mean, some of those are those scale
scores?

A. Those are scale scores on the left, yes.

Q. Okay. So 7 is where does that fall?

A. That falls in the below average. Because he

had like a 16th percentile.

Q. Okay, But it looks like some of those are 73,

and then you have an 81 and an 82.

A. And that's a standard score. We have a scale
score and then a standard score.

Q. Okay. So then 

A. It's because of the composite, we get the

scale score I mean the standard score for composite.

And the composite is made up of the Phonological

Awareness, it's made up of Elision, Blending Words, and

Sound Matching. And then rapid naming is made up of

Rapid Object Namina and Rapid Color Naming.

Q. So based on this, would you determine that he

was a student that had dyslexia?
I mean,

A. What I explain -- typically on an

older child, would definitely do that. Through our


training through Region 4, they have indicated to us
.4
that we typically are not supposed to identify dyslexia

 

 

 

 

before the age of second I mean before second grade,



because you have to try the interventions first.

 

 

 

And

 

 

 

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538

when they're young, that's a little young to identify 1

dyslexia--six years old.

Q. Okay. What about the next, the
Woodcock-Johnson? How do you interpret that? What are
you looking at?

A. I look at a1? the standard scores. I mean,

Basic Reading, whleh is made up of Letter?Word

Identification and Word Attack: that's basically your

phonics. So he was low in Letter-Word Identification.

And then Word Attaek, he did better in Word Attack. And

that would be pronnuncing nonsense words.

Q. And what's the difference between Letter-Word
ID -n I mean, what is Letter-Word 
A. He would haVe to name the letters and then

also read words in isolation.

Q. Okay. What about Reading Comprehension?

Reading Comprehension at the at his level,

first he would have to match things. Like there would

be -- he'd have to match a symbol with a picture. Like

there might be several different symbols and then

there's a house- And so he'd have to match the symbol

for house with the house. And it would be like a --

almost like a cartoon representation of a house. So

that's the lnwer level.

Then at the next there would be

 

 

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553

Yeah. So you have no knowledge of whether 

well, when do you think the parent first asked for A. to

be tested for special education?

A.

when they had the IAT where Ms.

I believe there was one last year in June,

Tappe was involved. And

then the next time was prior to referral.

Q.
as well?
A.
involved,
Q.


Q.

And wasn't there in fact a time in 2010-2011

That's what I'm saying. When Ms. Tappe was
right.

In the 2010-2011 year?

Yes.

And if a parent is requesting, then you should

go straight to a referral committee to determine whether

you're going to do the testing or not,

A.

Q.

should you?
Yes.

And in fact, there are provisions in the rules

and regulations to ensure that a child isn't denied an

evaluation by being referred to response to

intervention?
A. Yes. True.
Q. Now, if you say that the response to

you want to see how they respond,

intervention is part of the evaluation process because

is there a time factor

involved there?

 

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understand.
A. Do you want me to tell you or not?
Q. No. But in fact, all -- both the Broad and

the individual subtests all show very significant --
other than Word Attack, they're all very significant
discrepancies?

A. Yes.

But if you look at it, every single

thing is -- I mean, every -- if you look at it, Basic

Reading, Reading Comp, Math Calc, Math Reasoning, and

Written Expression, they all are -- if you're looking at
the discrepancy method, he's low in all of those.
Q. Right. Because he has learning disabilities
in all areas pretty much at this time.
A. Well, we had to rule out some of the other
factors in order to 
Q. Right. And we will --
A. Right.
Q. -- get to that.
A. Right. 

Q. Now, you're saying that Region 4 states that
you can't be determined as dyslexic before second grade.
A. That's our training,

yes. But they don't

recommend it.

 

Q. So in A.'s case, he has to have four years

of -- well, at least three and some parts of the year of

 

 

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failure before he would be determined to be dyslexic?

A. Well, if you want to go with the formal

calling him dyslexic, the IEPs reflected that he would
be receiving instructions in phonemic awareness, which
is -- which he would receive if he were dyslexic.

Q. So you could still have determined he was

learning disabled but not dyslexic in kindergarten?

A. Generally we would not.

Q. No. I understand. So it's no surprise,
really, that some 38 percent of HISD students in third
grade read below grade level, is it?

A. I can't answer that.

Q. And I think the CTOPP -- you did the CTOPP,

and that confirmed his phonemic awareness?
A. Yes.

Q. Now, Texas actually has, apart from being

subject to the special education laws, it

dyslexia law.

561

"1

 

has a separate

A. Yes.
Q. And does Region 4 say you can't be recognized

as dyslexic under that law and receive services, not

from special education, until you're in second grade?

A. According to our training on dyslexia, their
recommendation is not before second grade.
Q. And that?s even though the educational system

 

 

 

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