( CITY COUNCIL CITY OF NEW YORK - - -x TRANSCRIPT OF THE MINUTES of the STATED MEETING - - - - - - -x March 21, 1994 Start: 1:30 p.m. Recess: 4:45 p.m. City Council New York, New York BEFORE: MARK GREEN, PUBLIC ADVOCATE ·-~ RAYMOND M. DANYO 171 EAGLE STREET BROOKLYN, NEW YORK 11222 (718) 383-8465 ( 2 1 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 2 This is a recessed Stated Meeting. 3 seats. 4 important ceremony. 5 Mr. Speaker. 6 SPEAKER VALLONE: 7 10 Thank you very much, Mr. We have some very important presentations to make today. Just before we start the formal meeting, I 11 want to make sure minutes are taken here so this is entered 12 in the permanent record. 13 ~ There is a very Public Advocate. 8 9 Will people take their I want to first recognize several people and 14 ask my colleagues and you, Mr. Public Advocate, to grant the 15 privilege of the floor, starting with the Chief of 16 Detectives, Joseph Borrielli; Assistant Chief John Hill; 17 Assistant Chief Commanding Officer, Manhattan Detectives, 18 Kenneth Gussman; Deputy Inspector, Brooklyn, William 19 Gardella; Deputy Inspector, Manhattan Detectives, Charles 20 Luisi; Captain, Manhattan Detectives, Joseph Mottle; 21 Lieutenant, Commanding Officer, Manhattan South Homicide, 22 Robert Gibbons; Lieutenant, Manhattan Detectives, Paul 23 O'Connor; Lieutenant, Commanding Officer, Brooklyn South 24 Homicide, Robert Azzinari; Sergeant, Brooklyn, Detectives, 25 Kenneth Bowen, and Sergeant, Manhattan Detectives, John (' 3 1 2 Mullally. We also have Detective Edward Brown, 3 4 Detective Joseph Cruz, Detective William Glynn and Detective 5 William Powell. We also have present Rabbi Spielman, Chair of 6 7 the Crown Heights Jewish Community Council and William 8 Rappfogel, Metropolitan Council on Jewish Poverty. I would ask, Mr. Public Advocate, that the 9 10 names that I read be given the privilege of the floor. 11 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 12 I would ask the Clerk to please read the 13 official communication to the City Council. (Whereupon, the Clerk read Official 14 15 So ordered. Communication.) 16 (Applause.) 17 SPEAKER VALLONE: On behalf of all of my 18 colleagues, we make present this proclamation and it was 19 voted and adopted by every member of the City Council here. 20 We thank the four of you for what you did in 21 helping to heal one of the most difficult and bloodiest 22 events that have happened in our great town. 23 24 25 You helped bring healing and diligence. You make us all proud. On behalf of all of my colleagues, we present ( 4 1 2 you with this proclamation. RABBI SPIELMAN: 3 I wanted to add to the words 4 that were mentioned before that as far as Crown Heights is 5 concerned, we have been through and are continuing to go 6 through some extremely trying times. 7 to us the fact that the diligence of these officers and all 8 the officers and the teams that they represent have 9 successfully solved this crime. 10 Thank you. 11 (Applause.) 12 SPEAKER VALLONE: 13 It is very comforting Thank you, Mr. Public Advocate. I thank the Police for coming and making this 14 15 city a little bit better than it was and, hopefully, a lot 16 better in the future. Mr. Public Advocate, we will be in recess 17 18 until the Council's Buildings Committee is over. 19 Thank you very much. 20 (Whereupon, at 2:30 p.m., a recess was 21 taken.) (Whereupon, at 3:00 p.m., the Stated Meeting 22 23 24 25 resumed.) THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: of the March 16th Stated Meeting. This is a continuation ( 5 1 2 Will the Clerk please call the roll. 3 (Whereupon, a roll call was taken.) 4 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 5 I would like at this time prior to the 6 Invocation that we have a minute of silence in memory of the 7 two priests who were run down, Reverend Father Demitrios 8 Frangos and the Very Reverend Father Germanos Stavropolos. 9 A moment of silence, please. (Whereupon, a moment of silence was 10 11 observed.) 12 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 13 (Whereupon, the invocation was given.) 14 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 15 THE CLERK: 16 Thank you. Intro 220. A local law in relation to amending the rent stabilization laws and rent control laws. I 17 SPEAKER VALLONE: 18 THE CLERK: General order. Resolution 144, determining that 19 a public emergency requiring rent control in the City of New 20 York continue to exist. 21 SPEAKER VALLONE: 22 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 23 24 \ A quorum is present. 25 Coupled. Discussion on the general order calendar. SPEAKER VALLONE: Council Member Michels has asked that Intro 220 be set aside for separate discussion as I ( 6 1 2 well as 144, prior to roll call. THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 3 4 Weiner. COUNCIL MEMBER WEINER: 5 6 7 Council Member Thank you, Mr. Public Advocate. I call your attention to Resolution 222, 8 sponsored by myself, Berman and Foster. The resolution 9 reaffirms the Council's longstanding commitment to and 10 support for Jerusalem as the eternal and undivided capital 11 of the State of Israel. 12 The reason we are addressing this today is 13 because you might have read this past Friday that the United 14 Nations dealt with a resolution and language that refers to 15 Jerusalem as being the disputed territory or occupied 16 territory, something our government never believed. 17 What is disturbing is that resolution was 18 considered section by section. 19 abstain from voting. Our representatives chose to 20 It is very important as we discuss these 21 issues -- and they are watching very closely around the 22 world -- that we recognize the terrible things that have 23 happened in Israel over the past months are not a reflection 24 of the government of Israel. 25 of radicals that seek to destroy it. They are indeed a reflection ( 7 1 2 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 3 Are there any objections to immediate 4 Thank you, Mr. Weiner. consideration? 5 SPEAKER VALLONE: 6 Does Council Member Millard wants to be 7 We will vote on it later. recognized? 8 COUNCIL MEMBER MILLARD: 9 SPEAKER VALLONE: No. I would ask for a roll call 10 on Resolution 144, determining that a public emergency 11 requiring rent control in the City of New York continues to 12 exist and will continue to exist after April 1, 1994. 13 I urge an aye vote on this bill. 14 THE CLERK: 15 COUNCIL MEMBER ALBANESE: 16 THE CLERK: 17 COUNCIL MEMBER BERMAN: 18 THE CLERK: 19 COUNCIL MEMBER CLARKE: 20 THE CLERK: Cruz. 21 (No response.) 22 THE CLERK: 23 (No response.) 24 THE CLERK: 25 COUNCIL MEMBER DEMARCO: Albanese. Aye. Berman. Yes. Clarke. Yes. Dear. DeMarco. Aye. ( 8 1 DiBrienza. 2 THE CLERK: 3 (No response.) 4 THE CLERK: 5 COUNCIL MEMBER LASHER: Yes. 6 THE CLERK: Dilan. 7 COUNCIL MEMBER MALAVE-DILAN: 8 THE CLERK: 9 COUNCIL MEMBER DUANE: Lasher. Duane. Yes. Eisland. 10 THE CLERK: 11 (No response.) 12 THE CLERK: 13 COUNCIL MEMBER ELDRIDGE: 14 THE CLERK: 15 COUNCIL MEMBER ERISTOFF: 16 THE CLERK: 17 (No response.) 18 THE CLERK: 19 COUNCIL MEMBER FISHER: 20 THE CLERK: 21 COUNCIL MEMBER FOSTER: 22 THE CLERK: 23 COUNCIL MEMBER FREED: 24 THE CLERK: 25 COUNCIL MEMBER FUSCO: Eldridge. Yes. Eristoff. Yes. Fields. Fisher. Yes. Foster. Yes. Freed. Yes. Fusco. Yes. Yes. ( 9 1 2 THE CLERK: Harrison. 3 COUNCIL MEMBER HARRISON: 4 THE CLERK: 5 COUNCIL MEMBER HENRY: 6 THE CLERK: 7 COUNCIL MEMBER KOSLOWITZ: 8 THE CLERK: 9 COUNCIL MEMBER LEFFLER: Yes. Henry. Pass. Koslowitz. Yes. Leffler. Yes. 10 THE CLERK: Linares. 11 (No response.) 12 THE CLERK: 13 COUNCIL MEMBER MARSHALL: 14 THE CLERK: 15 COUNCIL MEMBER MCCABE: 16 THE CLERK: 17 COUNCIL MEMBER MCCAFFREY: 18 THE CLERK: 19 COUNCIL MEMBER MICHELS: 20 THE CLERK: 21 COUNCIL MEMBER MILLARD: 22 THE CLERK: 23 (No response.) 24 THE CLERK: 25 (No response.) Marshall. Aye. McCabe. Aye. Mccaffrey. Aye. Michels. Aye. Millard. O'Donovan. Ognibene. Yes. ( 10 1 2 THE CLERK: Pagan. 3 COUNCIL MEMBER PAGAN: 4 THE CLERK: 5 COUNCIL MEMBER PINKETT: 6 THE CLERK: 7 COUNCIL MEMBER POVMAN: 8 THE CLERK: 9 COUNCIL MEMBER POWELL: Aye. Pinkett. Pass. Povrnan. Aye. Powell. Yes. 10 THE CLERK: Rivera. 11 COUNCIL MEMBER RIVERA: 12 THE CLERK: 13 COUNCIL MEMBER ROBINSON: 14 THE CLERK: 15 COUNCIL MEMBER ROBLES: 16 THE CLERK: 17 (No response.) 18 THE CLERK: 19 COUNCIL MEMBER RUIZ: 20 THE CLERK: 21 (No response.) 22 THE CLERK: 23 COUNCIL MEMBER SPIGNER: 24 THE CLERK: Stabile. 25 COUNCIL MEMBER STABILE: Yes. Robinson. Yes. Robles. Aye. Rosado. Ruiz. Aye. Sabini. Spigner. Aye. Aye. ( 11 1 2 THE CLERK: Warden. 3 COUNCIL MEMBER WARDEN: 4 THE CLERK: 5 COUNCIL MEMBER WATKINS: 6 THE CLERK: 7 COUNCIL MEMBER WEINER: 8 THE CLERK: 9 COUNCIL MEMBER WHITE: Aye. Watkins. Aye. Weiner. Aye. White. Aye. 10 THE CLERK: Williams. 11 COUNCIL MEMBER WILLIAMS: 12 THE CLERK: 13 COUNCIL MEMBER WOOTEN: 14 THE CLERK: 15 COUNCIL MEMBER CRUZ: 16 THE CLERK: 17 COUNCIL MEMBER DEMARCO: 18 THE CLERK: 19 (No response.) 20 THE CLERK: 21 COUNCIL MEMBER LASHER: 22 I would like to explain a conflict that I Aye. Wooten. Yes. Cruz. Yes. DeMarco. Yes. Ognibene. Lasher. Aye. 23 have with respect to this legislation and the next bill that 24 is going to come up today, 220. 25 With respect to these items, I would like to ( 12 1 2 inform this body that I am the owner of an interest in a 3 four-unit building, 26 units, which are rent-controlled and 4 my wife as the owner of a six-unit building, which is a 5 rent-stabilized building. 6 I vote aye. 7 THE CLERK: Ognibene. 8 COUNCIL MEMBER OGNIBENE: 9 THE CLERK: Aye on 144. Pinkett. 10 COUNCIL MEMBER PINKETT: 11 THE CLERK: 12 COUNCIL MEMBER ABEL: 13 THE CLERK: 14 SPEAKER VALLONE: 15 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: Aye. Abel. Aye. Speaker Vallone. Aye. By a vote of 45 in the 16 affirmative, none in the negative, the resolution is 17 adopted. We will now move to debate. 18 We will now move 19 to Intro 220. 20 first be allowed to speak and the last speaker will be the 21 Committee Chair, Council Member Spigner. COUNCIL MEMBER MICHELS: 22 23 Council Member Michels has asked that he Thank you, Mr. Speaker. 24 This is a sad day for the people of this 25 city, especially those that live in multiple dwellings. ( 13 1 This is the first time that I can remember -- 2 and I 3 and I have been in this body for over sixteen years 4 cannot recall in this city's history that we passed or were 5 about to pass a bill that contains vacancy decontrols. This bill is an extension of the rent 6 7 control, rent stabilization. However, within it contains 8 the seeds of destruction, poisoned seeds of destruction of 9 all rent control, all rent stabilization in the city at a In order to 10 time when we only have a vacancy rate of 3.44. 11 do away with rent control, rent stabilization, the law says 12 you must have a vacancy rate of 5 percent. 13 We have been asked not to tamper with this 14 very delicate law by no less than the Director of Housing 15 for the State of New York, who begged us not to tamper with 16 it. He said that the first impact of the high 17 18 rent, high income provision of the act are yet to be felt. He then went on to say the permanent 19 20 exemption of the high rent luxury decontrol that we are 21 voting on today is a great incentive for owners to encourage 22 vacancy. 23 apartments where the owner would then set a so-called fair 24 market rent even if no improvements are made. 25 This particularly true with rent-controlled He said that while most owners are ( 14 1 2 law-abiding, there are certainly some unscrupulous owners 3 who act to evade the rent laws by attempting to obtain their 4 vacancies by engaging in harassment. 5 6 7 8 9 Further, if their rent comes to $2,000, there will be harassment of tenants. What I am asking for is an extender so there is an ability to study the consequences of the 1993 law. I urge you to vote no on 220. 10 Thank you. 11 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: Before calling on 12 Council Member Eristoff, let me explain that the debate and 13 discussion on the floor is among the members, not between 14 the gallery and the floor. 15 resist the impulse of commenting out loud. So I would ask the gallery to 16 Council Member Eristoff. 17 Would Council Member Eristoff yield for a 18 19 20 21 question from his colleague? COUNCIL MEMBER ERISTOFF: I will allow my colleague to ask a question. COUNCIL MEMBER FUSCO: My question is this: 22 as to the specific regulation that is being passed today, 23 does the rent regulations as they presently exist, does this 24 encourage those rich tenants to hold on to apartments while 25 they maintain homes on Long Island and Connecticut? ( 15 1 COUNCIL MEMBER MICHELS: 2 Studies have been 3 made that indicate that those people who have summer homes 4 and are permanent residents, they pay their state income 5 tax. They don't pay the New York City resident's tax. As a result, the landlord can then take over 6 7 their apartments and say that they are not permanent 8 residents. COUNCIL MEMBER ERISTOFF: 9 10 comments of Stanley Michels. 11 anti-Manhattan bill. I want to echo the This bill is, in essence, an Let's make not mistake about it. I want to first commend central staff for the 12 13 fastest print job in world history, where we have a 14 pre-printed agenda showing the bill has been reported out of 15 house. 16 This bill does nothing of the kind. Instead, 17 the bill helps property owners who have the fortune to have 18 so-called wealthy tenants as tenants. 19 the incidents of housing distress is not non-payment of 20 rent, but sewer and water rates and high property taxes that 21 are not addressed. 22 The real culprits in We had testimony last week which, I felt, 23 very well established the fact of the correlation between 24 distressed properties and high property taxes was very high. 25 These rent laws protect the market. They are ( 16 1 2 not designed to help individuals. 3 thousand dollars sounds like a lot of money. 4 apartments in the $1,500 range, if you use the 4.5 percent 5 inflation factor over the next fifteen years, it would bring 6 apartments over $2,000. THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 7 8 When you got Thank you, Council Member. 9 Council Member Millard. 10 COUNCIL MEMBER MILLARD: I rise to oppose 11 this legislation for the very simple reason that a lot of 12 the people who are going to support this legislation will 13 make the argument that we should have a free market, let the 14 market rule. One thing you have is the possibility of 15 16 bankruptcy not just of landlords but also the tenants. This bill goes beyond what Albany has done. 17 18 Albany says that if your rent is $2,000 or more as of the 19 day that bill was passed, then if you make $250,0000 at any 20 time in the future, no matter how much inflation is, if the 21 rent goes over $2,000 a month, then these provisions kick 22 in. 23 \ A thousand dollars or two It is the Council that provides the incentive 24 not only to harass existing tenants. It provides an 25 incentive only to rent to people who either are presently ( 17 1 2 making a quarter of a million dollars a year or you as a 3 landlord believe that some day they will soon make over 4 $200,000 a year. 5 I would ask you to vote no. 6 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 7 COUNCIL MEMBER OGNIBENE: 8 If we can get pass the demagoguery going on 9 here, this law only applies to people making $250,000, who Thank you. 10 live in apartments that rent for more than $2,000 and those 11 are the apartments that deregulation applies to and for the 12 other apartments that rent for more than $2,000 and only if 13 they are vacant. What we are trying to do here is not give 14 15 rent subsidies to the wealthy who live in the districts of 16 those that stood up here today and have spoken against it. 17 I think you ought to know that. It applies only to people that make a quarter 18 19 a million or more or with apartments that are more than 20 $2,000 per month. 21 not be destabilized until they are vacant. For those rents over $2,000, they will As far as the harassment issue, we have a 22 23 myriad of regulations that protect tenants from harassment 24 form landlords. 25 \ Ognibene. THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: Council Member Pagan. ( 18 1 COUNCIL MEMBER PAGAN: Colleagues, we are hear 2 3 as legislators to do what is right for everyone within the 4 city; not to play rhetoric or favoring one group over 5 another. Before anything else, we have a 6 7 responsibility to invest our resources well. Let's look at 8 the facts. Every one of 9 the bills that were submitted to this body to be considered Not everybody is happy with 220. 10 included the same extensions to rent control and rent 11 stabilization. Those who are advocating the defense of a 12 13 subsidy for people making a quarter of a million dollars in 14 the city, shame on you. Colleagues, this is about equity. 15 It is 16 fairness. 17 York City residents that should have it in the first place. 18 220 will eliminate a luxury subsidy to those New Since when are these advocates shielding 19 themselves with the small property owners? 20 Since when? 21 Remember that. 22 I urge you to vote for 220. 23 Thank you very much. 24 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 25 Council Member Linares. Thank you. ( 19 1 COUNCIL MEMBER LINARES: 2 3 Thank you, Mr. Public Advocate. I stand here to basically urge my colleagues 4 5 to examine very closely their conscience as they make this 6 decision. I think that what we have here before us is a 7 8 smoke screen. 9 approach a decision like this and weigh it carefully, not 10 I think the responsibility of this body is to rush into it and then face the consequences. We saw that experience take place in 1971 11 12 when there was deregulation and they had to rush to again 13 regulate because we saw what it was happening to our 14 neighborhoods. I think 220 today is marking the beginning of 15 16 the end for stable communities. 17 owners, are the ones who are being taken for a ride with 18 this bill. This is the beginning of the end for those 19 20 who voted today in favoring this legislation. I urge the members in good conscience to vote 21 22 The small fish, the small against 220. 23 Thank you. 24 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 25 Eldridge. Council Member ( 20 1 2 COUNCIL MEMBER ELDRIDGE: 3 This bill particularly .affects people that I 4 represent. 5 questions. It is troubling to me and it raises very serious My colleagues have expressed their opinions 6 7 that this is the beginning of decontrolling and 8 destabilization of apartment rents. I agree with that. I agree also that we do need to look at the 9 10 whole picture and this piece of legislation that comes to us 11 at the last minute, I believe it is ill-thought and 12 ill-conceived. For any of you who represent districts that 13 14 have apartments where people are now paying $1,200 or $1,400 15 a month are threatened because tenants are being told, 16 instructed how to make major capital improvements and raise 17 the rent. 18 It is not where wealthy people live. It is 19 where two professional working people live with children and 20 it is a needed place for them to live in. 21 you may have read about the migration of African-Americans 22 who have reached a level of affluence who are moving back to 23 the city because it is easier for them to live. 24 25 \ Thank you. Over the weekend We are losing not only their leadership participation in government in the city, but we are losing r· 21 1 2 the taxes we get from their incomes. I believe that this bill threatens the 3 4 stability of the west side whre 60 percent of the citizens 5 live in rental apartments. I believe that this legislation is driven by 6 7 the landlords who are building new apartments, who have 8 empty apartments and are trying to rent them at $3,000 and 9 want to move people out of rent-stabilized apartments. I believe they are the same people who come 10 11 to you for tax exemptions and insensitive overdevelopment 12 and I believe that it is time for the whole Council to look 13 at the whole picture. We don't mind giving money to large 14 15 corporations who pay millions of dollars in salary. 16 that is not viewed as making the wealthy_ pay their share. 17 But you can't wait to dump on what we consider to be middle 18 class people earning an income and working hard and paying 19 $2,000. 20 are interpreting it. 21 that. 22 That is not luxury housing in the sense that you I think you had better understand I wish that you would support us sometimes in 23 our effort to make this city livable for people who 24 contribute to it as much as they do. 25 Somehow Thank you. ( 22 1 2 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 3 Council Member DiBrienza. 4 COUNCIL MEMBER DIBRIENZA: Actually, I am 5 interested in the nature of the bill as to whether or not 6 the question before us as Council Members can be divided so 7 that many of us who are interested in extending the rent 8 stabilization rules could vote for that and then those of us 9 who have trouble with the luxury decontrol aspect either 10 because of the arguments made in part by Council Member 11 Michels or in part by Council Member Eldridge or by other 12 members here. I don't know if it is possible, but my 13 14 recollection of the rules and my understanding is that THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 15 I am told that it is 16 one bill. 17 have to be done in advance and that as of now it cannot be 18 divided. 19 I am told that such a request to divide would It is one bill, one vote. COUNCIL MEMBER DIBRIENZA: I am suggesting 20 that we amend the legislation, which I am suggesting in a 21 motion to divide the question to conduct two votes on the 22 same piece of legislation. 23 \ Thank you. COUNCIL MEMBER WEINER: Is it not the case 24 that the only question on the table is that we are to 25 approve or disapprove this bill? ( 23 1 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 2 3 request is out of order. You can continue with your remarks on the 4 5 substance of the bill. Council Member Freed had asked to be 6 7 Council Member, your recognized. 8 One moment. 9 Council Member Eristoff. 10 COUNCIL MEMBER ERISTOFF: 11 COUNCIL MEMBER OGNIBENE: THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: COUNCIL MEMBER ERISTOFF: I would like to withdraw the motion to recommit. THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 18 19 Council Member Ognibene, you are out of order. 16 17 I move to lay his motion on the table. 14 15 In light of the very interesting comments of my colleague from Brooklyn -- 12 13 Quiet in the Chambers. The motion is withdrawn. 20 Council Member Freed has the floor. 21 COUNCIL MEMBER FREED: 22 I am not sure people understand that, first, Thank you. 23 this bill shouldn't be called the luxury decontrol, the part 24 that deals with people's income over $250,000, but the real 25 death knell of rent stabilization is going to be the ( 24 1 2 decontrol of any rent that reaches $2,000 a month at any 3 time, which is what this bill does. What this bill does is perpetually decontrol 4 5 apartments as they reach $2,000 a month. 6 who is in place at the time reaches $2,000 a month, they 7 stay in place. 8 is decontrolled. When they leave the apartment that apartment Two thousand dollars a month may seem like a 9 10 Whenever a tenant lot to some people, but in Manhattan is not unusual. Furthermore, it doesn't deal with the size of 11 12 the apartment. 13 four kids, it is almost beyond doubt that it is going to be 14 an apartment that is somewhere close to $2,000 a month. 15 If you happen to have a family of three or Additionally, it does not deal with the fact 16 that your apartment currently rents for $1,400, $1,500 and 17 if your landlord decides to put in major capital 18 improvements, whether the apartment needs it or not, your 19 rent adjustment just went up to $2,000. 20 Please understand that there are a lot of 21 people in Manhattan who are doubled up. 22 apartments where you got two or three college students, 23 professional people, just trying to make it, who are paying 24 close to that amount of rent. 25 THE CHAIRPERSON: There are a lot of Thank you. ( 25 1 2 Council Member Fusco. 3 COUNCIL MEMBER FUSCO: 4 I rise as one of the key prime sponsors of this bill. 5 I have heard words like smokescreen, working 6 people, affordable housing and this is the beginning of the 7 destruction of rent control, rent stabilization, which would 8 have a terrible impact on low income members of our society. 9 Well, that is based on the smoke screen being 10 cast on this Council. It is also an insult to this Council 11 because the majority of the members who represent those 12 constituents, so-called individuals who say it is a smoke 13 screen. There is no way that the Council members of 14 15 this Council, including the prime sponsors of this 16 legislation, and those who voted in committee for this 17 legislation, would permit that to happen. 18 they would permit affordable housing to be taken away from 19 low income people. THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 20 21 22 23 24 25 There is no way Thank you, Council Member. At this time the chair recognizes Council Member DiBrienza. COUNCIL MEMBER DIBRIENZA: again, understand your ruling. I would like to, 26 1 There are several sections to this item 2 3 4 before us. There are several distinct sections. I want to be able to -- many people might 5 vote on the parts that are less controversial perhaps 6 differently than others. 7 8 9 I want to know the basis of your ruling or suggestion that I cannot move to divide the question. THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: Your request to amend 10 the bill, it could have been done prior to its introduction 11 and debate and discussion today. 12 Therefore, the Chair ruled against you. 13 COUNCIL MEMBER DIBRIENZA: If in fact I 14 sought to have some portion of this bill not voted on at 15 all, I might understand why wouldn't be amended. 16 But since under this proposal the entire bill 17 would be voted on, just simply two votes, I fail to 18 understand the ruling. 19 I don't want to belabor this. 20 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 21 22 Council Member DiBrienza, you are asking a fair question. I don't want to belabor this body. If you 23 want to vote on any different resolution than 220, either 24 add or subtract a section, you would had to have submitted 25 it beforehand and in writing, an interpretation based on ( 27 1 2 Robert's Rules of Order. 3 The Chair recognizes Council Member Eristoff. 4 COUNCIL MEMBER ERISTOFF: 5 make the motion to recommit to the committee. COUNCIL MEMBER OGNIBENE: 6 7 I would like to I call the question. 8 I move to table his motion. 9 The rules say that a motion takes precedence 10 over a motion to recommit. THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 11 12 There will be a vote on the motion to table. 13 SPEAKER VALLONE: 14 This is a motion to table the motion to 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 Point of order. recommit. I urge my colleagues to vote yes. This is a non-debatable motion. THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: Roll call, please, on the motion to table. We will have a roll call on the motion to table the recommittal motion. 22 Will the Clerk call the roll. 23 THE CLERK: 24 COUNCIL MEMBER ALBANESE: 25 THE CLERK: Albanese. Berman. NO. ( 28 1 2 COUNCIL MEMBER BERMAN: 3 THE CLERK: 4 COUNCIL MEMBER CLARKE: 5 THE CLERK: Cruz. 6 COUNCIL MEMBER CRUZ: 7 THE CLERK: 8 (No response.) 9 THE CLERK: Yes. Clarke. Pass. Yes. Dear. DiBrienza. 10 COUNCIL MEMBER DIBRIENZA: No. 11 THE CLERK: 12 COUNCIL MEMBER DEMARCO: 13 THE CLERK: Dilan. 14 COUNCIL MEMBER MALAVE-DILAN: 15 THE CLERK: 16 COUNCIL MEMBER DUANE: 17 THE CLERK: 18 COUNCIL MEMBER EISLAND: 19 THE CLERK: 20 COUNCIL MEMBER ELDRIDGE: 21 THE CLERK: 22 COUNCIL MEMBER ERISTOFF: 23 THE CLERK: 24 COUNCIL MEMBER FISHER: 25 THE CLERK: DeMarco. Yes. Duane. No. Eisland. Yes. Eldridge. No. Eristoff. No. Fisher. Foster. Yes. Yes. ( 29 1 \ . Yes. 2 COUNCIL MEMBER FOSTER: 3 THE CLERK: 4 COUNCIL MEMBER FREED: 5 THE CLERK: 6 COUNCIL MEMBER FUSCO: 7 THE CLERK: 8 COUNCIL MEMBER HARRISON: 9 THE CLERK: Freed. No. Fusco. Yes. Harrison. Yes. Henry. 10 COUNCIL MEMBER HENRY: Yes. 11 THE CLERK: 12 COUNCIL MEMBER KOSLOWITZ: 13 THE CLERK: 14 COUNCIL MEMBER LASHER: Yes. 15 THE CLERK: 16 COUNCIL MEMBER LEFFLER: 17 THE CLERK: Linares. 18 COUNCIL MEMBER LINARES: 19 THE CLERK: 20 COUNCIL MEMBER MARSHALL: 21 THE CLERK: 22 COUNCIL MEMBER MCCABE: 23 THE CLERK: 24 COUNCIL MEMBER MCCAFFREY: 25 THE CLERK: Koslowitz. Yes. Lasher. Leffler. No. No. Marshall. No. McCabe. No. Mccaffrey. Michels. Yes. ( 30 1 2 COUNCIL MEMBER MICHELS: No. 3 THE CLERK: 4 COUNCIL MEMBER MILLARD: 5 THE CLERK: 6 COUNCIL MEMBER O'DONOVAN: 7 THE CLERK: 8 COUNCIL MEMBER OGNIBENE: Yes. 9 THE CLERK: Millard. Pass. O'Donovan. Yes. Ognibene. Pagan. 10 COUNCIL MEMBER PAGAN: Yes. 11 THE CLERK: 12 COUNCIL MEMBER PINKETT: 13 THE CLERK: 14 COUNCIL MEMBER POVMAN: 15 THE CLERK: 16 COUNCIL MEMBER POWELL: 17 THE CLERK: 18 COUNCIL MEMBER RIVERA: 19 THE CLERK: 20 COUNCIL MEMBER ROBINSON: 21 THE CLERK: 22 COUNCIL MEMBER ROBLES: 23 THE CLERK: 24 COUNCIL MEMBER ROSADO: 25 THE CLERK: Pinkett. Yes. Povman. Yes. Powell. No. Rivera. Yes. Robinson. Pass. Robles. Pass. Rosado. Ruiz. Aye. ( 31 1 2 COUNCIL MEMBER RUIZ: No. 3 THE CLERK: 4 COUNCIL MEMBER SPIGNER: 5 THE CLERK: Stabile. 6 COUNCIL MEMBER STABILE: 7 THE CLERK: 8 COUNCIL MEMBER WARDEN: 9 THE CLERK: Spigner. Yes. Yes. Warden. Yes. Watkins. 10 COUNCIL MEMBER WATKINS: Yes. 11 THE CLERK: 12 COUNCIL MEMBER WEINER: 13 THE CLERK: 14 COUNCIL MEMBER WHITE: 15 THE CLERK: 16 COUNCIL MEMBER WILLIAMS: 17 THE CLERK: 18 COUNCIL MEMBER WOOTEN: 19 THE CLERK: 20 COUNCIL MEMBER CLARKE: 21 THE CLERK: 22 COUNCIL MEMBER MILLARD: 23 THE CLERK: 24 COUNCIL MEMBER ROBINSON: 25 THE CLERK: Weiner. Pass. White. Yes. Williams. Yes. Wooten. Yes. Clarke. Yes. Millard. No. Robinson. Weiner. No. I I 32 1 2 COUNCIL MEMBER WEINER: 3 THE CLERK: 4 COUNCIL MEMBER ABEL: 5 THE CLERK: 6 SPEAKER VALLONE: 7 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 8 9 10 11 12 Abel. Aye. Speaker Vallone. Aye. The motion to table the recommittal motion of Council Ognibene has won, 31 to 15. At this time, we will continue the debate and discussion on Intro 220. Council Member Spigner, I believe, is the last one to speak. 13 COUNCIL MEMBER SPIGNER: 14 I would only say that this has been a long Thank you. 15 afternoon, long day. 16 made have been adequately addressed except, perhaps, the 17 issue of the amount of money that the City of New York 18 currently spends in manning and operating its in rem stock. 19 All of the points that could have been The number is $140 million, just for 20 operating expenses, not to take into consideration the loss 21 of real estate taxes and the water bills which, I am told, 22 adds to the figure. 23 24 25 \ Yes. We are talking about $6,000 per year in addition to the rents that are collected. It does not factor in the cost of renovating ( 33 1 2 those buildings that have been taken in rem. 3 tremendous amount of money. It's a We have in place rent regulations for fifty 4 5 years and in that fifty years all we have to show for it is 6 vacant lots, abandoned buildings and foreclosures and an in 7 rem rate that is astronomical. It is a disincentive for people to purchase a 8 9 building or invest in them or maintain them. It is clear to 10 me that it's irresponsible to continue down the same 11 slippery slope. This bill is not a bill that taxes poor 12 13 people. I shed a tear as I listened to the emotional appeal 14 for people who make $250,000 a year. That is really sad. The average rent in New York City is less 15 16 than $600 per month, between $550 and $600. 17 survey shows that. The latest The passage of this bill does not address the 18 19 small home owner, the small property owner. 20 that, but we couldn't get the vote. 21 support in the Committee for the measure that would have 22 given a 25 percent rise in rate on vacancy for twenty units 23 or less. 24 25 We want to do There was not enough We couldn't pass that bill. This bill does not break people who are making a quarter-million dollars. They have options. They ( 34 1 2 can either stay where they are or they can move to some 3 vacant luxury apartment that is in the City of New York. Quarter-million dollars is still a tremendous 4 5 amount of money. 6 dollars as opposed to the need of the City of New York to 7 try and balance a budget where there is a gap of $2.4 8 billion, the tax generated from this increase is not a lot. We are told that it will generate 9 10 approximately $100,000 the first year and $200,000 the 11 second year based on the taxes that will have to be paid on 12 the new rental. However, even $100,000 is a tremendous amount 13 14 of money. As it relates to harassment, there are 15 anti-harassment measures on the books. 17 that if someone is harassed, there are adequate and ample 18 measures 19 that can address and assist people who are being harassed. 21 22 \ My experience is 16 to various funding programs and other services So, harassment, in my opinion, is not a 20 ( When you look at the quarter-million problem. If it is a problem, we have to address it. In so far as the question of the rent that is 23 now $1,200 or a $1,900, the likelihood that will be raised 24 to $2,000 I think is rather remote given the rent stabilized 25 apartments and vacancies. They are only entitled to 5 ( 35 1 2 percent in rent-controlled apartments -- 3 percent. 3 So I urge a yes vote. 4 (Applause.) 5 COUNCIL MEMBER ELDRIDGE: 6 I have two questions. Do you believe that the 17,000 properties 7 8 that are ready to go in rem are properties where there is 9 now a rent of $2,000 a month? COUNCIL MEMBER SPIGNER: 10 As it relates to the 11 17,000 properties, I don't where they are. 12 what condition they are in. I don't know All I know is we have in central management 13 14 41,000 units, which cost us $140 million annually, which 15 does not factor in ~he cost of taxes, water and sewer rates. THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 16 If there are no other 17 speakers at this time, the Clerk will now call the roll on 18 Intro 220. 19 THE CLERK: Albanese. 20 COUNCIL MEMBER ALBANESE: 21 THE CLERK: 22 COUNCIL MEMBER BERMAN: 23 THE CLERK: 24 COUNCIL MEMBER CLARKE: 25 THE CLERK: Cruz. No. Berman. Aye. Clarke. Yes. 36 1 COUNCIL MEMBER CRUZ: 2 3 May I be excused to explain my vote. There has certainly been an issue that I 4 5 listened to very carefully and I listened to the debate very 6 carefully. I happen to have a lot of Mitchell-lamas in 7 8 Parkchester. When I hear that there are people opposed to 9 explaining the why's and where's of their income when these 10 tenants living in Mitchell-Lama have to, I find that 11 inequitable, certainly unfair. My first concern about the stabilization is 12 13 that I have been assured as my colleagues have been that 14 there are extensive protections. 15 I vote aye. 16 THE CLERK: 17 COUNCIL MEMBER DEMARCO: 18 THE CLERK: 19 COUNCIL MEMBER DIBRIENZA: 20 25 DiBrienza. THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: Member. May I be excused You may not, Council You spoke. COUNCIL MEMBER DIBRIENZA: 23 24 Yes. to explain my vote? 21 22 DeMarco. I debated on the motion. THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: In the spirit of 37 1 2 fairness, Council Member, you can speak to the issue. COUNCIL MEMBER DIBRIENZA: 3 4 say before casting this vote that what could have been a 5 clearer vote for everyone interested in the record of this 6 occasion, I can only cast one vote. The portion of the bill that extends rent 7 8 stabilization, I am in favor of. The portion of the bill that says if two 9 10 things exist, $250,000 and $2,000 rent, you are right, you 11 pay more. 12 There is another portion of the bill that 13 says if an apartment goes to $2,000, it will ultimately fall 14 victim to vacancy decontrol, that section I am opposed to. 15 Having said that, I vote no. 16 THE CLERK: 17 COUNCIL MEMBER WATKINS: 18 I\ I simply wanted to Watkins. Thank you for allowing me to cast my vote now. 19 I vote aye. 20 THE CLERK: Dilan. 21 COUNCIL MEMBER MALAVE-DILAN: 22 THE CLERK: 23 COUNCIL MEMBER DUANE: 24 THE CLERK: 25 COUNCIL MEMBER EISLAND: Aye. Duane. No. Eisland. I would like to ask 38 1 2 permission to reopen the vote on Resolution 144, so I can 3 cast my vote, please. 4 Yes. 5 And on 220, I vote no. 6 THE CLERK: 7 COUNCIL MEMBER ELDRIDGE: 8 THE CLERK: 9 COUNCIL MEMBER ERISTOFF: Eldridge. No. Eristoff. No. 10 THE CLERK: Fisher. 11 COUNCIL MEMBER FISHER: 12 THE CLERK: 13 COUNCIL MEMBER FOSTER: 14 THE CLERK: 15 COUNCIL MEMBER FREED: 16 THE CLERK: 17 COUNCIL MEMBER FUSCO: 18 THE CLERK: 19 COUNCIL MEMBER HARRISON: 20 THE CLERK: 21 COUNCIL MEMBER HENRY: 22 THE CLERK: 23 COUNCIL MEMBER KOSLOWITZ: 24 THE CLERK: 25 COUNCIL MEMBER LASHER: As before on 144, I Pass. Foster. I vote aye. Freed. No. Fusco. Yes. Harrison. Yes. Henry. Yes. Koslowitz. No. Lasher. ( 39 1 2 have the same possible conflict with respect to my wife 3 owning a six-unit building, which is rent-stabilized, and 4 having a four-unit building that is rent-controlled. 5 With respect to the bill, I vote no. 6 THE CLERK: 7 COUNCIL MEMBER LEFFLER: 8 I would like to speak to how people have conveyed this to me. The people that have spoken to me about this, 9 10 Leffler. who care about this issue, don't want this bill. 11 Why? 12 They fear harassment. People who are in the 13 area of $1,200 feel that they will be pressured to get out 14 so their rents can be raised. Maybe there are laws on the books, as Mr. 15 16 Spigner said, but too many people feel that it is just on 17 the books. 18 I think where there is an incentive, you will get it. This is the real world. Harassment does exist. 19 I vote no. 20 THE CLERK: Linares. 21 COUNCIL MEMBER LINARES: 22 THE CLERK: 23 COUNCIL MEMBER MARSHALL: 24 THE CLERK: 25 COUNCIL MEMBER MCCABE: No. Marshall. No. McCabe. I would like to ( 40 1 2 explain my vote. I think the bill before us is misleading. 3 4 think it causes a great sense of distrust between ourselves 5 and tenants in the City of New York. 6 I vote no. 7 THE CLERK: 8 COUNCIL MEMBER MCCAFFREY: 9 I would like to be Let me say that those who end up in advocate 11 positions today, that if the bill were to pass it will be 12 the end of rent control and rent stabilization are pandering 13 to a mistruth. 14 15 \ Mccaffrey. temporarily excused to explain my vote. 10 I I The Chairman of the Committee himself acknowledged what the reality is. 16 I vote aye. 17 THE CLERK: 18 COUNCIL MEMBER MICHELS: 19 THE CLERK: 20 COUNCIL MEMBER MILLARD: 21 THE CLERK: 22 COUNCIL MEMBER O'DONOVAN: 23 THE CLERK: 24 COUNCIL MEMBER OGNIBENE: Aye. 25 THE CLERK: Michels. No. Millard. I vote no. O'Donovan. Aye. Ognibene. Pagan. ( 41 1 \ Aye. 2 COUNCIL MEMBER PAGAN: 3 THE CLERK: 4 COUNCIL MEMBER PINKETT: 5 THE CLERK: 6 COUNCIL MEMBER POVMAN: 7 THE CLERK: 8 COUNCIL MEMBER POWELL: 9 THE CLERK: Pinkett. Yes. Povman. No. Powell. No. Robinson. 10 COUNCIL MEMBER ROBINSON: 11 THE CLERK: 12 COUNCIL MEMBER ROBLES: 13 THE CLERK: 14 COUNCIL MEMBER RUIZ: 15 THE CLERK: 16 COUNCIL MEMBER SPIGNER: 17 THE CLERK: Stabile. 18 COUNCIL MEMBER STABILE: 19 THE CLERK: 20 COUNCIL MEMBER WARDEN: 21 THE CLERK: 22 COUNCIL MEMBER WEINER: 23 THE CLERK: 24 COUNCIL MEMBER WHITE: 25 THE CLERK: Yes. Robles. Yes. Ruiz. No. Spigner. Aye. Yes. Warden. Aye. Weiner. Yes. White. Williams. Aye. 42 1 2 COUNCIL MEMBER WILLIAMS: 3 THE CLERK: 4 COUNCIL MEMBER WOOTEN: 5 THE CLERK: 6 COUNCIL MEMBER FISHER: Wooten. Yes. Fisher. Counsel to the 7 Council has advised me to disclose the law firm of whom I am 8 counsel represents both tenants and landlords and may 9 represent parties that lobby on this. 10 No one in the firm has spoken to me. 11 I vote aye. 12 THE CLERK: 13 COUNCIL MEMBER ABEL: 14 THE CLERK: 15 SPEAKER VALLONE: 16 Abel. Aye. Speaker Vallone. May I be temporarily excused to explain my vote. I compliment my colleagues on both sides. 17 18 This is a very important issue for the people of the City of 19 New York. I think this debate is healthy for both 20 21 \ Aye. sides. 22 I want to record to indicate that the State 23 Legislature enacted a law concerning apartments for $2,000 24 and $250,000 income. 25 remove the date of October 1, 1993. All that the City Council did was to That is all. ~ r 43 1 It did not affect rent control in any way, 2 3 shape or form other than the removing of the date 4 I vote aye. 5 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 6 The Clerk informs me that by a vote of 28 in Thank you. 7 the affirmative, 18 in the negative, Intro 220 passes this 8 Chamber. 9 10 11 We will move to supplemental introduction and reading of bills. SPEAKER VALLONE: At this time I ask that 12 immediate consideration be given to the resolution by 13 Weiner, Berman and Foster, reaffirming the Council's 14 long-standing commitment to and support for Jerusalem as the 15 eternal and undivided capital of the State of Israel. 16 We move to immediate consideration. 17 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 18 (No response.) 19 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 20 Hearing none, all those in favor say aye. 21 (A chorus of ayes.) 22 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 23 (No response.) 24 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 25 Any objections? consideration is adopted. All opposed say no. The immediate ( 44 1 SPEAKER VALLONE: 2 3 immediate considerations. We wish our colleagues of the Jewish faith a 4 5 That concludes the very happy Passover. 6 Council Member Foster wishes to speak. 7 COUNCIL MEMBER FOSTER: 8 Mr. Public Advocate, may I remind my 9 Thank you. colleagues that on Wednesday of this week, the 15th, in the 10 Chambers here we will be celebrating Greek Heritage Month, 11 Independence Day. All Council Members are invited. COUNCIL MEMBER ERISTOFF: 12 I would like to 13 take the personal privilege of drawing this body's attention 14 to the fact that my mother, Nancy Eristoff, was appointed 15 Chairperson of the Museum of Natural History. 16 Thank you 17 SPEAKER VALLONE: 18 The next Stated Meeting will be March 30th. 19 Thank you very much, Mr. Public Advocate. 20 THE PUBLIC ADVOCATE: 21 The Stated Meeting is concluded. 22 (Whereupon, at 4:45 p.m., the meeting was 23 24 25 adjourned.) --------- -- -~ -- ---------- - - - - - - - - --------- 45 1 CERTIFICATION 2 3 4 STATE OF NEW YORK 5 COUNTY OF NEW YORK 6 7 8 9 I, RAYMOND M. DANYO, a Shorthand Reporter and Notary Public in and for the State of New York, do hereby 10 certify that the foregoing ip a true and accurate transcript 11 of the within proceeding. 12 I further certify that I am not related to any 13 of the parties to this action by blood or marriage, and that 14 I am in no way interested in the outcome of this matter. 15 IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set my 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 hand this 8th day of November, 1994. 46 1 2 C E R T I F I C A T I O N 3 4 5 6 7 I, RAYMOND M. DANYO, a Shorthand Reporter and 8 Notary Public in and for the State of New York, do hereby 9 certify the aforesaid to be a true and accurate 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 transcription of my stenographic notes.