have any extra money.

Right at this time I have no extra money. (0V)
(0V) and (U1) the second key is  (0V)

we?ll work on this.

. .. taking anything less than a thousand  (0V)
Right.

 and the only place that any extra money is coming off the table is from our


Right.

So, either you?re not getting anything  I?m not getting started or you?re giving
me four hundred bucks. I mean, 

If I ?m not taking it out of my pocket.
The hard  (0V)

l?m not taking it out my pocket and I?m not taking it out of his pocket. If you
want to keep us out, you give me four hundred dollars to start this process, good
faith you know deposit?

 

    

i

 

"the somcmsaying I have six

hundred dollars to give  (O) I I,
The weak link is the source because he, he.
Right.

Because he, he has a hard time being direct.
Right.

And, and.

So if he feels that he?s already given you the six hundred dollars or he has the six
hundred dollars and he?s already said yeah my brother will take care of it. He?s
already said, he?s already said my brother will take care of it so when it comes



down to the deposit we want to get the cash out of pocket so he can?t
go to that drug dealer if he?s met one and purchase a handgun because you didn?t
provide him with one timely enough

 

   

CH: Timely enough.
CH: Oryou can?t gethimagunsohe?s like??
   ?g -. my;  we?ve already taken care ofthat, he?s already said he?ll
give you six hundred dollars so the brother will give you six hundred dollars.
TR: His response then is that?s not enough, I need a grand to get started
CH: Right.
 Well that?s whenhe could say well okay then maybe I don?t need all that stu??,

downgrade me to the next level of junk.

 

 Well that?s what I mean (IA)
We've already taken away your Uzi, we?ve already, I mean that?s.
UCE That?s another problem. 
TR: Otherwise Emma

CH:  Wwe Want

to get that cash from him. dollars
I . I. .

 
    

. 35:39 am:

 

.  .811th

\7-2

 

NN: That?s what, I mean he wanted to know if its (Un?t:  @3139in to give me 

TR: I) Right there, there?s the di?erence, right there is you shoot it up.

I5 

TR:

 

. (U0 because, 
(IA voices all talking at once)

 

 

TR: Okzly here you go, FRANK, you?ve worked all week. Here?s your ?ve dollars.
You can do whatever you want with that ?ve dollars.
CF:  dollars, 
an Men STEVE . . .
UCE: (U1) got ?ve dollars 
EFL  i
UM3: (UI)

extension one one one eight)

CH: Right, right, right, right$223kUCE:
CH: 1, I understand. Now, now (U1) I (U1) what you?re saying (UI)
CH:  bar-mime havesixmdxed packs 

(Ui)
.: . 



 

Lfl?.? 

CHE 
(IA voices talking in background)
     ammth i

 

why (U1).
TR: Every Single  one ofthat six hundred (UIabsolutely positively a U1) probably not (U1)
(IA voices in background)

 (holiday. Mpnd'ayo?i comm, I ?m not sure (IA)
UF: (IA) It takes two days to drive here, right?
 Right.
 Two or three days and so two or three days to get back and you?re already, you?re
out of pocket.
TR But givmg the money for domg the work. The guy has earned the money Once

\f

 

CH:
TR:
CF:

CF:
TR:

UM3:

TR:

TR:
TR:

CH:

UM4:

UCE:

(U1)
And that?s the point.

Talking about before what we were saying last night (Ul) he works for a week
he?s gonna make like three or four hundred dollars. 

?m gonna work.

Yeah that?s what we?re, tomorrow who?s going to pay (Ul) we?re gonna say four
hundred bucks.

(U1)

Absolutely, it doesn?t matter. See you?re not listening STEVE. Yeah he?s working
for the store because.

We?re telling the source to let him go.

Absolutely, no doubt but once the source gets the money, it?s his money. He can
choose to do whatever he wants with it, that?s the point. Once it?s in his pocket he
can say l?m gonna go buy hamburgersan nobody is
forcing him to.

     

Reall) 
UT)
(1A voices in background)

He can part with that money, it?s no longer his (IA) all day long, it?s his, it?s his.
He can do whatever he wants. And he?s sitting there with four hundred dollars in
his pocket. . . piece of shit broke down last week (IA)

(lA voices talking simultaneously in background)

Once. once he gives it to him it?s his money whether we orchestrated it or not, it's
still his money even though he?s got (IA). .

Um this guy here, new guy.
Oh yeah the lawyer.

The new guy, you were, you were with the bomb techs and some of us earlier we
were looking at this um hand grenade thing, right? They can make some han
grenades that are somewhat functional and kind of show 

1 la

 

 

UCE:

TR:

UCE:

TR:

UCE:

UCE:

UCE:

TR:
UCE

UCE

?M.M1fthat
. sue: *3 
. ..

kind of show him how to do that, how to use ngtand everything
and have a demonstration (U1)

happened to me, I, I don?t know  the otherWhy?

me do one, I would say let him see it go off.

Why don?t we, why don?t we do that? And then deliver it like you know and like
we got you that or something like that, we can deliver we got you that but point
out two basic points. We got two basic, we got two basic even like two days
before and if we deliver like three days after.

Like two little ones we can try out

Yeah, this is how it works, take it and throw it, okay that?s how it works, right?
Well now you know how the grenades work. This is so guns work this way, you
know this is it, this one here, um this is how you load and unload it. I?m not
bringing a live gun to you. basically cause I don't trust you that you?re going to
pull steal my shit if I give you a loaded gun.

I?ve got two grenades and a gun and if you leave I?ve got nothing and I?m dead.

Right, exactly so this is why you bring a non functional gun, this gun doesn?t
function. This is how it works. The gun works this way. This is how you quick re-
load the magazines, you know. This is the grenade. The grenade goes this?way.
Bring a, bring a um bring a the trimmer magazine mechanism for, the trigger
mechanism for the explosive, for the bomb. This is how you load it up and how
everything works, you know.

Yeah.

The battery, the battery goes in here. The switch goes this way. This is how-it all
works.

Speaking of which.
Now you know how everything works.

I?m ?nished then I have something to talk about.

i 7

(IA voices in background)

 

UCE You know how everything works. This is how everything works, right? Now you
know how everything works. Load it the car, take you home and in three days I?m
gonnamyou so I don?t have to put the locks up on you and show you
how it works. I?ll deliver it to you, hand it!? to you. gigg?'?lot of stuff,

here?s everything. I got my money?d~

 

(IA voice in background)
(End of Session 16)

UCE:

CH:

UCE:

CH:

LF:

SD:

CF:
SD:

LF:
SD:

UCE:

SD:

UCE:

SD:
CF:
SD:

Session 17(1203/201 l) (00:22:51)
I like all that but I mean I would still have the other vest for the take down.

I don?t think he's gonna have a vest put on him, I can show him how to wear it
but think, I think he?s gonna take it 015'. .

I think. who is gonna put it on.
You think he?s going to put it on and go?
think, think he?s gonna put it on.

l, 
practice session cause he?ll think he?s gonna be caught if we practice. He?llthink
the ?tckin? spy satellites will see. Which, which 

Oh, that?s mic. I didn?t think of that.
I mean, 1 don?t know but that, that?s one concern. I mean I.


.-

And that?s okay.

He would stillgetinpamdisebecause it?sextmsecure. 
the vest on and just go.

i would like 

you know, as soon as,



as soon as he gets it.

1 think so too.

And that?s why..

I, I, i think he?ll do it you know?

lfhe?s stopped and killed in a traf?c stop it doesn?t matter he?s still going to
paradise. 80..

We talked about it yesterday.

SD:
LF:
SD:

UCE:

CH:

UCE:

he said [Ul] he?s extremely..
Huh?


Yesterday or the day before we talked about ah, ah.. upstairs, Kerry Myers said
it?s not practical, put the battery into something in there. It?s not so much, the time
What about, okay that?s not possible, what about once you put the batteries
in, if you take them out and they are, you?re gonna fuckin? blow up. This is, i
mean, oncethis thingisarmedyoutryanddisann it,you gotaprettygoodchanee
of blowin? yourself up.

Yeah, I mean you can?t.
But what ifthey are tryin? to prep..
Like ?ea market city in Webster.

in a situation where if you arm this thing you?ve got to use it or you?re ?icked.
Either it?s not gonna work, or it?s gonna go off one way or the other and so one of
the onceheputs inthe battery, sucks
thejuice down, and he has a limited amount oftime beforehe has to push the
button and die or shoot somebody. Ken-y Myers said well it doesn?t work that
way. The circuit isn?t bumin' it?s juice until you push the button. That is pretty
common sense Okay, ?ne. But what about once you put the batteriesin and
connect the switch, connect everything together. If you pull it apart, anybody
who?s kinda hooked there, the, the batteries on a battery cable or plugged
something into an arch, youjerk the cord out ofa wall thatarc could detonate the
device. Dangerous to pull it apart, you pull this thing 890?, once you, that?s it
man. You pull it apart and it?s, dang near as good as pushin? the button. And a
huge risk, it makes him think, once he plugs it in he?s committed it and if he
believes it, that shows his intent. If you ?re ready, once we do this we?re not takin?
this thing off. Th, th, that?sjust ah..

voices in background]

Okay, yeah, that would be great. l?d wanna see it, once you get back there. 
would..accidentally.. I might have issues; 1 might have issues with that.

Well his property, there is plenty of places to go [Ul] instead of a tree stand?

sniper?
That?s de?nitely what I heard ah Alfonso talking about yesterday at lunch.

9/

UM:

CH:

SD:

CH:

CF:

NN:
CF:

CF:
CH:
CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:

UCE:

CF:
CH:

Lmean.. .
Oh yeah so.
There is one way in, and one way out.

He was throwing out the idea of wanting to well. No he didn?t say exactly
that but.

Yeah.

I think he said that Rich said something about it, that is probably
American Middle East drug companies

I gotta live with these guys.

[Low audio]

Well what do they do for that explosive [um Did they have any kind oftraining
for us to View 

No but is aware ofthatand they drove to the place and he actually pushed a
buuon to initiate the device. You kind of meant it, once you push that little red
button, you mean. . .and that?s what everybody was talking about.

How many years? What did he get?

I don ?t know. . . talk to Miller about that.

voices in background]

no, no its not, that right. That?s right.



You going to have recordings tonight? CHS, you gonna go?[Ul]

I don?t know. I don?t really want 

You mother fuckers keep giving him a device. We gotta keep transcribing so.




1 think, I think you pulled it better than me actually because 

3

I see a lot of Ricky Martin.

UCE:

UCE:

CH:

CF:

CF:

SD:
CF:

CF:

NE:

CH:

NE:

NE:

NE:

NE:

Ricky Martin, ah, you know what, yeah.

Oh my God, yeah.

You?re actually, you?ve actually got a point there 

Damn.

voices]

You canrock itbetterthanlcan. Doyousee?tathappening? Lasttwonights??]

[Laughter in background, IA voices]

Nobody can say that okay you don?t put a suicide vest on unless you fucking
mean the shit.

Or you drank a lot of whiskey.
Well that was one, two times so.
[Ul]

[Background voices]

Oh you?re going to the hot tower.
How do I know this and you don?t?
[Background voices]

Are they doing SVCT ?om headquarters?
Yes they are.

They?re dialing in from upstairs?
No they?re coming down.

Oh okay good. So they?ll be in that conference room cause we're just going?to
keep them on the line for a couple of minutes?

Yes.

Okay sounds good, thank you.
I think he knew that they were.
0h Bienkowski.



UCE:

NE:

NE:

NE:
JC:

JC:

JC:

JC:

UCE:

JC:

UCE:

JC:

UCE:

SD:
CF:

There you go.

Yeah whatever you say.

Thank you, thank you Taylor.

What am I chopped liver?



This won?t even bother.

lithink l'm going to write you guys a guide. 
Did you ever talk to Jenny Smith 

No, I?m trying to get a hold of what?s her name 
What about Ryan Hatch?

What about him?

Somebody at ITOS knows him.

[Background voices]

Did we talk anymore about the meeting location.
Negative.

That?s what I?m asking. That?s what we?ve been sitting here trying to
brainstorm on how we're going to do that. We?re going to give him the grenades,
you know and take him to a low ?eld and show him how it works.

Yup.

Blow a few of them, give him, show him how a gun works, you know and um and
um send him on his way 

Good idea. You can send him likejust a couple of grenades and have fun with
them 

We're gonna do, we?ve gonna, we?ve got a video tape that.
live ones.

Yeah. [Chuckles]



UCE:

1C:
CF 

JC:

CF:
JC:

UCE:

CF:

CF:

UCE:

PM:

UCE:

CF:
PM:

You?re laughing like, you?re laughing we?re joking. Do you see a smile on my
face? I am dead serious.

I?ve never, I?ve never seen a smile on your face. 


[Background conversation]

1] Button down shirt.

My, my CHS was called my Amir this moming. Amir wants a thousand dollars
down payment. I only pay six hundred dollars. You need to pay him fotu' hundred
dollars. pay him 

Okay and everyone is cool with that 

Right okay so that?s what we?[Ul] Like everybody else let's get this shit over with and get 
Get this out of my division. [Chuckles] Out of my division.

As long as you get me my press release. As long as you get me mypress release


[lA voices]

do you remember looking award shows, backgrounds 
[Ul] i don?t want to play anymore, get it done and get it done now.
Alternatively, take the six hundred dollars and ?y out of here Sami.
Hey, You like me. I

I do.

But you don?t like him.

But you don?t give her any paper that?s all messed up.

Exactly [Ul]

[Ul] he doesn?t give me any paper.



PM:
CF:
PM:

CF:

Exactly and so it?s never messed up.

[Ul] page I7 is done and they said that was pretty 
Oh yeah you told me and then walked with it 
Did 



1 can any about twenty ?ve pounds, I used to carry like twelve, that was my
favorite, when he talked how he used to carry twelve pounds, damn man 

I did a lot of [Ul] stuff in there. Can you guys get that worked out?
We?ll get it worked out.

Or are you very busy getting ready to go?

Or English.

Hi Sara this is Taylor.

We, we need to ?gure out where you?re meeting and what time.

Well what do you know? How handy is that?

Tomorrow, not today?

It?s going pretty well. Urn we had a really good teleconference um I think
. .

voices talking simultaneously]

. . . just so you can know it?s goingto be at ah UCE will have total, the CH8 I
need one thousand dollars down payment The CHS is going to tell Sam, and
the target that UCE needs a thousand dollars. 1 told him I have been struggling, I
came up with six hundred they?re going to have to come up with the rest. The
target will havejust been paid a bit more than that he?ll eam this week. He?ll have
it in his pocket. It?s his money. He can do whatever he wants and then.late_r in the
day UCE is going to show up for this meeting and while the UCE and target are
together alone the UCE is going to say look, he says you?re going to give me so
much money and you?re going to come up with the other four hundred or you
know we?ll have to wait [Ul]

[Simultaneous conversation]

'7

CF 



JC:

UM4:

UF:

CF:
SD:

fomorrow, tomorrow. We haven?t determined, we?ve got an issue with a 
that?s a big deal for the target. He doesn?t always show up for work early ahd 
befoxethatbutourgoal 
We?vejust got to 

Onemorcthing 
CHS 

And I explained well we?ve got the looks like we?ve just talked to her so


[Simultaneous conversation]

Well which, whichever one you know. She was actually at the SVTC today, but
she was actually at Do you have that number? I, okay.

So we were at this training last week that was it. Well not many people 
Terri?c um let?s see, Bobby O?Neill should come to the SVTC 

Oneofthe 
was like okay you know, how did you go about getting yourjob here. We all had
to go on-line part of the process. You guys we all like turn around and
like 

[Simultaneous conversation]

Is that the thing where they were talking about a change.

Right. right. right

[Simultaneous conversation]

You don?t have the, but either way you still had to go on-line and 

Yeah, yeah and Chris Hileman should be hue and not to. He?s great, Chris
Johnson 

I?m not a tech guy.
Oh, oh cause I am? Actually I might as well apply for it at this point.

you have all these things around you so that makes you more ofa tech? guy
than me. Or: why didn?t you see the credit card?



CFSD:
CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:

Alright, oh we?ve still got to get I guess we don?t

really have to but.
No cause it can stay in for the next.

Yeah actually you know what yeah it can so fucking leave it. Yeah, why don?tl
take this out?



Okay you need, you need the charger, right?
Yeah I need the charger.

You have, you have one of mese at home, right?
No, l'll take that thing too.

You don't? You don?t have this at home?

No its.

You don?t have a home charger? That's for your blackberry.
Oh it?s one; it?s one that ?ts my blackben'y?
Yeah, yes.

Yeah I should, yeah.

Okaycause I need toputthis backout. This is Terry Rawls? thatlstolesothat
goes in there. All you need to do is plug that in there.

Al?sht. yeah.

And you?re good.

I know how it works.

Okay. 

Alright.

And they you?ve got one for the - too?

i do not have a - charger.
[Background noise]

CF:

SD:
CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:
CF:

JC:

JC:

This is the older blackberry one, you know it?s thicker and everything like that so
this one goes like that.

But that?s the one that we charge our new blackberries on?
Yes.

Well actually here.

Yes this is the one you have your, see, your blackberry is charged on this one.
\ieah see if it will fit.

Yeah it will. Yeah that?s, that?s our new blackberry one.
Okay.

But that?s the old kind so yeah you don?t, use the thick one.
Alright.

So, so this goes for-

Alright.

And that one goes for 

[Background noise and IA voices in background]

Yes 
isprobablynornorethan?A] lthinkso. 
what you said thatthe more good conversations wehave, the more intense and if
We can get him, you know reaching into his own pocket and take that to money to
you know walk into the source. He wants to go ?x his carand he wants to I
mean it?s his money. Once it?s in his pocket and he earned it, he can do whatever
hewants.

voices in background]
I mean think it sounds good.
Right.

1 don?t think he?ll ever go for it, because, as controlled an environment as it is
explosives and live weapons [Ul]

JC:

UCE:

JC:
CH:
JC:
CH:

1C:
TR:

Yeah, yeah and l, and that?s a really good idea We mentioned tl'nt language [Ul]
yeah and he, he did get a good I think he did good a so something 

No but they don?t care though, it?s, it?s not like [lA] they don?t, they don?t care
about if he 

Yes that?s not the problem. The problem [Ul]

veah, yeah, yeah.

if. if.

Right.

So what if 

Yeah exactly, yeah.

Oh, but I?ve got a friend in Knoxville division [Ul]

That?s exactly what bothers him is we can get back out there 
voices talking simultaneously in background]

Yeah, he did in fact we, we were scrambling to get there on time. He was already
in there and all the charges that he was mentioning. think were things that 
and then and then when, when. the Asac was 

(End of session 17)



Abbreviations:

(SC) Simultaneous conVersation
(0V) Overlapping voices

(IA) Inaudible

Transcriber?s notes

Session 20 (Bac)<ground noise and IA voices in background)
(muf?ed background conversation)

UM: (IAclicking noise).

(mu??led background conversation)
(noises)
UF: (IA) water?
um: [laughs]. 
UF: (IA) the only thing is that (IA) this.
(IA) this (IA) water?
UF: I need a signature on (IA).
UFI: Really? Yes! (laughs). (IA).
UP: I promise.
UFI: (laughs).
UF2: 
UP I: (IA) question-
(muffled background conversation)
UF 1: (laughs).
UF: Let me get (IA):

UFI:

UF:

UFI:

UF:

UF:

UM:
UFI:

UF:

UM:

UF:

UM:

UF:

UM:

UM:

(laughs).

(simultaneous inaudible conversation).
(IA) want you to 

(laughs).

(IA) the RA (IA).

(muf?ed background conversation)
(IA) waiting for you to go and wear it-
(IA).

(laughs).

(IA).

(inuffled background conversation)
I?m smarterthan either of (IA)
(mu?'led background conversation)
You might 



-him and . . . Did I even really 
aA>~

drive. Yes!

(IA) like 

(IA) gonna, take my (IA) and go away.
(mu?'led  conversation)
(background noises)

(caughing)

(sneezing)

(IA). (muf?ed voice)

0/

(Overhead page: JAY BENKOWSKI please dial three, zero, zero, one. JAY
BENKOWSKI, three, zero, zero, one.)

(Background noise voices in background)

UM: (IA) used to 
UF: (IA) same (IA).

(muf?ed background conversation)

(background noises) 
UP: I like to point (1A).

(mu?ied background conversation)
UF: One (IA).

(muf?ed background conversation)
UP: I need (IA).

(knocking noise)

(muf?ed background conversation)
UF: (IA).
UF3: Uh . . . Ididn?t!
UF: When you (IA). (IA) get you (IA).
UF2: Umm, couldn?t you (IA) so?er?
UM: (IA). .

(possibly typing noises)

(noises)
UF: (IA).
UM: (IA).

(muf?ed background conversation)
UF: Uh, (IA). Jake!

3

UF:
UF 1 
UM:

UF:

UF:

UF:

UF:

UM:
UP:
UM:
UF:
UFI:
SD:
UM:

UMI:
UM3:

(muffled backgnound conversation)

Yeah, (IA).

(IA). How you doing?

(IA), (IA), supposed to.

(muf?ed background conversation)

Yeah, (IA) writing this novel.

 now, no, no, for the Iove of God.

Hey, (IA).

(simultaneous inaudible conversation)

(IA).

(noises)

(IA).

I (IA) from.

(muf?ed background conversation)

(IA).

I have one.

(IA) again?

Yeah, (IA).



We?re gonna have you pull resources to (IA) now.
I had 

(muf?ed simultaneous conversations)

Yes, (IA) we?re trying to settle (IA) and the best 
It doesn?t matter. If (IA) closed this thing 

?1

-Exactly!~

UM4: 

UFZ: (IA) called (IA).
UM3: (IA).
UF 1: Did you see 
UMZ: It is (IA).
UP: I don?t (IA).
(mu?led background conversation)
UM: (IA).
UF: (IA).

(muf?ed background 

JC: Howdy, howdy.
UF: Hi.
(Background noise IA voices in background)
SD: Trying to set it up now and the best news I heard all day (IA)
(IA voices in background)
CF: It?s absolume right.
TR: Those are not at a forty-?ve degree angle.
JC: Do you anticipate any emergency NSLs 
UFI: No, (IA).
UMI: (IA) Jim (PH) (IA).
(banging noise)
UM2: (IA).
UF: (IA) will come (IA) that.
CF: (U I)
UF: Wow, what just. happened?



UF:
UF2voices)

Wow, listen to that. She knows how to address (IA)
(Laughs) (U1) He?ll be here watching over us though.
(Laughs) (U1)

(1A voices)

Are you guys pretty sun that nothing is going to go on tonight, the meet will be
tomorrow?

CHS recording tonight is going to be recovered. We just discussed that.

From the stuff off the printer (U1)
You know earlier.

l've got to call KENNY.

Earlier.

'l?hank you.

Earlier, like ten minutes ago we said, ?Man, we shouldn?t do this today,? and
Chris Franck said, ?Yeah, we should. I?ve got to have something to harass Pat
with.?

Exactly, it?s like you know what some of these nights aren?t mined quite yet so.

You ass. No was just gonna let Tammy Kraszka take the night off because she?s
so, so tired.

She likes ovenime.



A-and a. What?sa-I
A-is similar to, eh . ..



It?s a that is sirnilar to



UF3:

CF:

UF3:

CF:
PM:
CF:
PM:

CF:
PM:
CF:
PM:
CF:
PM:

CF:

PM:

CF:

PM:
CF:

PM:

How can the-and the-not meet up?

They do, but - is something like this . . .

Uhum.

And he just kind oflike - or something and then you 
And the -

Yeah, exactly. So essentially it?s the same thing.

on, so they don?t have to be in the car? Now last night, were last night-and

Yes last night was 

On the 

0n the CH8 (banging noise) and then you had?he had 
Then how does it go on and off?

They do?em straight?

How did we end up with seven sessions?

(muf?ed background conversation)

I think it?s, either, either he clicks it on and on or it just automatically does that
cause I, l?ve done UC recordings where itjust cuts o?'a?er a certain point and
then it starts a new session.

Because we can?t match it up. We have two hours on 
(muf?ed background conversation)

Yeah, yeah. It?s all on the device (SC) 

And the - has eight sessions.

it?s the device. The device will hold, what, I don?t know how it does it but it will
just say okay this session?s ended, a new session starts.

(inuf?ed background conversation)
Okay, okay.

7

CF:

PM:

CF:

PM:

PM:
NN:
PM:

PM:

PM:

PM:

PM:

Some, 1 mean when it, obviously when it?s shut on and off then it?s um then tlnt?s
obviously it starts off with a new session.

(laughs)-
Right.

SC) sometimes it willjust cut it off maybe if it?s been going for like an hour, two
hours, it automatically cuts off when 

Well, like one of them you hear him say, ?Twenty ?rst, two thousand eleven.?
You don?t hear the beginning but then you get ?ve seconds on one of them?and it
says this is Special Agent.

(1A voices in background talking simultaneously)

Right, honestly. from what I?ve heard of how these devices work or I?ve actually
watched someone do them, it?s usually they tum them on say that they?re starting
the recording.

Right.

And then they say.

They do a preamble.

(IA) Right and then they do one at the end.

Right, right that I?ve seen.

And then they shut it off. So wouldn?t it be the same way like cause you know
how all of sudden you realize okay there?s nothing going on and wouldn?t be shut
off?

Well, this is weird. They?re ?ve seconds worth.

Well sometimes you, wouldn?t you turn it on thinking that you might have 
something and you don?t?

I don?t know if you have two things.

But if you have to do the preamble I don?t what, how about that but I know I?ve
gone to make a call and he turned it on, did the preamble.

Right.

{7

PM:

PM:
CF:
PM:

JC:

PM:

JC:

PM:

JC:

PM:

JC:

PM:

JC:

PM:

And then alternate it, pick up the phone when you try calling him then he?s like
alright pick up the phone and then he had to end it or whatever but 1 don?t, you
know, I don?t know how that works. 'lhat?s the only thing can, I don?t (1A).

1 know. It just doesn?t make sense why they?re not, this one?s not ?tting because
we?ve been able to pick it up, all the others.

ls somebody wearing something or 

(IA voices in background talking simultaneously)

1 was going to say (Ul) he?s the messenger. Like all of a sudden (UI)
Yeah exactly, exactly. Any idea how 

I just, rough estimate is be back, back here by seven so (IA)

Eight or nine? Okay.

(IA voices)

Doyou recall Sara Sweeney lookingatsome ofthe tech cuts? And wantingtoget
some stu?? from Miami? Red wolf or whatever?

I?ve got em.

Has anyone started on the transcripts?

Just, just Tuesday morning. Were you able to start on the 
Tiger one, the one that.

Red tiger one. We haven?t gotten very far on that?

Yeah.

But the total of all four (UI)

Okay.

We have JEFF SHULER right now and got stuff(Ul) from Miami. We
were having a little trouble making it ?t our equipment, making if compatible. 1
have a list ofeverything (U1) so whatever you need. "Ibey, I told them the way 
as long as they were all done, incorporated (Ul) before she came back
because there won?t be any more tech cuts until she comes back, right? Cause
she?s the one (U1)

7

NN: Well not that for me it probably (Ul) a big deal because I have had work holidays.
CF: Yeah.
NN: (Unstu?'where it?skindofabigdealwl).

CF: No it?s. ..it?s expensive uhm it was just nobody saw it coming so that?s why. If it was
like expected like hey sorry I?m not going to be home but I had to make a phone call like a
couple days before I wasn?t cause my dad?s like hey still coming home on the And like
it?s like the I?m like no and Phi not coming home at all.

NN: (Ul) might get any money back from ?ying?
CF: No they just credit, 1 mean have a credit.
NN: Oh that?s good. Cause usually you know how it is, it?s like.

CF: Yeah, no give you a credit uhm it?s good for like a year which I?ll use it in a
year.

NN: Yeah you will 
CF: So.

CF: Yeah. . .yeah technically. As long as you..you average two hours a day then it?s fine.
Like you don?t have to work avp every single day. Like right now all of us have worked
probably enough avp for the next like three months. So in theory we can'just work our eight
hours for the next tlu'ee months, Don?t get me wrong that?s probably what alter this is done then
yeah.

NN: That. ..that is more and bene?cial because we need you now. Every it?s not
always like that.

CF: That brings me back to the whole availability cause guess what I haven?t pulled anything
less than a 12 hour day in like well except there?s like the weekends and stufflike that
it?ll be like ?ve or six hours. 

NN: Right.

CF: Either way that?s.. .that?s an average. Now I don?t need to sit here two extra hours when
have nothing going on that's it. big boy rules and the reason, I think the reason we do

1 

U.S. v. Osmakac, Case No. 

Exhibit 1 to Government?s Motion in Umlne Regarding Overhear Recordings

FILED UNDER SEAL

Trangrigt from mmger 24. 201;

SD: Yep, just walked in the door.

UF: Alright, thanks.

SD: Alright, thanks. Bye.
Hello.

MA: Hi man. So what have we got? Two of em?

SD: Yes.

MA: Okay. Two is better than three.

SD: Yes.

MA: Okay. Alright, was starting to fill them out. Oh, let?s see. Alright. [lnaudible] Here. .
uhh. . . case agent, consensual, body recorder. Intercept date is today?

SD: Yeah. Yep.

MA: 12/24/11. Tampa, Florida. It will be downloaded today. Okay.

(Phone rings)

SD: Hey.

(inaudible voice on other end of phone)

 

 

 

 

.sojust

alright,go_od to know. okay, very

 

 

SD: 5, Oh, okay. Uh huh. Oh. Okay. We won?t, yeah, okay,
cool. Okay, I will let you know. Alright, have a good night. Bye.
MA: Man I thought this was already..l thought yesterdavs recordings sealed the deal.
SD: Yesterday, which one?
MA: The cash and the video and all that.
Oh, with the CH5.
MA: Yeah.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

SD: Or with the UC you mean?

MA: Yeah.

SD: Day before yesterday?

MA: Yeah. yeah.

SD: nah, well, not quite.

MA: Not quite.

SD: Yeah. ldon?t know actually. it looked pretty good. Actually, no, 

MA: They need a little bit more?

SD: Yeah, and they're still . .. Part of the problem is they want to catch him in the act. The attorneys 
do and stuff, but the problem is you can't show up at a night club with an AK 47 in the middle of 
a night club and pretend to start shooting people, or i mean people 

MA: Right.

SD:  would get killed just a stampede just to get away from him.

MA: Right.

SD:  so it?s not. Alright what do i need to sign?

MAS Print. Print. Signature. Let?s Yeah. lt?s going to be recovery of recorder is the reason.

SD: For accepted custody.

MA: Yeah.

SD: Alright.

Inaudlble

SD: What time do you want to  

MA: uhh..what 

SD: Okay.

MA: Well, what time you accepted it here?

SD: 1710.

MA: Okay, and yeah.

SDdon?t.

Okay. Then just put his name on there. We?ll get the number.

i know we?ve got it. Oh here it is right here.

So intercept date.

23317. 23317. SamiOsmakac.

That?s below the 5 number?

Yeah. Just do it like that, it?s fine.

Okay.

2 11. Okay. i think that?s . . . think you?ve got everything.
Okay

I think you got everything. l?ll ?ll that time in once i download them.
Alright, there you go.

And you?re going to need wave copies and all of that stuff, right?
Yeah, whatever you guys normally do.

Whatever we . . . the normal thing? Okay.

Yup.

Who was the person on call for that? The steno person? Pat here or??
i have no idea.

[inaudible] will know. Okay.

 

 

 

 

Okay, alright, we?ll get it rolling.

What else do you need?

No. l?m going to get this knocked out so I can go.
Alright.

That's it man. l?ll make you. . .

SD: Once you do the copies . . .

MA: Yeah, I'll make four capies for you and one copy for whoever the person is going to be and that
one copy will be in the wave format.

SD: Okay, Okay.

MA: So . . .

SD: Alright.

MA: It?s probably going to be an hour or so.

SD: Alright. i can . . . l'll wait there?s . . . that way we can . . . that way you can give them to me and i
can. . .

MA: Right, okay. [inaudible]

07:47 (Long break in conversation)
11:43 (Ul Background conversation starts)

SD: [dialogue is very faint in the background] (Ul) the guy (Ul) last night (Ul) lguess the ?nch (Ul) if
we haven?t erased it (Ul) they might be able to pull something up off it. But if it happens again (Ul) But
the good thing is the main thing we needed last night was (Ul) But Jake and were actually talking a?
it. if we can, after this is over, we?re gonna try to run (Ul) i think he's (Ul) natUral at it, and as long as 
didn't target any Palestinian we?d be ?ne.

CF: (Ul) person would have to testify (Ul) all over the place.
SD: I think he might. (Ul) something like that he could make some money on.
CF: (Ul) this thing goes to trial or not.

CF: What?s up buddy?

 

 

 

 

MA: Alright man, how you deing?
CF: Good, Good.
MA: (Ul) you know how long these are? Pretty long..meetings?

SD: No, honestly i don't we got there at probably probably 5 hours a 
roughly.

MA: Okay, we?ll have to put it on DVD.

CF: Oh no, Pat said something to Vic about one of the key fobs they were listening to with
the disk and it came up with something from before so maybe it wasn't completely erased, or something
like that.

SD: She said something about 
MA: I think she left me a message about 
CF: Yeah, 

MA: You know what l?m sometimes when you get a copy, if you like download it to the C:
drive it will list all of them, and sometimes you might click on the wrong thing, and i know we?ve got a
bunch of yours 

CF: Oh (Ul)

MA: it Yeah they might?ve clicked on that one and brought that one up and copied it
instead of clicking on the right thing.

CF: Sony to drag you in tonight 

MA: I had my sister call my was i?m going to get on the phone with her.
CF: 0h Shit..Mike what time did you get here?

MA: Right at 

CF: Okay

MA: it's working out alright.

SD: The big 

CF: Use your 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

$153" The big thing is last night he went to talk to 
CF: he broke up with 

SD: He said". he showed him the flag or something and said ?are you in or not? and Hodzic said 
need some time to think about it? and Sami is like "i need to know now" and Hodzic said give me some
time to think about it? and Sami said "if you're not in then you're The good thing though at least
hopefully, at least according to what Sami told  it?s good for and we can run this down
before the dumb he said in his he said he's got a bunch of boxes of
stolen stuff whenever they need cash Just go return it to apparently now he gave Sami
a video camera last night that he stole from best and now Sami's going to use 

6

CF: To make his video?

SD: Yeah and he?s already planning on what he?s going to he and the CH5 talked about
it today and the CH5 said Semi is going to start out about the (UI) are idiots because they are noti


CF: Dude I can't wait to see going to give that to the so dude what great
evidence is that shit 

SD: Yeah

CF: Holy When he shows up talking about how he can?t wait to die and commit this and
and shit like 

SD: Yeah we?ll make sure the CH5 asks for it 

CF: Yeah, fucking tell be like hey, if you need somebody, to you know distribute that or
something like i know just give it to me and VII take care of 

SD: He'll do 

CF: Either way, if we got our hands on say there is a pretty fair chance of that happening
if all this goes what

SD:  as long as he doesn?t give it to 
CF: Right they broke 

SD: not like said that-.he told the CH5 Hodzic is Still a good guy, he's just not
in the right place or something like Where Dennison I don?t know.

MA: is this what she?s been using?
CF: Yes.

MA: The black 

 

 

 

 

CF: no it?s the one with the Yeah, the yellow one.
MA: That?s not the right size though.
CF: Oh it's i thought there was another one. Should be over 

MA: I was saying i don't think is the She has this one here but This is the one i
that used last 

CF: That one doesn?t look like it?s going to ?t 
MA: No thatbecause I don?t see another 

7

MA: I was telling this is a little up okay, but these speakers are already
highlighted dark, so usually that doesn't happen until after l've downloaded so by looking at that it
makes me think that its already been downloaded they should be be like a white
speaker.

CF: well you already hooked it up right?
MA: i said we?ll just look at the date it might be acting a little
CF: What the fuck is going on?

MA: This is what is saying three hour and ?fteen, sixteen so we'll just let it roll
and see what we come up with. it?s just going to take longer to long

CF: And this is the ?nch that?s going on now?
MA: Yeah I went ahead and did its one WAV format and the other just be

CF: well you can make them all ifyOu?re just making one WAV like
if you're making the WAV copy, you can make them all WAV if you instead of just making
copy of the other and stuff like the only one that need to be I guess not WAV are the just
so we can have but there is no video on this so.. shit just make them all fuck save
you a step

MA: That will be we?ll do it all in one shot 

CF: Give me your 

SD: huh?
CF: Give me your 
SD: Why?

CF: You know 

 

 

50: 

CF: God damn 

SD: Because as soon as i send this l'm going to play it.
CF: God are you fucking kidding 

SD: What kind of phone do you have?

CF: Not one that has fucking angry birds on so why don't you give me your 

pU'poses.

Sessions: 1 of 7

Participants:



UF:

Umdentlfied male

Unidentified female

Translation Key:

 

 

 

 

Ul: Unmtelligible
lA; lnaudible

SC: Simultaneous Conversation

CF: Faster you click on. .

JAB: 

CF: Pretty frickin' cool, right?

JAB: Yeah.

CF: And then we used .or that. So it should be 5 recordings all total (Ul) CHS through UCE
CF: 
Beautiful.

CF: And that?s all we have.

JAB: Thank you.

CF. is right here.

MB. You are wonderful.

CF. Although they?re not quite of it ls.

And then we have the enhanced forjust the 

CF l'm sorry?

 

JAB: The enhanced copies..,.is it just the 

CF. me make was the- on 12/7 so that's the only
enhanced one that I have.

JAB: Whale been enhanced than that. But maybe that was-

CF: This is the only one that have.
JAB: (Ull
CF: I have no idea.

JAB. And the was the car ride. correct?
CF: 7?h 

JAB: lsn't that when they were in the car together? Or is that the situation or do
you not remember?

don't remember

You don?t have to remember.

CF: Ok I was going to save that.
JAB: (Ul)
CF: Oh my empty dip left (Ul) scraper and gum that?s not mine.

Aren't they mints? (Uli.
And then .
JAB: And no one that you know of has actual summaries of these other than just having 



They?re all verbatim transcripts.
JAB: True,
CF Do you you know where to find those?

Yeah they?re over at Pat's.
CF: Or you can get them on the.t..oh yeah, you don?t have access to the some.
JAB: Yeah don't have access to your Share drive.

CF: That's right.

 

 

 

 

JAB: I have Headquarters shared drive.
CF: Very well. 
And Newark's actually. Well, Newark loves me.

Well, maybe some day we will present to you the same amount of IOVE that Neward does. I
would think that probably not but 

Ha ha. I doubt it. Hey I can only handle so much anyway.

CF. Yeah that?s true.
JAB: Ha ha
CF. ldon't know I think you can probably handle more than you know.

JAB: Thank you. That is all needed.
CF: 0k

JAB: Um, and then I?ll just get with the transcripts to look at to look at the duration and like how long
these things were and 

CF: Ooh, and it?s ok 12/ 5.
JAB: You're a Ilar.

CF: I?m sorry. I knew I had different 12/ S, was the attempted one at the
Mosque and that's why we had recorder (UI). And, uh, and but we didn't get
anything ?cuz (Ul) with just sat in the car, remember? That?s when 

Is it really that long ago?
CF: 12/5.
JAB: Oh shit. Holy fuck monkey, that's that long ago, God why do 

CF: So that was, uh, so. you can put that on there, I mean it?s technically IDS is, uh, is a-e
had in his pocket. (UI).

JAB: Nothing came off of It.
CF Nothing is on 

ME: I shit, it was really that long ago. Well I've been here for 3 weeks now. I've
been here the entire month of December. I know.

CF: Enjoying this right?

 

 

 

JAB: Yeah actually. I've been having a blast. Haven't you? Haven't it been more fun since i showed
upthough?

CF: I'll give you that

JAB: Ha. Do you have like someone smiling in your office? 


CF For whatever reason, yeah. Well I give you all those, yeah. Alright. What are you working on


This,

CF: This?

And other timellne this is like my main tasking of the day.
CF. Let me know it you need anything. i mean 12/5 

No Maybe what I need (Ul) through the transcripts and get lUl} gist of which one wants which.
What's the matter now? What's wrong?

Um, one of the tech guys wants to replace the. he needs 
JAB: ok, know, it's ok. lt's ok.
CF: Oh I know it's ok. it?s Just one more thing to have to deal with right now.

JAB: 0k thank you. Hi let you get back to real work then.

CF: It?s not really 
Ha.
CF: Need anything else?

JAB. No. That is all I needed.
Give me a holler if you need anything right?
JAB Thank you darling.

CF: You're very welcome.

UF1: Pardon me.

JC: (Talking in background with someone else.) I mean talking to 

UCE: Good deal.

 

 

 

1C:



JC:



NN:

UCE:

CF:





TR:
try.

was.?

Um, hello.

hours or something like that.

You look so much like him.

They going to make you stick around all weekend 

Oh no. No, no.

Yeah so you say.

Oh no, no. no. We?ve been talking about that, be done and disappear in (M).
It you 

He blathered on for 5 minutes then one of us you mean? And then he?d blather onto

what y0u're saying? You?re trying to pull something out of him.

(SC).

UF3:

CF:

NN:

UCE:

NB:

NB:

CF:

JAB:

CF:

JAB:

CF.

JAB.

CF.

CF

Ha ha.

Hey Jaqueline?

Do they think it?s going to be good enough?

Don't know (lA)

What did you write on the 302?

He said the sky is turning green and there are mushrooms out there.

Jaqueline? Jaqueline? On the 20'" there was 

Liar. thought-n the .
-n the 

Thank you.

Yes maam.

You got what you needed.
(UI) jUSt a friend

You say l'm just a friend.

 

 

 

NN:



TR:

UM3:

CF:



NN:

CF:

CF:

NN:

CF:

ldon't say that, you say that.

Gosh well, you're not you friends You sut close, doesn?t mean you are close.
help him listen

Just benefits, not friends. (There are many overlapping conversations gomg on now)

Aah ok. But you say I?m just a friend. With you, you got what need. 

(Ul) little child bike home alone in the rain. Ha ha.

I know I get that all the time.

Out of your fucking mind.

Hey. Kenny IS looking for cover for- Shit. He?s trying to replace-

I did not want talk to anyone all day, was confinement.

Yeah. Oh. I don't know, hang on, I got to take this call man. hang on. Hey man. Hey 

let me call you back from a landline real quick, thanksUCE:

JC:



TR:

I wouldn't give my kid a gun and he doesn't deserve one either.

(Ul) gun before a long time take to school with him a long time before, 
That's true.

Yeah unfortunately tomorrow afternoon, it would be a long (UI).

(On phone.) Hey man how are you? literally talked to every single one of them.
(ln background.) Hey what is he talking about? Is he asking for this?

(On phone.) Yeah. .

Franckl

think it?s changed. The statutes that she had given 

Oh I don't pay attention to any of those.
I wouldn?t either.
(On phone.) Oh my

(in background.) I can print the statutes that Sarah gave us but based on where we are 

 

 

 

NN:

CF.

TR:

UM3.

CF:

UF1:

NN:

CF:



NN:

CF:

ldon't say that, you say that.

Gosh well, you're not you friends You Sit close, doesn't mean you are close.
I help him listen

Just benefits, not friends. (There are many overlapping conversations gomg on now)

Aah ok. But you say l?mjust a friend. With you, you got what need. 

(Ul) littie child bike home alone in the rain. Ha ha

i know i get that all the time.

Out of your fucking mind.

Hey, Kenny is looking for cover for- Shit. He?s trying to replace-

i did not want talk to anyone all day, was confinement.

Yeah. Oh. I don?t know, hang on, I got to take this call man, hang on. Hey man. Hey 

let me call you back from a landline real quick, thanks.

TR:

JC:

UMS:

TR:





CF:

JC

TR

UCE:

JC:

CF

TR:

i wouldn't give my kid a gun and he doesn?t deserve one either.

(Ul) gun before a long time take to school with him along time before, 
That's true.

Yeah unfortunately tomorrow afternoon, it would be a long 

(On phone.) Hey man how are you? literally talked to every single one of them.
(in background.) Hey what is he talking about? is he asking for this?
(On phone.) Yeah.

Franckl

i think it's changed. The statutes that she had given 

Oh i don?t pay attention to any of those.
i wouldn't either.
(On phone.) Oh my

(In background.) I can print the statutes that Sarah gave us but based on where we are today.

 

 

 

 



128 What you think is, ok, whatever, here's what i?m looking to do and both
know that we?re 

CF: (On phone.) on ok. I was going to say. I talked to every team leader personally 
Ha ha. Alright, alright

128. (in background conversation.) The best I can, marry up what we have with the elements, so that
we can at least give them, and know even have it written and say, assembled up ahead of
time (Ul) know nothing is ever perfect because they all want it ironclad, you know. but if we gust say
here are the what we 

CF: (On phone.) Yeah, yeah, I hear you.

128: (in background.) And here's what we intend to do at future meetings. Uh, in order to (Ul) the
following (Ul)

CF: (On phone.) Holy shit.

TR: (in background conversation.) Urn, need to call Sarah right now-and that would probably take
me most of the rest of the day.

128: l'm not asking you to do it, I'm asking you for whatever the charge is. l?m going to do it.
TR: i don?t know what it is. What l?m saying, i would need to sit down with the statute 
1281 0k.

TR: And spend that time (UI).
CF: (On phone.) on ok, yeah, I?ll talk to him when see him.
123: Enough ok, alright, that?s cool. i thought maybe you know based on ok

CF: (0n phone.) Yeah, l?m sure don't see him around anywhere so l'm sure he?s getting his
ass chewed somewhere. shit, yeah. 0k good, i was telling you they were a b'reeze,
good alright. Yeah. Check. Yeah. We haven't even made that phone copy that
UK. Copy that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. We?ll fix it. No, we'll fix it man. Um, we squared away for
9:00 here tonight? We still still got the 3 teams? teams, shit, ok, ok, good. Um, any
additional know Liz brought it up to me yesterday when I gave brief about, um.
taking it back to normal shifts because she?s like, yes, because she?s like honestly, those shifts we have
are killing us and uh, I know you and have already about, what, 3 or 4 times right now. But,
oh, you think we should just change and go with that? Yeah sure. Ok. of
logistical purposes, yeah I told her that. I explained everything to her, was like hey. the team leasers
perspective, what do you think? Like we can?t do for so there's not going to be censustently
And you know stuff like that. What do you think? An e?s like, I'd still do it. I?d still change it. 
don't know, 6am to 2pm? Holy shit. Yeah. Yeah. 0k. Um, i think think everybody is kind

 
  

 

 

 

1 of wanting the 8-4, 4-midnight, midnight to 83m. 0k. 0k, mean, you I hope so and that's
2 the other thing, i mean we need need to 0k, I mean if it?s, yeah, i mean
3 it it?s not that big of a pain in the ass, if it?s not too big, if you have yeah,
4 yeah. 0k. Well, that's the team leaders are all good with it, like if you?ve already briefed them
5 and they?re cool With it, mean, fuck it, let?s just wait. Yeah, yeah. yeah, yeah. Yeah
6 do that, it?s horrible. lt's burning her guys out and
7 everything like that so I mean, i don?t know, man. Well, I know, lknow. l'm with
8 you man. Get Steve's perspective and then see what he has to say and then we can make a dechton
9 after that. Alright, thanks man. Yeah, yeah, I?m going to talk to him. Uh, alright, cool, we'll fix it man,
10 don?t worry about it. Alright, later.
11 UCE: (in background gonna be $1000 or $1000 plus change. Guns are $400 or
12 got to come up with (keeps talking but he?s IA)
13 TR.- (ln background conversation.) We have the undercover told him was I'd like 3 guns
14 and lot of I don't gun is really guns is (Ul) So one of
15 Our theories, and a lot depends on you and CTS in terms of charge on to steer him forward
16 no guns or one gun and explosives.
17 SS: (in background conversation.) He?s not going to be around (Ul) with the money, so what?s the
18 answer to that?
19 (In background conversation.) Oh no, no, no, no, you give me money to start. lget started. you
20 don?t get anything until you give me the balance. 
21 SS: That could be months down the road, or even longer.
22 UCE: See the thing thing is, his thing was paying for it. was going he?s going to pay the front end, the source is gorng to pay the back end.
25 UCE: No, he was always gonna pay the whole thing, this is a new thingTR: (Another background conversation.) Yeah we do (Ull but as we progress and he did
28 express sort of the urgency in terms of he didn't say 'same hour? or 'same day' like he did before but he
29 did express want to do.. .
30 Are you getting him money or what?
31 SD: No l?m getting $5.000 from him 
32 CF: Oh nice and you handed the uh, you handed the- and a-to the source today?
33 SD. Yes.
8


 

 

 

CF:

50.

SD.

CF:

0k.

The thing?

The what?

Did you already throw st out?

What?

The little mint thing.

That little mint thing. Oh yeah I did throw it out.
Oh.

That's perfect to keep the screws in.

Oh, well, ljust leave them on my desk. Oh shit, lgot to 

END 03" SESSION 1

 

 

 

 

LIJN

This is a test 00:00:15 Real timeThis draft transcript, in Its current form, is for the sole purpose of revrew
by the prosecuting attorneys and should not be construed as a final verbatim transcript. Further review
may be necessary for trial purposes.

Case: 24)
Sessions: 2 of 7

Participants:

Unidentified male

UF: Unidentified female

Translation Key:

UI: Unmtelligible
lA lnaudible
SC: Simultaneous Conversation

 

CF:

SD: Alright. l?il be (Ul)

 

JC: $5,000 

TR: (in background conversation.) So in terms of interstate sure. We kind of
knew that but this confirms we got to from our standpoint 

(talking in background, he is IA)
CF: Hey man, how are you?

Good man, how you domg?

CF: Oh I?m hanging in.

TR: 50 from our standpoint as well, we?ve got to be not only that, get day before
yesterday (Ul) we asked the source. uh, to drive. the, the, vehicle said be willing to be
that you can bring that So. I seems clear is that so wrapped up in
doing losing doesn?t understand what's realistic, which works to our advantage but
we don't know if we feed him something completely off the wall, we don't know if he'll so far
Out there really, tends to be more toward the 
Whatever (Ul) yeah, oh, I mean, so 

 

 

 

 



the money 

TR: Yeah, what we ended up doing, tricky is the source drove him to a pulled up,
met and target left separately was Yeah he?s fully completely,

almost undoubtedly ready to do that. (Ul) There's a noon SVTC with Headquarters. (a vacuum cleaner
in background?)

CF: new one.

TR: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um what the UC, what it?s going to didn?t seem to
that's exactly what 

JC: So then you're still (Ul) down payment?

(Many other conversations in background.) (Sounds like CTOC Specialist PM in one of the conversations
she's discussing the bank scan software.)

TR: Exactly. Um, the other thing is we could play with and i don't know that he'll go for of
our thoughts the gun, he wants to see people one oi the thOughts that
we had was, these guns are so the closest we can make can make
explosives can make for you the gun is in the higher
price range or something Think that plays with charges on it?

UM6: 
um: 

NN: (Another background conversation. Sounds like PM and NN are discussing the bank scan software 
But no, and that?s kind of like i could have probably 

(Many simultaneous conversations here.)

NN: (Ul)..But the thing is all You It?s already screwed up before it hits Bank Scan. Right and
either they didn't choose the right template Or they did something wrong. And i think that?s even part
of the problem and, um, i think most people have more issues though beforehand and
don't really think we spend as much time on the beforehand part, um, and i know 

(Various conversations occurring - cannot transcribe)

NN: (Ul) you know what i mean and well, i mean that's part of the reason, I was like oh my
the thing is all that 

You've got to be kidding me.

TR: 0k. Alright. And i have a question in terms of not leading him too the two people that steers him more towards the government, not overtly, but just, the scurce
has prewously had said what he says (Ul) well you told me before that you wanted to be a

2

 



 

 

civilian what he said well you told me before you wanted to be a civilian understand

you want to kill more people, can you think of anything else where possibly killing those people 
Would reasonable to try 0k.

Rw: The US. Attorney will be here or his Deputy or whatever they call him.

TR: Ok. Hey Sarah, so you're aware of, says that. uh. you?re aware
Rw: ls our standing order, do not be seen about.- don?t even be in the
area

Rw. Yeah,-

CF: We?re one burn away from bringing the whole thing for another month, what I want
to tell them.

RW. We made a lot of great progress. Thanks to you. Thanks to everybody really but yesterday was
huge 

Ok, if you hit my vouce mall, just do the 

RW: 0k, Mr. former FBI to dig in to of you guys, really, all
you can dig into the US. Code. We need to be telling them that the way we see it, we have these
violations, where do we need to push this all the way to fruition, what are you going to expect to have
us with the subject We do not believe it?s prudent to allow him to drive very far after picking up inert
weapons. re, the Alt-47?s and a bomb vest, to get more than 200-300 yards from the undercover after
that drop is made and take him down. ls you feel that you have enough then to prosecute?
They want this Hollywood ending, that?s great but, plus once we start laying out attempted use of a
WMD, and don?t remember the titling code for that of the automatic weapons code,
we need to lay out what we see for that today. And want to do that with CTS today. Hey, here?s what
we?re looking at, this is what the FBI sees is the potential charges based on what we know, and what say
them (Ul) putting them on the spot. For what it's worth so you guys understand the information over at
the US. Attorney?s office. The U.S Attorney is aware that the case exists but has no clue about what
level of detail we are asking (Uli potential delivery as early as next week, if and stuff
like that with this that?s how bad it can be. That she?s she?s not or IS meeting her
supervisor who's not going to be putting it forward, I want what they refer at this stage.

JC. who her supervisor that?s 
That's where it ends? Ha ha.

That?s where it ends. Um, because how at this stage does the US Attorney not know that this
case is being briefed to the President, they've got an undercover into it now, we just talked weapons
acquisition with and they anticipate delivery as early as next week, bring this thing to fruition and arrest.

 

 

think if I was the US. Attorney, i'd be ripped by not knowing that. I wouldn't get too wound up about
it.
CF: Yeah, but, what I'm saying. 0k you'd get pissed but i don?t think 

RW: But how do be like me keeping it from the i just forgot to tell you this guy
wants to buy a bomb next week. What? Yeah, yeah, we?ve been working for a month on it.

So again, dig into the, uh, Criminal Code for me.

CF. Hey did you email Kenny back, speaking 

RW: We got an hour and a half.

TR: i told Jay that I could probably do a really good job of that not doing anything.
That'd be great.

TR. (U1). Not familiar 

Rw: You need a couple of generic codes to throw at him about Violations of possession and attempt
of use. etc

1C: Do we have a starting pomt as far as like what she's been looking at?

TR: Yeah, I have the printout, yeah, but I'm not sure how current that I talked to her she?s
she forgets 

.IC: Hey other day, um, I've known and I kind of have forgotten it, I?m the primary
Duty Agent next week, um, do I need 

RW: Yeah, find a replacement?

JC: Yeah

RW. Yes, cuz I really think that depending on how tomorrow goes, next week will be very 
CF: (Ui) do 

aw; Next week will be very but, knowing Murphy, not that i believe in that, really, but
just joking around about it. something will come up, we?ll be like, well Jake you got a complaint call
about such and 

1C: Yeah that's what I'm saying and it's like I want to shirk my duties 

saw: you find far out do they have the Duty roster? I would look two weeks
out, call the person who?s got it then and say, hey, can we swap.

.iC: Problem 

 

 

Finding someone for the holidays.

1C: Yeah it?s a holiday duty 

1C: Well call and tell Brett, say, hey, just, you got a secondary, he?s a primary.
TR: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

CF: Let Draper 

Rw; I didn't mean to get 

lC. And I just wanted to draw attention to that so that if they call and say, yeah, can't do it, then
the SAC doesn't call you or something saying, what the 

Rw: No he?s aware of this one.

JC: Well, I know know what I'm didn?t Jake find a replacement or
something like that.

RW: Yeah, well, I guess it's because he had nothing better to do (Ul) annual leave sir.

TR: Well know, two years ago, three years ago, my ?rst Christmas took Tom Oates duty
'cuz he had use or lose and it had looked apparently hard as he could and then there was a
canvass and then there was an email that said if somebody doesn?t help him out. we?re going to draft
somebody else from the list 'cuz this guy is use or was about two said, oh yeah, I'm
going to do somebody three months 

RW. Yeah and like Franco said, I think we got you 
CF: Yeah.

RW: Either that or we could say, sucks for you man, we're going to go make an arrest. You handle
that complaint call from the whackadoo talking about Bin Laden being in, uh, downtown Tampa.

TR: Jake do you have that printout that Sarah gave us? is not here.

1C: He?s being 

TR. reviewing tapes or?

JC: lUl).

TR: The gun charge, do y0u get weak, not a lot of but multiple explosive devices

would be big, really big, so some way he left one, he wears one, that's a much bigger charge than 

TR. See that?s what l'm wondering, I mean, what I wondered is if we have the ability do you think it
would sell, of these guns costs you more than three or four 

 

 

 

UCE: Grenades? Grenade?s already in it.
TR- What's that?

UCE: Grenades are already part of it.

TR: Ok. But what I'm terms 

UCE: You saying body 

TR: No. no, no, what I?m saying is let's try to control what he gets, a gun complicates things a lot for
us.

UCE: Right.

TR: And l?m wondering if we can keep him, scare him away from the guns by saying, dude, you

know, you can?t give me anything, your buddy doesn't have a lot of money, you guys can't afford a gun.
But with the money you have, lcan get you several other choices, I can get you a vest with (UI)
grenades. you have the (UI) grenades and blow yourself up, I can?t get you Do you think that
would, unless you can come up with 4 or 

it Yeah that was an initial request. With the source, he wanted to buy two AK's, nothing
at all about explosives, in every, every pipedream scenario he?s had since 

TR: How do we come up with enough money for them to pay for everything?

UCE: Not that guns aren?t going to be that bad as far as price goes. I think the money and
guns is not the issue, 

JC: Kerry Myers keeps saying 
UCE: Who said that?

1C: Kerry 

TR: Well, what?s his name, Andy, said 46.

UCE: 4-6 what?

Thousand dollars for automatic weapon of any shape or description on the black market.
UCE: Why?
TR: Because it's illegal. And two they?re very limited supply.
can call somebody who 
TR: Yeah, I mean, find out. I mean, but, and maybe that's a completely 
6

 

 

 

 

 

(lA)

JC: Plus I really don?t think he has any concept of how much it costs. He?s n0t even worried about
the money, you know that's not 

TR: Well exactlyknow but l?m saying he's not going not going to say, oh, he?s not charging you $3,000
so l'm walking right.

l?m pretty 

JC: get Andy's point that on Southwest Border if you don?t ask for enough, then
they think you?re a cop.

TR: Right, right. 

JC: He?s not the Southwest Border interacting with a bunch of other people who have tried to get
automatic weapOnS

TR: But there are expert witnesses that will testify that this costs $6,000 . they sold it to him fort
FBI made this happen. And will happen. And everything that we can do to
strengthen our this case sucks, everything that we can do to strengthen it, we Ought to do. I
mean right now, the way that this is sitting, we have yet to envision a scenario where I wouldn?t advise
my client, il? represented Sami, you?ve got a decent chance I would take it to trial. Right now, we have
not yet we have not yet come up with 

END OF 2

 

 

 

 

 

purposes.
Case: -ID 24)
Sessions: 3 of 7

Participants:

UM: Unidentified male

UF. Unidentified female

Translation Key:

 

 

Ul: 

IA: inaudible

SC: Simultaneous Conversation

TR: Situation where i don?t say no, we've at least got a chance of convincing one out of twelve

people to say the government caused this to happen. That's all it takes, one out of twelve. To measure,
room full of SO people, you?ve to pick twelve, you only get three strikes to say that person won't fit and
you've only got certain reasons you can person and he doesn?t to jail. i mean,
what we have mean that's how good a case we have to build. And the other
thing i was trying to explain to these guys this morning, the chances of us getting in, much, if any, of the
is low. What happens between he and (UI) is going to be 95% of what he's
going to try. Because we can?t convict him based on the fact he's got stupid ideas, we can?t convict him
based on the fact that he traveled to Afghanistan because that was in we can prove it. i
mean if we can prove it, yes, if we can?t prove it, or at least show probable cause. we
rule of law iS, you can?t convict someone for A because they did 8.

JC: 00 you know what ljust thought of, though, and i meant to bring this up last night? if he brings
up his travel or if there's a way to get back to that travel to Turkmenistan, if he told you this morning
that he was trying to tom the (UI), like he told our source, that?d be a charge right there.

TR: That absolutely IS a charge and that, and then even if we can't stay in that charge to convict him,
then we get to present evidence, even if we know they'll acquit, we get in front of the jury, a
a key.

1C: Ok that was one of the issues early on, before he even started asking for weapons, that he
actually had technically, had already admitted a terrorist act, material support or whatever, because he
tried an overt act Afghanistan to tom the muiaheddin.

 

 

 



mean I just ideas, I mean I don't know if this would work, just in terms of his
experience, whatever, maybe you could say, when did you, have you ever been to these places and get

him to brag, well, I tried to go to Afghanistan but I didn?t make it. I mean, uh, that's ..some
way to get him to talk about would 

JC: Well, I mean, he brought it up, so, I mean, there could be, but I need to tell 

I do too, I mean, yeah, I mean, and, just if the opportunity arises. therejust .that would 

1C: But yeah, I mean I get let ?nd out they?re (UI) 
?cuz a regular AK is like $400 and it?s 

TR. And that's true, 

1C: But the one?s that he's given made to be a whole lot of safety and


Right and one of the things is, is that the Illegal weapon that (UI) charge, making it illegal like
that? That?s a 20-year charge, I mean which is one of the reasons it costs a lot of money because jUSl
ok gives you a five, if I make it (UI) for you, which is another, I mean, 20 years adds a lot of
value onto a product. (UI) remind of (Ul) rules 

TR: you're violating 
0k, listen, do you want information or do you want me to get down off my desk?
(UI).

UFI: Um, and then also there's (Ul) which might be relevant, um, (UI) targeting, um, though
the underwear bomber? 

10' Portland.

Portland, he was trying to bomb 3 Christmas tree lighting ceremony.
One 

UCE: Portland was a lone wolf, was it just one?
Just one guy got arrested.
UCE: Oh yeah, 

TR: 

UF1: Yeah I?m getting it (Ul) have a question. Do you have Title 18 

 

 

awn)?

oovmtn

TR: Another question lake as much for you because (Ull the source more than Did you tell
the source to bring back up the whole (Ul) thing. Just in terms of, because, that?s a better charge, Sarah

said, the government building, not that we can?t charge but that could help us focus him and identify
targets 

We've got to pitch him to do that anything him complicated direction can be very
dicey, because, he would take that and say, and want you to go and do, you know, or some kind
of crap like that. then we'd be screwed. 50, source is not an undercover, he?s done a good job as a
source but he?s not an undercover.

No, somehow we?ve got to identify targets in terms of take down. We can't
have a roving SWAT team. We have to make sure have to make sure he gets one, because
do we take him down?

UCE: His entire targeting plan is in ?ux right now because. depends on what he 
TR. The problem is, if it?s not real explosives, 

UCE Yeah Baby! Feels good don't it? (laughs)

TR: of the stuft we're giving him is against the law.



TR: (Ul) gun charge, (UI) get 5 years and (Ull 18 months.

50. He?s an irrational guy, it's not like us where you have an objective and do all the planning
toward it. i mean, I don't think he cares,

TR: Only 18 months is dicey because.
MI: I mean, he may come up with a specific night club or something like that.

SD: I think the problem you're going to run into is that riding along in the car he might see
something and go there.

(People talking over one another)
(Ul) no one?s going to be able to answer these questions.

TR: That?s it exactly, how can we identify which is why, i mean, i was talking with Jake, and
that's a good point, is the source, and I think the source could bring back up the whole he said no
civilianstell him what other military targets a depot


SD: He didn?t care about women and 

UCE: 

 

 

 

 

 

JC: 

No, no, no, no, but the source cares. It the source is paying and the source says i'm not paying it
if you?re not going to target 

CF: i don't think Sami is going to care when he starts spraying the crowd with bullets 

SD: The other thing is, I mean, he keeps talking about paradise, this is his way into paradise. So it he
sees heYbor and he drives by it, you know, some gathering of like 6 000

kuffar or something. .he's had no idea about. i mean that's your way into paradise, it doesn't matter.
TR: Right.
CF: What else Other than actually brandishing a weapon in a 

50: Unless (Ul) so big like a or something like that, like they did in Dallas.

Start selling himself?
Yeah
TR: is there anywhere where there?s a in a building with a parking garage? Anywhere

downtown or somewhere? i don't know if, for some reason
he thought he could get into a garage where he could, I don't 

Are you talking about like World Trade Center parking in the garage and blow it up?


UCE: Now you're going to the extreme 

CF: Yeah.

UCE: That?s why you're domg that.

CF: Yeah totally.

UMP: Yeah absoluteiy.

Yeah absolutely, I mean, because without an identi?ed target and see that?s the thing, i mean,
to, to, charge him with attempted use of a destructive device, we have to know what his target was. We
have to absolutely, positively know because one charge is, against a gavernment institution, that was
the charge, or against an institution engaged in an act oi commerce act would have had to
have an elfect on 

UCE: interstate or international?

 

 

what does it take to target, like he says it or what?

TR: It would have to be a pretty firm commitment and a consistent commitment. I mean, and, it's
not just, well, I think I'm going to when he heads out.

NN: (Ul) no gay bar, same difference.

CF: (UI) station and gay bar are same thing?

NN: Where?s this gay bar going to be at so I just know what area to avoid?
JC: You'll find those Ybor (UI).

NN: Wait where they at in Ybor? You told me I was safe In Ybor.

I was kidding you?re safe in Ybor.
SO: I did and you are. Why wouldn't you be.
Either way, I wouldn?t want to be anywhere near.

there. (IA)

JC: Shall we join the meeting?

NN: (IA). (UI) twelve, 

UCE: (IA).

TR: Find out how well she's able perform in 
UCE. How well what?

TR: How well she's able to get us what we want.
UCE: Perform under pressure.

TR: Exactly there we go. I like that better.

1R: I think she'll succeed.

You got what I need (singing) (laughs)

 

 

 

NN:

CF:

CF:

CF:



CF:

TR:

CF:

CF:

CF:

TR:

CF:

PM:

NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:

NN:

PM:





NN:

PM:

You say he?s just a friend (singing)


Oh man, look what I started.

No, that?s how he sings.

what 
Federal Criminal Codes and Rules,
What year"?

Uh 2011

Oh can I have that?

Uh, you certainly may not.

You, you can use it for this evolution
Here you go fine sir.

Muchas gracias. Didn?t know who had a new one.

Oh baby, got what I say he's just a baby 

What you doing?

No.

FIG stuff?

Yeah.

Want to help me make some packages? You don?t have 
What?

those stupid Not that you need 

could probably take a break.

From what you?re doing?

Yept Help you out a little bit 

Yeah that's what i was thinking.

 

 

yeah definitely.

And then what did they say 

No. (Ul) Grey and I even said 

Not even a response? i thought if you'd help do 

But either way, could you get 

I don't have a schedule, just 

Well 

Holiday i know my name is not 
Right and I would have made sure I was (Ul) too.

ldon?t know what the requirements or education or anything like that but Well liust don't

want (Ul) helping or offering to help.



PM:

NN:

PM:

NN:



NN:

PM:

NN:

CF:

NN:

CF.

NN.



UMP:

Well you haven't been yet.

Well even then when 

You help everybody all the time.

Whatever.

know. l?m just going to putt and do up?
0k yeah I?ll come over for a little bit.

But don't (Ul) i just thought maybe, uh, we can chit chat.
definitely will.

0k.

lthink we'll be ok



Yeah oh i know.

You could 

lthink we'll be ok but I appreciate you worrying about us.

Waiting on you?

 

 

 

 

 

TRdidn?t know.
Pre meeting before your meeting?

That's all we do is meeting before the meeting.
I thought it was noon that your SVTC wast

Meeting after the meeting, the meeting during the meeting.

END OF SESSION 3

 

 

 

purposes.

Cm: 241

Sessions: 6 of 7

Participants:



UF:

Umdentlfied male

Umdentified female

Translation Key:

 

U1: Unintelligible

1A: lnaudlble

Simultaneous Conversation

NM: I heard food.

He's taking 

UFZ. I heard (U1).

Yeah, leaving tomorrow. 12:303m. Um, 

Ml: (U1) (U1) story behind that. (U1). So how are you doing, (U1) fired up, yep. 0h (U1).

NN: 

(U1). You had drones, don?t you? You have drones? Probably operatmg from, along with your.

uh, t0rture chamber Where else, the waterboard all that the
ha, ha, 

UM4:

UMS

Ml:

UMS:

MZ:

UMS.



Yes It would be. Yeah.

That :5 a gap(?) 1 don?t know these people leave comments 
0k (U1).

Oh yeah, yeah, actually they?re very 

Yeah (U1). You domg the other, um, 

 

 

 

M2: Well we have that 

Right. yeah, the only thing there is stuff no, you've got to reconfigure here
(Ul)

UM7: 0k.

MZ: art-fades 

Where do you look at? That possessionof a?

NN. Thought you guys have a meeting.

50: We are. Not an official meeting.
(on.
Yeah

Rich was gone that's why I there was kind of, somewhat of an official one.
(Ul) right now Where you going?

Huh?
NN- At your meeting?
SD: What?s that?

NN: It shows Rich's green Right. Right, right. right, but I mean like (Ul) whatever it IS
not that they when would we know about though? (Ul) or no? I mean how
do 

UCE: (Ul)last0ctober(Ul)

JZB: That?s awesome. I was starting at what she said before so tdon't know if their off of
all about Allah and the one and only (M)

UF3: why the whole 

(There is a meeting, overlapping conversations. Hard to understand what they are saymg. UCE does
not take part in the meeting}




UF3: Huh? I have 


UF3 (IA)

 

(UI)

NN: No, I don't know but I?m you don't think it?s (UI) drop off too? (UI)
drop off? (UI) drop off. 

UCE: Alright, cool, yeah, they're in that room right there.

15: Where's your slackin' brother?
SD: He had some errands to run, 
They going to need those uh, grenades or not?

NN: Well he?s not going to the (UI). (background)
50: Yes

UCE: What?s goin' on sir?

15. Hey.

NN: I?m gorng to can him (background)

50 You guys know each other?

IS: Yeah we met the other day.

15: How many do you need?

50: You're both Marines too.

15: Very good. Semper Fi.

UCE. Yes sur.

(UI) huh?

NN: He ran out, he?s not going to the meeting, you not going either? You guys going to grab lunch?

Where you guys gomg, when are you going, (UI).

UCE: I think we were talking 

IS: 

He was saying they're homemade grenades somebody puts together.

15: I can get they're homemade but they?re made in a grenade factory (IA) 
some (IA) and then some all of the (UI) everything.

UCE: (IA) They look worn and inexpensive? ?Cause right now we have money 

3

 

 

 

 

IS:

UCE.

JS:

UCE:

IS.

UCE:

15:

NN.

JS.

UCE.

NM:

15;

NN:

JS:

UCE 

IS:

UCE:

JS:

UCE:

.lS:

UCE:

JS:



NN:

UFP.

I see. Gotcha.

I IA)

That?s easy (IA) black powder (IA) a little bit of (IA)
How do you light them?

Match or lighter. (IA) 00 you want to see one of these things wark?
(IA) ..there IS no place to demonstrate.

(IA) ..plenty of places. We could go out on the 

Yeah right over here where we can all stand here with binoculars!
You have to watch and tape it.

(IA) Yeah, you know, he's trying to get crazy now.

(IA) schedule?

Unfortunately yeah, Saturday. (IA).

(IA).

I might work A couple hours (IA).

Ha, ha, ha. 0k, ok. That?s easy

It's nothing, even the other one is nothing.

Grenades came up (IA).



How big will they be?

big do you want them?

Just want to get an idea so will be able to express the 
Grenade-Sized? Size of a baseball? Depends on how much tape you put on 
My lawyer (IA).

Your lawyer?

Well that scunded like not a good thing.

u.

 

 

 

 

10

11

12

13

14

15

UCE:

IS:



UCE:

.IS:

UCE:

15:

NN:

UCE:

.IS:

UCE:

JS:





(IA) Shrapnel around it? Inside it?

885 on the outside of it, 885 or ball bearings whatever 
(IA). Not that we?ve ever done this before.

Cell phone 

Cell phone, baseball, 

(IA).

(IA).

Whatever works for you brother. (IA).

(IA).

(IA) Well there is a civilian method it's called 

Wonderful if they'd let would love to go 
Give you you're a 
(IA).

(IA).

END OF SESSION 6

 

 

 

UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE
FEDERAL BUREAU OF INVESTIGATION

 

5525 West Gray Street
Iampa. 14.33609

File Number? -

Date of Recording: 12/22-23/201 I
Time of Recording:

'I?cicphone?:

CI) 1024: 2 0f'4
Language: English
I ranscriber: Ruth Rojas 

VERBATIM TRANSLATION

Participants:


UM
Abbreviations:
IA Inaudible
LTI 
PH Phonetic
1 Noise notations or 'I'ranslator?s Notes
SC Simultaneous conversation
0V Overlapping Voices
Recorded Message
Italic-s Ifngl ish

 

cu 1024: 2 on"

l'his draft transcript. in its current form, is for the sole purpose ot'review by the
prosecuting attorneys and should not be construed as a linal verbatim transcript. Further review
may be necessary for trial purposes.
(Session M)
(LI MA Buckgmund Noise/Background conversations)
(Overhead paging. Ken Mitchell Please call 106 7)
(Movement. Typing. and Breathing)
(Na conversations until I 0:53)
TR Al humdila
Cl" umdila
UM bet they?re coming home rehabbcd.
Cl" Other language/NOT ENGLISH)
NN He's talking to himself. He does that a lot.
UM Yeah.
NN Especially in his sleep. Laughs.
You a light sleeper or a heavy sleeper?
NN Heavy sleeper. Laughs.
Oh my God. thirty-seven emails. (IA)
You missed the lunch man.

CF I know man. Had to run a couple errands. Like. you know. pay bills and make sure 
don't get kicked out of my place.

I gotta go. I got a errands I gotta run to.
UCL And how could we ?nd and ?nd out the tech guys that done with that?

(IA) Someone exit with it.

 

CDt?l

UM
l?R
UCli

UCE
TR

UCE

(fl?
UCli
Cl"
SD
UCE
l"
SD

uce
UCE
ucr;
ucr:
so
CF




lD24; 2 ol?4

[Al

Not sure.

Cause there's nothing being done with that (M)
Go patrol and see'.?

Yeah. just a safe area for right now.

Okay.

Never. never leave your post. unless proper relicl'.
right?

Something like that. Did i get that

'l never quit my post until

Unless properly released

lt's properly rcleaved

i will pass on to the sergeant in the yard if not (lA) for the guard.
So. mm the sentry release me all. Of?cer of the day
Yes

1 will walk my boots in military manner, keeping all (IA), conserving everything that
takes place (IA).

That was good

Philip?s (lA) military man.

Yes. what is a military man'.?

'l'hen there was a bond (lA 

I would not he the poster (M) military man.
Yes you would.

No I wouldn't.

Hey you shaved. I thought you were going to HA) beard.

 

Lu 1: 2 of4

SI) 1 did shave.

What happened to your beard? What was wrong with the beard. You'd grow big. ll
would have be a red beard too.

cr --

Sl) I know

CF You'd have a_ beard.

UCE Dude at the mall red heard. "that would be cool. Remember that dude at the mall.
Cl- 'l'he one you slept with in the bathroom.

SD Me

No. the one you was swapping swip, swips. spit with.

SD ?l'ltat?s not the one saw

Cb Awe. yeah. I remember him.

UCL: he one you was swapping spit with.

Yeah. that dude was awesome.

UCE Do you remember.

CF He said 1 had kind eyes and thatjust worked for me.

UCE My ?rst. my ?rst

NN I heard it was a turkey sandwich. but.

(.10: l'irst that Saturday. that Saturday that we sere commanded to meet with the CNS
Ut?ti She showed me a picture of the birthday cake she made you.

Yes.

Cl" 0h. Sarah. Sandwich cake. Laughs.

NN Yeah. she's like. look (IA) and l?m like

 

 

 

CD 
CF
NN

Cl"

NN

(Tl'l'R

(IF

SD



H324 70?

The sandwich cake. yeah.

I?m like. that wouldn?t work out cause we'd do anything to (IA). I'd probably eat all ol'it.
And she cut her toe open.
opened the oven or something like this. like brought her tow across and just completely
sliced?ropen.

[just looked at the thing and was how the hell did you make a sandwich cake

She made a sandwich cake for me. That was an ongoing, that was a running joke in my
class because 1 got so tired of eating the normal shit and in line to eat the same thing over

i thought that was very sweet of'hcr. Nobody 

Hey. it's Steve Dixon. How are you? Good. Hey, did you guys finish with the truck
today?

Did you see the (M)

I?m sorry.

Okay. no. no. nope. We?re good.

Did you see recording that IA)

He did

I was just curious

Was there good video?

Its. it might as well not be It?s all black. mean, you could. you could see his white
shirt and I?m sure il'you freeze frame maybe you can possibly make him out. But. it?s
shit.

But yeah

video

 

 

LU 3



(I l:

(Il'



IR

NN



Ci?

CL

C?l"



'l1024:20i3 

Yeah. it?sjust too dark.

From that thing?

Yeah. I mean. I can play it right. lean bust it out, It?s real
It's not a big deal.

hat?s okay.

No. I want to see it.

it's out the door IA) 1 saw it a few times when the door opens.

that?s what I?m saying. ll'you freeze frame you can probably get a picture or thi.
When the door was open. i mean.

Yeah. yeah.

When the door opens it lights up. (IA) truck lights up 

L?ven that would be useful.

I skipped through it, so I guess, I mean. it was black the entire time.

Oka).

i could see his white shirt and see his hands moving and stuff. but I can?t make out his
face.

Okay.

Awesome.

Alright, thank you.
So I mean. it's.
What's up man??
Hey.

So. I mean it'll. like I said I could go through it and see if! can freeze lrame a picture.

 

 

 

VII '7

SD
Cl"
Cl-

UCE
UCE

SI)
Si)
UClt
the-t. ?l
have to leave to go try to get a (1A) vehicles.
that means it does (lA)

But uh. it's not like the other one was.

Surveillance from yesterday said that he went to seven-eleven. That he (IA). Could you

ligure out where that (M) what it was.

No. you can't take the heat.
Well you now. you can?t leave.

Yeah

You're stuck here.

You could go with me to the recruiting of?ce.
What?s the recruiting ol'liee'.?

Dispatch somebody local

Was that being

Yeah. Come slurpee?

One ol?the Air Fore: guy saw some guy walk out. some mid-eastern guy walk out ol'the

Gyro shop right beside

Hey. do we know what time it was last night Jacob (IA).
Scanning around with a camera.

It was alter he broke store.

Okay. so just soon after about like eight o'clockish?

Yeah

So l'mjust gonna go up there. He?s a busy guy and the airport guy had picture ol'thc guy.

so (just wanna make sure that it's not him. Not our guys. so.

 

 

 

 

 

 
SI(Tl:

Cl?
'l'R


?l?R


NN
CF
'l'R
CF
TR
CF

'l'R

l5

IUJ4: 2 0171??

1? it's someone else he?s gonna recruit. shoot up the recruiting of?ce (M 

We're not worried. We just wanna make sure it?s not our guys.

Oh yeah. (IA) could honestly give a shit less about that.

Yeah. that?s line. We could leave some weapons there il'they want to.

Seven-fifty pm.

Seize-?fty pm. Thank you.

Bush Boulevard.

On a telephone call - Hey bro. what's going on? Hey got a question for you. Um. do
you. actually you know what. I uh already. I just answered it. Don?t worry about it.
Laughs. 'l'hanks. that was easy for you. I know. Hang-up

Now, that was. ifit was Dave saw David, it was Liz. so I can just give Liz a call.

Did you review the northeastern question?

No

She sent it last night.

Oh. yeah. I remember that.

Are you going to the 

Aye. how'd everything go with uh. US attorney?

l?ine

Yeah?

He was really cool.

Did. was it actually Bobby who showed Or was it?

Yeah. thought he might be milled cause Rich said that he hadn?t heard about it until
yesterday. He was totally cool, offering a few thing and then said oh. (IA) Sara?s been in
touch every day (IA).

He's. a cool dude. though.

 

 

kUthe telephone - lley Liz it?s Chris. How are you?.? Good. good. got a quick question
for you. Um. was looking over this surveillance log from last night. It said. ah. after.
after the uh. CHS meet. l?m sorry. after the whole thing went down and everything like
that. you guys saw him go into a seven-eleven or saw his car at a seven-eleven. ls that
correct? l'iftieth and Bush and he didn't. do you know if he went inside or did he just.
okay. But hejust got. hejust got gas.

Oh. boy.

Yeah. yeah. know. gotcha gotcha. And that?s that it was just brought up that he
went to a seven eleven. so everybody is like. what the hell did he go in and do. what did
he. what was he doing, so to bought gas. that makes sense. Okay. so it was lil'tieth and
ah. where? l?iftieth and Bush. ok y. appreciate. That?s all I needed. That could be his.
that could be his brother. mean his brothers go out and party and stuff like that. so l?m
sure that was one of them. Yeah. that doesn't seem like our boy's normal hangout. so
Laughs. i wouldn't think so. but oh whatever. Cool. I appreciate it. Yes, yeah yeah. I
am. All four teams will be here. um ifyou?d like to attend to uh. you know give. give
the team leaders at little oh. you know. Uh. brief afterwards. that would de?nitely be
welcome. Yeah. yeah. yeah. Same place that I gave you guys your brief. Yeah. yeah of
course. Ofeourse. yeah. I mean. we?ll. It?ll probably go on for a while cause we have
four teams. we gotta get them all radios. Which l'm sure it?s gonna take a while. And
then. um obviously the brie?ngs will take a little bit. So. a?er we knock that out then. I
mean. we?ll be here. So. ifyou can make it cool. l?m sure you're gonna give them some
useful hints. l'm gonna try and pass on everything. you know. he heard from you and
Steve and everything like that. but it probably better coming from you guys. so. Awe. 
was yes. Yeah. it will and l'm de?nitely gonna go over all this too. l'hanks a lot Liz. 
appreciate it.

Where you at. 1 board you having to say hejust got gas. Was that the

Yeah. that

Was that the seven-eleven thing? Just gas?
that's. yeah that?s what she said.

He didn't look like he went in?

Well. he went in but there (lA) she said he went in, was in there for a minute and then
came out. So. I mean. we can send somebody in and over to go talk.

No. don?t feel comfortable. Appropriately (IA) resources were unnecessary. He went
for. he didn't have time to buy a phone and went in to pay for gas.

Yeah.

 

 

 

 

RW
JC

Cl"

(Il'l'R
Cl"


(IF

TR
Cl"
'l'R
Cl;

'l'R

. .. u. 
'l hat?s through visual only though.

Yep. lhat's cool

You good with that?

Yes sir.

'l?hat?s our story and I'm sticking to it (M).

A hundred percent. A- okay.

(IA) senator.

Saves me some time. so I appreciate that.

Okay. what the hell else was I doing? Oh, yeah. Email.

Sir.

reporting continues to be (IA) and surveillance. And just wanted to pass on to you that
whatever the teams have been doing

'l'hat's

(IA) 'l ell them to keep doing (lAl

'l'hat?s what l'm trying to do tonight because we're ripping out surveillance tonight.
[know

And that's potentially bad. but that?s why i wasjust talking to Liz. I was like hey. il'you
could

Yeah. and that?s exactly (M)

Meet that breed

The lessons learned from the other teams, because they?ve been doing it right.
Exactly

That was the thing. so

You know what they?re doing right?

 

 

 

 

 



CF



l"

HI 4 

l'hcy?rc backing off
?1 hey?rc not like (IA)

That?s the lessons lea
asked me to share wit

So
Aye, it ain't me man.

(Session 14)

anyways. Good job, Chris l?ranck.

End

 

 

UM: Unknown Male

UF: Unknown Female
Typing Kc}:

Ul: 

PH: Phonetic

IA: lnaudiblc

Speaking simultaneously

- . . . . - . . - . - - . . . - . . . . - - - - . - 0

(12/23/20] I) (003215!)

 

RW:

UCE

RW:

UCtz

RW:

UCE:

RW:
RW:
RW:

W:

UCE:

RW:

UCE.

RW:



RW:



RW:

Cli:

Well he didn't know you know about it cause you're gonna need a down payment
for their server cause some of this stufT?A 

(Someone coughs in background)
Yeah (Ul) somebody else (1A)
(Background noises)

Okay.

Right.

I here?s no way around that.

Right. right and what he can say is well no the other dude is taken care ol?. he like
well the other dude is not here right now. We're supposed to be limiting his
involvement. need somebody right now. And I?m not. you know. l. I?ll go back
and talk to bout it.

Yeah.
whatever his lA)
Ul)

Yeah.

I?m not certain about this guy because it doesn?t make sense to get some other
(Ul) It?s not going to happen. Whatever (Ul) so it doesn?t

Two hundred bucks. three hundred bucks.

HA) is not gonna change anything. (Ul) that's what I?m saying so what. what
sense does it make for me to demand that cause.

it changes it legally.

No. no, no.

(IA) Yeah. yeah. yeah.

I understand. understand what l?m saying but for us, for us.
But for his mindset.

As law enforcement.

 

RW:

CE:




RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCE:

RW:

UClz;

RW:

UCLL:



RW:

Cl?;

KW:
RW:

With his mindset.

For us. for law enforcement.

Right. right.

'l?hal's. that?s. it's a, it?s a beautiful thing. l?mjust saying in a real world situation.
Yeah what his is likely to be.

Just in a real world situation, period. In a real world situation. period. how is that.
what sense does that make. in a real world situation? Other than what we would
like in. for law enforcement purposes. you know. which understand it'that's
what they?ve got. that's the perfect thing, that's what we would love to happen but
in a real world situation it?s. that doesn't make sense in a real world situation
cause regardless of whether we. you know. need money right now to do
something right now I'm still not doing anything until get balance (Ul) and the
down pawl-has got to be more than (Ul)

Why does it have 

 to be enough (Ul) it?s got to be enough to put you. to have. to have.
to?nave'iue uud?Clally where l?m not leaving (Ul)

A lot 

(Ul) is more than that.

that gun, yes? but the bomb stuff. no.

(Background noises)

(L51)

(Ul) the gun later (Ul)

(Background noises)

The gun thing I totally agree with (Ul) t?m not li'onting your operation (Ul)
(Background noises)

hand grenades. we have grenades being made too.

Yeah heard that so STEVE (Ul) yeah they're starting to work on it.

Yeah so I think that?s where that couple hundred bucks 

he]

 

 

RW:

RW:

UC 

RW:

UCE:

RW:

IA:



RW:

UCE:

RW:





(Background noise)

But I need a little bit to get started acquiring materials from you cause these guys
aren?t from it so with that. with the grenades it?s a couple hundred bucks for
materials and at least get. get started. (Ul)

(Background noise)

dynamic.

It?s. understand (IA)
(Background nosic)

l've done this more times than (1A).

It?s beautiful. it?s beautiful and I would love if. ifit was (lA) that would be the
best possible way to do it. (lA)

(Background noise)

For what, get. you get three hundred bucks out of his pocket to buy the pipes and
the vest and black powder?

(IA)
(Background noise 

We?ll need to. need to stall him. investing my time into it for doing something.
you need to come up with half of the money. That way, ?rst of all it covers me
more?in expenses and the second part IS that I don't. I'm not going to take a loss.
the second part is that I know that if you don?t. if you pull out you're out. You?ve

Right.

There's no.

You?re not getting back.

There?s no. there's no give me backs.

Right HA)

 

 

 

 

LICE:

RW:

UCls:

RW:

UCli:

RW:



KW:

UCE:

RW.

UCli:



UCli:

RW:

UCE:

KW:

Right so you?re invested, everybody is invested at this point. 'l'hat?s why you do
that. that?s the reason we do that.

Mm hm.

Everybody is invested at this point. We're all going forward. we're all
committing. you know.

Well that's why the. the source told me that as much money that if he'll give up
three hundred of his own income this week and the source gives him the other
seven hundred to come up with a thousand for half of it, that?s okay.

Yeah but how do you, how do you separate those, how do you separate those
transactions?

Well you don?t have to take any money. We?re not taking any money to begin
with from the source. you can, the source is gonna take care of you later.

Nah. nah that?s not what l?m saying cause how do you separate those transactions
cause you?re talking about two different transactions. You?re talking about a
transaction that l?m. l?m gonna conduct with him but (Ul) gonna conduct with
somebody else for three or seven hundred dollars.

Seven.
0r 1 start this thing.
Mm hm.

How. you don?t separate, how, I mean me, want to separate those transactions
(til) two of them together you know take care of that and then come see me and
here's a thousand dollars to go. that?s one thing. If he gives his seven hundred
dollars to the CH5. the gives it back to me and says that's. that?s one thing.

Or it he takes his three hundred and the CH8 gives him another seven hundred
and then.

Right that's. that?s the only two ways. that?s. those are the logical ways that this
thing happens.

Right.
ll'hc gives money to the CH8 or the Cl IS.

l/fl'he CHS gives him.

 

 

UCE:
RW:

liCli:

KW:

UCE:

RW:

UCli:

(Iii:

RW:
UF:


Ul":
RW:
UCli:
RW:
UCLS:
KW:



The {8 gives money to him.

To him.

One way or another I don?t, I can't separate where piecemeal where I?m getting
paid from.

I would. you've got the experience. I would disagree with that based on their
relationship.

That doesn't make sense.

Based on their relationship. To me. to me it does it. if hey he said he was going to
pay for it well if he says he can?t for all ol'it so you?ve got to pay for some ot'it
and he's got to pay for some ol'it.

That's not a conversation that would have with him. would have it (IA)

I think what he?s saying that an independent person he wouldn't be working it out
and making the deal. It should be the source and the bad guy saying how they're
going to work it out. who?s going to pay what share.

Good.
And then pay him fully.

Other than. well other than the background is that you helped out his family
before and they?ve been here For eleven years.



And so there is a little bit ot'a trust factor there.
No me. me. and the. me and the HS are okay.
Right.

()ur relationship is (IA)

'l'hat's why to me if he says well I can give you three hundred and he's gonna
give you seven hundred and you can say okay well I trust him and good with you
giving him three hundred and he?s gonna give the seven hundred then he's gonna
tell me that.

I?m not gonna tell him that though. He should know that before he comes to see
me.

 

 

 

 

Ul:

UCli:

RW:

UCli?

RW:
UCE:
RW:

RW:

JC:
RW:

JC:

UCli;

JC:
UM:

RW:

llCli:

Yeah. that's. l.

He would know that because he had the source already. That would be. that
wouldn?t be something that I?m not educate. would not educate him.

that?s. that?s (IA) that?s a feasible. that?s a feasible scenario. that's a feasible
scenario.

That?s what you're going to do. that way the source has to he coached.
(Ul) Okay lagrce.

I. I'm with you. l?m not arguing with you.

(Background lA voices)

You want to go at three o?clock with RALPH and explain to him the time for
tomorrow and everything?

Yeah that's what we werejust talking about.
Well I heard nighttime and all that stuff so 

One thing I told the source this morning was we were talking about (Ul) trying to
get SAMMY (PH) to actually show up on time cause (Ul) but il'it did happen
he?d be a little bit more calm. Um you know the, the problem with WAl'l (PH) is
you can?t call him. (Ul)

Right.

You know so you how. you kind ol'like go lind him somewhere you know.
Exactly. (til)

(M voices)

What we need to do is drive away for a while. chit chat some more. talk IONY
I've got to get? you?ve got to get more speci?c for him.

(UU

 

 

 

 H:

RW:

JC:

RW:

C:

RW:

UClz.?

RW:

UM3:

RW:

Ul";
RW:

(Background noise)

So you would have to schedule it either early enough in the day (Ul) orjust
schedule it after everything is over late in the day.

(Background noise)
(lA voices in background)
So why can't we get it done early?

We can um the only issue we've got isjust do we depend on SAMMY to be
reliable enough to show up.

(IA voices in background)

I don?t know man this poor guy he gets almost five hundred bucks in his hand
tomorrow and he says you need me for another week? That's a thousand bucks
(Ul) why wouldn?t he show 

Well right but you're a hardworking (Ul)
(lA voices in background)

No I'm. l?m trying to think ifi?m a. ifl?m a retarded fool who is hard up for
money and don?t have a pot to piss in, another five hundred dollars looks pretty
good.

that?s not iOgieal  that?s not logical.
didn?t say logical. I said hard up for money.
Yeah.

Anyone that?s hard up for money anyways. constantly didn?t have enough and
now he knows he's got to acquire some money to get some. well no he thinks that
the other guy is going to pay for it. He's told hey can?t cover the entire cost ol'it
now. now he?s thinking well if he can?t cover the entire cost. l'vc get almost live
hundred here and I work next week l?m not going to need the money once I go do
my thing so that? 5 almost a thousand dollars. hat should be enough to get the
whole thing started. to give due. I give the guy eight hundred bucks and i got my
stuf?l'. I?m almost there.

Right I know it by the time i got (Ul)

You're not feeding him (Ul)

 

 

JC:
Ul":

RW:

RW:

JC:

1C:



JC:

UCE:

UM:

RW:

He?s got live hundred bucks and (U l)

(Ul) usually, don't you guys usually require it to be mailed. like l?ed-lix to you.
that?s usually what I do. 1 would follow up with a lied-13x. But if I would have
lied-ex unless overnighted it. 

That?s a lot easier to go (Ul)

Well yeah I mean I. don?t think we usually have the (Ul) I think it?sjust usually
the.

(M voices in background)

Well again more reason to make it tomorrow when he has to give you back
money so you can?t. (Ul)

(IA voices in background)
Right that?s the source.

(Ul) and don?t forget they?re strapped right now. You?re gonna have to pay him
certain things so he knows you?r' serious.

(Ul)

And I?ll, l'll help you on the rest but (Ul)

(IA in background) alright thanks so much. bye.
(IA multiple voices in background)

You have to give him like four hundred hundred bucks. Source says he wants
three hundred and ?fty dollars or however much you know.

lt's got to he more speci?c than that. (Ul) He comes into the store. the source sits
down. said he needs a thousand dollars. it?s about half, maybe a little bit more.
(Ul) you have to ping him. can't take care of this whole thing for you. We?ve all
worked very hard for this

(Ul)

Maybe you can meet him tonight. He'll pick you up right here outside the. outside
the building, outside the store or you?ll meet him where you met him last time or
whatever time is appropriate. (Ul) the source has to be very speci?c that 
(PH) wants a thousand bucks. alright? i can only give you six hundred right now
You have to pay him the other four.

 

 

 

 

 l; 

RW:

UCli:

W:
l'R.

RW:



RW:

PC:



RW:

UM:





(Ul)
(lA voices in background)

And then when SAMMY says well what about the other. if that's about halt what
about the other thousand? Let?s worry about that later.

(Hi)
We?ll worry about that later.
Hopefully we'll be able to get that together but (Ul)

Can?t your. can?t your friend ah can?t your friend sell some ot?his

stolen items? (Chuckles)

Well il?lie's so worried about the other thousand mean, I mean (Ul) I think can
get it together. You get what you can and between us we?ll be able to make it
happen. Do you have anybody else you could ask? You know hopefully I'll have
a good week at the store and we?ll be able to.

Maybe your other brothers can still help you. even know they?re not in it. We'll
ligurc it out. We?re going to be able to make this happen but . . .

he?s got thirteen grand doesn't be?
(M) my money, he wants you to give him four hundred dollars (IA)
(lA multiple voices in background)

You need to give him what you have right now, four hundred dollars (IA) cause
he's not going to front the money and then you take ol'l'and he's out l'our hundred
dollars. lt's not like you can return it (M)

(M voices in background)
You?d better help the supervisor out, that?s all I?m saying.
(IA voices in background 

He was clearing the cubes the other day. He scared the. almost drew down on
him.

cleared the other Side, didn?t see you go over.

You can't clear my side too. saw you come around. well I heard you and then l.



 

 

RW:





UCli.



UCE:
UM3:

KW:

RW:

UCli:

UMZ:

Uce:

UCli;



UCE:

RW:

80 what?s the timing plan? Cause that conversation basically happens in the
morning (IA) at night again (IA).

You know what happens then (lA)

lA voices in background)

You?re asking show me your target.

Well that's. 1 think driving, i think just driving around even though maybe you're
not as familiar as just for opsec to keep mobile s6 {hat its?tarder to follow you and
track you.

[Simultaneous talking]
Are you asking. me asking you what's your target.
Yeah.

'l hat's. that?s law enforcement. Show me your target, that?s law enforcement. ?l 0
get away from all that by saying like it's basically it?s what type of target are we
looking at cause I don't care what the target is. I mean truth. I mean truth be told
no I don't really give a.

I want plausible deniability.

(Lil) don't give a shit. give a shit. what type of target are we looking at so that we
know that we build for that target.

(I ll)

So then start laying it out fucking and get to him when you have. when you (IA)
(1A voices in background)

(M) I ain?t telling you what the target is.

Just out ol?sheer frustration trying to explain.

Well it?sjust, it'sjust it's human nature. I feel sick to my stomach. I feel il?it
does. great. ifit doesn't at least we?ll have an idea of what we're looking at.

Have you researched it. is there security there? ls it a hard target. is there. is it.
what are it's hours of operation?

ll

 

 

 Just, just so we get that layout of what you're building for so. so we do that. it we
do that.

I. End of session IS)

 

 

RW:





UCE:

UCli.?

RW.

UCli:

W:

UCli:

RW:





RW:

ii:

Session 16 (12/23/20l l) (002225 I)
Yeah. yeah.

If we do that today that?s a long conversation.
Right.

That?s not ?ve minutes or ten minutes. no that?s. that's you?ve got to sit down
(Ul)

(M voices in background)

You know and we need some place where we can have a conversation. We can
actually do that in the car truthfully. We can do that in the car as long as its
comfortable (Ul)

Right your trunk or back ol'the truck. (Ul)
Yeah (lA) back of the truck. (Ul)
(IA voices in background)

Well and again you don?t want to spend too long in the back, start getting into
other stuff that you don?t want to jam you up on something so sure.

But I?ll get to it so but that?s. that?s.
So basically cut the meeting out and then tonight it would be.

What happens though. what happens though with the people they're trying to get
you to (M) that we have where we?ve got to meet tomorrow. we?ll have the short
conversation. Okay l?m doing it so this is what you?re gonna need to do. you've
got to get your money together. We?ll give you, you've got a week to get your
money together

(lA voices in background)

(Ul) you know which give me the details ofit and l?ll I'll go. I'll go lA) up
materials and start 

Right.

You know.

 

lJCl?z
RW:
UCli.
RW:

UCE:

RW:


RW:

UCE:
RW:

KIE:
RW:

W:



RW:

Does that still open the door back up for him to say well is paying for it so
you?ve got your money. Didn't you get it from him already? He?s supposed to be
paying for it, no?

No. no. no. i didn?t.
Cause he's already today said you?re gonna have to give him.
Right that?s.

He may still. he may still pull that four hundred out of his pocket and hey i got
paid today here's the four hundred.

Well what l?m saying. what l'm saying to that. what l'm saying to that; that lirst

plan you had said (IA) to this thing wouldn't solve the problem that we?re having
right now. The scenario that you came up with just now solVes the problems that

we're having right now but eliminates the meeting.

Yeah.
'l'hat's the only thing i will say.

And i?m. and think you, at least what i heard last night was the l'ewer meets the
better the way this relationship is kind ofset up because.

(UI)

Yeah. yeah. six ot'one half dozen of the other too but in his mindset the fewer
times you guys are together the.

(UH
Right the better he feels about.
Sure.

Not inadvertently dragging himselfinto it and being recognized and seen together
and.

Sure operationally, operationally you and me. it doesn't hurt us at all but actually
it?s not a bad thing for us to get operationally. operationally as far as the. the urn
how more realistic our operation is on. on outside of what law enforcement wants.
realistically for our operation the fewer meets is better and. and what we?ve
discussed is.

They tell us.

 

 

 

UCli:

RW:

UCL:

W:

UCli;

RW:

UCli.

JC:

UCE:

JC:

RW:

UCE:

RW:





it?s better.

Law enforcement wise the. the more meets 

today the plan that we had before, when we were coming up before. would have
satis?ed what they were asking for but it's not optimal for. for (M)

It gives him. it has more ol'a chance ot'him taking the live hundred bucks he gets
tomorrow.

Yes sir. yes sir. yes sir.
And go do something else with it.
Correct. yes sir.

Well then and also it creates a situation that they also (M) where he has to
actually just go and get the money from the source to give to you possibly.

Yes.
And. and that?s what. and they de?nitely said they 

Right yeah we de?nite. yeah we don't want actual money moving. 'l?hey pret'er
that. he just gives you. ?nd a way to get him. him give you a salary which he?s
earned legitimately.

And that secondary. that secondary it' we did a secondary that down payment
medium then what will happen after. the money still comes directly from the
source. mean but still it?s. you?ve eliminated that, getting that money out ot'his
hands. that?s the only thing that you don?t. but you can still. I mean you can still.

Okay.

He doesn?t have to actually be the one that pays me cause he doesn't have to get it
from the house you know on that second meeting, on that third meeting or
whatever that will be. whatever the next one. But you know what happens though
is that (M) what happens.

Exactly. No I'd rather get the live hundred tomorrow and get that. Now the
question would be, now that you have your down payment and you're gonna do it
for him and get him the stuff; how long is it gonna take you to get it and when is
your next meet? Cause the next meet for me. the next time you and I get together I
will have your stuff.

 

 

 

 

UCli:

W:



RW:

UCliz





RW:

UCE:

RW:

UCl-j:

RW:

CE:

RW:

UClz;

RW:

UCli:

RW:

UCE

(Ul)

You need to have money.

Exactly.

lfl've got the stufTand you don?t have any money. youjust.
You don?t get the stuff.

We?ll. you don?t get the stuff and you come back.

I'll see you later.

And I'll see you later.

Sure.

Um when does that meet happen? Is that. does it take you two weeks to gel the
stuff. yOu say I'll. you know what the best time for me about January. the ?rst
week sometime in January I can have it all put together and ready for you.

It can be whatever. whatever we want it to be. That doesn?t matter. it can he done
in a week.

Right. We can do it next ?l'hursday.
(Ul)
Next Friday.

It can he done in two weeks. I mean that?s. that's.

What he expressed and what I. how I understood what he expressed was that the
sooner the better because right now he?s clean but he doesn?t know how long
that's going to last.

Right. I remember hearing that.

So.

 





RW:

UCE
RW:

RW:



Ul-:

RW:

JC:
Uidid. I said that.

Oh perfect. Quit. don?t drive erratically, quick driving erratic. don't you know
don?t. don?t I mean did he like hunker down . . .

He's always driving erratic.
Did he hunker down in the seat with you at all driving'.?
(1A) Yeah.

See that draws attention cause i would think stop it because you?re drawing
attention to yourself. People driving by even ifthey're not the police think that?s
weird that there?s a guy that keeps sinking down in the seat and they're just.

hat's weird.

He does that all the time.
Oh no worries.
(Chuckles)

Anyway to me that would be like would you cut that out you?re drawing attention
to us.

Alright.

Looks suspicious.

Get your head off. get your head olTa swivel. You look suspicious. relax.
Okay.

Okay.

Alright I've got one thing to. to address here.

IA) got to make a phone call. SAC okay?

So

I didn't (IA) 011 no. no, you?re tine. I didn?t want to interrupt. we had a good (lA)
we had a good 

 

 

 

 

1C:

UCL

JC:

JC:
UCE

JC:

UCli






if

UM3:


RW:



lf. if the source says hey (PH) wants a thousand bucks I can only. l. can
only pay him six hundred, you need to get the four hundred. Could we think
we've got any holes in the story in terms ol'like when did you talk to and

Some. does that work?
Yeah. yeah and that?s.

Cause we don?t have to. we don't have to have a made up transaction between the
source and yen before then.

Right. sure.

Because he committed six hundred. You?re good with that because of your all?s
relationship but needs to pay the other four.

Right. I think il'he says a thousand I?m line you know so um yeah so told him
that. that he?s gonna, that told him that he?s gonna give four hundred lA) that
he got six and that they can sit there and hash it out however they want but like
dude I ?m getting paid four hundred dollars. I?m going to take my entire paycheck
that I?m getting (M) and I you know whatever it is.

You still have ninety for gas.

Yeah whatever they has out. whatever they has out (Ul)
That would be like (Ul)

If it ends up. il'it ends up you know that.

It also shows his intent. every, he was willing to cough up almost his entire
paycheck to get this thing going.

Yeah there you go.

 

 

UCli

RW:


RW:
1C:

RW:
JC:

RW:


RW:

18:

RW:

RW:
JB:

18:

UM4:

RW:

Yeah.

I makes money for him. just access.

Access. yeah. He thinks he doesn't even care about the money. It?s just you know.
I?m sure the money is good but.

I'd like to break here and the three ol'us go see the SAC real quick. We?ve got
give him this heads up before we call RALPH (PH) and tell RALPH about it.

Think about your option SV'l'Cing of RALPH.

Oh I can. yeah? if we can do one direct yeah we can do that too. Um but
we want to tell ?rst.

Yeah absolutely want. I want to tell him. He?sjust been saying when he wants to
go before the tour ?fteen? Should set. say maybe three thirty or three forty ?ve
at the latest?

We can probably do it in twenty minutes. We need to go up and see the boss.
Okay. okay.

And say we?re gonna with CPD one last time at three thirty

Right.

So we want to give you the heads up.

Perfect. yeah that?s great.

(Ul) We pulled up prayer times (IA)

Yeah.

 

 

UCli:



UM3:



JC:
RW:

CH:

TR:
CH:
TR:

CH:

UCE

CH:
UCI:

UM3:

lJCli

One to one something.

The thing is the rest of the prayers are pretty close all the way to lsha which is
seven thirty so maybe a?er lsha would be the easiest thing unless you want to
meet him right before and like you all on the ?y stop and Ul) somewhere um but
that?s something to consider and then ?gure out where.

(Ul)

Well the biggest thing is to ?gure out where you want to meet so that you know
cause the source is gonna tell him. talk to him and this is where usually meet him
at this time (IA)

We?ll be in the HO room right?
Yep.
Perfect. Three thirty, we can work on the prayer time and everything.

(IA voices. background noise)

with (M) and that can't be confirmed he did or didn't.
l) was in the area where he said he was.

Right. right.

Like they might have 400 bucks.

(IA voices)

Do you give him a handgun?

Right.

Handgun will be useless (Ul) pre. pre anything.
Right.

Just to have one.

 


UCI:
UM:


UP:
CH:

UClt;

Cll:

UCE
CH:

l'R:


?lR:
CH:
TR:
CH:

CH:

l?R:

Well you can talk that up but just in terms of.
l'm not giving him a handgun.
You can?t understand (lA)

Right and understand it. i understand it. 'lhe focus is now is between we were
just talking about how your saying the source saying l'll give him six hundred.
you?re gonna give him four hundred and then you come and saying need a
deposit you know take the six hundred M)

know where he's going.

Take the six hundred the source gives me to start the thing um i ?ve got some shit
l?ve got to do with my ear. l?ve got, you know l'm gonna keep this four hundred.
I?ll keep (IA) on delivery. You need your deposit.

Right.

You need your deposit, the four. six hundred cause if the source goes to him
saying.

He?s gonna try to talk me out of that four hundred dollars?

What l?m saying is the source. how the source states you now you give him four
hundred l?ll square it.

'l'hcre's two keys: on one the source has to make it absolutely clear he doesn?t
have any extra money.

Right at this time i have no extra money.

And (Ul) the second key is.

We'll work on that.

laking anything less than a thousand.

Right.

The only place that any extra money is coming oii'the table is from our guy.
Right.

So either you?re not getting anything. I'm not getting started or you're giving me
four hundred bucks. I mean (Ul)

 



CH:


CH:

Cl l:
TR:
CH:

CH:
CH:


CH:

Ul?:

UM3:

Ul?:
'l 
UCE

ll'l'm not taking it out of my pocket.

?l'hc hard.

?l'he weak link is the source because he, he.
Right.

Because he. he has a hard time being direct.
Right.

And. and.

So if he feels that he?s already given you the six hundred dollars or he has the six
hundred dollars and he?s already said yeah my brother will take care of it. He?s

down to the deposit we want to get the cash out of pocket so he can?t
go to that drug dealer if he?s met one and purchase a handgun because you didn't
provide him with one timely enough.

'l'imely enough.

downgrade me to the next level ofjunk.

(U1)

Well that?s what I mean (IA)

We?ve already taken away your Uzi. we?ve already. I mean that's.

l?hat?s another problem.

10

 





UF:

CH:
Ul?z
UCE:
UP:
?1 R:
TR:
Ul?:



Cl".


UM3:

CH:
UM:
UCE:
CH:
CH.
Ill-'2

Otherwise (Ul)

(IA) deposit. we want to get that cash from him.

(IA voices 

But no what l. once you. once you get 

IA voices all talking at once)

Just its his operation you?re out there and you've done (Ul)

What does the thousand dollars 

ll ll)

'l hat's what. mean he wanted to know il?its (Ul) okay (Ul) six hundred.
(Ul) Right there. there?s the difference, right there is you shoot it up.
He?s not going to shoot it up.

Ul)

(lA voices all talking at once)

Okay here you go, FRANK. you?ve worked all week on this. Here's your live
dollars. You can do whatever you want with that live dollars.

Yeah. right.
?l?hen S'l'liVE . . .
(Ul)

(Overhead paging. PAT MAHN please dial one one one eight. PAT lN.
extension one one one eight)

Right. right. right. right.

(Ul)

Ul)

l. I understand. Now. now (Ul)

Yeah then you discuss how they?re (lA)
(IA)

11

 

TR:

TR:

Ul?:

UM3:

(IF:

TR:

UM4:




..

CF:





TR:

TR:


voices talking in background)

The long and short ol?it is. the bottom line is that you don?t have to understand
why (U1) his hand to yours. livery single one olthat six hundred (Ul) (lA Ul? in
background) your boss says the United States Attorney Ul) they?re the ones who
take the court case, case to court and they say it matters so it matters. At the end
ofthe day that's kind of where we are

ls it absolutely positively a deal killer. probably not (Ul)  we did not entrap this
BUY-

(lA voices in background)
(M) it takes two days to drive here. right?
Right.

'l we or three days and so two or three days to get back and you're already. you?re
out ol~ pocket.

But giving the money for doing the work. The guy has earned the money. Unce
he's earned the money he can do whatever he wants.

(Ul)
And that's the point.

'l'alking about before what we were saying last night Ul) he works for a week. he
makes two hundred. three hundred dollars.

l?m gonna work.

Yeah that's what we?re. tomorrow who?s going to pay (U l) we're gonna say four
hundred bucks.

(U1)

Absolutely. it doesn?t matter. See you?re not listening S'l'h?Vli. Yeah he?s working
for the store because.

We're telling the source to let him go.

12

 

 

 

 

(?llz

M4:

TR:

TR:

UCl-i:

Ul':

UCH:



UCE:



UCL:



UCE:



Really?
(U)
(M voices in background)

He can part with that money. it's no longer his (IA) all day long, it?s his. it?s his.
I to can do whatever he wants. And he?s sitting there with four hundred dollars in
his pocket. . . piece ofshit broke down last week (IA)

(IA voices talking simultaneously in background)

Once. once he gives it to him it's his money whether we orchestrated it or not. it's
still his money even though he?s got (IA).

Um this guy here, new guy.
Oh yeah the lawyer.

The new guy. you were. you were with the bomb techs and some of us earlier we
were looking at this um hand grenade thing, right? They can make some hand
grenades that are somewhat functional and kind of show him how to do that. how
how to use (M) and everything and have a demonstration 

I I that happened to me. I. I don?t know what the other (IA) said to me. that's (til).
Why'.?
If you can only do one I would say let him see it go off.

Why don't we. why don?t we do that? And then deliver it like you know and like
we got you that or something like that. we can deliver we got you that but point
out two basic points. We got two basic. we got two basic even like two days
before and if we deliver like three days after.

Like two little ones we can try out.

Yeah. this is how it works, take it and throw it. okay that's how it works. right?
Well now you know how the grenades work. This is so guns work this way. you
know this is it. this one here. um this is how you load and unload it. I?m not
bringing a live gun to you. basically cause I don?t trust you that you?re going to
pull steal my shit ill give you a loaded gun.

I?ve got two grenades and a gun and if you leave I ?ve got nothing and I'm dead.

13

 

 

 

 

Hi:





i;



UCE

Bring a. bring a um bring a the trimmer magazine mechanism for. the trigger
mechanism for the explosive. for the bomb. This is how you load it up and how
everything works. you know.

Yeah.

The battery. the battery goes in here. The switch goes this way. 1 his is how- it all
works.

Speaking of which.

Now you know how everything works.

i?m ?nished then I have something to talk about.
(IA voices in background)

You know how everything works. This is how everything works. right? Now you
know how everything works. Load it the ear. take you home and in three days i'm
gonna come over to you so i don?t have to put the locks up on you and show you
how it works. I?ll deliver it to you. hand it over to you. Here is the lot ot'stuti'.
here?s everything. I got my money so.

(IA voice in background)

(Find of Session 16)

14

 

 



UCli:

CH 

CH:

CH:



SD:

l' 

80:

TR:
UF:

IR:

UM:


Session 1702/23/20?) (00:22:51)
I like all that but mean I would still have (M)

don?t think he's going to have a vest on him. can show him how to wear it but I
think he?s going to take it off.

(lA) put it on.
You think he's going think so. 1 think he?s going to put it on.

t. I think he?s so paranoid and that?s the one concern I have with the practice
session cause he'll think he's going to be caught ifwe practice. He?ll think (I ll) 
don?t know but that?s. that?s one concern. I mean I.

I can see (Ul) cause he said, he said (Ul) still give him paradise because (Ul) and
I think (Ul)

(Ull
(Ul several UM's speaking at one)

Stopped and killed in a traffic stop because it doesn't matter he?s still going to
paradise.

We talked about yesterday.
Huh?

Yesterday or the day before we talked about um upstairs. KERRY MYERS said
it?s not practical. put the battery (Ul) What about, okay that's not possible. what
about once you put the batteries in. if you take them out and they are. you?re
gonna fucking blow up. This is. once this thing is armed you try and disarm it.
you?ve got a pretty good chance of blowing yourself up. And what's. well what if
they (U l)

(Ul)

Situation where if you arm this thing you've got to use it or you?re fucking, either
it's not going to work or it's going to o??onc way or the other and so one of the
thoughts (Ul) once he puts in the battery it arms the detonator and sucks the juice
down on him and he has a limited amount of time before he has to push the button
and die. KERRY MYERS said well it doesn?t work that way. The circuit isn't
burning the juice until you push the button. that?s pretty common sense. Okay.

 

 

UCli:

Cll;

UF:

Cll:



Cl":





CF:

SD:
Cl":

line but what about once you put the batteries in and connect the switch. connect
them together. If you pull it apart. anybody who?s you know hooked their. the

batteries on a battery cable or plugged something into an arc,jerk the cord out ol?
a wall that are could detonate the device. Dangerous to pull it apart, you pull this
thing apart. once you. that's it man. You pull it apart and it's. damn near as good

committed it and be it believes it. that shows his intent. ll'you?re ready. once we
do this we?re not taking this thing off. 'l'hat?sjust a.

(IA voices in background)

(IA) I?d have issues. ?d have issues with that.

Well his property. il?you (Ul)

'l?hat's de?nitely what I heard ALFONSO (PH) talking about yesterday at lunch.
(U l)

Oh yeah so.

(Ul) there's one way in and one way out.

Throwing out the idea of wanting to (Ul) well he didn?t sayexaetly that but. He
said that RICH said something about it.

(Ul) American middle east. these (IA) companies are either (Ul)
(IA voices in background)

Well what do they do for that explosion Do they have any kind ot'training
for us to view 

No but IA) is aware of that and they drove to the place and (Ul)

You?ve got a minute. once you push that little red button. you leave and that?s
what everybody was talking about.

How many years? What did he get?

(lA voices in background)

You going to have recording tonight? l)
I don't know. don?t really want (Ul)

The mother fuckers keep giving him advice we?ve got to keep transcribing so.

 

UM3:

UM:
Cl":

UM:

UCE:

Ul":



UM:

CF:

UM:

Cl":

UM:

l" 



Ul?:

CF:

UF:



(Ul)


I think I think you pulled it off better than me actually because 
I see lot 

MARTIN. ah. you know what. yeah.

Oh my God. yeah.

You?re actually. you?ve actually got a point there (Ul)

Damn.

(lA voices)

Do you see that happening?

Last two nights (Ul)

(Laughter in background. lA voices)

(Ul) Nobody can say that okay you don?t put a suicide on unless you locking
mean the shit.

'l hat?s it.

Well that was one. two times so.
(Ul)

(IA voices)

Oh you're going to the hot tower.
(IA voices)

How do I know this and you don?t?
(IA voices)

(lil)

(IA voices)

'l?hcy?rc dialing in from upstairs?

 

l'R:

UF:

UMZ:



UM2:

Ul-z

UMZ:
UM3:




Ul?"

UM3:

Ul?:


JC:

UM3:

UCE:

JC:

UCE:

JC:

No they?re coming down.

Oh okay good. So they?ll be in that conference room cause we're just going to
keep them on the line for a couple of minutes?

Yes.
Okay sounds good. thank you.

think he knew that they were.
()kcy dokcy.

There you go.

Yeah whatever you say.

Thank you, thank you sweetheart.
What am I chopped liver'.?

I ll)

This. won?t even bother.

I think I'm going to write you guys a guide. (Ul)
Did you ever 

(IA voices)

Did we talk anymore about 
Negative.

(lA voices)

Yup.

Blow a few ot'thcm. give him, Show him how a gun works. you know and um and
um send him on his way (IA)

Good idea. You can send him like just a couple ofgrenadcs and have fun with
them lA)

 

 

UCE:

UMZ:



UM:

JC:



1C:

UM4:



Ul?:

TR:
Cl":

TR:
'l 
PM:
l'R:

We're gonna do. we've gonna. we?ve got a video tape that.
(Ul) live ones.
Yeah. (Chuckles)

You?re laughing like. you're laughing we're joking. Do you see a smile on my
face? I am dead serious.

I've never. I?ve never seen a smile on your face. 
(U 1)
(IA voices. someone laughs in background 

My, my (ll-IS was called my AMIR (PH) this morning. AMIR wants a thousand
dollars down payment. I only pay six hundred dollars. You need to pay him tour
hundred dollars. pay him (IA)

Okay and everyone is cool with that. (Ill)

Right okay so that?s what we?ve got to do.

(IA voices)

Like everybody else (IA) let?s get this shit over with and.
Get this out ot'my division. (Chuckles) Out of my division.
(IA voices)

Um do you remember looking (IA) backgrounds 

(IA voices)

Alternatively take the six hundred dollars and ?y out ol'(lA)
You like me.

I do.

But you don't give her any paper that?s all messed up.
(Ul)

(UI) never give me anything.

Exactly and so it's never messed up.

 

 

 

PM:

?l R.

PM:

PM:

UM:

PM:

PM:

JC:

TR:





lik:

'lR:

(U1) and they said that was pretty (IA).

Oh yeah you told me (Ul)

Did 

(IA voices)

(IAstuffin there. Can you guys get that worked out?
We?ll get it worked out.

are you very busy getting ready to 
(IA voices)

Or English.

We. we need to ligure out where (Ul)

Well what do you know? How handy is that?
'l?omorrow. not today?

It's going pretty well. Um we had a really good teleconference um I think
everybody agrees that um we?ve come up with a pretty workable scenario . . .

(IA voices talking simultaneously)

. . .Qiust so you can know it?s going to be at ah UCli will have total. the I
need one thousand dollars payment (1A) The CHS is going to tell SAM. an the
target that UCE needs a thousand dollars. I told him come up with six
hundred they're going to have to come up with the rest. lhe target will have just
been paid a bit more than that he'll earn this week. He?ll have it in his pocket. It's
his money. He can do whatever he wants and then later in the day UClj is going to
show up for this meeting and while the UCE and target are together alone the
U03 is going to say look, he says you?re going to give me so much money and
you?re going to come up with the other four hundred or you know we?ll have to
wait (Lil 

(lA voices talking simultaneously)

'l?omorrow. tomorrow. We haven?t determined. we?ve got an issue with a IA)
that?s a big deal for the target. He doesn?t always show up for work early and (IA)
before that but our goal is to do it before that so it could be later in the afternoon.
We'vejust got to (til).

 

 

 

 

'l R:







UP:

10
UM4:

IIF:

IR:

TR:
UM4:



(IA voices talking simultaneously)
One more thing (UI)
CHS meets . .

And I explained well we?ve got the (IA) looks like we've (lAljust talked to her so
(IA)

(IA voices talking simultaneously)

Well which. which ever one you know. She was actually at the today but
she was actually at (UI) Do you have that number? I. okay.

(IA voices talking simultaneously)

So we were at this training last week (IA) that was it. Well not many people (IA)
(IA voices talking simultaneously)

'l'erril'ic um let?s see. BOBBY should come to the (IA)

(IA voices talking simultaneously)

One of the instructors at one time was trying to state a point and say you know it
was like okay you know how did you go about getting yourjoh here. We all had
to go on-Iinc (IA) part of the process. You guys (IA) we all like turn around and
like IA)

(IA voices talking simultaneously)

Is that the thing where they were talking about a change.

Right. right. right.

(IA voices talking simultaneously)

You don't have the. but either way you still had to go on-line and (UI)

Yeah. yeah and Cl IRIS should be here and not to. He?s great. CHRIS JOHNSON
(IA)

I'm not a tech guy.
Oh, oh cause I am?

Actually I might as well apply for it at this point.

SD:

(?Fr





UM:
CF:
SD:
Cl?
SD:
Cl?:


Cl":

UM3:
UM4:


M4


UM4:
UM3:
UM4:

UM3:

(I 

SD:

Well you have all these things around you so that makes you more we tech guy
than me. On why didn't you see the credit card?

Alright. oh we?ve still got to guess we don?t
really have to but.

No cause it can stay in for the next.

Yeah actually you know what yeah it can so fucking leave it. Yeah. why don't 
take this out?.?

(Ul)
Okay you need, you need the charger. right?
Yeah I need the charger.

You have. you have one at home, right?
No, I'll take that thing too.

You don?t?.? You don?t have this at home?

No its.

You don't have a home charger? That's for your blackberry.
Oh it's one. it's one that lits my blackberry?
Yeah. yes.

Yeah should. yeah.

Okay cause I need to put this back out. 'lhis is TERRY RAWLS (PH) that stoic
so that goes in there. All you need to do is plug that in there.

Alright. yeah.

And you?re good.

know how it works.
Okay.

Alright.

And they you've got one for m. too'.?
do not have a. charger.

 

 

 

 

Cl":

SD:
CF:

Cl":
UM:
CF:
SD:
CF:
SD:
Cl":
31);


TR:



UM3:

(Background noise)

This is the older blackberry one. you know it?s thicker and everything like that so
this one goes like that.

(M voices in background)
But that's the one that we charge our new blackberries 
Yes.

Well actually here.

Yes this is the one you have your. see. your blackberry is charged on this one.


Yeah it will. Yeah that's. that's our new blackberry one.
Okay.

But that?s the old kind so yeah you don't. use the thick one.
Alright.

So. so this goes for.

Alright.

And that one goes for (IA)

(Background noise and IA voices in background)

Yes in fact we did talk about that so and um basically I think where it is right now
is probably no more than (IA) I think so. I think so and I think it?s real similar to
what you said that the more good conversations we have. the more intense and if
we can get him you know reaching into his own pocket and take that to money to
you know walk into the source. He wants wants to (M) I
mean it?s his money. Once it?s in his pocket and he earned it. he can do whatever
he wants.

(IA voices in background)
mean think it sounds good.

Right.

 

 

 

JC:





?Cl-l:

JC:

UMZ:
UM4:
UM3:

TR:
JC:




I don?t think he'll ever go for it. because. as controlled an environment as it is
(Ul) live weapons (Ul)

Yeah. yeah and l. and that's a really good idea. We mentioned that language (U 
yeah and he. he did get a good (IA) I think he did good a (IA) so something (M)

No but they don?t care though. it?s. it?s not like (IA) They don?t, they don't care
about ifhc 

Yes that's not the problem. the problem (U1)

Yeah. yeah. yeah.

ll'. ii'.

Right.

So what il'(lAJ

Yeah exactly. yeah.

Oh but (IA) Knomille division.

'l?hat?s exactly what bothers him is we can get back out there (IA)

(IA voices talking sirnul'tdl?l?Ebusly in background)

in there and all the charges that he was mentioning I think were things that lAl
and then and then when. when.

(End ofsession l7)

 

 

 

Session 20 (Background noise and IA voices in background)


JC:

Ui?:

SD:

Ci";
TR:


CF:

TR:

TR:

Ul?;

1?2:

PM:



(IA Ul' voices in background)
(Someone sneezes in background)

(Overhead page JAY BENKOWSKI please dial three zero new one. JAY
BENKOWSKI three zero zero one)

(Background noise IA voices in background)

Howdy. howdy.

Hi.

(Background noise IA voices in background)

Trying to set it up now and the best news heard all day (IA)
(IA voices in background)

It's absolutely right.

those are not at a forty-?ve degree angle.

Do you anticipate any emergency NSl.s 

U1)

Wow what just happened?

Do we. . 

(lA voices)

Wow listen to that. She knows how to address (lA)
(Laughs) (Ul) He'll be here watching over us though.
(Laughs) (UI)

(lA voices)

Are you guys pretty sure that nothing is going to go on tonight. the meet will be
tomorrow?

CHS recording tonight is going to be recovered. We just discussed that.





UM3:


[11"3,





NN:



PM:

CF:






PM.

Ch

It?s fucked up.

I-rom the stu?'oI?I'thc printer (UI)
You know earlier.

I've got to call KENNY.

IiarIier.

Thank you.

IzarIier. like ten minutes ago we said man we shouldn't do this today and IRIS
said yeah we shouId I've got to have something to harass 

it?s like you know what some of these nights aren?t ruined quite yet 50.

You ass. No I gonna let AMMY KRASAKA take the night of! because
she's so. so tired.

She likes overtime.


A-and 21- What?s 

A-s it.

(til)?

It?s a little recording device that is simiIar to.
How can thc.and the.not meet 
Ihey do but thc?s something like this.
Mm hm.

And he Just kind of like -or something and then.
And the 

Yeah exactly so essentially it?s the same thing.

Oh so the) don?t have to be in the car?.? Now last night. were last nigh.and

Yes last night was.

 

 

l?M:

Cl":



Cl?:



(Th

PM:

CF:

PM:

CF:

PM:

Clthe CH8 and then he had. he had a. 

Hum how does with seven sessions?!

I think it?s. either. either he clicks it on and on or it just automatically does that
cause i. l've done UC recordings where it just cuts ol'fat'ter a certain point and
then it starts a new session.

Because we can?t match it up. We have two hours on the.
Yeah it?s all the device.

And (ll-has eight sessions.

it?s the device. The device will hold, what, i don't know how it does it but it will
just say okay this session's ended, a new session starts.

Okay. okay.

Some. I mean when it, obviously when it?s shut on and oil then it's um then that's
obviously it starts off with a new session.

Right.

Sometimes II will just cut it off. maybe il'it's been going for like an hour. thi
hours. it automatically cuts 

Well like one ol'thcm you hear him say twenty lirst two thousand eleven. You
don't hear the beginning but then you get ?ve seconds on one of them and it says
this is Special Agent.

(IA voices in background talking simultaneously)

Right. honestly. from what l've heard of how these devices work or I've actually
watched someone do them. it's usually they turn them on say that they're starting
the recording.

Right.
And then they say.
?l'hey do a preamble.

(IA) Right and then they do one at the end.

PM:

NN.



PM 



PM:

NN.

PM:

NN:

NN:
PM:

Cl:

PM:





JC:

PM.

Right. right that l?vc seen.

And then they shut it off. So wouldn?t it he the same way like cause you know
how all of sudden you realize okay there's nothing going on and wouldn't be shut

Well. this is weird. 'l'hey're ?ve seconds worth.

Well sometimes you. wouldn?t you turn it on thinking that you might have
something and you don?t?

I don't know il'you have two things.

But if you have to do the preamble I don?t what. how about that but know l?w
gone to make a call and he turned it on. did the preamble.

Right.

And then alternate it. pick up the phone when you try calling him then he?s- like
alright pick up the phone and then he had to end it or whatever but I don't. you
know. I don't know how that works. 'l'hat's the only thing i can. I don't (M).

I know. it just doesn?t make sense why they're not. this one?s not fitting because
we?ve been able to pick it up, all the others.

is somebody wearing something or 

(1A voices in background talking simultaneously)

was going to say (HI) he's the messenger. Like all ol?a sudden (Ul)
Yeah exactly. exactly. Any idea how 

I just. rough estimate is be back. back here by seven so (lA)

Eight or nine?.? Okay.

(lA voices)

Do you recall Sara Sweeney looking at some of the tech cuts? And wanting to get
some stuff from Miami? Red wolf or whatever?

l'vc got em.
Has anyone started on the transcripts?

Just. just Tuesday morning. Were you able to start on the 

 

 

 

.lC:

PM:

JC:

PM:

PM:

1C:

PM:

JC:

PM:

JC:

TR:

NN:
UM:

NN:

'l'iger one. the one that.

Red tiger one. We haven?t gotten very far on that?
Yeah.

But the total ot'all four (Ul)

Okay.

We have .ll-Ll-?F SHULER right now and JliFl"s got stuf?Ul) from Miami. We
were having a little trouble making it ?t our equipment. making il'eompatible. 
have a list of everything (Ul) so whatever you need. They. told them the way I
(Ul) as long as they were all done, incorporated (U 1) before she came back
because there won't be any more tech cuts until she comes back. right? Cause
she?s the one (Ul)

Right.

But they're working on it now. They?re working on the 

Okay yeah 1 mean guess like the sooner the better on those.

Well.

(Ul) sending email wanting to know ifit was done 

IA voices in background talking simultaneously)

Everybody thinks that within a week we?re be arresting people (Ul)

l've got to set all this crap up from our UC or have someone (U1)

f/l We have not received any UC funds yet (lA) typically not not a UC (IA).

(simultaneous background conversations)

NN:



PM:


What we do is (Ul) email.
Well good (Ul) get that money. Get that 

lt'the cquipmenl?s broke and it?s compatible have (Ul) can go upstairs and have them

UM: 0k sounds great.

 

 

 

 

 

PM: (Ul)packetsol'everythingwl). We need those l?orlUl)
UM: (UH

PM: and the other two are being worked and IS will be done tonight. l?il'teen
through eighteen. nineteen and twenty.

UM: 'l'he undercover on that one 

Supposed to be home on the 

PM: But we need you to ?nd out. You?re gonna have to 

UM: (UH. I don't know how that ll'not 

PM: Let me found out (Ul) on that. 

Well not that lor me it probably (Ul) a big deal because have had work holidays.
Yeah.

NN: And I have (Ul) stulT where it's kind ol'a big deal (ill).

NN: (Ul) might get any money back from ?ying?
CF: No credit. mean I have a credit.
NN: Oh that?s good. Cause usually you know how it is, it's like.

Cl": Yeah, no give you a credit uhm it's good for like a year which I'll use it in a
year.

NN: Yeah you will 
(7F: So.

NN: Well you guys when don?t know how your whole availability thing works but when you
let's say work more than your. . .your supposed two hours availability (Ul) put down that hey I
worked ?ve hours availability. Does that mean that later on in the year you don?t have to
work as much availability?

 

 

 

 

 

Like you don?t have to work avp every single day. Like right now all of us have worked

yeah.

NN. 'l?hat. . .that is more and beneficial because we need you now. livery it's not
always like that.

Cl?: l'hat brings me back to the whole availability cause guess what haven't pulled anything
less than a l2 hour day in like well except there's like the weekends and stall like that
it'll be like live or six hours.

NN: Right.

(IF: Either way that?s. ..that?s an overage. Now i don?t need to sit here two extra hours when
have nothing going on that's it. big boy rules and the reason. i think the reason we do
it is one because we?re full of lawyers who think oh you need to do this and two cause you got
lazy motherfuckers who are just like who just don?t put in the time and effort. And like when we
have shit going on cool I?ll work 20 hours days that?s line.

NN: i think everybody here (U1) anyways.
Cl": Well that's and.

NN: (lfll

CF: And but some people. Dude.

NN: (Ul 

Cl": No.

NN: You know what mean.

CF: I know.
NN: 
know there is i mean but not everybody in the organization is like you and l.

Cause everybody here we?ve the last two