Page 1 UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT WESTERN DISTRICT OF LOUISIANA LAFAYETTE DIVISION - - - - - - - - - - - - MARISELA VALDEZ HUERTA, : ET AL : : : VS. : : : L.T. WEST, INC., ET AL : - - - - - - - - - - - - - CIVIL ACTION NO: 6:11-CV-01589 JUDGE HAIK MAG. JUDGE HILL DEPOSITION OF PATROLMAN BRENT ZACKERY The oral deposition of PATROLMAN BRENT ZACKERY was taken in the above-entitled cause, pursuant to the following stipulations, before Cheryl Venable, CCR, at the offices of Borne & Wilkes, 200 West Congress Street, Suite 1000, Lafayette, Louisiana, on the 21st day of June 2012, beginning at 11:45 a.m. Page 2 1 A P P E A R A N C E S 2 3 4 5 6 HUGHES, SOCOL, PIERS, RESNICK & DYM, LTD. (BY: JOSE J. BEHAR, ESQ.) 70 West Madison Street Suite 4000 Chicago, IL 60602 312-604-2614 jbehar@hsplegal.com 7 8 9 FOR MARISELA VALDEZ HUERTA, CINDY ALEJANDRA CABRERA HUICHO, ISY ELIZABETH GONZALEZ VALENZUELA, PERLA YAZMIN LAGARDA HUERTA AND MARTHA ICELA FLORES GAXIOLA 10 11 12 13 14 15 ONEBANE LAW FIRM (BY: JAMES D. BAYARD, ESQ.) 1200 Camellia Blvd., Suite 300 P.O. Box 3507 Lafayette, LA 70502-3507 337-237-2660 bayardj@onebane.com 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 FOR L.T. WEST, INC., JAMES CRAIG WEST, LUCAS TROY WEST AND CATHERINE WEST Page 3 1 A P P E A R A N C E S (continuing) 2 3 4 5 6 BORNE & WILKES, L.L.C. (BY: JOHN F. WILKES, III, ESQ.) 200 West Congress Street, Suite 1000 P.O. Box 4305 Lafayette, LA 70502-4305 337-232-1604 wilkes@bornewilkes.com 7 8 9 FOR SERGEANT ROBERT MCGEE INDIVIDUALLY, SERGEANT LUCAS LAVERGNE INDIVIDUALLY, CITY OF MAMOU AND CHIEF OF POLICE GREG DUPUIS 10 11 12 ALSO PRESENT: MR. JAMES CRAIG WEST 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 REPORTED BY: Cheryl Venable, CCR Lafayette Certified Shorthand Reporters 337-988-6477 on behalf of: US Legal Support-Chicago 312-236-8352 Page 4 1 I N D E X 2 Page 3 4 Examination by Mr. Behar.................. 5 Examination by Mr. Wilkes................. 84 6 Reexamination by Mr. Behar................ 98 7 Exhibit 1 (Subpoena)..................... 10 8 Exhibit 2 (Patrolman Zackery's 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 6 statement)..................... 74 Page 5 1 S T I P U L A T I O N S 2 3 4 It is hereby stipulated and agreed by and 5 between counsel for the respective parties that 6 the deposition of PATROLMAN BRENT ZACKERY be taken 7 pursuant to Notice of Taking Deposition for all 8 purposes as authorized by the Federal Rules of 9 Civil Procedure. 10 It is further stipulated and agreed by and 11 between counsel for the respective parties, and by 12 the witness, that the reading and signing of the 13 deposition by the witness shall be waived. 14 All formalities in connection with the 15 taking of said deposition, including sealing and 16 certification, are hereby waived, except for the 17 reduction of the questions and answers to 18 typewriting by the court reporter. 19 All objections, except as to the form of 20 the question and nonresponsiveness of the answer, 21 are hereby reserved until the time of the trial of 22 this cause. 23 24 25 Page 6 1 2 PATROLMAN BRENT ZACKERY, after having been first duly sworn, was examined 3 and did testify as follows: 4 EXAMINATION 5 BY MR. BEHAR: 6 Q Please state and spell your name. 7 A Brent Zackery, B-R-E-N-T, last name 8 Z-A-C-K-E-R-Y. 9 Q Good morning, Mr. Zackery. 10 A Good morning. 11 Q Thank you for coming earlier. I understand 12 your deposition was scheduled for later today, 13 so I appreciate your accommodating us. 14 A No problem. 15 Q Have you ever had your deposition taken before? 16 A Yes, sir. 17 Q How many times? 18 A Once. 19 Q I'm going to give you some guidelines that may 20 sound a little bit familiar to you from the 21 last time you gave your deposition, but I hope 22 that it will make the process today go a little 23 smoother. 24 A Okay. 25 Q The court reporter just gave you an oath to Page 7 1 tell the truth. 2 under a legal obligation today to tell the 3 truth? 4 A Yes, sir. 5 Q Thank you. Do you understand that you're As you can tell, the court reporter 6 is taking down everything we say today, so it's 7 important that your answers be out loud. 8 A Yes, sir. 9 Q She can't take down nods of the head, shrugs of 10 the shoulders and things like that. 11 A Okay. 12 Q Do you understand? 13 A Uh-huh (yes). 14 Q Thank you. If for whatever reason you don't 15 understand my question, ask me to rephrase it, 16 and I'll be happy to do so. 17 sure that you understand the questions that I'm 18 asking you today and that you answer them to 19 the best of your ability. I want to make 20 A Yes, sir. 21 Q And finally we've been doing pretty well about 22 this, but because the court reporter is taking 23 down everything we say, it's important that we 24 don't talk over each other. 25 A Okay. Page 8 1 Q Because that's going to drive her crazy. 2 A All right. 3 Q So please let me finish my question before you 4 start your answer, and I'm going to try real 5 hard to let you finish your answer before I ask 6 my next question. 7 A Okay. 8 Q Thank you. 9 Okay? Sir, are you taking any medication or any other substance that would affect or 10 impair your ability to tell the truth today? 11 A No, sir. 12 Q Thank you. Is there any other reason that you 13 can think of that would affect your ability to 14 be truthful today? 15 A No, sir. 16 Q Are you taking any medication or any other 17 substances that affect or impair your memory? 18 A No. 19 Q Thank you. 20 You said you've given a deposition once before, correct? 21 A Right. 22 Q Were you a witness or a party in that case? 23 A A witness. 24 Q What kind of case was it? 25 A The same case. Page 9 1 Q In this case? 2 A Uh-huh (yes). 3 Q When did you give a deposition? 4 A Well, it was more of, I guess, a statement, if 5 anything, of what happened here. 6 Q Was there a court reporter present for that? 7 A No. 8 Q And who were you talking to? 9 A Mr. Wilkes. 10 Q Anybody else other than Mr. Wilkes? 11 A It was myself, the chief, Greg Dupuis, Robert 12 13 McGee and Lucas Lavergne. Q Have you ever been in a setting like this where 14 lawyers were asking you questions and there's a 15 court reporter present? 16 A No, sir. 17 Q What is your date of birth? 18 A 2nd, 22nd, 1988. 19 Q What is your address? 20 A 1613 Fusilier Road, Mamou, Louisiana. 21 Q What is the highest level of education you've 22 obtained? 23 A High school diploma. 24 Q Have you ever taken any college courses? 25 A Never. Page 10 1 Q 2 Do you have any professional degrees or certifications or licenses? 3 A Yes, I do. 4 Q What do you have? 5 A I have graduated the police academy. I have 6 different certifications, taser, active 7 shooter. There's a lot more, though. 8 Q When did you graduate from the police academy? 9 A I'm not sure of the year. 10 11 I think it was in '08, '09. Q 12 Did you review any documents to prepare for today's deposition? 13 A No, sir. 14 Q And have you talked to anyone to prepare for 15 16 today's deposition? A No, sir. 17 MR. BEHAR: 18 Let's mark this as Zackery Deposition Exhibit Number 1. 19 (EXHIBIT 1 WAS MARKED FOR 20 IDENTIFICATION AND IS ATTACHED.) 21 MR. BEHAR: 22 Q (CONTINUING) Sir, I'm handing you what's been marked Zackery 23 Deposition Exhibit Number 1, which purports to 24 be a subpoena to testify at a deposition in a 25 civil action. Did you receive a copy of this Page 11 1 subpoena? 2 A Yes, sir. 3 Q Thank you. And if you could, turn to the last 4 two pages of this document, the page that 5 begins with the Rider A and goes on to the 6 second page. 7 Rider A? Have you had a chance to read 8 A No, sir. 9 Q Do you have -- actually, why don't you take a 10 moment and read 1 through 6, the page that has 11 Rider A at the top? 12 A (Witness complies.) 13 Q Sir, have you had a chance to read 1 through 6 14 of Rider A? 15 A Yes, sir. 16 Q Did you bring any documents with you today? 17 A No, sir. 18 Q And after having read Rider A, do you have any 19 documents in your possession at work, at home, 20 anyplace else that is responsive to any of the 21 Numbers 1 through 6 in Rider A? 22 A No, sir. 23 Q Okay. 24 A No, sir. 25 Q I'm sorry? Are you currently employed? Not with the Mamou PD. Page 12 1 A Not with Mamou PD. 2 Q No. 3 I understand that. I mean, do you currently have a job? 4 A Yes, sir. 5 Q And who do you have a job with? 6 A Ville Platte PD. 7 Q What is your rank or title? 8 A I'm only doing it part time at this time, and I 9 10 do carpenter work on the side. Q 11 How long have you been working for the Ville Platte PD? 12 A Part time about three years. 13 Q And do you have a rank or a title? 14 A Just patrolman. 15 Q And by PD, just so that the record is clear -- 16 A Police department. 17 Q Thank you. What are your job duties and 18 responsibilities as a patrolman for the Ville 19 Platte PD? 20 A 21 22 Make sure -- keep the streets safe and just do community policing. Q You said you've been working part time for the 23 Ville Platte PD's office for about three years, 24 so did you start in about 2009? 25 A Yes, sir. Page 13 1 Q And have you worked part time for the Ville 2 Platte PD the entire time you've worked for the 3 Ville Platte PD's office? 4 A Yes, sir. 5 Q And you're also a carpenter? 6 A Yes, sir. 7 Q How long have you been a carpenter? 8 A About two years. 9 Q Do you work for yourself, or do you work for -- 10 A Myself. 11 Q Before the Ville Platte PD's office, did you 12 13 hold any other job? A Yes, sir. I was working at the sheriff's 14 department, Evangeline Parish Sheriff's 15 Department. 16 years. 17 Q 18 19 I worked there for about two What years did you work for the Evangeline Parish Sheriff's Office? A I think it was -- I started in 2010. I 20 recently resigned there about September of last 21 year. 22 Q September of 2011? 23 A Uh-huh (yes). 24 Q Is that a yes? 25 A Yes, sir. Page 14 1 Q 2 Thank you. Did you work full time or part time at the -- 3 A Full time. 4 Q That's just one of these examples. I know you 5 know what I'm going to ask you, but let me get 6 the question out first -- 7 A Okay. 8 Q -- before you answer. 9 A All right. 10 Q Thank you. 11 A Yes, sir. 12 Q And what was your rank with the Evangeline 13 Did you say you worked full time? Parish Sheriff's Office? 14 A Deputy sheriff. 15 Q Were you deputy sheriff for the entire time you 16 worked for the Evangeline Parish Sheriff's 17 Office? 18 A Yes, sir. 19 Q And what were your duties and responsibilities 20 21 as a deputy sheriff? A 22 23 patrol, that sort of thing. Q 24 25 We serve subpoenas, I mean, make arrests, Who was your supervisor at the Evangeline Parish Sheriff's Office? A Lieutenant Jeremy Mitchell. Page 15 1 Q 2 And was he your supervisor the entire time you worked there? 3 A No, sir. 4 Q Was he also a lieutenant? 5 A Yes, sir. 6 Q When did Lieutenant Fruge retire? 7 A I'm not exactly sure. 8 Q That's fine. 9 They also had Adam Fruge. He retired, and Jeremy took over. I'm not sure. Do you remember when Lieutenant Jeremy Mitchell took over? 10 A Yes, sir. 11 Q When did he take over? 12 A Maybe about -- I guess about six or seven 13 14 months before I resigned. Q 15 Why did you resign from the Evangeline Parish Sheriff's Office? 16 A The pay. 17 Q I can understand that. 18 I wanted more pay. Did you ever work for the Mamou Police Department? 19 A Yes, sir. 20 Q When did you work for the Mamou Police 21 22 Department? A I started about -- as soon as I left the 23 sheriff's department, I went to Mamou. 24 there until -- let's see -- until about April. 25 Q Of this year? So from Page 16 1 A Yeah. Yes, sir. 2 Q So I just want to make sure I got this right. 3 So did you work for the Mamou PD's office from 4 about September of 2011 until about April of 5 2012? 6 A Yes, sir. 7 Q Did you work full time or part time? 8 A Full time. 9 Q What was your rank? 10 A Sergeant, patrolman. 11 Q What were your duties and responsibilities at 12 13 the Mamou Police Department? A 14 15 The same thing. Community policing, arrest powers, all of that. Q When you worked for the Evangeline Parish 16 Sheriff's Office, what were your work hours? 17 What shifts did you work? 18 A 19 20 Q 25 And when you worked for the Mamou Police Department, what shifts did you work? A 23 24 It rotated two weeks days, two weeks nights. 21 22 All shifts were 12-hour shifts. It was only night shift, 12 hours, seven days in two weeks. Q Did you resign your employment from the Mamou Police Department? Page 17 1 A Yes, sir. 2 Q Can you tell me why? 3 A For an incident that happened with a woman 4 being tased in Mamou. 5 Q Can you describe the incident for me, please? 6 A Yes, sir. There was a woman that was -- she 7 kept on messing with the neighbor's property 8 and everything. 9 do nothing about it. And the chief didn't want to And after a while, he 10 decided, you know, it was enough. 11 over there to get her. 12 disabled. 13 and she decided she wasn't going to come. 14 she took off running. 15 So I went I knew she was mentally I went over there to pick her up, I then caught her in a ditch. And She tried 16 to kick and bite, and I stunned her with the 17 taser. 18 guessing she was double jointed. 19 something with her wrists, and she came out of 20 the cuffs. 21 so I shot her with the taser. 22 I then put the cuffs on her. I'm She did She kicked me and took off running, And while I was walking her to the car, 23 she pulled the prongs out of her legs. And I 24 placed her in the back seat of the car. 25 once she was in the back seat, I was getting So Page 18 1 ready to leave with her. She kicked the back 2 glass out of the car. 3 And whenever I got outside of the car, she was 4 already coming out, so I tased her again. I called for backup. 5 So now I'm trying to hold her in the car 6 and trying to get my shackles out of the trunk. 7 So every time she would come out of the car, I 8 would hit her with the taser, and she would 9 fall right back in the car. 10 happened. 11 up on it, so I resigned. 12 Q 13 So that's what And the chief didn't want to back me Were you the subject of an internal affairs investigation? 14 A No, sir. 15 Q And when you say -- I'm just trying to 16 understand what you're talking about. 17 say that the chief didn't back you up on it, 18 what do you mean? 19 A When you Well, I had talked to a couple of instructors 20 about, you know, the situation, and they told 21 me that I was right in the way I tased the 22 woman and everything, but he did not want to 23 back me up on it. 24 for me to do was to resign, so I resigned. 25 Q So the best thing he said So did the chief ask you to resign? Page 19 1 A Yes. 2 Q And you resigned of your own accord? 3 A Yes, sir. 4 Q Do you know Robert McGee from the Mamou Police 5 Department? 6 A Yes, sir. 7 Q Have you ever worked with Robert McGee? 8 A Yes, sir. 9 Q When? 10 A I can't tell you the exact time, but he was 11 working at Mamou PD when I was working. 12 know, he was there, and every blue moon we 13 worked together. 14 Q 15 You Is that how you first met Mr. McGee, from working at the Mamou Police Department? 16 A Right. 17 Q Do you have an opinion one way or another about 18 Mr. McGee as a police officer? 19 A No, sir. 20 Q Do you know Lucas Lavergne? 21 A Yes, sir. 22 Q How do you know Lucas Lavergne? 23 A Me and him used to work together in Mamou 24 about -- when I first started, I started Mamou 25 PD, he used to be my sergeant. Page 20 1 Q 2 3 Did you first meet Officer Lavergne from working at the Mamou Police Department? A Yes, sir. Well, you can say that. I used to 4 see him, you know, when I was younger, you 5 know, at the PD, you know, working, but I 6 really didn't know him. 7 car, you know. 8 Q 9 I just seen him in his Do you have an opinion one way or another about Officer Lavergne as a police officer? 10 A No, sir. 11 Q Have you ever met the gentleman immediately to 12 13 your right? A Yes, sir. I met him when that incident took 14 place with these two girls. 15 with their names. 16 Q 17 18 I'm not familiar Do you remember when you first met this gentleman? A 19 Yes, sir. It was the night that one of my partners, Benjamin -- I forgot Ben's last name. 20 Q Bordelon? 21 A Yeah. Bordelon. He was a sheriff's deputy. 22 And he had a call about a suspicious vehicle 23 at -- I forgot his name. 24 name. 25 Q Mr. -- I forgot his Are you talking about the gentleman who is to Page 21 1 your right? 2 A Yes, sir. 3 Q West? 4 A Yeah. Mr. West's residence. 5 Q Okay. Do you remember what night that was? 6 A No, sir, I don't. 7 Q Do you remember what year it was? 8 A Yeah. 9 No, no, no. 10 11 I believe it was this year, I believe. It wasn't this year. It was in 2011. Q 12 Did you ever respond to a call in the early morning hours of May 2nd, 2011? 13 A It was Deputy Bordelon, and I assisted him. 14 Q Were you ever at the scene of a stop on that 15 date? 16 A Yes, sir. 17 Q Did you get a call through dispatch? 18 A Yes, sir. Well, Ben did. 19 from dispatch. 20 went to back him up. 21 Q Okay. Ben got the call And I was in the area, so I I understand. I get it now. If you 22 remember, what time did you arrive at the 23 scene? 24 A I don't remember. 25 Q When you arrived at the scene, can you tell me, Page 22 1 if you remember, who was already present at the 2 scene? 3 A Ben was there, Mamou PD Officer Lucas and 4 Robert McGee. 5 male subjects and two females. 6 Q 7 And also there were two white When you pulled up to the scene, were you in your own vehicle? 8 A Yes, sir. 9 Q Was there anybody else in your vehicle? 10 A No, sir. 11 Q Did you ever exit your vehicle? 12 A Yes, sir. 13 Q What's the first thing, if anything, that you 14 15 did when you exited your vehicle? A 16 17 everything was Code 4, if everything was okay. Q 18 19 I went over to Deputy Bordelon and asked him if And can you describe for me as best you can where you spoke to Deputy Bordelon? A 20 Yes, sir. We were on the 600 block of East Street in Mamou. 21 Q Where did you park your vehicle? 22 A Right behind his on the road. 23 Q If you remember, how many other vehicles were 24 25 at the scene when you first arrived? A Not including mine, there were four. Page 23 1 Q And you started telling me a little bit about 2 it. 3 more. 4 what did he say to you after you exited your 5 vehicle? 6 A I was just wondering if there was anything What did you say to Deputy Bordelon and I asked him if everything was Code 4. He said 7 yeah, he was just getting some information down 8 to do a report. 9 Q Did he say anything else to you? 10 A No, sir. 11 Q Did you say anything else to him? 12 A No, sir. 13 Q And what did you do next? 14 A I just -- I went and spoke with Robert McGee 15 and asked him, you know, what they were doing. 16 And he said he had came -- he had heard the 17 call, and he stopped the car in town. 18 Q Where did you speak to Robert McGee? 19 A At the scene. 20 21 Apparently he had stopped the car in town already. Q And if you can, just describe for me where 22 physically at the scene you spoke to Robert 23 McGee. 24 else's vehicle? 25 A Was it near your vehicle, someone We were standing outside by the white male's Page 24 1 car. 2 remember the color of it. 3 the two females in this case were in. 4 Q I believe it was a green car. I don't It's the one that When you were speaking to Robert McGee, was 5 there anybody else present for your 6 conversation with him? 7 A No, sir. 8 Q So it was just you and him, correct? 9 A Uh-huh (yes). 10 Q Is that a yes? 11 A Yes, sir. 12 Q Thank you. When you were speaking to Robert 13 McGee, were the two white males still in their 14 car? 15 A I don't remember. 16 Q Do you remember the car they were driving? 17 A I want to say it's a green Honda. 18 remember. I don't I want to say that's what it was. 19 Q Did you see two girls at the scene? 20 A Yes, sir. 21 Q And can you tell me where they were present? 22 A They were in the back seat of the car. 23 Q Of whose car? 24 A Of the two white males. 25 Q And please tell me what -- was there anybody Page 25 1 else present for your conversation with Robert 2 McGee? 3 A No, sir. 4 Q Please tell me what you said to him and what he 5 6 said to you. A Well, I asked him -- I said -- you know, I 7 asked him -- I said, "What are you all doing 8 here?" 9 vehicle." He said, "Well, we had stopped a I said, "Oh, I thought Ben had 10 stopped it." 11 vehicle." 12 off, and I noticed that he had put the two 13 female subjects in the back of his unit and 14 drove off to the station, to the Mamou police 15 station. 16 Q 17 18 He said, "No. I said, "Okay." We had found the Then I was walking At what point in time did he put the females into his unit? A Not too long -- while I was walking to my unit 19 to leave, that's when I noticed them getting 20 into the vehicle, into his car. 21 my radio on scan, and he said he was bringing 22 two females to the police station. 23 Q 24 25 And then I had I just want to make sure I understand. were speaking to Mr. McGee, correct? A Uh-huh (yes). So you Page 26 1 Q 2 And was there anything more to your conversation that you described? 3 A No. 4 Q Did you start walking away towards your 5 vehicle? 6 A Yes, sir. 7 Q And as you were walking towards your vehicle, 8 is that when you noticed that he took the 9 females out of the car and put them into his 10 11 unit? A Well, when I got -- well, it was really when I 12 got into my vehicle getting ready to back out. 13 That's when I noticed the two female subjects 14 get into his unit, and he was taking them to 15 the PD. 16 Q 17 18 I heard it on my radio. Do you know why he was taking the females to the PD? A Well, once I got to the PD, because I went over 19 there to see what was going on, he told me that 20 he was bringing them there for Mr. West to come 21 and pick them up, and he said he wanted to 22 scare them. 23 Q We'll get to that next. I just want to make 24 sure I got everything covered at the scene. 25 you told me that you spoke to Deputy Bordelon So Page 27 1 at the scene, correct? 2 A Correct. 3 Q And you spoke to Officer McGee at the scene, 4 correct? 5 A Correct. 6 Q Did you ever speak to Officer Lavergne at the 7 8 scene? A 9 No, sir. Because about that time Mr. Lavergne was leaving to go on to another call. When I 10 got there, I seen him there, but he was walking 11 to his unit to leave. 12 Q So you never had a chance to talk to him? 13 A No, sir. 14 Q Did you ever speak to the two male subjects in 15 16 the car? A 17 No, sir. I just looked at them to see who they were, but I didn't talk to them. 18 Q Did you recognize them? 19 A No, sir. 20 Q Did you ever speak to the two females at the 21 scene? 22 A No, sir. 23 Q Did you ever get a look at them at the scene? 24 A Yes, sir. 25 Q Can you describe for me how it was that you got Page 28 1 2 a look at them? A 3 I mean, I was standing right by the car when I talked to Mr. McGee. 4 Q So did you look inside the car at them? 5 A Yes, sir. I mean, I could see -- right when I 6 walked up I could see them in the car. 7 that's the first thing you do. 8 Q 9 Okay. Did you see their faces or just their silhouettes? 10 A I could see their faces. 11 Q If you saw their faces again, would you 12 13 I mean, recognize them? A It's a good possibility I would. I know one 14 had a -- she's a -- I want to say she's a 15 redhead, and the other one is a brunette. 16 Q Could you see what they were wearing? 17 A No, sir. 18 Q Sir, I'm going to show you what's been earlier 19 marked in another deposition as an Exhibit. 20 One is P0068 and P0070, and another one is 21 Bates Number P0123 and P0125. 22 you to look at these photos, and then tell me 23 one way or another whether you recognize these 24 females as the females that were on the scene. 25 A I'm going to ask Well, this one kind of looks like the one. Page 29 1 Q 2 And by this one, I just want to make sure. You're tapping your finger on Page P0123? 3 A Yes, sir. 4 Q So she looks like one of the women in the car? 5 A Yes, sir. 6 7 of does. Q 8 9 That's fair. Do you recognize the woman in P0068? A 10 11 From what I can remember, she kind She looks familiar. She looks like she could be the other one, but I'm not certain on it. Q Okay. That's fair enough. And, again, before 12 we get to the police department, we're still at 13 the scene. 14 the scene of the stop? Did you ever speak to Mr. West at 15 A No, sir. 16 Q Did you see Mr. West present at the scene of 17 the stop? 18 A No, sir. 19 Q Did Officer McGee ever tell you that the women 20 21 in the car worked for Craig West? A 22 23 I'm sorry about that. Mr. West over there. Q 24 25 Wait. I did see He did drive up there. When in the story that you've told me so far at the scene of the stop did he arrive? A I want to say Mr. West had arrived -- I think Page 30 1 he was there already. I remember seeing him. 2 Q Okay. 3 A I'm not sure, but I remember seeing him. 4 Q But you remember seeing him at the scene of the 5 stop, correct? 6 A Right. 7 Q Did you ever speak to Mr. West at the scene of 8 the stop? 9 A No, sir. 10 Q Do you remember where you remember seeing him 11 12 at the scene? A 13 14 I don't remember. I remember seeing his face at the scene. Q 15 Do you remember whether he was standing by himself or whether he was talking to anybody? 16 A I think he was standing by himself. 17 Q And do you remember where he was standing? 18 A It was -- I think somewhere around that car 19 20 that was stopped. Q Again, talking about the scene of the stop now, 21 did Officer McGee at the scene of the stop ever 22 tell you that the women worked for Craig West? 23 A No, sir, but we kind of figured that out. 24 Q How did you figure that out? 25 A Because we knew that he had, you know, some Page 31 1 workers working for him. 2 was mentioned on that call, but I'm not sure. 3 Q 4 And I want to say it When you say the call, you mean over the dispatch? 5 A Right. 6 Q Who was the dispatcher who put in the call? 7 A I'm not sure. 8 Q Was that a dispatcher from the Evangeline 9 Parish Sheriff's Office? 10 A Yes, sir. 11 Q Do you remember who was on duty that night? 12 A No, sir, I don't remember. 13 Q That's fine. 14 15 say that Mr. West was in charge of the women? A I want to say that's what he said, but I'm not 16 sure. 17 sure. 18 Did you ever hear Officer McGee Q I'm not going to say yes because I'm not Did you ever hear anyone else at the scene of 19 the stop say that Mr. West was in charge of the 20 women? 21 MR. BAYARD: 22 the form. 23 charge? 24 25 You specifically used the word MR. BEHAR: A No, sir. I'm going to object to In charge. It's a quote. Page 32 1 MR. BEHAR: 2 Q 3 (CONTINUING) Did you ever hear anyone at the scene of the stop say any words like that or to that effect? 4 A No, sir. 5 Q Did you ever hear Officer McGee say that the 6 women didn't have permission to leave 7 Mr. West's property? 8 A I don't remember hearing that. 9 Q Did you ever hear words to that effect? 10 A No, sir. 11 Q Did you ever hear anyone else at the scene of Not at the stop, no. 12 the stop say that the women didn't have 13 permission to leave Mr. West's property? 14 A No, sir. 15 Q At the scene of the stop, did you ever hear 16 anyone say that the women were being taken to 17 the hospital? 18 A Yes, sir. I heard that they were supposed to 19 be getting taken to Savoy Medical in Mamou to 20 do a rape kit. 21 Q And who told you that? 22 A I want to -- it was Robert McGee. 23 Q And that happened at the scene of the stop, 24 25 right? A Right. Before I left, yeah. We did talk about Page 33 1 2 that. Q Did you ever hear Robert McGee at the scene of 3 the stop say anything about the women engaging 4 in sexual intercourse or sexual activity or 5 words to that effect? 6 A No, sir, but I'm trying to remember how the 7 rape kit thing came about. 8 trying to remember. 9 about that those guys probably was trying to go 10 That's what I'm I think it was mentioned and have sex with them or something like that. 11 Q And who mentioned that? 12 A Robert McGee. 13 Q Did you ever hear anyone else at the scene of 14 the stop talk about taking the women to the 15 hospital? 16 A No, sir. 17 Q Did you ever hear anyone else at the scene of 18 the stop talk about the women engaging in 19 sexual activity or sexual intercourse or words 20 to that effect? 21 A I think one of the drivers had said that that's 22 what they were going to do, that they had 23 picked them up to, he said, go chill with them 24 like that. 25 Q Did you ever talk to one of the drivers? Page 34 1 A Well, whenever I got there, Robert was talking 2 to them, whenever I approached Robert. 3 got to Robert and we started having a 4 conversation, the guy backed off and stood by 5 the car. 6 Q When I So did you hear the conversation or part of the 7 conversation between Sergeant McGee and one of 8 the men in the car? 9 A 10 Yes, sir. While I was walking towards them, I overheard it. 11 Q Was it the driver or the passenger? 12 A I'm not sure. 13 Q And tell me what you heard. 14 A I heard him -- while I was walking there, I 15 heard him ask what were you all doing and stuff 16 like that. 17 them up to go and chill with them. 18 asked them where you all met them, and he said 19 at Wal-Mart. 20 heard. 21 Robert. 22 Q And the guy said we were picking And that was that. Robert That's all I When I got there, I started talking to But you didn't hear the man in the car say that 23 he picked them up to go have sex with them or 24 anything like that; you heard he picked them up 25 to chill with them, right? Page 35 1 A Right. 2 Q Are those the words he used, to chill with 3 them? 4 A Right. 5 Q At the scene of the stop, did you hear anyone 6 say anything about causing an international 7 incident or words to that effect? 8 A No, sir. 9 Q At the scene of the stop, did you ever hear 10 Sergeant McGee say that Craig West had asked 11 that the women be taken to the police station 12 to scare them? 13 A Where was this you said? 14 Q At the scene of the stop. 15 A Yes, sir. 16 Q Okay. 17 A No, no, no, no. 18 Q Did you ever hear anyone at the scene of the Hold on. Not at the stop, no. 19 stop say that the women were being taken to the 20 Mamou PD to scare them? 21 A No, sir. 22 Q Did you ever hear Sergeant McGee say that he 23 was taking the women to the Mamou Police 24 Department? 25 A Over the radio. Page 36 1 Q After you got back in your car? 2 A Right. 3 Q Did you ever hear anyone else say that? 4 A No, sir. 5 Q At the scene of the stop, did you ever hear 6 anyone say why they were being taken to the 7 Mamou Police Department? 8 A No, sir. 9 Q And as you sit here today, do you know one way 10 or another whether they were ever taken to a 11 hospital or an emergency room? 12 A 13 14 I don't know if Mr. West brought them or what. Q 15 16 I know they wasn't taken by an officer. And how is it that you know that they weren't taken by an officer? A Because right after the stop -- well, during 17 the stop whenever I was going to leave when 18 they calmed them down, when Robert said he was 19 going to the PD, I then went to the PD to find 20 out what was going on from Robert. 21 Q Why? 22 A That's usually how we do. I mean, when it's 23 late night like that, we usually go to the 24 Mamou PD anyway and drink some coffee. 25 Q So did you go straight from the scene of the Page 37 1 stop to the Mamou Police Department? 2 A Yes, sir. 3 Q When you arrived at the Mamou Police 4 5 Department, who was present? A 6 7 Robert McGee, Lucas Lavergne and the two ladies. Q 8 Did you see anybody else at the Mamou Police Department when you got there? 9 A No, sir. 10 Q And where were the two ladies? 11 A In the booking room. 12 Q Where in the booking room? 13 A They were sitting on the bench in the booking 14 room. 15 Q And where was Robert McGee? 16 A Him and Lucas Lavergne were both in the booking 17 room. 18 Q And where were they in the booking room? 19 A They were sitting down by the computers on the 20 right side, and the girls were on the left 21 side. 22 Q Did you go into the booking room? 23 A Yes, sir. 24 Q When you went into the booking room, did you 25 see what the women were wearing at that time? Page 38 1 A One had on, I want to say, a shirt and some 2 shorts, and I think the other one had on a 3 shirt and some pants. 4 Q 5 6 Did it look to you like either one of them was wearing pajamas? A 7 Yeah, that's what it was. It sure was pajamas. You're right. 8 Q Do you remember which one was wearing pajamas? 9 A The redhead. 10 Q Okay. 11 That's all I know. When you went into the booking room, did you have any conversations with Robert McGee? 12 A Yes, I did. 13 Q And did you have a conversation with him in the 14 booking room? 15 A Yes, sir. 16 Q Was Officer Lavergne present for that 17 18 conversation? A 19 Yes, sir, but before we could finish up, he had to go on another call. 20 Q Tell me what Robert McGee said to you. 21 A Well, I asked him why they brought the girls 22 here, and he told me that Mr. West wanted him 23 to scare them because they shouldn't go out 24 late like they did and snuck off. 25 he told me. That's what Page 39 1 Q And did you say anything to him? 2 A I told him that you can't do that, you know, 3 like that. And he said Mr. West said he was 4 going to be here soon to come and get them. 5 Like that. 6 Q Did Robert McGee say anything else to you? 7 A No. 8 Q Did you say anything else to him? 9 A I remember he was talking about the incident 10 like with the -- you know, what the guy was 11 telling him about the girls, that he had went 12 over there to pick up the girls and stuff like 13 that. 14 what we just talked about now. 15 Q Okay. He was just talking about, you know, And I know we just talked about it, but 16 to the best of your memory, can you tell me 17 what Robert McGee told you at the police 18 station? 19 A Well, he told me that Mr. -- that he talked to 20 the guy, and the guy told him they met at 21 Wal-Mart. So he just -- 22 Q And who is the guy? 23 A The driver of the car. 24 Q Okay. 25 A And the guy was just telling him -- you know, Page 40 1 again he repeated that they met the girls at 2 Wal-Mart and they went to pick up the girls. 3 The girls called them to go and chill. 4 what he said. That's 5 Q Okay. 6 A And he said that he had spoke with Mr. West. 7 Mr. West told him to bring them to the station 8 and scare them. 9 was getting ready to leave, but Lucas had That's what he told me. And I 10 already left, so I stayed with Robert because 11 you're supposed to have two officers anytime 12 it's females. 13 Q 14 15 Did you have any other discussions with Robert McGee in the booking room? A No, sir. I sat down and I was on the computer. 16 And he started trying to talk to the female 17 girls, but they didn't speak any English. 18 Q 19 20 Can you tell me, please, what he was saying to the females? A He was asking them if they speak English and 21 stuff like that. And he was -- well, he was 22 asking them if they speak English. 23 of understood him a little bit. 24 while, I mean, he just started -- he just kept 25 trying to talk to them. They kind And after a Then after a while he Page 41 1 took his phone out, and he was trying to get a 2 number from one of the girls, trying to get 3 their phone number. 4 Q Did he take his cell phone out? 5 A Yes, sir. 6 Q Can you tell me what he said or what he did 7 that made you think that he was trying to get 8 one of their phone numbers? 9 A He was saying -- he was trying to say the 10 numbers in Spanish, I guess. 11 to say it, but that's what he was trying to 12 say. 13 Q 14 I don't know how Was he trying to say the word number, or was he trying to -- 15 A The word number. 16 Q And was he talking to both of the females or 17 18 one of the females? A I want to say it was one of them. I'm not sure 19 because he kept going back and forth, you know, 20 to talk to both of them. 21 had my back turned at the time. So I'm not sure. 22 Q But you could hear what he was saying? 23 A Yeah. 24 25 And when I turned, I seen him with his phone. Q I He had his phone out? Page 42 1 A Right. 2 Q And is it your impression that he was trying to 3 get a phone number from one of the girls? 4 A Yes, sir. 5 Q Do you know for what reason? 6 A I'm sure I can think of a reason, you know, 7 8 but... Q 9 10 one of the phone numbers from the girls? A 11 12 Well, why do you believe he was trying to get To talk to them, I'm sure. To try to talk to them. Q At the police station, did Robert McGee ever 13 say anything to you about Mr. West being in 14 charge of the women? 15 A Yes, sir, he did. 16 Q What did he say? 17 A He told me that Mr. West was coming to -- well, 18 he didn't say in charge, but he said their boss 19 was coming. 20 Q 21 22 That's what he told me. Do you remember anything else he said about that topic? A He was -- no. He was just staying that 23 Mr. West wanted him to scare them. That's all 24 he said on that topic, that he wanted him to 25 scare them and he was coming to get them. Page 43 1 Q At the police station, did Officer McGee -- did 2 you ever hear him say that the women didn't 3 have permission to leave Mr. West's property? 4 A Yes, sir. 5 Q And what is it he said? 6 A He said that they never asked Mr. West if they 7 8 could leave. Q 9 That's what he told me. At the police station, did Sergeant McGee ever tell you that the men in the car couldn't have 10 taken the women off Mr. West's property without 11 Mr. West's approval or words to that effect? 12 A He said that -- pretty much to that effect 13 because he said they were trespassing because 14 it was Mr. West's property. 15 Q 16 And did he say that the women couldn't leave the property without Mr. West's approval? 17 A Yes, he did. 18 Q Do you remember anything else that Sergeant 19 McGee said at the police station while you were 20 there? 21 A No, sir. 22 Q Did you ever see Sergeant McGee laugh at the 23 women? 24 A Yes, sir. 25 Q Can you describe what he did? Page 44 1 A He was just trying to go -- I guess trying to 2 joke with them, and they were just laughing 3 because I guess they -- they were just smiling 4 because they didn't know what he was talking 5 about, I guess. 6 Q How long were you at the police station for? 7 A Until Mr. West came. 8 Q Okay. 9 A It must have been about ten minutes. 10 Q While you were at the police station, did you 11 get an opportunity to observe the women's 12 demeanor or composure? 13 A Yes, sir. 14 Q Can you describe for me what their demeanor or 15 16 composure was at the police station? A Well, they were scared. I could tell they were 17 scared. 18 little bit, and you could tell they were 19 nervous. 20 Q One of them was crying, crying a And I know this happened a while ago and I'm 21 testing your memory a little bit, but could you 22 tell me which one was crying? 23 it was the one in the pajamas or the other one? Do you know if 24 A The other one was crying. 25 Q Did you ever hear or see Sergeant McGee laugh Page 45 1 2 at the woman who was crying? A 3 4 No, sir. He was trying to tell her that everything was going to be all right, you know. Q 5 Did you ever see Sergeant McGee wave any handcuffs in front of the women's faces? 6 A Yes, sir. 7 Q Could you describe what he did, please? 8 A One of them had pointed towards him. I guess they were pointing towards his cuffs. So he 9 10 took his cuffs out and showed them. 11 said -- he kind of went by them and said, you 12 know, "This is if you go to jail," you know, 13 like that. 14 taser. 15 taser or not, but he did take his taser out. 16 Q 17 18 And he And then afterwards he took out his And I don't remember if he arced his I don't know what arced his taser means. Does that mean to discharge it? A Yeah. He discharged it. You take the 19 cartridge off. And if you press the button, it 20 will start shocking. 21 electrical current running through the gun, the 22 taser gun. It will show you the 23 Q And did you see Sergeant McGee do that? 24 A I don't remember if he did, but I was told that 25 if he did do it that -- the chief said that if Page 46 1 he did, it wouldn't show up on the report 2 because he was going to give a different taser 3 report. 4 Q 5 When did you have that conversation with the chief? 6 A After we left here for the first deposition. 7 Q I just want to make sure that I understand your 8 testimony, sir. While you were at the police 9 station, during the time, you know, you were 10 there -- and I apologize if I asked this 11 before -- do you remember as you sit here today 12 whether you were at the police station for five 13 minutes, ten minutes, fifteen minutes? 14 A 15 I think it -- I'm not too sure, but I want to say about ten minutes. 16 Q Okay. 17 A It wasn't that long. 18 Q While you were at the police station, did you 19 actually see Sergeant McGee take his taser out? 20 A Yes, sir. 21 Q Did you actually see Sergeant McGee put the 22 taser in front of the women's faces? 23 A Yes, sir. 24 Q Did you see Sergeant McGee arc his taser? 25 A I don't remember. I don't remember if he arced Page 47 1 it, but I remember the women kind of, you know, 2 doing like they were scared of it. 3 Q So you remember the women, and you just, you 4 know, did a gesture. So I want to make sure 5 that the record is correct. 6 and correct me if I'm wrong -- that the 7 movement you just made is that when Sergeant 8 McGee took out his taser and put it in the 9 women's face, they kind of leaned back? It looked to me -- 10 A Yes, sir. 11 Q Okay. 12 A That's when I kind of -- you know, I looked at 13 him like, you know, what are you doing, you 14 know. And after a while, he put it up. 15 Q Did you say anything to Sergeant McGee? 16 A No, sir. 17 Q This is me just not knowing any better. 18 When you arc a taser, does it make a noise? 19 A Yes, sir. 20 Q And you said you had a conversation with the 21 22 It makes a popping noise. chief about Robert McGee taking his taser out? A Well, we all did. Once we left here -- once we 23 left this office here, we got in the truck, and 24 they had a conversation about it. 25 Q And when you say this office here, you mean Page 48 1 Borne and Wilkes? 2 A Yes, sir. 3 Q And do you remember when this was? 4 A I'm not sure, but they should have it on file. 5 Q And you said you went into a truck, right? 6 A The chief's truck. 7 We all came in the chief's truck. 8 Q What's the chief's name? 9 A Greg Dupuis. 10 Q And you say you all. 11 12 So who else was in the truck? A 13 Myself, Lucas Lavergne, Robert McGee and the chief. 14 Q And tell me what the chief said. 15 A He said -- he told Robert -- he said, "Look, if 16 you did arc your taser, we're going to give 17 them a different taser report. 18 somebody else's taser." We'll just use 19 Q What did Robert McGee say, if anything? 20 A He said, "Okay. That will work." He said, 21 "Because I don't remember if I did arc my taser 22 or not." 23 Q Did Lucas Lavergne say anything in the truck? 24 A No, sir. 25 Q Did you say anything? Page 49 1 A No, sir. 2 Q How long were you in the truck for with the 3 chief and Lucas and Robert? 4 A Oh, we rode here, so, I mean, about an hour. 5 Q Oh, so you guys all came together? 6 A Right. 7 Q I understand. 8 And so you were leaving all together? 9 A Right. 10 Q Did -- 11 MR. WILKES: 12 You all came here from Mamou? 13 THE WITNESS: 14 MR. BEHAR: 15 Q 16 Right. (CONTINUING) As best you can remember, sir, did the chief say anything else about the taser in the truck? 17 A No, sir. 18 Q As best you can remember, did Robert McGee say 19 20 anything else about the taser in the truck? A He was telling the chief, "I don't remember if 21 I did, Chief, but it will probably be best to 22 get somebody's else's taser." 23 Q Anything else that you remember? 24 A Nothing else. 25 Q Back to the police station on the night of the Page 50 1 incident, did you ever see Robert McGee make 2 any gesture or movement to indicate that he was 3 going to handcuff the women to the bench? 4 A Yes, sir. 5 Q Can you describe what you saw, please? 6 A I mean, he did like this with his arm, like he 7 was putting the cuffs on his arm, and he showed 8 them how the other cuff would go hook to the 9 bench. 10 Q And so that the record is clear, you just made 11 a gesture. 12 McGee did? Are you repeating what Sergeant 13 A Yes, sir. 14 Q So he took one hand, and he had the handcuffs 15 in his hand? 16 A Right. 17 Q So his handcuffs were out, correct? 18 A Yes, sir. 19 Q And he touched the handcuffs to his wrist on 20 his other arm? 21 A Yes, sir. 22 Q And then did he point to the bench? 23 A Yes, sir. 24 Q And I can show you, but as I understand it, 25 there are chains underneath the bench, correct? Page 51 1 A Yes, sir. 2 Q Did he point to the bench or to the chains on 3 the bench, if you know? 4 A To the chains on the bench. 5 Q As I understand it, too, there's a metal arch 6 on the counter in the booking room? 7 A Yes, sir. 8 Q Did you ever see Sergeant McGee point to one of 9 the women's wrists and then point to that metal 10 arch? 11 A Yes, sir. 12 Q And describe for me what you saw, please. 13 A Well, one of them he showed, you know, the 14 cuffs that would be to the bench, and he showed 15 the other one his wrist being on that arch. 16 Q 17 So to one woman he pointed to -- he had the handcuffs in his hands, correct? 18 A Yes, sir. 19 Q So the handcuffs were out? 20 A Yes, sir. 21 Q And to one woman, he took the handcuffs, 22 pointed to his wrist and then pointed to the 23 chairs on the bench, correct? 24 A Yes, sir. 25 Q And to the other one, he took his handcuffs, Page 52 1 pointed them to his wrist and then pointed it 2 to the metal arch on the counter? 3 A Correct. 4 Q As you sit here today, do you remember which 5 6 one he did with which? A Yes, sir. 7 the bench. 8 arch. 9 Q The redhead, he pointed toward the The brunette, he did towards the And so that the record is clear -- and I know 10 you don't understand the names -- the one that 11 you keep describing as the redhead, was she the 12 one in the pajamas? 13 A Yes, sir. 14 Q Thank you. Did you ever hear Sergeant McGee 15 say the word sleeping while you were at the 16 police station? 17 A No, sir. 18 Q Did you ever hear or see Sergeant McGee say or 19 do anything to indicate that the women were 20 going to have to sleep on the bench while 21 handcuffed? 22 A Yes, sir, I sure did. 23 Q Can you describe that for me, please? 24 A I forgot what he was talking about, but I 25 remember him making a sound like, you know, Page 53 1 going to sleep on the bench. 2 the bench. 3 was. 4 Q 5 6 And he pointed to I'm not sure what the conversation I don't remember the conversation. And did he make a sound or did he make a gesture? A He was kind of trying to -- like he was trying 7 to talk and make them understand, you know, 8 kind of talking slow about it, about them -- 9 the girl laying down on the bench. I think one 10 of them actually did lay down on the bench. 11 I'm not sure. 12 Q 13 14 Did you ever hear Sergeant McGee say the word a Mexico or a Mexico to the women? A He said a lot of stuff trying to talk their 15 language, but I'm not sure all what he was 16 saying. 17 Q I wasn't following him. Well, let me ask you this: Did you ever hear 18 Robert McGee say anything or did you ever see 19 Robert McGee do anything to try and indicate or 20 suggest that the women were going to be sent 21 back to Mexico? 22 A Yes. 23 Q Can you tell me as best you can remember what 24 25 He said something about deporting. Robert McGee said? A He was trying to talk language saying -- Page 54 1 deporte is what he kept saying. 2 Q Deporte? 3 A That's how he was saying it, right. 4 Q And what did you personally understand that to 5 mean? 6 A Getting deported. 7 Q And was he talking to the women when he was 8 saying this? 9 A Yes, sir. 10 Q Was he making any gestures or any movements 11 with his body while he was saying it? 12 A Yes. 13 Q Pointing away? 14 A Yeah. 15 16 He was pointing like away. Like to show them that, you know, away, like a gesture with his fingers. Q And, again, so that the record reflects this, 17 it looked to me like you picked up your arm and 18 you took your hand with your finger pointed and 19 kind of waved it behind your head? 20 A 21 Right. He pointed at like a different way from where they were. 22 Q Like pointing it away from them? 23 A Right. 24 Q I understand. 25 Did you ever hear Sergeant McGee say the words let's go Mexico or yes to Mexico, Page 55 1 anything like that? 2 A No, sir. 3 Q Did you ever hear Sergeant McGee say anything 4 or did you ever see him do anything to suggest 5 or indicate that the women were going to be 6 deported or sent back to Mexico because they 7 had left Mr. West's property? 8 A Yes, sir. 9 Q And describe that for me, please. 10 A He was telling them that they can't do stuff 11 like that because Mr. West will have them 12 deported. That's what he was telling them. 13 Q So he said Mr. West would have them deported? 14 A Right. 15 Q Do you remember anything else that Sergeant 16 McGee said about Mr. West having them deported 17 at the police station? 18 A 19 He said that Mr. West was going to be mad that they snuck out. 20 Q Anything else? 21 A That was it. 22 Q Did you ever hear -- the woman that you've been 23 describing in the pajamas, did you ever hear 24 her say the words trailer, jeans? 25 A Yeah. I remember hearing something about a Page 56 1 trailer and something about jeans. 2 understand what she was talking about. 3 Q 4 I didn't Do you remember her saying the word trailer or trying to say the word trailer? 5 A Yeah. 6 Q Do you remember her saying the word jeans or 7 trying to say the word jeans? 8 A Yes, sir. 9 Q Were you looking at her when you heard those 10 words? 11 A Yes, sir. 12 Q And was she making any gestures or movement 13 14 when she was saying them? A 15 16 I don't remember, but I remember her saying it. But I don't remember. Q 17 Did you ever hear Sergeant McGee say no trailer? 18 A Yeah. Yes, sir, I did. 19 Q You've just been telling me, you know, the 20 words that you heard Sergeant McGee say and 21 some of the gestures that you saw Sergeant 22 McGee make at the police station? 23 A Uh-huh (yes). 24 Q My question to you, sir, is earlier you told me 25 that Lucas Lavergne was also present at the Page 57 1 police station, correct? 2 A Right. 3 Q Was Lucas Lavergne present for everything 4 you've just described to me that Sergeant McGee 5 said and did? 6 A No, sir. 7 Q Do you remember when he left the police 8 9 He was on the road on a call. station? A About the same time I went in -- well, me and 10 Mr. McGee started talking about why the women 11 were here. 12 Q He had done left. He got a call. So did Sergeant Lavergne -- it sounds like 13 Sergeant Lavergne left shortly after you 14 arrived? 15 A Correct. 16 Q And he left when you were still talking to 17 Sergeant McGee after you first arrived? 18 A Yes, sir. 19 Q You remember when he came back? 20 A I think he came back the same -- almost the 21 22 same time Mr. West did. Q Was Sergeant Lavergne present for any of the 23 actions that you've just told me that Sergeant 24 McGee took? 25 A No, sir. Page 58 1 Q 2 Did you ever see Sergeant Lavergne laughing at the women? 3 A No, sir. 4 Q Did you ever hear Sergeant Lavergne say that 5 the women didn't have permission to leave 6 Mr. West's property? 7 A No, sir. 8 Q Did you ever hear Sergeant Lavergne say the 9 words no permission to the women? 10 A No, sir. 11 Q Did you ever hear Sergeant Lavergne say to the 12 women that they weren't to leave their 13 employer's premises? 14 A No. 15 Q Did you ever see Sergeant Lavergne say the word 16 Mexico to the women and wave like they were 17 going to be sent back? 18 A No. 19 Q Anything to that effect? 20 A Nothing. 21 Q Did you ever hear Sergeant Lavergne say the 22 words gringos malos or words to that effect? 23 A No, sir, I don't remember hearing that. 24 Q Did you ever hear Sergeant Lavergne tell the 25 women or say to the women that there were Page 59 1 gringos malos who killed Mexicans? 2 A No, sir, I don't remember hearing that. 3 Q Did you ever hear Sergeant Lavergne say the 4 words gringos locos or anything to that effect? 5 A No. 6 Q Did you ever see Sergeant Lavergne make a 7 gesture where he ran his finger across his neck 8 like he was slicing a throat? 9 A 10 11 No, sir. It was Officer Robert McGee that did that. Q You didn't tell me about that before. Maybe 12 that's because I didn't ask the right question. 13 So could you please describe what you saw? 14 A Mr. McGee told the women that -- well, it was 15 when Mr. West came in. He told the women -- 16 while he was walking, he told the women that 17 you got to be careful who you come across 18 because people -- you know, there's killers and 19 murderers and stuff like that that will try to 20 harm you. That's what Robert told them. 21 Q So this was after Mr. West arrived? 22 A Right. 23 Q And you witnessed this yourself, correct? 24 A Correct. 25 Q Did this happen in the booking room? Page 60 1 A Yes, sir. 2 Q So when this particular part of the story 3 happened, you were in the booking room, 4 correct? 5 A Right. 6 Q The women were still in the booking room; is 7 that correct? 8 A Correct. 9 Q Sergeant McGee was in the booking room? 10 A Yes, sir. 11 Q Was Sergeant Lavergne in the booking room? 12 A No. 13 Q Had he come back yet? 14 A Yeah. 15 16 He had went to the dispatcher's office. He passed through to the dispatch. Q 17 So he was at the police station, but not in the booking room? 18 A Right. 19 Q And where was Sergeant McGee standing when he 20 21 said this and made this gesture? A 22 He was standing in the back almost by the exit door. 23 Q And were the women still on the bench? 24 A Yes. 25 Q And where was Mr. West standing? Page 61 1 A Mr. West was just getting into the room. 2 Q And can you show me to the best of your memory 3 the gesture that Robert McGee made? 4 A (Witness indicating.) 5 Q So it was with his thumb? 6 A Right. 7 Q And so that the record is clear, what you just 8 showed me is you took your hand, you raised 9 your thumb, and you took your thumb and ran it 10 11 across your throat? A 12 13 Yes, sir. As if being cut in the neck by a knife. Q 14 When he did that, were you in a position to see the women's reaction? 15 A Yes, sir. 16 Q And how did they react? 17 A They were kind of scared and kind of leaned 18 back, you know, as like showing like they were 19 scared of what he showed them. 20 Q 21 Did you ever see Sergeant Lavergne point his finger at the women and mimic shooting them? 22 A No. 23 Q Did you ever see Sergeant McGee do that? 24 A It was something with a shotgun. 25 something about a shotgun. I remember I remember bits and Page 62 1 pieces of it, but I don't remember if he made a 2 gesture about it. 3 getting -- somebody getting shot, and I forgot 4 what it was. 5 Q 6 He was talking about Do you remember anything about what it was or more than what you just told me? 7 A No, sir. 8 Q Was it Sergeant McGee who was saying something 9 10 about a shotgun? A I believe it was -- I remember they -- whenever 11 Mr. West came in, it was -- they was talking 12 about, you know, people that can -- he just was 13 continuing on about people that can -- like 14 stuff happens, you know, bad stuff can happen 15 to them, stuff like that. 16 Robert saying something about people get 17 killed. 18 kind of -- like a shotgun gesture like. And I remember He made a gesture, and he made some 19 Q Oh, so he made like a shotgun gesture? 20 A Yeah. 21 22 When he kept talking about the subject about being killed. Q And you just made the gesture, but, again, I 23 want the record to be clear. 24 like you picked up both hands, correct? 25 A Right. It looked to me Page 63 1 Q And you had the shoulder up -- 2 A Yes, sir. 3 Q -- on one arm, and you pulled a trigger, 4 correct? 5 A Right. Correct. 6 Q And with the other arm, you made it look like 7 you were holding the barrel of a shotgun, 8 correct? 9 A Yes, sir. 10 Q Did you ever see Sergeant Lavergne mimic 11 shoveling a hole in the ground? 12 A No, sir. 13 Q And could you describe for me what you saw? 14 A He made a gesture like he was holding a shovel 15 16 and digging in the dirt as if to bury somebody. Q 17 18 It was Sergeant McGee. And were the women still sitting on the bench at this point? A Yes, sir. They were looking -- you know, they 19 were pretty scared, you know, when he started 20 doing that. 21 what it was, but I know they were frightened. And there was something. 22 Q Was Mr. West present for that? 23 A I don't think so. 24 25 present. Q I forgot I'm not sure if he was I don't remember. You don't remember one way or the other whether Page 64 1 2 this was before or after Mr. West arrived? A 3 4 I want to say it was a little bit before he arrived. Q I'm not sure. After Sergeant Lavergne returned to the police 5 department, did he ever go back into the 6 booking room? 7 A No, sir. 8 Q So he went back to the police department and 9 went straight to the dispatch office? 10 A Correct. 11 Q At some point Mr. West arrived, right? 12 A Correct. 13 Q And do you believe that you were at the station 14 15 From what I can remember, yes. for about ten minutes when he arrived? A 16 I don't think I was there that long. He didn't really stay that long either. 17 Q Who left the station first? 18 A Mr. West. 19 Q So you were there the entire time that Mr. West 20 You or Mr. West? was there? 21 A Correct. 22 Q Did you hear anything that Mr. West said after 23 24 25 he got to the police station? A He had came with some passports, I guess it was, you know, showing us like, you know, that Page 65 1 he have -- that he like has control -- not to 2 say control, but I guess you can say custody or 3 whatever. 4 what he told us. 5 the ones that he had. 6 passports, you know, and something about they 7 wasn't supposed to be going out like they were. 8 Q 9 10 He's responsible for them. That's And he showed us a couple of And he showed us their And by their passports, you mean the women who were at the police station? A 11 The ones at the police station and all of the ones that he have. 12 Q How many passports did he have? 13 A Oh, I'm not sure. 14 Q To the best of your memory, what else did He had a good bit of them. 15 Mr. West say during the entire time he was at 16 the police station while you were present? 17 A He was just really agreeing with Robert, you 18 know, you can get hurt, you know, that they 19 shouldn't have left like they did. 20 the women, they were worried about -- you know, 21 they were scared of him coming because 22 something -- I don't know why, but they was 23 more scared of him. 24 mention his name, they were scared I guess 25 because they didn't want to get shipped back. And I know Every time Robert would Page 66 1 Q 2 3 women were scared of Mr. West? A 4 5 Is it your testimony that you believe that the Yes, sir. Scared of what he might say, you know. Q And I know it's a little bit hard to describe 6 these type of things, but to the best of your 7 ability, can you describe for me, you know, 8 what the women were doing or saying that made 9 you think that they were scared of Mr. West or 10 11 what he might do? A They were like shriveled up, you know, and they 12 kept looking at the door to see if he was 13 walking in. 14 Q Did Mr. West arrive alone? 15 A I think so. 16 Q Do you remember anything else that Mr. West 17 18 said at the police station? A 19 20 I don't remember nobody else. No, not right offhand. That's about everything he said. Q 21 At the police station, did Mr. West ever say the words mucho fucking? 22 A No. 23 Q At the police station, did you ever hear 24 25 Mr. West say the words mucho killing? A I don't know, sir. I don't remember that. Page 67 1 Q Do you remember anybody at the police station 2 saying the words mucho fucking or mucho 3 killing? 4 A I believe it was -- I think at one point 5 Mr. Lucas Lavergne did say that. 6 had came back. 7 from him. 8 Q 9 10 I think he I remember hearing that word So at some point -- was it before or after Mr. West arrived? A I think it was after Mr. West arrived. I think 11 he came around after, but I remember hearing 12 it. 13 remember hearing it from his mouth. 14 Q 15 You know, when you said that word, I Was Sergeant Lavergne in the booking room when he said these words? 16 A Yeah, he was. 17 Q So just so -- 18 A He had just came in. 19 Q He had just come in? 20 A Yes. 21 Q So when he said these words, the women were 22 still in the booking room; is that correct? 23 A Correct. 24 Q Were they still sitting at the bench? 25 A Correct. Page 68 1 Q And Mr. West was in the booking room? 2 A Yeah. 3 Q And you were in the booking room? 4 A Right. 5 Mr. West was standing more to the back almost by the exit door. 6 Q Of the booking room? 7 A Yeah. 8 Q Was he facing the booking room? 9 A Yeah. He was looking like -- let's say he's by 10 the door here. 11 deep, you know. 12 in. The booking room is kind of He was looking from the door 13 Q So he was looking into the booking room? 14 A Correct. 15 Q And was Sergeant McGee in the booking room? 16 A Yes. 17 Q And Sergeant Lavergne was in the booking room 18 when he said these words? 19 A Correct. 20 Q Did you see Sergeant Lavergne make any gesture 21 or make any movement while he was saying those 22 words? 23 A No, I don't remember him doing any gestures. 24 Q Did you see Sergeant Lavergne make any movement 25 or make any gestures towards the women at any Page 69 1 2 time he was in the booking room? A No. He was just trying to make them -- when he 3 said that, he was trying to make them 4 understand what Robert was trying to tell them. 5 And after that, there was nothing. 6 nothing else to do with it if you ask me. 7 don't remember anything else. 8 Q 9 He had I To the best of your memory, how long was Lucas Lavergne in the booking room after he came back 10 from the call? Like a minute, more, less? 11 A Maybe three to four minutes tops maybe. 12 Q Did you ever see Mr. West make any gesture or 13 any movement towards the women after he arrived 14 at the police station? 15 A I don't know. 16 Q Did you ever hear or see Mr. West say anything 17 18 to the women at the police station? A 19 20 I don't remember it. I remember he was talking to them, but I don't remember what he was saying. Q Other than everything you've described to me, 21 do you remember any other gesture or movement 22 that Sergeant McGee made at the police station 23 that could have been interpreted by the women 24 as threatening? 25 A I mean, the taser for one. I mean, if you Page 70 1 don't know it's a taser and it's pointing at 2 you, you know, that really scared them. 3 really scared the mess out of them. 4 handcuffs scared them, too, especially -- and 5 then the part about, you know, showing that 6 they was cutting the neck. 7 too. 8 Q 9 That And the That scared them, But the real thing was the taser. Did you ever see Craig West make any gesture or movement at the police station that could have 10 been interpreted by the women as threatening or 11 that scared them, that you believe scared them? 12 A No. They was just scared about -- he was mad 13 when he came in, you know, so they was just 14 looking at him, you know. 15 they were scared because he was mad. 16 Q 17 And they was just -- Did Mr. West appear to be mad to you when he arrived? 18 A Yes. 19 Q Did you have any conversation or any 20 discussions with Mr. West at the police 21 station? 22 A No. 23 Q Did you have any conversations or discussions 24 25 with Sergeant Lavergne at the police station? A No. Page 71 1 Q And you've already told me a little bit about 2 your conversations with Sergeant McGee at the 3 police station? 4 A Right. 5 Q Was there any other conversation you had with 6 him, anything else that he said to you or that 7 you said to him? 8 A 9 No, sir. I just went ahead and I sat there. just wanted to know why the women were being 10 brought there. Now, when he started doing 11 everything else, I didn't get involved with it 12 because I knew it was wrong. 13 Q Did you ever try talking to the women? 14 A No. 15 Q Did they ever try talking to you? 16 A One of them was trying to tell me something, 17 but I didn't get into it. 18 doing all of that, I didn't want to talk. 19 Q 20 21 Do you remember which one it was that was trying to talk to you? A 22 23 After he started The one that was not in the pajamas, the brunette. Q Do you remember -- and I know they don't speak 24 English. Do you remember any words, or what 25 made you think that she was trying to talk to I Page 72 1 2 you? A Because she was pointing to me. She was trying 3 to -- I didn't understand what she was saying. 4 I was just trying to tell her I don't speak 5 English, you know -- I mean, I don't speak 6 Spanish. 7 Q Was she pointing to you with her finger? 8 A Yeah. 9 Q Back to the truck in which, you know, you were 10 present with the chief and Sergeant McGee and 11 Sergeant Lucas. 12 the topic of the taser while you were all in 13 the truck, correct? You told me that you discussed 14 A Correct. 15 Q Did you discuss any of these other subjects or 16 incidents that we just mentioned while you were 17 in the truck? 18 A No. We was just talking about the taser. 19 Q Okay. 20 A And he asked him, you know, "Did you really, 21 you know, use the taser?" And Robert was like, 22 "No." 23 It's like I can remember it, but I'm not too 24 sure. 25 know like a while back we had to turn in some But I really believe he did arc it. But like the tasers -- I don't know -- I Page 73 1 tasers because -- well, they had turned in some 2 because they wasn't working right. 3 be one of them that was turned in and 4 destroyed. 5 some of us turn in our tasers, not everybody, 6 for them to go and put it on the computer to 7 see if it had been used. 8 Q 9 I don't know. So it could But they had had Do you know whether Sergeant McGee turned in his taser? 10 A I don't think so. 11 Q Did you see Sergeant McGee take his taser out 12 of the pouch or the holster? 13 A Yes, sir. 14 Q So as far as you're concerned, it was his taser 15 that he arced at the police station? 16 A Correct. 17 Q Do you remember when some of the Mamou Police 18 Department police officers had to turn in their 19 tasers for new ones? 20 A Well, it was like -- I remember they ordered 21 some new ones, and they said that they 22 destroyed some. 23 wasn't too long after that incident happened 24 because it happened whenever I went back to 25 Mamou PD when they did that with the tasers. That must have been -- it Page 74 1 Q 2 What make and model of taser did the Mamou Police Department use? 3 A X26, I believe it is. 4 Q And was that always the same make and model 5 they used? 6 A Always, but different serial numbers, yeah. 7 Q When they swapped out the old tasers for the 8 new tasers with some of the police officers, 9 was it still an X26? 10 A Right. 11 Q Did you ever write a report regarding what 12 13 happened at the police station? A Yeah. They had me write one. The chief had me 14 write one, but the report that I wrote is not 15 from what I'm telling you now because for the 16 simple fact I worked for the Mamou PD at the 17 time. 18 have, you know, told exactly what happened, 19 there's a good chance I would have been 20 terminated because the chief can just go there 21 and tell you you're fired. 22 service. 23 24 25 And we're not civil service. MR. BEHAR: If I would It's not civil Let's mark this as Zackery Deposition Exhibit Number 2. (EXHIBIT 2 WAS MARKED FOR Page 75 1 IDENTIFICATION AND IS ATTACHED.) 2 MR. BEHAR: 3 Q (CONTINUING) Sir, I'm handing you've what's been marked as 4 Zackery Deposition Exhibit Number 2, which was 5 handed to me earlier today by Mr. Wilkes. 6 There is no Bates number on this particular 7 document, but do you recognize this document, 8 sir? 9 A Yes, sir. 10 Q And what is this? 11 A This is the incident that occurred with the two 12 13 female subjects. Q 14 And is this the report that you just testified that you wrote? 15 A Yes, correct. 16 Q If I recall your testimony correctly, the chief 17 asked you to write this; is that correct? 18 A Correct. 19 Q And where were you when he asked you to write 20 21 this? A I was working at the Mamou PD in the booking 22 room. 23 report, and he told me I needed to do this. 24 25 Q I was in the booking room doing another Was there anybody else present in the booking room when he said that to you? Page 76 1 A No. 2 Q And as best you can remember, what exactly did 3 4 he tell you? A He told me that I needed to write a report on 5 what happened because they were going to have 6 to go to court for it, in case we have to go to 7 court, something like that. 8 Q Do you remember when he told you that? 9 A I don't remember when. 10 Q This incident that you've been testifying to 11 today happened on May 2nd, in the early morning 12 hours of May 2nd, 2011. 13 right to you? Does that sound about 14 A That sounds right. 15 Q How much later after May 2, 2011, did the chief 16 ask you to write a report? 17 A It must have been about -- it happened in May? 18 Q Yes. 19 MR. WILKES: Of 2011 now. 20 MR. BEHAR: (CONTINUING) 21 Q Of 2011. 22 A That was -- I went over there -- I went back So last May, not this past May. 23 over there around July, so it must have been 24 around August. 25 Q And if you could look on your report, the first Page 77 1 sentence on your report says, "On May 1, 2011, 2 I, former Evangeline Parish Deputy Zackery." 3 Do you see that, sir? 4 A Uh-huh (yes). 5 Q So at the time you wrote this report, you were 6 not with the Evangeline Parish Sheriff's Office 7 anymore? 8 A Correct. 9 Q At the time you wrote this report, were you an 10 officer with the Mamou Police Department? 11 A Right. 12 Q Where did you write this report? 13 A At the PD in the booking room. 14 That's where our computers are. 15 Q Do you remember which computer you used? 16 A Yes, sir. 17 in. 18 front. 19 side. 20 window. It was the one right when you walk It's facing you when you walk in the There's one in the front and one on the The one in the front facing the front 21 Q Facing the front window? 22 A Yes. 23 Q So unfortunately I did not bring the photos, 24 but in some photos that I've seen, you know, 25 and maybe when you worked there, you know, it Page 78 1 was there or it wasn't there, but I've seen 2 some photos of the booking room where there's a 3 blue filing cabinet. 4 filing cabinet? 5 A 6 7 Q The The other one. Okay. So the one that is closer to the glass partition? A 10 11 There's one by that one, but not that one. other one. 8 9 Do you remember the blue Yeah. But I can tell you this report is not correct. Q 12 So you wrote this report in response to the chief asking you to write a report, correct? 13 A Correct. 14 Q This report doesn't reflect what really 15 happened that night, correct? 16 A Correct. 17 Q What did you do with this report after you 18 wrote it? 19 A I think I saved it. 20 Q Saved it onto the hard drive of the computer? 21 A Correct. 22 Q Do you have a copy of this report in your 23 I'm not sure. personal possession? 24 A No, I don't. 25 Q Did you print out a copy of the report at the Page 79 1 time? 2 A Yes, sir. 3 Q And what did you do with that copy? 4 A I gave it to the chief. 5 Q Do you know what the chief did with it? 6 A I'm not sure. 7 Q Did you ever meet with Mr. Wilkes about this 8 case? 9 A Yeah. 10 Q Did you ever tell Mr. Wilkes what you've told 11 me today? 12 A No, sir. 13 Q Other than Mr. Wilkes and me, have you ever 14 Different. talked to any other lawyer about this case? 15 A No, sir. 16 Q Have you ever talked to the FBI? 17 A No, sir. 18 Q Have you ever talked to anybody from the 19 Department of Justice? 20 A No, sir. 21 Q You saw Mr. West leave the police station, 22 correct? You were still there when he left? 23 A Correct. 24 Q Did he leave with the two women? 25 A Yes. Page 80 1 Q 2 At the time he left, did he have the passports still with him? 3 A Correct. 4 Q Did he have them in his hand? 5 in his pocket? Did he put them Do you remember? 6 A In his hand. 7 Q And he brought more passports than just for the 8 two women who were at the police station, 9 correct? 10 A Correct. 11 Q Did you ever look through the passports? 12 A Yes, sir. 13 Q And how did that come about? 14 A Well, he had gave it to us to look at. 15 Q So do you remember who looked through them 16 first? 17 A Robert. 18 Q Robert McGee? 19 A Right. 20 Q Did Sergeant McGee actually look through them? 21 A Yes, sir. 22 He just opened them and looked through them. 23 Q Did he just kind of flip through them? 24 A Yeah. 25 Q Do you know one way or another whether Robert Page 81 1 McGee identified the two women at the police 2 station in the stack of passports that Mr. West 3 brought to the station? 4 A 5 6 Yeah. Mr. West had showed us their two passports first. Q 7 And we keep calling them passports, but do you know whether they were passports or work visas? 8 A I think they were passports. 9 Q I'm showing you again -- and you looked through 10 I think. them as well, correct? 11 A Correct. 12 Q When you were looking through them, did you 13 have them in your hand, or was someone else 14 holding them? 15 A No. I had them in my hand. 16 Q And I know this was a while ago, Officer. So 17 one way or another, do you know -- I'm showing 18 you P0123 and P0125. 19 you were looking at looked more like P0123 or 20 more like P0125 or both? Do you remember if what 21 A It looked like P0123. 22 Q Did you ever hear Mr. West say why he had the 23 24 25 women's passports? A He said he had to have them just in case -- I think he said because if they would get in Page 82 1 2 trouble or anything like that. Q 3 4 other of the women's identifications? A 5 6 Did you ever hear Mr. West say that he had any Yeah. He came with all of them. he said. Q That's what He came with all of them. I appreciate that. That was a bad question. 7 That was my fault. What I meant to ask you was 8 other than passports, did Mr. West ever say 9 that he had any other form of identification 10 for the women? 11 A No. 12 Q Did you ever see Mr. West touch the women on 13 No, sir. the way out? 14 A I don't remember. 15 Q Did you have an opportunity to observe the 16 women's demeanor or composure as they were 17 leaving the police station? 18 A Yes, sir. They looked like they were scared. 19 I guess they were scared because they know that 20 was their boss. 21 Q 22 You don't know why they were scared, but they looked scared to you? 23 A Right. 24 Q What did you do after Mr. West left the police 25 station? Page 83 1 A I left and went on the road. 2 Q Before today have you ever told anybody else 3 the truth about what happened at the police 4 station? 5 A No, sir. 6 MR. BEHAR: 7 break. 8 9 10 Let's take a two-minute I want to review my notes. (A BREAK WAS TAKEN.) MR. BEHAR: Q (CONTINUING) Sir, I just have a couple of more questions for 11 you. Other than what you've testified to 12 today, have you ever had any other discussions 13 with Officer Bordelon about this incident? 14 A No. 15 Q Other than what you've testified to today, have 16 you ever had any other discussions with 17 Sergeant McGee about this incident? 18 A No. 19 Q Other than what you've testified to today, have 20 you ever had any other discussions with 21 Sergeant Lavergne about this incident? 22 A No. 23 Q Other than what you've testified to today, have 24 you had any other discussions with the chief of 25 the Mamou Police Department about this Page 84 1 incident? 2 A No. 3 Q Have you ever seen the women again? 4 A No, sir. 5 Q And before today had you ever seen Mr. West 6 again? 7 A No. 8 Q Have you ever discussed this incident with 9 Mr. West? 10 A No. 11 Q One other question. Sir, at the police 12 department, at the station, did you ever see 13 Sergeant Lavergne take out his taser? 14 A No, sir. 15 It was only Robert McGee. MR. BEHAR: 16 Thank you, sir. I have no further questions at this time. 17 MR. BAYARD: 18 John, I'll let you go ahead if you have anything. 19 EXAMINATION 20 BY MR. WILKES: 21 Q Okay. Brent, on that report that's marked 22 Number 2, there's some initials underneath. 23 What is that. 24 A Yes, sir. 25 Q Okay. EOR? What is that? Page 85 1 A End of report. 2 Q Now, you were asked or you were told to write 3 the report? 4 A Told to write the report. 5 Q And the person who told you was who? 6 A Chief Greg Dupuis. 7 Q Now, you and I met one other time before, 8 correct? 9 A Correct. 10 Q All right. And that time was when we had to go 11 sit down in the lobby because Lucas couldn't go 12 up the elevator? 13 A Correct. 14 Q It was the chief, Lucas, Robert, you and I, 15 correct? 16 A Correct. 17 Q And you and I have never spoken other than 18 today when I called you on the phone? 19 A Correct. 20 Q Now, that day you had ridden with all of them, 21 you said, in the truck? 22 A Correct. 23 Q Was there any reason why you rode with them 24 25 instead of coming separately? A Because they told us we was all riding with the Page 86 1 2 chief. Q And as I remember it -- and you correct me if 3 I'm wrong -- that was the day when you all's 4 deposition had been set, but apparently 5 somebody at my office didn't let you all know, 6 right? 7 A Correct. 8 Q And I think -- and we discussed generally while 9 sitting in the lobby of this bank where those 10 four chairs are and that coffee table the case 11 in general? 12 A Correct. 13 Q Now, you said that when you were told to write 14 that report, you didn't write it correctly 15 because you were afraid you would be fired? 16 A Correct. 17 Q Now, that day when I asked you did you feel 18 that any of the officers, including yourself, 19 did anything wrong, you remember telling me no? 20 A Correct. 21 Q Is the reason why you told me no the same 22 reason that you wrote that report? 23 A Correct. 24 Q And I'm asking you because I don't remember. 25 At the time you rode over here for you all's Page 87 1 depositions, were you still working at Mamou? 2 A Correct. 3 Q Were you also working for Ville Platte part 4 time, or were you just working exclusively for 5 Mamou? 6 A Ville Platte part time also. 7 Q Now, since that day when you and I met and we 8 were all talking about the case and you and I 9 talked, have you talked to anyone whatsoever 10 11 about this case? A The only time it was mentioned was just the 12 taser part with Robert -- with the chief and 13 Robert in the truck. 14 Q 15 That was it. But, Brent, that was while -- I think you all were going to lunch at Hooters? 16 A Yeah, right. 17 Q Was the mentioning of the taser part that you 18 told Jose about where the chief made some 19 comments, was that on the way to Hooters? 20 A 21 Correct. That was right when we got in the truck right here outside in the parking lot. 22 Q Outside this bank? 23 A Correct. 24 Q And then other than that comment, did you all 25 talk any more about it like on the ride home or Page 88 1 anything like that? 2 A No, sir. 3 Q All right. That was it. And is the reason why you didn't 4 tell me about all of this bad stuff was because 5 you were afraid that I might tell the chief? 6 A Well, I mean, the chief was sitting right 7 there, you know. He would have heard it. And 8 you got to understand the way things operate 9 there, you know. The way things operate there, 10 as soon as I would have got home, I would have 11 been fired. 12 Q Okay. All right. Between that visit here at 13 the bank when you all left, went to Hooters and 14 today, have you talked to anyone -- I don't 15 care who it is -- at all about this case, good, 16 bad, indifferent? 17 A No, sir. 18 Q What made you decide to tell us what you told 19 20 us here today? A Being the fact that I could tell you the truth 21 because I'm no longer working there. 22 been working there, I wouldn't be able to 23 because I would have been, you know, getting 24 terminated right after. 25 Q Had I So if this incident -- well, let's talk a Page 89 1 little bit about the incident. The incident 2 involving the lady that had some mental 3 problems that you told us about earlier that 4 you were involved in, that made the press and 5 all kinds of stuff, correct? 6 A Correct. 7 Q And basically the press was that Mamou police 8 officer tasers mentally challenged lady? 9 A Correct. 10 Q Nobody called you and asked for your side of 11 the story, correct? 12 A Correct. 13 Q And you were offered -- and you correct me now. 14 Don't let me misstate it. 15 resign as opposed to what? 16 A You were offered to The chief told me the best thing would be to 17 resign because instead of going to the council 18 meeting -- he said they would have cameras and 19 everything else, and he said they're going to 20 drag me through the dirt before the truth would 21 have came -- you know, everything would have 22 came out right. 23 do is resign. 24 there. 25 Q Okay. So he said the best thing to And he had the papers right So there was like a paper where you Page 90 1 signed and resigned? 2 A Right, right. 3 Q But if that incident hadn't happened with this 4 lady, who I know gave you a lot of trouble and 5 as you put it you would have got backed up 6 instead of attacked in the press like you 7 got -- 8 A Right. 9 Q -- you'd still be working at Mamou? 10 A Correct. 11 Q And if you would have come here today to give 12 us your deposition, would you have told us the 13 same thing, or would you have not told us the 14 truth? 15 A I wouldn't -- like I said, I wouldn't be able 16 to tell you the truth because then I would have 17 been fired. 18 Q So if you'd still be working at Mamou, you 19 would have stuck by that original statement, 20 Exhibit Number 2? 21 A Correct. If Mamou had been civil service, then 22 I would have came and told the truth because in 23 order to be fired, I would have had to go 24 through a Board. 25 work like that. But with the chief, it don't Page 91 1 Q Right. If you were civil service and you told 2 the truth, you could say, hey, I told the 3 truth; you can't fire me for telling the truth? 4 A Right. 5 Q All right. I want to ask you about what one of 6 the Manuel boys told you, and I'm going to try 7 to see if I can find out which Manuel boy told 8 you. 9 the car or the one that didn't drive the car? Do you know if it was the one that drove 10 A I don't remember. 11 Q Brent, when he told you that they were going to 12 go chill, why did that mean to you that there 13 might be sex involved? 14 A I mean, what they did, they went and creeped 15 over there late at night, you know. I mean, 16 you probably pretty much know what's going on 17 then. 18 Q And one of them was in pajamas? 19 A Correct. 20 Q And the word chill -- 21 A Yeah. 22 Q -- on the street has a certain meaning? 23 A Correct. 24 Q Does it not? 25 A Correct. Page 92 1 Q And that meaning is sexual? 2 A Correct. 3 Q And chill is not just a word that 4 African-American human beings use on the 5 street? 6 Americans use on the street? It's also a word that Caucasian 7 A Correct. 8 Q And he specifically said chill? 9 A From what I can remember, yes. 10 Q Okay. 11 12 Do you remember after you all left here why the issue of the taser came up? A Because when we were in the meeting, you had 13 asked them about, you know, the taser, if he 14 did, in fact, pull out his taser, and that's 15 when we was walking away. 16 getting into the truck, that's when the chief 17 brought it up about the taser. 18 Q Whenever we was Do you remember me telling the chief and the 19 assembled group that we were going to have to 20 get the taser reports? 21 A 22 23 And that's why he said he was going to switch them. Q 24 25 Yes, sir, I do. But he said that after he walked out of this bank? A Correct. Not in front of you. Page 93 1 Q Now, do you know of your own personal knowledge 2 that any of the taser reports or tasers or 3 serial numbers on the tasers or parts of the 4 tasers, anything, got switched or changed or 5 fabricated or whatever? 6 A Yes sir. They were supposed to have -- they 7 took a couple of officers' tasers. 8 remember exactly which ones, and they turned it 9 in. 10 Q 11 12 I don't They didn't turn Robert's in. And you testified to that earlier. You said something about they didn't turn Robert's in? A Right. Because, see, I don't know if that was 13 the same taser Robert had before because they 14 had turned some in already because they were 15 bad, to get some new ones. 16 wasn't sure if that was one of the ones they 17 had already turned in. 18 Q Okay. Now, I guess they And that's what I wanted to get to next. 19 Because you mentioned the part about that they 20 got new tasers, and you said that could have 21 been before this incident? 22 A 23 Yeah. They got -- no. They got the new tasers after this incident. 24 Q So -- okay. 25 A What I'm saying is like they got the new tasers Page 94 1 after the incident, so I'm not sure if Robert 2 had got a new taser or what. 3 when this came about, they took some of the 4 other officers' tasers and not his. 5 Q But I know that And my question to you is when they got new 6 tasers, do you know that they got new tasers 7 like in the box to take the place of the old 8 tasers? 9 A Exactly. 10 Q Okay. So, in other words, the new tasers that 11 they got after this incident as best you know 12 were tasers that were brand-new from Taser? 13 A 14 15 Right. They're always brand-new. When you turn them in, you destroy them. Q 16 Now let's forget about what came in the box new. All right? And your taser is certified? 17 A Correct. 18 Q So you understand what Taser International 19 teaches you all about tasers and maintaining 20 them and testing them and all of that, correct? 21 A Correct. 22 Q You've been tased? 23 A Correct. 24 Q With regard to the taser that existed on May 25 1st or May 2nd, 2011, which Robert McGee Page 95 1 possessed as his duty equipment on his belt, on 2 his utility belt -- okay? 3 A Uh-huh (yes). 4 Q Forget about whatever came in a box, when, 5 where, whatever. 6 about the one that he had that night. 7 know of anything that led you to believe or 8 leads you to believe that that taser somehow 9 didn't get tested and the test results given to 10 11 I don't care. me for this case? A I'm talking Do you And if you do, tell us. Well, this was what was said from the chief, 12 that they wasn't going to use Robert's taser. 13 They was going to use another taser. 14 all I know about it. 15 see, when they got the new -- when they got the 16 new tasers, I was still at the sheriff's 17 department. That's But I don't know -- you 18 Q Right. 19 A But I knew about it when I came back they had 20 got new tasers. I don't know which officers 21 got the new tasers. 22 Q Okay. 23 A So that's all I know. 24 Q So you know what was said, but you didn't 25 actually see anybody say -- Page 96 1 A 2 Well, the chief called -- I believe it was Josh he called or somebody to pick up -- 3 Q Tell them what Josh's last name is. 4 A Uhlman. 5 Q Okay. 6 A I believe he called Josh Uhlman and told him 7 that he needed him to do the reports on the 8 tasers, but he never said nothing about 9 Robert's taser. 10 He said the other officers' tasers, not Robert's. 11 Q Did you ever talk to Josh about that? 12 A No. 13 Q At the time of this incident, did you carry a 14 taser? 15 A No, sir. 16 Q Now, I know what you told us, but I want to ask 17 you did you ever -- when Robert was telling you 18 why he brought these two girls -- because the 19 way I take it, you asked him why are they here, 20 correct? 21 A Correct. 22 Q In answer to that question, did Robert ever 23 tell you anything about I brought them here so 24 I could identify them and see their papers and 25 determine whether they're legal? Page 97 1 A No. The only thing he said, he was bringing 2 them there to scare them. 3 me. 4 Q 5 That's what he told You said that you heard Robert ask one of the girls for her cell phone? 6 A Correct. 7 Q Or you said phone number? 8 A Phone number. 9 Q But did you take that to mean a cell phone, or 10 did you not know? 11 A What do you mean? 12 Q Well, did you know whether he was asking her 13 for a fixed landline phone or a cell phone? 14 Did he ever mention -- 15 A He was asking for her number because her phone 16 was right there, and he pointed -- he had his 17 phone, and he pointed to her phone. 18 Q So it was a cell phone? 19 A Correct. 20 Q Did he ever say anything about he was trying to 21 get her to give him the number so that he could 22 determine whether her phone translated? 23 A 24 25 No, no. He was trying to get her number to talk to her. Q All right. Is there anything else, Brent, that Page 98 1 you know that either Jose or myself or this 2 talented young attorney down there who is 3 fixing to ask you some more questions weren't 4 smart enough to ask you that you want to tell 5 us about this night, good or bad, right or 6 wrong, whatever? 7 A Well, I'm going to say it like this. 8 that Robert was wrong in what he did. 9 him that after they left. I know I told Now, Mr. West, I 10 don't find where he really did anything to 11 them, you know, anything bad, you know. 12 came in. 13 left. 14 I know most people -- you know, most people are 15 scared of their bosses to be honest. 16 on his part, I didn't see anything bad. He came and picked them up, and they Now, I know they were scared of him, but 17 18 He But like MR. WILKES: Okay. That's all I've MR. BAYARD: I actually don't have got. 19 20 any questions. 21 Thank you. REEXAMINATION 22 BY MR. BEHAR: 23 Q I have just a few follow-up questions, sir. 24 You have no idea how the women ended up in the 25 Manuel brothers' car, do you? Page 99 1 A 2 3 They picked them up they said from Mr. West's house. Q Well, you know they picked them up, but you 4 don't know what happened that got them in the 5 car, do you? 6 A No, I don't. 7 Q So you don't know whether the Manuel brothers 8 invited them in? You don't know whether they 9 jumped in, and you have no idea whether the 10 women got in the car willingly, unwillingly or 11 anything else, do you? 12 A No. 13 Q Do you have any idea whether it was the women's 14 intention to have sex with the Manuel brothers? 15 A No, sir. 16 Q So you know that the Manuel brothers, they're 17 men? 18 A Uh-huh (yes). 19 Q It was your understanding when they were using 20 the word chill that they might have wanted to 21 have sex with the women, right? 22 A Correct. 23 Q But you have no idea whether that was 24 25 reciprocated by the women, correct? A Correct. Page 100 1 Q And you have no idea what Mr. West may or may 2 not have done to the women before this 3 incident, correct? 4 A Correct. 5 Q You have no idea what Mr. West might or might 6 not have done to the women after this incident, 7 correct? 8 A Correct. 9 Q Are you telling the truth today? 10 A Yes, sir. 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. BEHAR: I have no further questions. (DEPOSITION CONCLUDED AT 1:40 P.M.) Page 101 1 C E R T I F I C A T E 2 This transcript is not valid unless 3 accompanied by my original signature and blue seal 4 on this page. 5 I, Cheryl Venable, Certified Court 6 Reporter (Certificate #89010) in and for the State 7 of Louisiana, do hereby certify that PATROLMAN 8 BRENT ZACKERY, having been first duly sworn to 9 testify to the truth, the whole truth and nothing 10 but the truth, did hereby testify as is 11 hereinabove set forth in the foregoing 100 pages; 12 That the testimony was reported by me in 13 shorthand (stenotype), and transcribed under my 14 personal supervision and direction, and that same 15 constitutes a true and accurate transcription of 16 the testimony of the witness given at said time; 17 That I am not of counsel, not related to 18 counsel or any of the parties hereto, and that I 19 am in no way interested in the ultimate 20 disposition of this litigation. 21 22 _______________________________ 23 Cheryl Venable Certified Court Reporter State of Louisiana 24 25 Page 1 A ability 7:19 8:10 8:13 66:7 able 88:22 90:15 aboveentitled 1:18 academy 10:5,8 accommodating 6:13 accompanied 101:3 accord 19:2 accurate 101:15 action 1:7 10:25 actions 57:23 active 10:6 activity 33:4,19 adam 15:3 address 9:19 affairs 18:12 affect 8:9,13,17 afraid 86:15 88:5 africanameric... 92:4 ago 44:20 81:16 agreed 5:4,10 agreeing 65:17 ahead 71:8 84:18 al 1:7,10 alejandra 2:8 alls 86:3,25 americans 92:6 answer 5:20 7:18 8:4,5 14:8 96:22 answers 5:17 7:7 anybody 9:10 22:9 24:5,25 30:15 37:7 67:1 75:24 79:18 83:2 95:25 anymore 77:7 anyplace 11:20 anytime 40:11 anyway 36:24 apologize 46:10 apparently 23:19 86:4 appear 70:16 appreciate 6:13 82:6 approached 34:2 approval 43:11 43:16 april 15:24 16:4 arc 46:24 47:18 48:16,21 72:22 arced 45:14,16 46:25 73:15 arch 51:5,10,15 52:2,8 area 21:19 arm 50:6,7,20 54:17 63:3,6 arrest 16:13 arrests 14:21 arrive 21:22 29:24 66:14 arrived 21:25 22:24 29:25 37:3 57:14,17 59:21 64:1,3 64:11,14 67:9 67:10 69:13 70:17 asked 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cameras 89:18 cant 7:9 19:10 39:2 55:10 91:3 car 17:22,24 18:2,3,5,7,9 20:7 23:17,20 24:1,1,14,16 Page 2 24:22,23 25:20 26:9 27:15 28:2,4,6 29:4 29:20 30:18 34:5,8,22 36:1 39:23 43:9 91:9,9 98:25 99:5,10 care 88:15 95:5 careful 59:17 carpenter 12:9 13:5,7 carry 96:13 cartridge 45:19 case 8:22,24,25 9:1 24:3 76:6 79:8,14 81:24 86:10 87:8,10 88:15 95:10 catherine 2:17 caucasian 92:5 caught 17:15 cause 1:18 5:22 causing 35:6 ccr 1:20 3:15 cell 41:4 97:5,9 97:13,18 certain 29:10 91:22 certificate 101:6 certification 5:16 certifications 10:2,6 certified 3:15 94:16 101:5,23 certify 101:7 chains 50:25 51:2,4 chairs 51:23 86:10 challenged 89:8 chance 11:6,13 27:12 74:19 changed 93:4 charge 31:14,19 31:23,24 42:14 42:18 cheryl 1:19 3:15 101:5,23 chicago 2:5 chief 3:8 9:11 17:8 18:10,17 18:25 45:25 46:5 47:21 48:13,14 49:3 49:15,20,21 72:10 74:13,20 75:16 76:15 78:12 79:4,5 83:24 85:6,14 86:1 87:12,18 88:5,6 89:16 90:24 92:16,18 95:11 96:1 chiefs 48:6,6,8 chill 33:23 34:17 34:25 35:2 40:3 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10:12,15,18,23 10:24 28:19 46:6 74:24 75:4 86:4 90:12 100:13 depositions 87:1 deputy 14:14,15 14:20 20:21 21:13 22:15,18 23:3 26:25 77:2 describe 17:5 22:17 23:21 27:25 43:25 44:14 45:7 50:5 51:12 52:23 55:9 59:13 63:13 66:5,7 Page 3 described 26:2 57:4 69:20 describing 52:11 55:23 destroy 94:14 destroyed 73:4 73:22 determine 96:25 97:22 didnt 17:8 18:10 18:17 20:6 27:17 32:6,12 34:22 40:17 42:18 43:2 44:4 56:1 58:5 59:11,12 64:15 65:25 71:11,17 71:18 72:3 86:5,14 88:3 91:9 93:9,11 95:9,24 98:16 different 10:6 46:2 48:17 54:20 74:6 79:12 digging 63:15 diploma 9:23 direction 101:14 dirt 63:15 89:20 disabled 17:12 discharge 45:17 discharged 45:18 discuss 72:15 discussed 72:11 84:8 86:8 discussions 40:13 70:20,23 83:12,16,20,24 dispatch 21:17 21:19 31:4 60:15 64:9 dispatcher 31:6 31:8 dispatchers 60:14 disposition 101:20 district 1:1,2 ditch 17:15 division 1:3 document 11:4 75:7,7 documents 10:11 11:16,19 doesnt 78:14 doing 7:21 12:8 23:15 25:7 34:15 47:2,13 63:20 66:8 68:23 71:10,18 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